Amiga.org
Amiga computer related discussion => Amiga Software Issues and Discussion => Topic started by: bomrat on April 06, 2018, 02:47:38 AM
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hi, im trying to mount a samba share on my amiga. is there a hosts equivalent for the amiga.
looks like you cannot use ip's
thanks
arlan
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Depends on tcp/ip stack If not available than use another stack. Easynet has such a feature. based on AmiTCP3 I think, or pro on 4.
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Every TCP/IP stack has the hosts file/configuration.
For AmiTCP/IP based stacks (AmiTCP/IP, Genesis, EasyNet?):
AmiTCP:db/hosts
For Miami:
Database->Hosts in GUI
For Roadshow:
Devs:Internet/hosts
For Netstack:
ENVARC:sys/net/hosts
And I'm pretty sure even TermiteTCP has one somewhere :P
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Don't you need a specific SMB client application on the amiga side?
A side question, is there any amiga native network file sharing? (like SMB but for amiga)
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SAMBA for Amiga has a command-line client (SmbClient executable). You can use that to connect to the server (share) and establish a session, then list files, upload, download etc. There are also some SMBMount applications but I haven't tried those. I always use the smbd/nmbd and set the Amiga up as a server and the PC as the client.
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SMBMount and smb-handler (I think it is) work very well, but are a problem with file shares on modern Windows. Our Samba is so old you have to bump down the SMB security in Windows to make it work. I'm not even sure you can do that with Windows 10.
I use both with my NAS. If you don't want to screw with SMB security there is also NFS for Windows and available on most NASes.
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SMBMount and smb-handler (I think it is) work very well, but are a problem with file shares on modern Windows. Our Samba is so old you have to bump down the SMB security in Windows to make it work. I'm not even sure you can do that with Windows 10.
I use both with my NAS. If you don't want to screw with SMB security there is also NFS for Windows and available on most NASes.
Setting up one of my old pcs with W2000 should do the trick then.
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I think LoadWB is referring to smbfs. It is a single executable that enables you to mount SMB shares from the cli and is coded by Olaf Barthel. It is on Aminet. I use it with my NAS and it works very well. For NFS shares with Genesis there is ch_nfsmount included with OS3.9.
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Don't you need a specific SMB client application on the amiga side?
If you want to mount Samba shares on other machines from Amiga, there's absolutely no need to install full Samba installation on Amiga. SMBFS is a stand-alone executable which is just fine for the purpose. You can mount any Samba share as a drive under AmigaOS with it.
A side question, is there any amiga native network file sharing? (like SMB but for amiga)
Yes there is! NetFS Revised (http://aminet.net/package/comm/net/NetFS-revised) is a perfect solution for it. It preservers Amiga's file attributes (Samba doesn't) and everything.
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If you want to mount Samba shares on other machines from Amiga, there's absolutely no need to install full Samba installation on Amiga. SMBFS is a stand-alone executable which is just fine for the purpose. You can mount any Samba share as a drive under AmigaOS with it.
Yes there is! NetFS Revised (http://aminet.net/package/comm/net/NetFS-revised) is a perfect solution for it. It preservers Amiga's file attributes (Samba doesn't) and everything.
reading through the txt file it seems to be very useful...
I could setup my efika of mac mini with Mos as a server of some sort and use the client state on any other amiga in my house with network....
Genius :biglaugh:
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reading through the txt file it seems to be very useful...
I could setup my efika of mac mini with Mos as a server of some sort and use the client state on any other amiga in my house with network....
Genius :biglaugh:
Yeah, I can cross mount all my machines here with it... ram disks, partitions etc :) Easy to tune secondary machines from one "central" machine and copy files here and there. I also sync one machine to another to keep them in exactly the same state.
Here's a guide with screenshots how to configure it:
https://library.morph.zone/Mounting_Network_Drives#NetFS_Revised
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Yeah, I can cross mount all my machines here with it... ram disks, partitions etc :) Easy to tune secondary machines from one "central" machine and copy files here and there. I also sync one machine to another to keep them in exactly the same state.
Here's a guide with screenshots how to configure it:
https://library.morph.zone/Mounting_Network_Drives#NetFS_Revised
Thanks for this. I had completely forgotten about NetFS. I need to try it out.
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Thanks for this. I had completely forgotten about NetFS. I need to try it out.
And especially this NetFS Revised version is a great update to the ancient NetFS.
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Yeah, I can cross mount all my machines here with it... ram disks, partitions etc :)
Don't tell anyone, but back in the days, before NAT routers took over completely, it happened that I found remote Amiga systems of users on IRC that had netfs running and would allow sinister people like me to mount their RAM:, so I could mess with their ENV:sys/palette.prefs etc and see them complain on IRC about how their Amiga was behaving strangely. Good old times :)
Btw - the "true" SMB (aka NetBIOS over TCP/IP) equivalent for Amiga would be Envoy.
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Don't tell anyone, but back in the days, before NAT routers took over completely, it happened that I found remote Amiga systems of users on IRC that had netfs running and would allow sinister people like me to mount their RAM:, so I could mess with their ENV:sys/palette.prefs etc and see them complain on IRC about how their Amiga was behaving strangely. Good old times :)
Btw - the "true" SMB (aka NetBIOS over TCP/IP) equivalent for Amiga would be Envoy.
How do i find the files for Envoy?
Find lots of related stuff on aminet. patches and such...
but seemingly i cant find the actual files.....
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Don't tell anyone, but back in the days, before NAT routers took over completely, it happened that I found remote Amiga systems of users on IRC that had netfs running and would allow sinister people like me to mount their RAM:, so I could mess with their ENV:sys/palette.prefs etc and see them complain on IRC about how their Amiga was behaving strangely. Good old times :)
Yeah, I didn't do any harm to anyone, but sometimes if someone asked for some file, I dumped it to their RAM: disk, and told to check there :) Had to explain two times after that.
But this new version is password protected, and permissions are given in other way, so it's more safe now, and not open by default :) And of course most people are behind NAT too.
How do i find the files for Envoy?
Find lots of related stuff on aminet. patches and such...
but seemingly i cant find the actual files.....
It's a commercial product... I don't remember if it's been given away for free at any point, maybe still under copyrights. And it has some problems with NG systems.
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hi, im fighting eznet setup issues.
my setup is 192.168.0.100
gw is 192.168.0.1
nameserver is 192.168.0.1
nameserver is 4.4.4.4
nameserver is 8.8.8.8
trying to ping 4.4.4.4 cannot
i can ping 8.8.8.8, and 192.168.0.1
cannot ping from my linux server back to the amiga
wierd stuff going on
please help
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nameserver is 4.4.4.4
trying to ping 4.4.4.4 cannot
Are you sure this is what should work for you? Google's name servers are 8.8.8.8 and 8.8.4.4, and this 4.4.4.4 is something else or some ISP specific server.
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Use this DNS https://1.1.1.1/
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Are you sure this is what should work for you? Google's name servers are 8.8.8.8 and 8.8.4.4, and this 4.4.4.4 is something else or some ISP specific server.
4.4.4.4 used to be MCI WorldCom's public DNS server. After it changed hands numerous times it still remained active but a quick query of it today shows it as dead. The IP is now owned by Level3.
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I'm sorry. Every time I see the title of this thread on the front page I just picture this.
(https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/9/91/SambaDeAmigo.jpg)
:-)
bp
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I set up my Samba back in the early 2000s so I kinda just take it for granted now. Took a while and had a lot of help from the Samba group on Yahoo. I had problems with some of the Windows machines with passwords but broke the back of it. I always have to run my own NMBD script to get the thing going and all my shares with other PC's are actioned by clicking icons I created on the Workbench.
These are my notes I made last year to refresh me where all the things are kept and what links I used just in case it all ever fell over. Like I say my notes on my system.
Most PCs work, I have Win95,98 and XP connected.
http://www.scuzzscink.com/amiga/scuzzblog_september17/scuzzblogdseptember17_1501.htm
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I set up my Samba back in the early 2000s so I kinda just take it for granted now. Took a while and had a lot of help from the Samba group on Yahoo. I had problems with some of the Windows machines with passwords but broke the back of it. I always have to run my own NMBD script to get the thing going and all my shares with other PC's are actioned by clicking icons I created on the Workbench.
These are my notes I made last year to refresh me where all the things are kept and what links I used just in case it all ever fell over. Like I say my notes on my system.
Most PCs work, I have Win95,98 and XP connected.
http://www.scuzzscink.com/amiga/scuzzblog_september17/scuzzblogdseptember17_1501.htm
I have no problems running samba on my pcs. i have a couple of linux servers that run SMB files haring. and it works like a charm.
I have bad experience running samba on amiga. and worse experience in the actual file sharing. all files moved over smb protocol needs to be packed to maintain amiga file formating.
But i am going to experiment with my mac mini, morphOS and NetFS
setting up the mac mini as a fileserver. looking into setting it up with larger disks... and so on.
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A useful Samba on amiga guide:
https://sambaforamigaos.wordpress.com/
I used this years ago to set up samba. It is nice to see that it has been updated over the years
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I have no problems running samba on my pcs. i have a couple of linux servers that run SMB files haring. and it works like a charm.
I have bad experience running samba on amiga. and worse experience in the actual file sharing. all files moved over smb protocol needs to be packed to maintain amiga file formating.
But i am going to experiment with my mac mini, morphOS and NetFS
setting up the mac mini as a fileserver. looking into setting it up with larger disks... and so on.
Probably misunderstood the issue, my bad, but I don't get that problem.
Anyway good luck. I used the Samba Yahoo Group when I was needing help. The archive is all still up.
Just an extra note... I've been on the 1200 all night and hooked into a Windows machine and reading all the guides that came with Samba and how to write the config file and so on, and what not to do. Would be useful posting your SMB so that we could have a look at how you have things set up. Struggling to see why you are having the issues. I'm currently backing up my Samba drive onto the Windows machine. Earlier I was playing a number of Amiga animations that I have created and loaded via the network that are stored on the PC using DOpus on the Amiga. In truth I've had very few issues with the network and the Amiga. Mostly I get issues with a dodgy SCSI that I use, but I can put up with that.
When I first set up the network I got great help from the Samba group and there did use to be a very good guide that has sadly gone now, but I still have a copy of all the pages. I do recall there being a real stumbling block with the set up until one last post gave me the answer. Difficult for me to unthread that without going through all the group posts. I do recall passwords being an issue for a while.
Anyway have fun.
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I'm sorry. Every time I see the title of this thread on the front page I just picture this.
Hahaha :laughing:
On a serious note - NetFS was just released with a new version http://aminet.net/package/comm/net/NetFS-revised - I wonder how portable the netfs-server code is, would be great to have NetFS shares on Linux/BSD (and even Windows).
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Hahaha :laughing:
On a serious note - NetFS was just released with a new version http://aminet.net/package/comm/net/NetFS-revised - I wonder how portable the netfs-server code is, would be great to have NetFS shares on Linux/BSD (and even Windows).
Yea... sure would... but how are you going to store files on disks under windows ore linux, AND maintain amiga proprietary file formats under such conditions?
If you have a reasonable solution for that, please let me know. I really wonder.....
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Yea... sure would... but how are you going to store files on disks under windows ore linux, AND maintain amiga proprietary file formats under such conditions?
If you have a reasonable solution for that, please let me know. I really wonder.....
Why not use the same method as UAE (I presume WinUAE and FS-UAE alike, thought I only have experience with the latter) - a metafile amigafile.uaem that contains the Amiga specific filesystem flags. Or what do you mean by "proprietary file formats" in this context?
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Why not use the same method as UAE (I presume WinUAE and FS-UAE alike, thought I only have experience with the latter) - a metafile amigafile.uaem that contains the Amiga specific filesystem flags. Or what do you mean by "proprietary file formats" in this context?
I dont know any solutions to use uae, other than setting up a computer and run it as a server. Im guessing that the netfs will work under uae setup.
but using pc for storing amiga files is a bad thing.
I ran my first UAE setup by only using folders on the host for file storing. thereby overcoming the making of hardfiles.
However... after a while files started to go missing. icons did not work...
plus plus....
posted about it here in 2006 and was immediately encouraged to make hardfiles to maintain file integrity and formating under amiga.
What is meant with file formating.... you have to ask someone who know that better than me.
I am guessing it has to do with read/write, hidden and such "flags"....
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I ran my first UAE setup by only using folders on the host for file storing. thereby overcoming the making of hardfiles.
However... after a while files started to go missing. icons did not work...
plus plus....
posted about it here in 2006 and was immediately encouraged to make hardfiles to maintain file integrity and formating under amiga.
What is meant with file formating.... you have to ask someone who know that better than me.
I am guessing it has to do with read/write, hidden and such "flags"....
Yeah, all those are long time solved problems. Oh, and there is no "hidden" flag, that's not what that H flag is for ;)
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Yeah, all those are long time solved problems. Oh, and there is no "hidden" flag, that's not what that H flag is for ;)
Hidden was just to exemplify what flags might be......
Hidden is very much a flag for windows operating systems. and it is marked with an H
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Hi
I'm still not sure what the issue here is but I have used my Amigas on a home network consisting of a dozen PCs all hard wired through hubs and cables and they all have their shares set up on the Amiga and once logged in using NMBS and their specific SMBFS icon that I created their specific icon becomes available as a folder, and or complete drive to store Amiga files.
There are limitations on the file naming that is set out in the SMBFS guide and Windows restricts the use of certian file names. Over the last two days I have been backing up 2 SCSI drives and a 2.5" drive with 6GB of Amiga data using DOpus. I get one or two issues, but nothing serious. Within that are the current Workbench files of all the Amiga systems. There are only issues with |includes in AMOS, a " " file in MUI and the AUX file in Storage. Also CanDo has one or two example files that won't work and one of my animations is always flagged as busy. I've been backing up and using the PCs for decades now.
I also ZIP and CD copy using the Windows system.
Like I say, not sure whether this is a storage issue or whether you are trying to run programs from the PC side. That to me would be odd given that the Amiga is best at running Amiga programs. Never used an emulator or a Mac Linux etc system. Only use the Amigas and the PC. I also use a very slow system called AmiPC in times of urgent need. All have worked fine. I know what files have issues cus DOpus lets me know. I also have one XP machine set up as my hub or server for all my files which I drag Amiga programs and files off all the time across the network.
The SMBFS guide is very thorough on the various limitations. The program I assume has its limitations, but for me other than file names that the other OS doesn't allow I haven't ever experienced any loss of files and changes to files by the WindowsOS. I did get an odd problem with a file from one of the guides once that although found its way onto the Windows system could not be deleted.
Anyway, no doubt you are talking about something I know little of and I guess I kinda miss the point. It took me a long time to configure my SMB to get it all working properly on all the computers, but since I got it working has never failed. The reason I back up my Samba files and all the various Workbenches is that when I lose a hd I can quickly get back up and running. Fits on a ZIP and CD also so I have other options and even Parnet can get the ball rolling quickly. Networking is so important in keeping my gzillion computers fluid .... wouldn't be without all those wonderful cables. My internet is on a different network. Never cross the streams ... thats a rule not a guide , its the Venkman Rule. My A4000d 18GB is backed up regularly onto PC with no issue.... if I lost that it would be bad. I also only use conventional hard drives and trust me they all are fine. You have to hit the odd one with a hammer but they generally work fine.
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Hi
I'm still not sure what the issue here is but I have used my Amigas on a home network consisting of a dozen PCs all hard wired through hubs and cables and they all have their shares set up on the Amiga and once logged in using NMBS and their specific SMBFS icon that I created their specific icon becomes available as a folder, and or complete drive to store Amiga files.
There are limitations on the file naming that is set out in the SMBFS guide and Windows restricts the use of certian file names. Over the last two days I have been backing up 2 SCSI drives and a 2.5" drive with 6GB of Amiga data using DOpus. I get one or two issues, but nothing serious. Within that are the current Workbench files of all the Amiga systems. There are only issues with |includes in AMOS, a " " file in MUI and the AUX file in Storage. Also CanDo has one or two example files that won't work and one of my animations is always flagged as busy. I've been backing up and using the PCs for decades now.
I also ZIP and CD copy using the Windows system.
Like I say, not sure whether this is a storage issue or whether you are trying to run programs from the PC side. That to me would be odd given that the Amiga is best at running Amiga programs. Never used an emulator or a Mac Linux etc system. Only use the Amigas and the PC. I also use a very slow system called AmiPC in times of urgent need. All have worked fine. I know what files have issues cus DOpus lets me know. I also have one XP machine set up as my hub or server for all my files which I drag Amiga programs and files off all the time across the network.
The SMBFS guide is very thorough on the various limitations. The program I assume has its limitations, but for me other than file names that the other OS doesn't allow I haven't ever experienced any loss of files and changes to files by the WindowsOS. I did get an odd problem with a file from one of the guides once that although found its way onto the Windows system could not be deleted.
Anyway, no doubt you are talking about something I know little of and I guess I kinda miss the point. It took me a long time to configure my SMB to get it all working properly on all the computers, but since I got it working has never failed. The reason I back up my Samba files and all the various Workbenches is that when I lose a hd I can quickly get back up and running. Fits on a ZIP and CD also so I have other options and even Parnet can get the ball rolling quickly. Networking is so important in keeping my gzillion computers fluid .... wouldn't be without all those wonderful cables. My internet is on a different network. Never cross the streams ... thats a rule not a guide , its the Venkman Rule. My A4000d 18GB is backed up regularly onto PC with no issue.... if I lost that it would be bad. I also only use conventional hard drives and trust me they all are fine. You have to hit the odd one with a hammer but they generally work fine.
This is a rather complicated matter to attend to. And i am no expert in the matter myself.
I just remember from the time i started using UAE and stored amiga files under windows managed folders that were mounted in uae as amiga drives. Having dynamic disk sizes was at times convenient.
But as time progressed executing files may cause strange behaviours both on amiga and pc side.
After asking about it here on this board i was promptly persuaded to start using hardfiles instead.
At the time being i was using windows XP
Long filenames and "." or "~" in filenames could at certain times cause malfunctions because windows interpreted the files differently form what the amiga was....
The same behavior could be experienced in using windows (NTFS or god forbid FAT) filesystems to store amiga files in a network.
If you however compress files before storing them the matter is irrelevant because the amiga file attributes or flags are maintained inside the compressed file.
As long as the compressing and uncompressing is happening inside the amiga environment.
What i want is an amiga native filesystem that operates as a file server in my network. completely independent from what my PCs do....
In addition i would have SMB mounted to pick up any media file i need on an amiga.
And i belive i have found a viable solution with NetFS and my Mac mini with MOS.... :D
hope this clears up any misunderstanding, and if i am wrong at any point. please correct me.
If any one feel the need to elaborate even deeper, please feel free to do so.
I wonder at the matter myself, and to understand it better would be nice.
EDIT: Ooooh.. and a side note. Mounting ALL the windows drives as drives in the amiga (UAE) and use dopus 4.0 as a file manager to move or copy (maintain) files on the windows side is a really bad idea....... i have tried...... it worked GREAT for a time, then it suddenly just went awfully bad.... and i had to reformat two pc drives and lost bucket loads of data in the fall.... Highly NOT recommended.
And whether OP has found a solution to his query, i have absolutely no idea...
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Noone ever said using Windows as fileserver for anything else than Windows was a good idea :) A NetFS server for Windows will have the same issues as you have when using SMBFS to mount shares from on a Windows server, it could actually work better, as it would only expect Amiga clients, and hence can compensate using meta files, like FS-UAE does.
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The same behavior could be experienced in using windows (NTFS or god forbid FAT) filesystems to store amiga files in a network.
If you however compress files before storing them the matter is irrelevant because the amiga file attributes or flags are maintained inside the compressed file.
As long as the compressing and uncompressing is happening inside the amiga environment.
Yeah, and as long as it's done with an archiving program that really preservers them. LHA, LZX, ISO files, or similar should be used instead of ZIP, TAR, RAR, or other "alien" archiver.
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Noone ever said using Windows as fileserver for anything else than Windows was a good idea :) A NetFS server for Windows will have the same issues as you have when using SMBFS to mount shares from on a Windows server, it could actually work better, as it would only expect Amiga clients, and hence can compensate using meta files, like FS-UAE does.
Not sure what this means....
What filesystem will contain the actual amiga files regardless of network protocols in use?
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Not sure what this means....
What filesystem will contain the actual amiga files regardless of network protocols in use?
All of them, there's nothing magic about files on Amiga. The problem is meta data, information about the files, the filesystem flags, not the files themselves. A networking filesystem is a network protocol, it's up to the client and server of the protocol to decide what filesystem flags it will present to Amiga DOS. In case the server does not have any understanding of Amiga filesystem flags, the client must translate those to flags that are native to the server, or simply use dedicated meta files on the server for that purpose. Like FS-UAE does with .uaem-files, this has its clear advantages, as it also simplifies rights management/security on the server.
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For a list of what limitations you face when using Windows as a file server...
https://msdn.microsoft.com/en-us/library/aa365247.aspx
Do not use the following reserved names for the name of a file:
CON, PRN, AUX, NUL, COM1, COM2, COM3, COM4, COM5, COM6, COM7, COM8, COM9, LPT1, LPT2, LPT3, LPT4, LPT5, LPT6, LPT7, LPT8, and LPT9. Also avoid these names followed immediately by an extension; for example, NUL.txt is not recommended. For more information, see Namespaces.
So, if Amiga (or Mac, or anything else) wants to write a file "AUX" (as for example "DEVS/DOSDrivers/AUX"), that is a problem. The easy solution that I use, is simply to not have Windows file servers :)
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All of them, there's nothing magic about files on Amiga. The problem is meta data, information about the files, the filesystem flags, not the files themselves. A networking filesystem is a network protocol, it's up to the client and server of the protocol to decide what filesystem flags it will present to Amiga DOS. In case the server does not have any understanding of Amiga filesystem flags, the client must translate those to flags that are native to the server, or simply use dedicated meta files on the server for that purpose. Like FS-UAE does with .uaem-files, this has its clear advantages, as it also simplifies rights management/security on the server.
I see. :)
My plan became the mac mini as soon as i heard abot NetFS. Simpley because it is native amiga in every way. And since i already have the mac mini. it suddenly has a purpose in life. :D
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Yes, of course MorphOS makes that easy. Personally I would enjoy NetFS support on my qnap NAS, and also on the various Raspberry pies I build into my Amiga systems.
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Yes, of course MorphOS makes that easy. Personally I would enjoy NetFS support on my qnap NAS, and also on the various Raspberry pies I build into my Amiga systems.
My nas does not have or support NetFS
i use readynas NV+ and asustor AS204
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My nas does not have or support NetFS
i use readynas NV+ and asustor AS204
Nobody's NAS have support for it. It was speculative talk that "what if" or "could it" -> "then I would" :)
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Nobody's NAS have support for it. It was speculative talk that "what if" or "could it" -> "then I would" :)
aaah... i see:biglaugh:
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I am running a Synology NAS. I wonder how much work it would be to provide NetFS support on that system?
API/SDK guidance is here: https://www.synology.com/en-global/support/developer
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I am running a Synology NAS. I wonder how much work it would be to provide NetFS support on that system?
First a portable open source NetFS server implementation would be needed. Not something that appears to be in the horisont :)