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Author Topic: Problem with KS3.1 and Amiga 3000  (Read 3565 times)

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Offline madgrizzleTopic starter

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Problem with KS3.1 and Amiga 3000
« on: November 15, 2017, 11:50:26 PM »
I recently purchased KS3.1 roms to upgrade my A3000 that came with KS2.04.  For the KS2.04 ROMS, ROM0 is in U181 and ROM1 is in U180 (marking of ROM0 and ROM1 on the motheboard is wrong.. or markings on the ROMs are wrong.. many hours wasted trying to figure out why my computer wasn't booting).

When I install the new 3.1 roms, I get black screen.  One was marked U180 and the other U181.  I tried switching them but I got the same result.  With them back in their respective spots, I tried setting the ROM speed to 16 MHz (J151 and J152) and still got black screen.  Pin 1 is facing the daughterboard and there are no bent/unseated pins.

The motherboard is v8.9 with no ROM tower.

Any suggestions?  The vendor said they were tested in an A3000 before they were shipped and offered to send me another set if needed.
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Amiga 2000, 2MB Chip RAM, OS3.9, GVP Combo 030/22 13 MB, Supra 4MB
Amiga 3000, 16 MB RAM, OS3.9, A3640 v3.2 with 060 Processor, Picasso II, A2065, PCD-50B
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Offline madgrizzleTopic starter

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Re: Problem with KS3.1 and Amiga 3000
« Reply #1 on: November 16, 2017, 01:29:51 AM »
Notches line up.. notch pointing toward the installed daughter board.  Yes, I can remove the 3.1 ROMs., reinsert the 2.04 ROMs and boot.

Are there only two jumpers that need to change your drop the room speed to 16 MHz?  The vendor is sending new ROMs anyway.. I hope it's just the ROMs rather than something else strange.
Only Amiga *woo-woo* Makes It Possible
Only Amiga   ... Makes.. It .. Happen!
Amiga 2000, 2MB Chip RAM, OS3.9, GVP Combo 030/22 13 MB, Supra 4MB
Amiga 3000, 16 MB RAM, OS3.9, A3640 v3.2 with 060 Processor, Picasso II, A2065, PCD-50B
Dead VA2000/CX :(
 

Offline madgrizzleTopic starter

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Re: Problem with KS3.1 and Amiga 3000
« Reply #2 on: November 16, 2017, 02:39:36 AM »
Switching them didn't work.. first thing I tried.  I found this while googling:

"I purchased a pair of 3.1 ROM's which were in fact 27C400s. I also have the rev. 8.9 mobo which leaves pin 1 of the ROMs floating. I Never had a bit of trouble with them even when the mobo was over-clocked and ROM timing was set for the fastest speed. They had a mirror image burned into the upper and lower 256KB of each ROM so they would have worked with pin 1 to GND or VCC although left floating is usually resolved as a logical high by the internal address buffers.

I also have a pair of TC574200 which I burned a 512KB 3.9 ROM image into using the mirror method which worked fine with pin 1 floating also. It wasn't until I did the 1MB ROM hack that I finally got around to connecting pin 1 to A19! But that's just my personal experience. :razz:"

But then I found this:

"Still i did not have my KS3.1 at work and i also found out why: The Adresslines of A4000 and i guess also newer models of A3000 (Rev 8.x an higher) decode also A19 (from amiga) to A17 (on rom chip) which makes for a total of 1024K of rom space (18 adress lines, 16 data lines, 2 chips = 2^18x2(bytes)x2(chips)=1024Kbytes). On older Rev. (6.x, 7.x) A3000 A19 is not connected and that leaves room for max 512Kb. So since KS3.1 is (only) 512kb it should work great right? But my KS3.1 did not work. Looking a bit closer at my KS3.1 (they are eproms and not roms in my case) i found out that my chips are 4mbit (512kb) each so that totals to 1024K so that means only half of it it filled with the KS3.1 code and the other half is not used. Now how does the amiga select the 'right' part of the chip and not the part which is not used? It uses the extra adresline (Amiga A19, Rom A17) to do so! I think this extra line was intended for future kickstarts which might be bigger than 512K (Older KS1.2/1.3 was only 256K and grew to 512 starting with KS2.0). The A17(rom) line on the sockets on the ROM-Tower was not connected to A19 (amiga) but was connected to ground(0V) and with that it selected the unused part of my Eproms and that is why my KS3.1 did not work in my Amiga3000. Until now because after i reconnected the A17 lines from my eproms to +5V (which makes the amiga use the other half of my eproms) it finaly worked :-D :-D :-D"


I don't know what the chips are, but they are from Amiga on the Lake and are labeled as Amiga Forever 3.1 ROMs.  Anyone know if 8.9 has a floating pin 1?  I looked at the back side of the mb and there appears to be something coming off pin one of U181..  nothing on backside of U180 and was too obscured to see if something connected from the topside.
« Last Edit: November 16, 2017, 02:48:42 AM by madgrizzle »
Only Amiga *woo-woo* Makes It Possible
Only Amiga   ... Makes.. It .. Happen!
Amiga 2000, 2MB Chip RAM, OS3.9, GVP Combo 030/22 13 MB, Supra 4MB
Amiga 3000, 16 MB RAM, OS3.9, A3640 v3.2 with 060 Processor, Picasso II, A2065, PCD-50B
Dead VA2000/CX :(
 

Offline madgrizzleTopic starter

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Re: Problem with KS3.1 and Amiga 3000
« Reply #3 on: November 16, 2017, 03:52:33 PM »
I had to bend the pins a little as well.
Only Amiga *woo-woo* Makes It Possible
Only Amiga   ... Makes.. It .. Happen!
Amiga 2000, 2MB Chip RAM, OS3.9, GVP Combo 030/22 13 MB, Supra 4MB
Amiga 3000, 16 MB RAM, OS3.9, A3640 v3.2 with 060 Processor, Picasso II, A2065, PCD-50B
Dead VA2000/CX :(
 

Offline madgrizzleTopic starter

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Re: Problem with KS3.1 and Amiga 3000
« Reply #4 on: November 17, 2017, 10:43:12 AM »
Got a response from the vendor and they found a problem with their prom burner and complete stash of previously burnt 3.1 roms (they got black screens when they plugged them in).  They are sending me a new freshly burned set that they tested on two different A3000 and offered to throw in something extra for my troubles.

All's good, I hope.
Only Amiga *woo-woo* Makes It Possible
Only Amiga   ... Makes.. It .. Happen!
Amiga 2000, 2MB Chip RAM, OS3.9, GVP Combo 030/22 13 MB, Supra 4MB
Amiga 3000, 16 MB RAM, OS3.9, A3640 v3.2 with 060 Processor, Picasso II, A2065, PCD-50B
Dead VA2000/CX :(
 

Offline madgrizzleTopic starter

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Re: Problem with KS3.1 and Amiga 3000
« Reply #5 on: November 17, 2017, 07:17:02 PM »
True that.
Only Amiga *woo-woo* Makes It Possible
Only Amiga   ... Makes.. It .. Happen!
Amiga 2000, 2MB Chip RAM, OS3.9, GVP Combo 030/22 13 MB, Supra 4MB
Amiga 3000, 16 MB RAM, OS3.9, A3640 v3.2 with 060 Processor, Picasso II, A2065, PCD-50B
Dead VA2000/CX :(
 

Offline madgrizzleTopic starter

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Re: Problem with KS3.1 and Amiga 3000
« Reply #6 on: November 19, 2017, 12:51:47 AM »
Got new roms and have 'similar' problem still.  I get black screen, but the keyboard caps lock button light works.  Use to stop after about 12 presses.. now it continues to toggle.  They claimed they tested it on two A3000's and I didn't have to bend the pins in to install them.

Switched 2.04 roms back in and got the boot screen.

I'm at a loss.  Rev 8.9 motherboard with both rom jumpers set to 25 mhz.
Only Amiga *woo-woo* Makes It Possible
Only Amiga   ... Makes.. It .. Happen!
Amiga 2000, 2MB Chip RAM, OS3.9, GVP Combo 030/22 13 MB, Supra 4MB
Amiga 3000, 16 MB RAM, OS3.9, A3640 v3.2 with 060 Processor, Picasso II, A2065, PCD-50B
Dead VA2000/CX :(
 

Offline madgrizzleTopic starter

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Re: Problem with KS3.1 and Amiga 3000
« Reply #7 on: November 19, 2017, 01:16:28 AM »
Well, I got the floppy hookedup correctly and now its doing something.  Guess you shouldnt believe everything you read on the internet.. need a floppy drive working to boot an A3000.
Only Amiga *woo-woo* Makes It Possible
Only Amiga   ... Makes.. It .. Happen!
Amiga 2000, 2MB Chip RAM, OS3.9, GVP Combo 030/22 13 MB, Supra 4MB
Amiga 3000, 16 MB RAM, OS3.9, A3640 v3.2 with 060 Processor, Picasso II, A2065, PCD-50B
Dead VA2000/CX :(
 

Offline madgrizzleTopic starter

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Re: Problem with KS3.1 and Amiga 3000
« Reply #8 on: November 23, 2017, 03:05:47 PM »
Quote from: matt3k;833308
I have a 3000 (9.03) with 3.1 roms and it will boot fine without a floppy connected.
I think perhaps the issue is that I don't have the battery installed.  After sitting a few days, I came back to it and it wouldn't boot.  If I pulled the power off the hard drive, and it booted so that told me it was a scsi issue.  I plugged the power back into the hard drive and once again, it didn't boot.  I found a thread from 9 years ago where someone suggested warm booting when it was like that.  I did the three-finger salute and it booted right up off the inserted floppy.  I powered down and disconnected the floppy drive and again, it booted up but to the hard drive (as expected).  I think I either 1) need to install the battery or 2) be prepared to warm boot.
Only Amiga *woo-woo* Makes It Possible
Only Amiga   ... Makes.. It .. Happen!
Amiga 2000, 2MB Chip RAM, OS3.9, GVP Combo 030/22 13 MB, Supra 4MB
Amiga 3000, 16 MB RAM, OS3.9, A3640 v3.2 with 060 Processor, Picasso II, A2065, PCD-50B
Dead VA2000/CX :(