Amiga.org
Amiga computer related discussion => General chat about Amiga topics => Topic started by: dandelion on October 30, 2016, 02:15:53 PM
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I know that Commodore was not without its fault (ahem!) but every time I watch Deathbed Vigil I'm struck by the dedication and sheer passion the teams had for the Amiga and Commodore. Perhaps it was a different, simpler time, where people felt a greater tribal loyalty to the company they worked at, to the point where it was a large part of their identity and gave them significant meaning in life. Perhaps today people have more individualised searches for meaning and identities are far more complex and varied - multitudes of threads combined in a multitude of ways. Are there companies today which engender the same passion from their staff to the products they create?
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Apple?
Tesla?
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Apple?
Tesla?
Apple is right opposite of Commodore and Amiga. Apple has %&$#?@!%&$#?@!%&$#?@!%&$#?@!ty overpriced products and great marketing.
Commodore used to have great product (Amiga) and %&$#?@!%&$#?@!%&$#?@!%&$#?@!ty marketing...
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Apple is right opposite of Commodore and Amiga. Apple has %&$#?@!%&$#?@!%&$#?@!%&$#?@!ty overpriced products and great marketing.
Commodore used to have great product (Amiga) and %&$#?@!%&$#?@!%&$#?@!%&$#?@!ty marketing...
Amiga pricing wasn't that kind either.
Although you're right about Commodore marketing, it really sucked.
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Newtek, they supported the Amiga years after its production ended with hardware like The video Toaster/flyer and groundbreaking software like Lightwave 3D. They are still in business selling PC based video editing hardware and software including Lightwave 3D. They dont get nearly as much credit as they should. They even did repairs to video toaster hardware for no cost till about 5 years ago when they finally ran out of parts.
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I'll go out on a limb and say that if you look at "cleverness"(which I think the Amiga had plenty of) then I'm keeping an eager eye on Mill Computing and what they (hopefully) will come up with.
Having watched all(?) their presentations it feels like one of those times when everything fits with everything else. I hope none of the big CPU companies buy them out before they bring something to market.
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I would say anything Elon Musk touches. Even just reading the Wikipedia summary about him makes him sound like a gosh-darn American Hero.
Disclaimer: I own stock in Tesla, lol. :laugh1:
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Apple is right opposite of Commodore and Amiga. Apple has %&$#?@!%&$#?@!%&$#?@!%&$#?@!ty overpriced products and great marketing.
Commodore used to have great product (Amiga) and %&$#?@!%&$#?@!%&$#?@!%&$#?@!ty marketing...
I disagree... in the sense that the question was about loyalty. So in that context, Apple certainly fits. In terms of ethics and products you are right, of course.
Also, I hate to admit it, but employees of Microsoft always make my head spin, when it comes to company loyalty...
Yet, nothing beats the Amiga comunity... Heck, Commodore has been dead for so many years and I bet most of us would jump at a chance to work for them...
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Amiga was such a small team, though. I mean how many people work on the latest iPhone, compared to something like the Amiga 1000? All Amigas were designed by small, dedicated teams, mostly because Commodore didn't want to spend anything on R&D.
These days, it's not a small group of pioneers changing the world of technology. You're just another expendable worker drone in a huge mega-corporation like Google, MS or Apple. No one will ask you to put your signature inside the latest iPad or Surface or whatever. If you leave, there will be hundreds ready to take your place.
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Amiga was such a small team, though. I mean how many people work on the latest iPhone, compared to something like the Amiga 1000? All Amigas were designed by small, dedicated teams, mostly because Commodore didn't want to spend anything on R&D.
These days, it's not a small group of pioneers changing the world of technology. You're just another expendable worker drone in a huge mega-corporation like Google, MS or Apple. No one will ask you to put your signature inside the latest iPad or Surface or whatever. If you leave, there will be hundreds ready to take your place.
The A1000 was mostly designed before commodore bought them & so the lack of R&D money wasn't commodores fault. From listening to the stories from the people who were there, I get the impression that commodore provided them with more money than they had ever seen for R&D.
The A500 was probably the last money well spent by commodore though & it caused a permanent rift between Amiga and commodore. After that they started pouring money into AAA, which was never going to be good.
More people worked on the A1000 than we have heard from & Apple just buy in all the components anyway. So it's kinda hard to compare, but if you did try then you should include the people who worked on the 68000 and the 8520's as well.
It's not such a small team & not all of them got their signature on the case. But yeah the marketing outside the UK sucked (in the UK it was good enough for a while).
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I think most of the magic from those days (regardless of what brand you had, except maybe lame IBM) was because home computing was new. It was a novelty. Not everyone had one. If you had one, you were in the minority, and, thought of as maybe a little weird. Nowadays, if you don't have a computer, you're viewed as a little weird.
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Amiga pricing wasn't that kind either.
Although you're right about Commodore marketing, it really sucked.
Im not so sure. Commodore was successful in implying that amiga is something special, something for "creative minds". The release involving an appointment of andrzej warhola and deborah harry speaks lenths about it i think. Till today amiga users, or people who consider themselves to be that, think of them as being something special. Id call it deep implied indoctrination contrary to some shortsighted propaganda. It has even survived decades after the decline of the company.
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I know others have already disagreed with me in another thread but current (non-mainstream distro) Linux. The same 'here is all the design, go hack it' is still alive.
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I think back then, computing was at the beginning of it's journey and the new possibilities, with the imagination and skills of the original Commodore team made a great community project. Apart from the marketing side of things, the word caught on that the Amiga is a capable machine offering amazings spec at that time! :)
Computing nowadays seems to be more homogenized, with a hotch-potch of basically the same features with a few variations and advancments now and then.
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I think back then, computing was at the beginning of it's journey and the new possibilities, with the imagination and skills of the original Commodore team made a great community project. Apart from the marketing side of things, the word caught on that the Amiga is a capable machine offering amazings spec at that time! :)
Computing nowadays seems to be more homogenized, with a hotch-potch of basically the same features with a few variations and advancments now and then.
Your right. Back in the day the A1000 became the target of everyone, MS, Apple were gunning for the ingenuity that made it what it was.
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I would say anything Elon Musk touches. Even just reading the Wikipedia summary about him makes him sound like a gosh-darn American Hero.
Disclaimer: I own stock in Tesla, lol. :laugh1:
Musk is a very sharp guy, but from what I hear he's quite an a-hole on a personal level, possibly sociopathic. Most guys reaching his level of success are to some degree, Steve Jobs, Bill Gates, Jeff Bezos, extremely driven, meticulous, workaholics. Their job is their life and they are unable to relate to the fact that many people do not want to place their job above all else in life.
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Newtek, they supported the Amiga years after its production ended with hardware like The video Toaster/flyer and groundbreaking software like Lightwave 3D. They are still in business selling PC based video editing hardware and software including Lightwave 3D. They dont get nearly as much credit as they should. They even did repairs to video toaster hardware for no cost till about 5 years ago when they finally ran out of parts.
Not to mention they released the source code for the original Toaster software, how many other tech companies do you see doing that? Personally I think it should happen far more often, both for historical reasons, and to allow continued development of long-dead products. I would like to see schematics and firmware for any microcontrollers, ROMs, PLDs, etc released for any hardware device that is discontinued as well to allow it to be repaired.
As for the computer industry in general, computers were new and exciting back in the days of the Amiga. Technology was evolving at a breakneck pace. Computers were never quite powerful enough for what you wanted to do, a computer that was a year old was getting obsolete, 2-3 years old and it was so far behind that it was practically useless. Today things have matured, general purpose PC's are so powerful that the available computing power has vastly outstripped the needs of the average user. Case in point, until a couple years ago I was using a nearly 10 year old desktop as my primary PC and it was perfectly adequate for most of what I needed, I was using it for PCB CAD and even some light FPGA development and it did alright. The main reason I upgraded was so that I could do video transcoding and I plan to use the i7 I have now for 10+ years. Software used to improve constantly with each version adding new capabilities and improved features. These days whenever I update to a new version it's more like ok what useful features did they take out, what new bugs does it have and where did they move everything around to? I no longer look forward to new versions and rarely upgrade at all until forced. The whole industry is mature and the magic is gone. The personal computer has reached ubiquitous commodity status.
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A software update in Amiga land = faster, more efficient software (happiness).
A software update on anything else = I want to chuck this piece of crap out the window and then jump myself.
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Roku ?
Kamelito
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Im not so sure. Commodore was successful in implying that amiga is something special, something for "creative minds". The release involving an appointment of andrzej warhola and deborah harry speaks lenths about it i think. Till today amiga users, or people who consider themselves to be that, think of them as being something special. Id call it deep implied indoctrination contrary to some shortsighted propaganda. It has even survived decades after the decline of the company.
Indoctrination vs propaganda?
Scary choice of words.
I'd prefer to think I make up my own mind on the merits of such matters without undue weight given to outside influences.
Personally, I never would have found the Amiga interesting without the 68K processor.
The chipset was only middling to fair, personally I think Paula left a lot of room for improvement.
And AGA wasn't quite what it could have been as an upgrade.
Its a pity that the '060 was never really taken full advantage of.
If the Amiga had been more sucessful, perhaps Motorola would have kept developing that design.
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I suspect the 68K would have run its course either way, I think it had pretty much reached the limits of the architecture and that's why the industry moved on to other designs. The 68040 ran hot and struggled to reach 40MHz and likely would not have scaled much higher. Personally I think the genius of the Amiga was the chipset, even if imperfect for a while it was far and away ahead of anything else out there in terms of graphics and sound in a personal computer. When the A500 came out most mid-range PCs had 286 CPUs, CGA or EGA framebuffer graphics and little more than a beeper for sound. By the early 90s with the advent of sound cards and improved graphics cards for the ubiquitous PC clones the Amiga lost some of its advantage combined with Commodore falling behind in improving it. I suspect that the Amiga could have been just as easily developed around Intel CPUs and the end result would have been similar. From the user perspective it doesn't matter what CPU is inside, the competing architectures had broadly similar processing capability. It's what the surrounding hardware and software does with that capability that makes the experience. As an example, the original Macintosh machines used the same 68000 as the original Amigas and provided a completely different experience.