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Offline SystemTopic starter

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Amiga.org Phase 2 complete
« on: February 15, 2004, 01:22:52 AM »
Welcome to the new Amiga.org!  We're now running Xoops 2.06, and this marks the completion of "phase 2" of our upgrades.  Thanks for your patience during this process.


Thanks to Steve and Brian (Ackbarr, core Xoops developer) at PlanetXoops.com, phase 2 -- the upgrade to Xoops 2.x has been completed.  To mark this, we've added a new look and feel to the site which, like the last one, will mutate as needed to match the community's needs and desires.  I know that change is never easy for a lot of you, and indeed getting here hasn't been easy for us, but please understand that the upgrade to Xoops 2.x was a necessary one.  

The big question: Why?
Because Xoops 1.x had become no longer secure.  Don't Panic, we don't believe that anyone's information has been truly compromised, simply that there have been a couple of incidents where changes were made to the site lately that "we" didn't make.  It is inevitable however that all Xoops 1.x sites will have the same problems, since the 1.x path has been devaluated.

To give a little history, Xoops 1.x is the code base we run.  In earlier versions (the version 1.x level), code and display were integrated as one thing.  To change even the background color of a table row, you had to edit the PHP code.  As a result, over the last 3 years of running Xoops 1.x, our code base had been highly -- and I mean HIGHLY -- modified to add little niceties and features that users had requested to make the site run smoother.  All these changes made upgrading, even to another Xoops 1.3.x upgrade, very, very difficult, as we had to replicate every hack and modification we'd ever made to the code.

About four months ago -- as some of you recall seeing -- I made the "executive decision" that

1) Since the site was no longer secure
2) Since upgrading to a more secure 1.3.x version wasn't possible (we were running the latest 1.3.10)
3) Since initial testing actually proved that Xoops 2.x was more compatible on several levels with the LATEST Amiga browsers

It was time to bite the proverbial bullet and perform the "dreaded 2.x upgrade".  The trouble is, because of all the modifications and different third-party modules we had installed over the years, every attempt that *I* made met with no success.  Whether this is due to the particular version of Xoops 2.0.5.2, the use of third-party additions, or my own oversight is unknown. So, I put the 1.x site back up, closed every hole I could find, and called in the professionals.  

About two months ago, I began working with Steve and Ackbarr (PlanetXoops.com) to establish a dev site using a copy of the live data.  Using a secondary development site let the entire team get involved in the process and work towards the new site design and layout.  There's still a lot to do, but we've got a list and at this point, there's no sense in delaying the upgrade when the changes which are left can be handled while live.

I will say this: Xoops 2.x is a lot more promising, but I never realized the amount of work that would be involved in a "mere" upgrade.  Rather than five theme files as in Xoops 1.x, EVERY module including the system itself has been seperated into its own "templates" (which control individual aspects of the display), on top of the now eight different "theme" files (which control the overall look of the site).  Imagine going from having to make five changes and being online, to needing 100+ changes.  

So why didn't you just install the old Amiga.org theme?
If you've read this far, you might ask why I didn't just download and install one of the many "themes" available like all the other Xoops sites do?  Well, that's both a simple answer, and the cause of most of the work.  To explain, Xoops -- like almost everything else in the world -- actually supports modern Web standards, like CSS and XHTML.  Unfortunately the developers of most Amiga browsers haven't had the opportunity to expand their support as quickly as the rest of the world.  This is truly understandable, and not a slam at all.  After all, Amiga browser developers don't have zillions of free ones to play with like Mozilla Firefox, Netscape, Internet Explorer, etc.  

A big challenge for us when redesigning this site was that no "out of the box" theme for Xoops (including the stock Xoops theme) was compatible with any Amiga browser. What the team and I had to do was literally fall back to square 1 and start over, rewriting every bit of code to older HTML standards.  We've been able to successfully test MOST of the site to work with the latest Amiga browsers.  Most features work correctly, but let me say this with the hopes that you clearly understand my intent.  If you're not using the latest Amiga browser, UPGRADE.  The browser developers depend on your support by way of upgrades to make their development possible.  If you're not willing to upgrade to the latest and greatest Amiga versions out there, you really can't complain if things don't work properly.

Quite simply stated, the more we worked to adapt the old Amiga.org "Blue" theme, the more we realized that it was incompatible with the theme/template split in Xoops 2.x.  Besides, what's the use of an upgrade of this magnitude if no one notices the change :)

Okay, what's next?  What's "Phase 3"?
Phase 3 of our upgrades is literally "expansion."  Once Phase 2 has been completed, and all the kinks have been worked out, Kent Seaton and I will begin writing and looking for new modules which will help expand Amiga.org's feature set to make us truly unique amongst all the copycats out there.  This may include:

- Personal address books, link lists, and such
- Expanded personal messaging,
- IRC Interfacing for the #Amiga.org channel
- Adding the ability for users to have their own personal Web pages (though the potential for abuse and the heightened overhead for the staff makes this a little less likely in the immediate future),
- Team project management abilities (such as an Amiga version of "sourceforge")

and more.  We truly want to make Amiga.org a very useful and meaningful experience.  To do that, we'll invite everyone's input as soon as the current upgrades are considerably complete.  We hope you'll bear with us in all this and begin to share the enthusiasm that the staff has for the potential future of this site.

Finally, a recommendation
I would be remiss if I didn't point out the excellent work, assistance, and support of the staff at PlanetXoops.com.  If you're considering running a site, for any reason at all, please consider them your first stop along the way.  They've been instrumental in these upgrades and I really believe that Amiga.org wouldn't be possible today without their help and support.

Best regards,

Wayne Hunt and the staff at Amiga.org
 

Offline SystemTopic starter

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Re: Amiga.org Phase 2 complete
« Reply #1 on: February 14, 2004, 10:51:36 PM »
I hope you don't mind me saying, but the new theme sucks somewhat.
 

Offline SystemTopic starter

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Re: Amiga.org Phase 2 complete
« Reply #2 on: February 15, 2004, 02:18:41 PM »
As I recall, I BEGGED for someone to step up and help with the graphics for a header.  No one did, except one of the admins.  This is what you get.  If you don't like the color choices, feel free to create and suggest a new banner.

I knew there would be some hesitance towards something new, but I NEVER expected this amount of whining.
 

Offline SystemTopic starter

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Re: Amiga.org Phase 2 complete
« Reply #3 on: February 15, 2004, 03:33:23 PM »
I guess it's too much to ask for that people actually READ things before bitching and whining.
 

Offline SystemTopic starter

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Re: Amiga.org Phase 2 complete
« Reply #4 on: February 15, 2004, 04:46:02 PM »
Crumb,

As I stated -- which you're obviously unable or unwilling to comprehend -- the old theme was incompatible with Xoops 2.x.  This INCLUDES THE  HEADER.  The header under the old site was custom written and dynamically generated.  That is not possible under Xoops 2.x

Wayne
 

Offline SystemTopic starter

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Re: Amiga.org Phase 2 complete
« Reply #5 on: February 15, 2004, 07:14:40 PM »
Look.  

It's not #OOPS#ing possible.  Drop it.
 

Offline SystemTopic starter

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Re: Amiga.org Phase 2 complete
« Reply #6 on: February 15, 2004, 08:37:56 PM »
Quote
You've got to have the right attitude, and quite frankly, you don't.

You are absolutely right.  I don't.  I take this site very, very personally after 9 years of running it -- despite the multiple attempts to destroy it by hackers, rival sites, and even the main companies involved in the Amiga community.

Over the last month or so, I poured a majority of my time and heart into this MANDATORY Xoops upgrade.  I invited literally dozens of people in to take a sneak peak (and to solicit feedback) and everyone seemed to LOVE the changes.  I put them online, and I'm being attacked on a very personal level for my efforts, so forgive me if I seem a little disgusted by the responses to the new site.

Once again, I am *forced* to wonder exactly why in the hell I bother to try and support this community any more.  It seems the more effort I put into this site, the more I am made (by admittedly a few users) to regret it and I simply don't know what to do from this point.