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Amiga computer related discussion => Amiga Hardware Issues and discussion => Topic started by: toples50 on November 07, 2016, 05:25:38 PM
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Hi,my beloved Amiga 2000 does not work.I have removed the battery I washed the motherboard in dishwasher but nothing.It can't boot.I have either grey or blue screen floppy drives does not make the usually sound and also I can't boot with the combination ctrl+A+A.
I need help because I have the Amiga since 1992...I can provide pics if necessary.
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How bad was the battery leak? You've removed & reseated all the custom chips? Please tell us it was 100% dry from its adventure through the dishwasher (and that you didn't use "heated dry"), before powering it on! :shocked:
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Battery hadn't any liquid so it wasn't bad at all.I haven't removed any chip and i Let motherboard about a week before use it again.The same symptoms had the machine before remove and wash the battery and motherboard.
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We need more info to be able to help. What hardware do you have (hard drive?, etc) and what actually started the trouble?
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I would remove all accessories and every expansion board, and make sure you're connected to a working display. Does the "Insert Workbench" logo appear when you turn on the power?
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Hi,my beloved Amiga 2000 does not work.I have removed the battery I washed the motherboard in dishwasher but nothing.It can't boot.I have either grey or blue screen floppy drives does not make the usually sound and also I can't boot with the combination ctrl+A+A.
I need help because I have the Amiga since 1992...I can provide pics if necessary.
Wait a sec. people actually put motherboards in the dishwasher?
Just curious.
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Wait a sec. people actually put motherboards in the dishwasher?
Just curious.
I've heard of it. None too good for metal contacts for chips. I would clean and reseat everything.
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Wait a sec. people actually put motherboards in the dishwasher?
Just curious.
I've done it with keyboards here at the office. Toss a bunch of them in the dishwasher in the break room when they get too cruddy. Works pretty well, although if you use the heated dry it cooks them dead, 100% of the time. Also just a pinch of detergent, anything more than that and it'll bleach the keys and leave them streaky (at least, that's what happens with those generic black Dell keyboards). Set them in front of a fan for a couple days, flipping them every few hours, to dry.
If OP wasn't super-careful on those above two matters, his board is probably dead (err, deader than it already was, anyway).
For motherboards I use QD Electronics Cleaner, or some similar-type spray. Never thrown one of those into the wash. Yet. :D
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I haven't any expansion boards or any extra cards.The insert workbench logo does not appear at the start.Just grey or blue screen.Also drives lights are always on and power light also is always on without flashing.I heard from someone that I have to push the custom chips one by one.
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What version of Kickstart do you have installed? A quick google search for Amiga boot colors can give you some more information:
http://wiki.classicamiga.com/Amiga_boot_error_code_colours
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Its 1.3 version.
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Could you post close-up pics of the battery area?
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Ok I will do it tomorrow.
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Do i have to post more detailed pics?(from under the motherboard).
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Even though the angle of the photo doesn't show it, the corrosion seems to have reached up near pin one. You could pull the CPU and examine the sock et.
I have one that I had to replace the socket on that had similar damage.
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I wil post more detailed pics later this week.
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You've posted pictures from every angle except the one that would actually show the damage. :(
You'll probably need to remove the CPU for a thorough cleaning, and/or replace the CPU socket, if corrosion has reached it. Perhaps trying with a CPU card installed, which disables the built-in 68000. Slim chance this might help with your diagnoses...
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Some more pics from the Amiga.
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As you can see for yourself, you're definitely going to need to remove and clean or replace your 68000 socket. Check continuity on that resistor and other components, as well.
Edit: That 68000 looks like crud, too. It can probably be cleaned, but might as well just pay the $5 bucks for a 68010 on ebay - they're 3-5% faster and allow you to make use of things like the 'Quit' key in WHDLoad software. :)
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Hi,my beloved Amiga 2000 does not work.I have removed the battery I washed the motherboard in dishwasher but nothing.It can't boot.I have either grey or blue screen floppy drives does not make the usually sound and also I can't boot with the combination ctrl+A+A.
I need help because I have the Amiga since 1992...I can provide pics if necessary.
Sorry to hear of your amiga trouble. but for all readers here PLEASE DO NOT WASH YOUR AMIGA MOTHERBOARDS IN DISHWASHERS I DONT CARE WHAT YOU READ ON FORUMS!
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I don't think damaged from dishwasher.I think the problem was the battery.Now what can I do?
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I washed the motherboard in dishwasher but nothing.It can't boot.I
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[sarcasm]
You just washed it in a dishwasher and expect it to work?
No way - a dishwasher treatment is not sufficient.
Nah - you need to use a sandblaster to do the trick...
[/sarcasm]
:roflmao::laughing::laugh1:
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I don't think damaged from dishwasher.I think the problem was the battery.Now what can I do?
The best option is probably a professional repair service. However, if you want to solder yourself and except to have some fun with it, here's what I would do:
First, remove the CPU socket and try to get a new one. This one looks really damaged. Try to clean the CPU pins as good as possible. The pins cannot make contact in the shape they currently are. An eraser might be useful to get some of the oxygen from the pins. They should be metal-blank, not copper-green as they are now.
Following that, try to check all the traces on the board. The way how they look is a good indication that some of them are dead and not connected to anything. You probably have to replace some of them with jumper wire to make them work again.
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And these big sockets, since it may already be damaged are easiest to remove destructively. Put something under to protect the board and pry the plastic off the pins. Then you can easily desolder one pin at a time.
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An eraser might be useful to get some of the oxygen from the pins.
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You mean "oxide", don't you? (Oxygen = Sauerstoff)
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I don't think damaged from dishwasher.I think the problem was the battery.Now what can I do?
The battery no doubt was the cause of your problem, just hope the dishwasher didn't introduce more problems. The biggest problem is how fast you can get it dry. If you have drops of water, say, inside a socket for hours or days, not a good thing :-(.
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Looks to me like you need to clean the socket contacts and CPU pins, probably nothing more.
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Looks to me like you need to clean the socket contacts and CPU pins, probably nothing more.
I doubt that the socket can be cleaned to the degree that it can be made working reliably again. No matter about that, it's a cheap replacement part. The problem might be to solder the corroded connections.
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Yes, I agree after looking at those photos again. If the CPU contacts are perfectly clean (use emery cloth), and if the green contacts are cleaned (use finest flatblade screwdriver to score a clean contact on each pin) then it would probably work but yeah, to replace the socket will surely be more reliable.
It's a stark warning though isn't it, to never ever under any circumstances neglect batteries or electrolytic capacitors. I'm guilty of it too, I have systems I need to check and recap both Amiga and others, and I bet I'm not alone either in this respect.
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And these big sockets, since it may already be damaged are easiest to remove destructively. Put something under to protect the board and pry the plastic off the pins. Then you can easily desolder one pin at a time.
Easy way is to flush cut the legs to get the socket out of the way, then use a solder sucker to suck them out of the board one at a time.
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OP could try Silvo or Brasso first with cotton wool buds instead of emery cloth come to think of it. In any case, personally I'd use Silvo afterwards to get the pins nice and shiny.
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Thanks guys!I will try to fix it...
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I've washed a lot of electronics in dishwashers over the years, including complete CRT monitors when they were really nasty and have had few issues although it's best to remove the flyback and/or focus divider if that is attempted. Electronics that have come from heavy smokers are nasty and going through the dishwasher removes most of the sticky disgusting nicotine/dust sludge that makes them really unpleasant to work on. When boards are manufactured they are washed in a similar process to clean off the soldering flux and other debris. That said, you have to know what you're doing, some parts like potentiometers and switches are not sealed and do not tolerate such aggressive washing well, and dishwashing detergent is quite alkaline and can cause corrosion if it becomes trapped so I use only a very small amount.
For high value vintage stuff like Amiga parts I recommend hand washing in a sink, use a small amount of liquid dish soap and a toothbrush or similar to gently scrub the nooks and crannies. If the water in your area has minerals in it I recommend rinsing with distilled water or isopropyl alcohol. After washing, allow it to dry thoroughly, I use compressed air to blow all the water out of spaces under chips where it likes to become trapped, then I set the board over a heat vent for several days to allow it to thoroughly dry before powering it up.
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Im assuming the guy didnt use detergent! Even just with water you have several problems:
1. High heat. Alot of these old components barely hanging on just the heat alone could ruin them
2. Breakage: running through high heat with water jets you can cause all kinds of problems with caps and resistors coming loose.
3. Toxicity for your food. Washing a corroded electronic board in a dishwasher can make your plates and cups toxic
so AGAIN PLEASE DONT WASH AMIGAS IN THE DISHWASHER,. and yes you may have further ruined the board by doing so luckily there is no shortage of a2000 mbs and they are cheap.
I've washed a lot of electronics in dishwashers over the years, including complete CRT monitors when they were really nasty and have had few issues although it's best to remove the flyback and/or focus divider if that is attempted. Electronics that have come from heavy smokers are nasty and going through the dishwasher removes most of the sticky disgusting nicotine/dust sludge that makes them really unpleasant to work on. When boards are manufactured they are washed in a similar process to clean off the soldering flux and other debris. That said, you have to know what you're doing, some parts like potentiometers and switches are not sealed and do not tolerate such aggressive washing well, and dishwashing detergent is quite alkaline and can cause corrosion if it becomes trapped so I use only a very small amount.
For high value vintage stuff like Amiga parts I recommend hand washing in a sink, use a small amount of liquid dish soap and a toothbrush or similar to gently scrub the nooks and crannies. If the water in your area has minerals in it I recommend rinsing with distilled water or isopropyl alcohol. After washing, allow it to dry thoroughly, I use compressed air to blow all the water out of spaces under chips where it likes to become trapped, then I set the board over a heat vent for several days to allow it to thoroughly dry before powering it up.
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so AGAIN PLEASE DONT WASH AMIGAS IN THE DISHWASHER,. and yes you may have further ruined the board by doing so luckily there is no shortage of a2000 mbs and they are cheap.
Where are you finding cheap a2000 boards?
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Where are you finding cheap a2000 boards?
"cheap" is a relative term. At least they show up on ebay pretty frequently, which is a lot more than I can say for 1200/3000/4000's. Thanks, hoarders. :(
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I'm sure the hoarders would love to buy up 1200's/3000's/4000's, but you said so yourself - there are non available. There are plenty of 1200's in the UK though, but A4000's and A3000's are more of a rarity here.
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"cheap" is a relative term. At least they show up on ebay pretty frequently, which is a lot more than I can say for 1200/3000/4000's. Thanks, hoarders. :(
If I could find a cheap A2000 board I could maybe use it to get mine working.
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Few questions:
When you switched the machine on did the power light flash ?
If you have a hard drive was there any hard drive light activity? Any.
Again if hard drive was the light on all the time for a while ?
Did the keyboard caps light flash on and off constantly ?
The screen monitor, was the image static or did it flash differing shades ?
When you pushed in the floppy was there any drive activity ?
Have you left the machine running for a long time and if so does the power light begin to flash, or stop flashing and stay on constant say. And if the screen is flashing after a while does it stop flashing.
I have an A2000HD with a mind of its own and its a bit like my old Austin A35 in that it wants a little TLC in booting. I always fix my computers by taking very tiny steps and just dealing with one thing at a time. Doing anything drastic could very well create more issues sadly. All is not lost though. A2000s are very hardy.
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I will send the Amiga to an expert to repair it!I want the machine back to life...
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I will send the Amiga to an expert to repair it!I want the machine back to life...
Good luck. A2000's are durable, but I think when people hear what you've already done to it, most are going to be pretty wary. :(
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I really wouldn't worry about it too much. Over the years I've washed literally hundreds of PCBs in the dishwasher. A couple of times I had some of the solder mask flake off but I can't think of a single instance where a component failure occurred. This was monitor chassis's, 80s motherboards, arcade game logic boards, expansion cards, you name it, when I was repairing this stuff pretty frequently it was nearly standard procedure to wash the stuff before I started working on it once I had done the initial checkout. As long as you get it thoroughly dried out I would be seriously shocked if any parts were damaged by the washing.
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Boards and water/dishwasher o.0
x)
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Boards and water/dishwasher o.0
x)
The board is one problem. But I wouldn't want to put my dishes into this dishwater afterwards anymore. (-;
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For the most part water does not hurt electronics, as long as they are dried out before power is applied. Most components are sealed, the only thing you have to watch out for are things like switches and pots where water can get in and it's hard to get it out. Like I said, I did it for years, I for a while I was repairing a lot of monitors and boards that had been exposed to cigarette smoke or machine shop coolant vapor. The stuff is nasty, leaves a sticky film all over everything. Normally I ran them through the dishwasher before I worked on them, made it so much more pleasant. Literally hundreds of boards, it worked for me, but YMMV. In retrospect the potential for lead contamination of the dishes is a somewhat of a concern but that's in the past. Now I wash in the sink with a toothbrush when needed, it's easier to protect the labels and keep water out of sensitive parts without removing them. Final rinse with isopropyl alcohol makes it dry out much quicker.
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Well, if you're looking for someone to repair it, I'm happy to help. I've repaired 2 A2000s (and a A500+), all now running strong, and all were in MUCH worse shape than your's is currently.
I can't see your location, but send me a PM and maybe we can work something out.