Amiga.org
Amiga computer related discussion => General chat about Amiga topics => Topic started by: Cyberus on March 03, 2004, 03:46:45 PM
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Why is it that Amiga hardware is so expensive?
Sure, its an enthusiast's market, but so is the Apple Mac.
It's something I've thought about before, and I'm sure all of you have thought about it too. We all know that we have to pay the price for being so enthusiastic about a platform that is essentially dead.
But what really brought it home to me, is that I've got a Powerwave PowerMac clone, and I've been spending a bit of time playing around with it and looking at the possibilities - its a PCI based Mac, with 604 processor, that can be upgraded to a G3/G4 by way of an upgrade card (which would cost between about 50 and 200 pounds depending on whether it's a G3 @350MHz or a G4@800MHz), capable of running classic Mac OS (which I'm not a huge fan of so far), Yellow Dog Linux and other Linux distros, Mac OSX. It supports PCI cards obviously, and I can hook up a normal VGA monitor, as the gfx card has both the Apple standard and the VGA standard outs. I can run applications such as Mozilla with ease, and at the fraction of the price of an Amiga.
So I'm asking myself, why am I sitting on all this expensive, ill supported Amiga hardware?
Now it isn't my intention to troll or start a flamewar or whatever, and I realise that the big thing about Amigas is that they run Amiga OS (!). But does anyone else take a step back and think.....why? I can understand why people have lost patience with the Amiga - every other classic system seems to be so much more affordable for a start....
Seriously, it may be evidence of dedication, but spending 300 or 400 quid on upgrading a ten-year-old machine to seven-year-old specification seems to be just plain silliness.
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Why? Because it runs smooth, it's stable and it has not much crashes
It's about useability rather than being up to date. If you aren't dependent of windows (because of your work or so), you can do everything on it (except the newest games and so).
*sigh* it's just so much fussing around with sh*t of these pc's! I do not want to know the amount of burnouts due to this.
btw see also my thread about spyware in bios (!RANT!)
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Because amiga hardware is rare and only produced in small quantities....
Thats the reason....
So for the few companies that still exists, they have to sell them at ridiculous prices to make ends meet :-(
But when os4 is out(yes, its coming) things will change, IF os4+a1 or a1 lite sells in large enough numbers, then companies will see that there can be made cheap hardware and that they can make money on it.
And not to forget that this will also create competition, something that have been missing for a long time.
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The best thing we can do for the Amiga, and its future, is to convince as many as possible to buy it, not only online, but in real life also, talk to relatives, friends, your neighbour, your kids, your....you get the picture :-)
Spread the word!
Then you have done something good for your community :-)
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I agree with restore2003. Tell more people about it and watch the price drop soon.
:-)
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@Cyberus,
It's no secret that I've shared your concerns and queries about the pricing of these parts and the new systems. Speaking strictly for the new systems, there are certainly a lot of "answers" being bandied about, but none of them make much real sense and a majority simply sound like excuses for gouging the remaining community.
I'm not promoting EITHER solution here, but while the $300 Pegasos is a good and acceptable step in the right direction (I've paid $300 for mobo and processor before), there is simply no legitimate reason for an AmigaOne motherboard/processor to cost "$750" or more.
Using a Pegasos, I can (and have) built a full machine -- including 17" monitor -- for around $700 USD. $700 USD is, to me, an acceptable cost for a full Linux-capable PPC solution IF you just can't bear to run Windows or Intel.
I understand economies of scale. I understand that the more you buy/build the cheaper it gets. I understand that the Pegasos is currently a loss leader for Genesi (strictly guessing).
That being said, the problem here is that "Amiga's" and Genesi's markets are embedded and dedicated devices (slot machines, ATMs, set-top boxes, etcetera). In my mind, Such devices would never suffer a $300 cost for a motherboard and processor. I know that the local cable company pays less than $100 for even the latest set top box with DVR capability. Granted, that's an "economy of scale" issue, but there's a point where you simply cannot lower the price of a product by buying more parts. In other words, buying a million processors doesn't get you a 90% discount versus 20% for ten thousand.
That leaves strictly a server market for low power embedded or small-footprint Linux machines. You know, the Sun "Cobalt" and other dedicated Web servers. Even the trend for those devices is "more power" and "lower cost". You can buy dedicated LAN Webservers for under $300 now, so where does this leave "Amiga" (or Genesi for that matter) to turn?
Wayne
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@Wayne:
I agree the a1 shouldn`t cost that much, infact the price should have been cut in half, but thats not likely now :-(
Btw:
Will there ever be an option to delete your own post?
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@restore2003
Not unless the Xoops team writes it in, which is doubtful.
Wayne
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restore2003 wrote:
Spread the word!
I fear they do not want to hear about it from me anymore. I fear they get mentally disturbed if I mention Amiga once more :lol:
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Then use hypnosis :crazy:
Or sales marketing techniques :rtfm:
:-)
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Yay! 500! :pint:
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Because.
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restore2003 wrote:
Then use hypnosis :crazy:
Or sales marketing techniques :rtfm:
:-)
hm, hypnosis would work I think, though I need some practice.
But I really can't do marketing techniques, my brain is not built for that.
I'll go for the hypnosis then :inquisitive: :-o :crazy:
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The best thing we can do for the Amiga, and its future, is to convince as many as possible to buy it, not only online, but in real life also, talk to relatives, friends, your neighbour, your kids, your....you get the picture
But when someone asks "Why?", what do you say? Just think of software base.
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And not to forget that this will also create competition, something that have been missing for a long time.
Aint there competition already?
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I don't think it would be too good to "spread the word" too much yet...
I mean, if you get someone interested, he buys A1, then what? Debian or some other Linux distro?
I'd say better wait for at least public beta of AOS4 before making THAT much noise...
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@itix:
Aint there competition already?
You are joking right? :-?
What other alternative is there for os4? Only Eyetech`s a1 og micro a1.
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(edited: Uh forget it. I misread the post. ;/)
You're right. If you want to run OS4, A1 has no alternative.
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If you want to run OS4, A1 has no alternative.
CyberstormPPC or BlizardPPC maybe?
Yes, those aren't "sensible" options for "AmigaOS4-only" computer imho... But those 3 are the only current options for now...
(Of course there's 4th option, "wait-and-see", hardware like SharkPPC or other PPC hardware might be supported in the future, but only 3 options are confirmed for now)
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As for the older systems I would have to agree somewhat about the availiabilty of the hardware. Especially the stuff for the Big Box's (which I'm a proud owner of 2 A4k's and A2k).
Still waiting for another chance to get ahold of a CSPPC for my first Miggy, I think about the current status of the Amiga world. I think some of these people are trying to be emotion profiteers. It seems that every time I mention "Amiga" in a chat room, irc room, what be it, people usually end up telling me about their fun times with theirs, and ask, "Did they get that NEW os out yet"
Yeah, I think because so many people are so hungry for the New Amiga. The New OS. The Messiah that will lead them out of the dark, that some of the companies supplying it think they can play on that emotion. Yes Amiga people seem to be more emotionally attached to their systems then Macintosh people. That's just my 2ยข .
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Hey you lay down all the {bleep} and negative talk about Expensive Amiga because it isnt rigt time for that now!!!
wait and se one or two year,,,And we see Amiga Community come together and bring us the best solution for what we all
want of an Amiga!
!!!,,,WHY drive BMW when you can drive Skoda?Skoda is much cheaper!
We Just love the Amiga Computer concept with Amiga operating system!
Windoze,Mac OS and Linux doesnt give you the right feeling of computing, like Amiga!
all the talk about expensive AmigaOne Computer is useless right now,, HeY you ,i dont agree with you!,,1300 euro isnt much money if you really want a Amiga PowerPC based system!!
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Plexus wrote:
wait and se one or two year,,,
Another two years? We've been waiting 10 so far.
!!!,,,WHY drive BMW when you can drive Skoda?Skoda is much cheaper!
You've obviously never had a BMW.
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@justthatgood
I really agree with that. the amiga die hards should have controlled their obsession and gave the likes of Eyetech the middle finger instead of shelling out stupid amounts of money to dodgy companies who are clearly going out of their way to screw every last dime from Amiga users.
Tell more people about it and watch the price drop soon
Yeah right as if with the likes of Eyetech, they are not a professional company anymore but more like a bunch of bats sucking every last drop of blood from Amiga users necks.
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Pah, that's easy, to run the OS we like... we been using it for so long. Many of us have started to learn coding stuff on it too.
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I must admit that I allways had a my team kinda like felling for the AMiga though... but that was when the Amiga's custum chipset was on it's days...
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plexus wrote:
Hey you lay down all the {bleep} and negative talk about Expensive Amiga because it isnt rigt time for that now!!!
wait and se one or two year,,,And we see Amiga Community come together and bring us the best solution for what we all
want of an Amiga!
!!!,,,WHY drive BMW when you can drive Skoda?Skoda is much cheaper!
We Just love the Amiga Computer concept with Amiga operating system!
Windoze,Mac OS and Linux doesnt give you the right feeling of computing, like Amiga!
all the talk about expensive AmigaOne Computer is useless right now,, HeY you ,i dont agree with you!,,1300 euro isnt much money if you really want a Amiga PowerPC based system!!
I wasn't actually referring to the cost of next gen Amigas when I wrote that post, I was thinking at the time of the relative expense of PPC cards for classic Amigas.
Compared with pretty much ANY platform, using the Amiga is expensive. I was just asking why, both 'why' in a question sense, and also 'why' in a rhetorical sense, like in desperation, "Why?!".
Just think how expensive Apple stuff has always been, but Mac hardware a few years old doesn't command a premium like Amiga hardware.
Perhaps its because Amiga fans are more devoted and are willing to pay more for secondhand cards, perhaps its because the user base is so small and therefore the product more expensive, perhaps new products in *some* cases are more expensive because sellers know it is a market of devotees and they can charge more, but maybe that's unlikely. But all of that's beside the point, its expensive to buy decent Amiga hardware!