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Amiga computer related discussion => Amiga Hardware Issues and discussion => Topic started by: hese7 on March 27, 2018, 08:27:27 AM

Title: A4000+ Alice motherboard DIY
Post by: hese7 on March 27, 2018, 08:27:27 AM
Let me introduce you to the A4000+ Alice rev1 motherboard.
A4000+ motherboard is based on the Amiga 4000cr motherboard designed by Commodore.

I have been thinking for a while to do some Amiga hardware and decided to start with a relatively easy but laborious task, an Amiga 4000cr motherboard.
I didn't have a blank A4000cr motherboard PCB nor any high-resolution pictures of a blank PCB, so I had to layout the A4000+ PCB completely manually.
I used a fully working A4000cr motherboard as a reference.
The PCB dimensions and all component locations, hole locations, hole diameters, solder pad dimensions, component silkscreens, etc. of the A4000cr motherboard were manually measured and transferred to the PCB design software.
I draw the line at the PCB traces, those I didn't attempt to mimic from the original A4000cr board.
The PCB traces of the A4000+ were fully manually routed (which too ages).
The result is a quite close replica of the original A4000cr motherboard.

Here are a few pictures of the blank PCB.
(https://thumbs2.imgbox.com/c5/45/lxb43uuy_t.jpg)  (http://imgbox.com/lxb43uuy)(https://thumbs2.imgbox.com/87/3a/VEuiJeEa_t.jpg)  (http://imgbox.com/VEuiJeEa)(https://thumbs2.imgbox.com/fe/a8/2VArlK8A_t.jpg) (http://imgbox.com/2VArlK8A)
(https://thumbs2.imgbox.com/3d/34/VP39PHnc_t.jpg)  (http://imgbox.com/VP39PHnc)(https://thumbs2.imgbox.com/93/79/RZYQ5TuV_t.jpg)  (http://imgbox.com/RZYQ5TuV)(https://thumbs2.imgbox.com/84/e2/FuSvop5M_t.jpg) (http://imgbox.com/FuSvop5M)
(https://thumbs2.imgbox.com/fc/63/NyKMLtXj_t.jpg)  (http://imgbox.com/NyKMLtXj)(https://thumbs2.imgbox.com/33/c8/IKsJwdB8_t.jpg)  (http://imgbox.com/IKsJwdB8)(https://thumbs2.imgbox.com/21/6c/iXT4455n_t.jpg) (http://imgbox.com/iXT4455n)

A few pictures of the board being assembled.
(https://thumbs2.imgbox.com/03/e2/fcEG9yXb_t.jpg)  (http://imgbox.com/fcEG9yXb)(https://thumbs2.imgbox.com/7f/3c/fCVRZuA2_t.jpg)  (http://imgbox.com/fCVRZuA2)(https://thumbs2.imgbox.com/c2/3f/ryglTAnk_t.jpg) (http://imgbox.com/ryglTAnk)
(https://thumbs2.imgbox.com/b5/74/agYCmJEC_t.jpg)  (http://imgbox.com/agYCmJEC)(https://thumbs2.imgbox.com/ee/ae/yObLrlKV_t.jpg)  (http://imgbox.com/yObLrlKV)(https://thumbs2.imgbox.com/2c/4c/EXMbI66J_t.jpg) (http://imgbox.com/EXMbI66J)
(https://thumbs2.imgbox.com/08/65/7RhedZji_t.jpg)  (http://imgbox.com/7RhedZji)(https://thumbs2.imgbox.com/d7/fb/mfwAqqxL_t.jpg)  (http://imgbox.com/mfwAqqxL)(https://thumbs2.imgbox.com/6d/2d/fHBY8NzJ_t.jpg) (http://imgbox.com/fHBY8NzJ)

Pictures of the finished board.
(https://thumbs2.imgbox.com/e9/cf/dZSBKCqd_t.jpg)  (http://imgbox.com/dZSBKCqd)(https://thumbs2.imgbox.com/b4/21/vL1ZVoMW_t.jpg)  (http://imgbox.com/vL1ZVoMW)(https://thumbs2.imgbox.com/29/4f/q5uOVdk7_t.jpg) (http://imgbox.com/q5uOVdk7)
(https://thumbs2.imgbox.com/b3/5d/7zunKNlF_t.jpg) (http://imgbox.com/7zunKNlF)

A4000+ motherboard being mounted in the Amiga 4000D case.
(https://thumbs2.imgbox.com/3e/f2/vMKv59Q7_t.jpg)  (http://imgbox.com/vMKv59Q7)(https://thumbs2.imgbox.com/bf/91/Yw88p8Cp_t.jpg) (http://imgbox.com/Yw88p8Cp)

A4000+ motherboard fully working.
(https://thumbs2.imgbox.com/85/88/1nY2wp84_t.jpg) (http://imgbox.com/1nY2wp84)

A screenshot of the designed PCB.
(https://thumbs2.imgbox.com/bb/15/oAnD60Ms_t.jpg) (http://imgbox.com/oAnD60Ms)

Link to the photo gallery:
A4000+ Alice motherboard (http://imgbox.com/g/W8xVbJ9RdD)

The next motherboard that I'm working on will be something completely different.
Title: Re: A4000+ Alice motherboard DIY
Post by: BLTCON0 on March 27, 2018, 10:59:46 AM
Awesome!
Title: Re: A4000+ Alice motherboard DIY
Post by: Djole on March 27, 2018, 11:04:28 AM
Wow, awesome work, unbelievable!! What are the plans with the design ?
Title: Re: A4000+ Alice motherboard DIY
Post by: Pyromania on March 27, 2018, 12:31:49 PM
@hese7

Very cool project!
Title: Re: A4000+ Alice motherboard DIY
Post by: kolla on March 27, 2018, 12:53:44 PM
Every now and then, having ten thumbs can be a great thing.. all thumbs up! :D
Title: Re: A4000+ Alice motherboard DIY
Post by: Iggy on March 27, 2018, 01:37:26 PM
Impressive.
Are you going to do anything with the design files?
Title: Re: A4000+ Alice motherboard DIY
Post by: bbond007 on March 27, 2018, 02:08:34 PM
Quote from: hese7;837911

The next motherboard that I'm working on will be something completely different.


WOW!!! Very impressive!  

Can't wait to find out what the next board is...

I assume the 4000+ board would work with Chucky's A3660 accelerator board?
Title: Re: A4000+ Alice motherboard DIY
Post by: Oldsmobile_Mike on March 27, 2018, 02:23:30 PM
Wow! It's amazing when something as complex as this pops up seemingly out of nowhere. Much better than boards that get talked about for years but never happen, haha. ;)

This should certainly help resurrect a few A4000's that have suffered battery damage (assuming you decide to sell or otherwise produce additional boards).

How about for a "phase 2", incorporating some of the more common A4000 motherboard mods, such as PIO2 and 64MB of RAM mod? :)
Title: Re: A4000+ Alice motherboard DIY
Post by: Vlabguy1 on March 27, 2018, 02:38:06 PM
Now what?
Title: Re: A4000+ Alice motherboard DIY
Post by: kolla on March 27, 2018, 02:44:00 PM
Quote from: Vlabguy1;837929
Now what?


A CD32 clone :)
Title: Re: A4000+ Alice motherboard DIY
Post by: midway on March 27, 2018, 03:20:57 PM
Thats great work hese! How long did it take to do all your work?

Thats dedication on a highest level possible. Hats off.:laugh1:
Title: Re: A4000+ Alice motherboard DIY
Post by: kirk_m on March 27, 2018, 04:36:48 PM
Wow!  So, what are the plans for it?  Selling them in the fashion of A1K's RED 500+?
Title: Re: A4000+ Alice motherboard DIY
Post by: arttu80 on March 27, 2018, 04:46:50 PM
This is AWESOME!!! How can one person manage to accompish such a beautiful thing and like no one even knew about it? You should maybe consider massproduction of these babies? Maybe Individual computers will be interested?
Title: Re: A4000+ Alice motherboard DIY
Post by: goldfish on March 27, 2018, 04:48:29 PM
Great modified version that is ATX layout would be cool A4000 are so dam expensive to buy. If one could buy a board fully assembled ready to fit in standard ATX case that would be wicked. Or even the new A1500 checkmate case
Title: Re: A4000+ Alice motherboard DIY
Post by: goldfish on March 27, 2018, 04:49:34 PM
Whats the Alice reference ?
Title: Re: A4000+ Alice motherboard DIY
Post by: kirk_m on March 27, 2018, 06:51:47 PM
Quote from: goldfish;837939
Whats the Alice reference ?


Alice is the AGA equivalent of the OCS/ECS Agnus  in the A4000.
Title: Re: A4000+ Alice motherboard DIY
Post by: madgrizzle on March 27, 2018, 07:49:03 PM
Quote from: goldfish;837938
If one could buy a board fully assembled ready to fit in standard ATX case that would be wicked.


I think wicked is an apt description.  This is amazing work.
Title: Re: A4000+ Alice motherboard DIY
Post by: F1Lupo on March 27, 2018, 08:11:07 PM
@ hese

just WOW!
:hammer::drink::hammer::drink:
I want one of these boards as a spare for my A4000 to keep her running at least as long as I do:)

btw, it's always Jan1, 1978 on Amiga screenshots so change our batteries lol
Title: Re: A4000+ Alice motherboard DIY
Post by: trekiej on March 27, 2018, 08:27:25 PM
Wow!
Title: Re: A4000+ Alice motherboard DIY
Post by: shaf on March 27, 2018, 09:27:15 PM
I'd gladly but one just to replace my spare A4000 Rev B board.
Title: Re: A4000+ Alice motherboard DIY
Post by: Jeff on March 27, 2018, 09:56:09 PM
This is Amazing! What are your plans for it?
Title: Re: A4000+ Alice motherboard DIY
Post by: hirschma on March 27, 2018, 10:18:40 PM
I'd love to hear details about how it was assembled. That's very, very neat work for a hand assembly job - looks like pro reflow/selective solder in the pics.
Title: Re: A4000+ Alice motherboard DIY
Post by: efrenmgp on March 27, 2018, 11:46:37 PM
Amazing job! Congratulations! I can only imagine how many hours of hard work and dedication went into this :)

As everyone else now I wonder... will they be for sale? How can we get one of them?

Again... great work! :)
Title: Re: A4000+ Alice motherboard DIY
Post by: yssing on March 28, 2018, 12:05:17 AM
That is really impressive work!
Any plans for selling the bare motherboards??

So now there are new versions of a bunch of the classics... COOL!
Title: Re: A4000+ Alice motherboard DIY
Post by: AmigaEd on March 28, 2018, 12:18:44 AM
To say this is spectacular and awesome would be a massive understatement!
Job Well Done!
Title: Re: A4000+ Alice motherboard DIY
Post by: BozzerBigD on March 28, 2018, 12:21:28 AM
@hese7 (http://www.amiga.org/forums/member.php?u=5821)

I think the new Phase 5 need to hire you and then they'd be a real company! ;-)
Title: Re: A4000+ Alice motherboard DIY
Post by: Motormouth on March 28, 2018, 02:50:42 AM
Very Impressive!!!!!
Title: Re: A4000+ Alice motherboard DIY
Post by: quenthal on March 28, 2018, 01:33:57 PM
Quote from: Djole;837917
Wow, awesome work, unbelievable!! What are the plans with the design ?
I think hese confirmed on Finnish Amiga forum that next step is to build ATX-compatible version with Prometheus PCI builtin.
Title: Re: A4000+ Alice motherboard DIY
Post by: gary2000 on March 28, 2018, 01:56:22 PM
Wow, this caught me by surprise. I would like to buy one as well or have one produced if the files are made available.
Title: Re: A4000+ Alice motherboard DIY
Post by: yssing on March 28, 2018, 11:40:37 PM
Quote from: quenthal;837974
I think hese confirmed on Finnish Amiga forum that next step is to build ATX-compatible version with Prometheus PCI builtin.

That would be extremely amazing... and they will probably sell very fast.
Title: Re: A4000+ Alice motherboard DIY
Post by: pyrre on March 29, 2018, 01:44:38 AM
Quote from: yssing;837996
That would be extremely amazing... and they will probably sell very fast.
I was thinking the same thought. any amiga MB in an ATX form factor would be really desirable.
I know i would get one, or even two.... :D
Title: Re: A4000+ Alice motherboard DIY
Post by: jackflash on March 29, 2018, 04:20:43 AM
Fantastic work, any chance of a redesign to use an fpga in place of the custom chips?
Title: Re: A4000+ Alice motherboard DIY
Post by: Vlabguy1 on March 29, 2018, 01:09:02 PM
So you only had one board made?  Hmm..seems odd.
Title: Re: A4000+ Alice motherboard DIY
Post by: Oldsmobile_Mike on March 29, 2018, 02:08:43 PM
Quote from: Vlabguy1;838010
So you only had one board made?  Hmm..seems odd.

I hope that's not the case. Like these other seemingly bits of unobtainium like the AmiITX and the red A500+ boards, etc. That people who have the incredible technical skill to produce a thing like this, but are seemingly incapable or unwilling to start up a Kickstarter, or a GoFundMe, or whatever, to churn up the funds for mass production. And when  inventory runs out, do another, etc. Dunno, I guess we'll see. :)
Title: Re: A4000+ Alice motherboard DIY
Post by: BozzerBigD on March 29, 2018, 02:18:45 PM
@Vlabguy1

There would be no point telling us about the achievement if the board is never going to be released! He might as well have said he ported Doom to the Amiga in 1995 but just kept it to himself if there will only be one!
Title: Re: A4000+ Alice motherboard DIY
Post by: Vlabguy1 on March 29, 2018, 03:22:52 PM
Quote from: BozzerBigD;838012
@Vlabguy1

There would be no point telling us about the achievement if the board is never going to be released! He might as well have said he ported Doom to the Amiga in 1995 but just kept it to himself if there will only be one!


You don’t know this ..unless you chatted with with OP privately.  That being said there was no mention of a release or multiple boards, even blanks being produced. While cool and neat is there really a yuge market for these boards atm? Can any sort of profit be made?  I seriously doubt it.  But hey if the price is “decent” I might buy one to support the cause. But I currently have plenty of A4000’s and A4000 mb’s.

R.
Title: Re: A4000+ Alice motherboard DIY
Post by: Oldsmobile_Mike on March 29, 2018, 04:23:51 PM
Quote from: Vlabguy1;838017
I currently have plenty of A4000’s and A4000 mb’s.

That must be a nice "problem" to have. :laughing:
Title: Re: A4000+ Alice motherboard DIY
Post by: Vlabguy1 on March 29, 2018, 04:34:38 PM
Quote from: Oldsmobile_Mike;838018
That must be a nice "problem" to have. :laughing:


It is for sure.  There are more on the way though I have been slacking on taking pictures etc.  I want to switch gears from collector to user again.  Soon I keep saying...

R.
Title: Re: A4000+ Alice motherboard DIY
Post by: Acill on March 30, 2018, 02:02:53 AM
I have a project going to have the Rev 2 4000 done with everything being released to the public if funded. Take a look at it here.

https://www.gofundme.com/amiga-4000-replica-with-schematics
Title: Re: A4000+ Alice motherboard DIY
Post by: tbtorro on March 30, 2018, 02:17:36 AM
Well done for the obviously immense amount of work that went into this. :slowclap: Now I know where did all my chips go.. ;)
Title: Re: A4000+ Alice motherboard DIY
Post by: trekiej on March 30, 2018, 02:48:47 AM
I hope to get the A4000(T) I always wanted?
edit:
I am glad to have OS4.1 FE Classic.
We need to make PPC boards now.
Title: Re: A4000+ Alice motherboard DIY
Post by: hese7 on March 30, 2018, 04:07:12 PM
Thanks for the replies.

It took me about 50-75 hours to do the schematics and layout the components on the board. And about 250 hours to do all the routing.

After I have sold my remaining PCBs on Amibay, I will release the project files so you can do more group orders yourself. Or continue developing the project if you wish. I wasn't planning to be the sole provider for the PCBs anyway. I'm more interested in doing new hardware.

@tbtorro
Yep :)
And I bet your remaining stock will go fast.

@all
ATX motherboard is being developed right now and should be ready relatively soon if all goes well.
Title: Re: A4000+ Alice motherboard DIY
Post by: trekiej on March 30, 2018, 04:45:31 PM
I am wondering if the Amiga A4000T schematics would make for a better At build.
Title: Re: A4000+ Alice motherboard DIY
Post by: Iggy on March 30, 2018, 04:46:16 PM
Quote from: hese7;838047
Thanks for the replies.

It took me about 50-75 hours to do the schematics and layout the components on the board. And about 250 hours to do all the routing.

After I have sold my remaining PCBs on Amibay, I will release the project files so you can do more group orders yourself. Or continue developing the project if you wish. I wasn't planning to be the sole provider for the PCBs anyway. I'm more interested in doing new hardware.

@tbtorro
Yep :)
And I bet your remaining stock will go fast.

@all
ATX motherboard is being developed right now and should be ready relatively soon if all goes well.


YEAH! An ATX board, that is what I want!
Title: Re: A4000+ Alice motherboard DIY
Post by: kolla on March 30, 2018, 09:58:33 PM
:banana::banana::banana:
Title: Re: A4000+ Alice motherboard DIY
Post by: nicholas on March 30, 2018, 11:17:32 PM
Quote from: quenthal;837974
I think hese confirmed on Finnish Amiga forum that next step is to build ATX-compatible version with Prometheus PCI builtin.


Sign me up!! :)

An FPGA CPU would be nice too, would be great if MikeJ and hese could collaborate on something.

Or dare I say it, the Vampire team....
Title: Re: A4000+ Alice motherboard DIY
Post by: kolla on March 30, 2018, 11:56:29 PM
Quote from: nicholas;838058

Or dare I say it, the Vampire team....


Don't you mean the Apollo Team?
Title: Re: A4000+ Alice motherboard DIY
Post by: trekiej on March 31, 2018, 12:51:36 AM
I am for an Atx motherboard. Is it a good idea to use sockets as much as possible for expandability? Is it possible to put larger foot prints for fpa chips?
Title: Re: A4000+ Alice motherboard DIY
Post by: B00tDisk on March 31, 2018, 03:46:52 PM
I've hemmed and hawed about getting in to Amiga hardware again for decades but if an ATX board comes out of this, I'm THERE.
Title: Re: A4000+ Alice motherboard DIY
Post by: toRus on April 02, 2018, 08:33:40 AM
Would love to have another new old=classic Amiga but I don't have time or knowledge to do it myself. Either as new machine to last long enough or just as a backup.

Replication/redundancy/diversification is good but it would be great if some parties joined forces and did something great for Amiga; integrate the past and also push forward. I am fed up with Macs/Linux/generic x86 boxes (even kept a Windoze machine for a while many years ago) - they never gave as enjoyment as Amiga did and I am not just being nostalgic (nothing bad about it anyway).