Amiga.org
Amiga computer related discussion => Amiga Marketplace => Topic started by: Acill on September 06, 2016, 01:19:04 PM
-
Check it out! A tester is selling his system before you can even get the Vampire V2 for the 500.
http://www.ebay.ca/itm/322249615287
-
It's hard to know if this is legit or not. Some things in the description don't seem right and he's listed it in remote control toy batteries category. The category is why I didn't see it in the searches I follow.
-
It's hard to know if this is legit or not. Some things in the description don't seem right and he's listed it in remote control toy batteries category. The category is why I didn't see it in the searches I follow.
"I have approval to sell this so support will not be an issue."
-
Is it normal for people to leave circuit boards floating around inside computer cases?
It's something I'd never do, so I wouldn't buy that even of I wanted it.
-
Is it normal for people to leave circuit boards floating around inside computer cases?
It's something I'd never do, so I wouldn't buy that even of I wanted it.
Seems like a pretty awkward location. How are people supposed to mount that thing? Also, ugh, a barrel battery. :p
-
It's hard to know if this is legit or not. Some things in the description don't seem right and he's listed it in remote control toy batteries category. The category is why I didn't see it in the searches I follow.
it's legit since it looks like it's kipper himself selling it
-
Back to the future!
-
it's legit since it looks like it's kipper himself selling it
You might want to re-read that, lol. :p
-
What are those ball things on the motherboard oscillator? One looks like a solder ball, the other one looks brown.
LOL all these nit picks...you'd think we'd have bigger fish to fry :)
-
You might want to re-read that, lol. :p
what's wrong with salmon selling Amiga gear? now if it was a shark that's another thing ;-)
-
this price is sick total JOKE :angry: bull%&$#?@!%&$#?@!%&$#?@!%&$#?@! emulator fpga for that price ehhh
-
this price is sick total JOKE :angry: bull%&$#?@!%&$#?@!%&$#?@!%&$#?@! emulator fpga for that price ehhh
FPGA is not emulation, stop the nonsense.
-
> it's kipper himself selling it
perhaps selling on Auctions Site some ready to run A500s + Vampire V2 may help to finance the vampire project, no?
-
It's not Kipper selling it. Where anywhere in the description does it say that that account belongs to Kipper? Also don't you think if it was actually Kipper, that he would at least be able to list it in the correct category, and not be selling it with a messed up floppy drive, etc.?
-
@ Oldsmobile_Mike
you might want to re-read that;)
-
@ Oldsmobile_Mike
you might want to re-read that;)
Already did. Show me where it says "I am Kipper2k". :p
-
Already did. Show me where it says "I am Kipper2k". :p
show me where I say defintively that it is him:biglaugh:
-
show me where I say defintively that it is him:biglaugh:
Hi,
Quick note, i do not sell anything on Ebay, i am too cheap to pay their fees :)
-
FPGA is not emulation, stop the nonsense.
Of course it is, so that's hardly nonsense.
BTW - Why hasn't anyone pointed out the A600 Vampire2 that has popped up on eBay.
-
Wonder what the reserve was. It didnt sell because of lower bids.
-
Hi,
Quick note, i do not sell anything on Ebay, i am too cheap to pay their fees :)
lol I figured more than one Vampire Beta Tester in North Bay, Ontario would be unrealistic but I'm happy to say I'm proven wrong:hammer:
-
Of course it is.
No it isn't, there is no translation of code going on.
-
lol I figured more than one Vampire Beta Tester in North Bay, Ontario would be unrealistic but I'm happy to say I'm proven wrong:hammer:
I am in Thunder Bay, not north Bay, there is also someone selling their v600 board. Once they receive their order we cannot prevent the resale of it, if people want to take the opportunity to try to make extra cash then it is up to them to face the wrath of the forum boards :)
-
No it isn't, there is no translation of code going on.
It loads code every time it restarts. That configuration makes it emulation.
If we have a difference of opinion, lets just leave it a that.
Because its my opinion that if its running on anything but dedicated silicon, its an emulation.
-
I am in Thunder Bay, not north Bay, there is also someone selling their v600 board. Once they receive their order we cannot prevent the resale of it, if people want to take the opportunity to try to make extra cash then it is up to them to face the wrath of the forum boards :)
"Squirrely wrath" of the forum boards. :lol::lol:
-
No it isn't, there is no translation of code going on.
Translating code is not a requirement or definition of an emulator.
An FPGA isn't a 68000 and it isn't using any of the original logic, therefore it's an emulation.
FPGA's even use software, so you can't differentiate by calling them software and hardware emulation.
The differentiation I think you are arguing about would be parallel vs sequential emulation. That is the only inherent difference between cpu's and fpgas. A cpu multiplexes it's logic gates, while an fpga has logic gates permanently allocated. The main difference is latency, as you can't make lots of things happen at exactly the same time.
But why let reality get in the way of defining a pejorative.
-
Because its my opinion that if its running on anything but dedicated silicon, its an emulation.
So the Motorola 68K is an emulator? Because the 68K source code is, actually, not run on real silicon, but is interpreted by the microcode interpreter that is built into the 68K.
-
So the Motorola 68K is an emulator? Because the 68K source code is, actually, not run on real silicon, but is interpreted by the microcode interpreter that is built into the 68K.
I think you're over playing the mask rom and state machine in the 68000 to build a straw man.
Obviously a 68000 isn't an emulator as it's the real thing and to emulate something you have to try to appear to be something else.
An FPGA programmed to appear to be a 68000, is an emulation. The vampire could also be programmed to emulate a c64 or pc if you put the effort in.
You might think that Vampire is great and winuae is %&$#?@!%&$#?@!%&$#?@!%&$#?@!, but both are emulators. They are just different types of emulators. Deal with it.
-
An emulator takes a native code and translates it into a desrination code, a fpga in this instance actually configures the inner gates to become a 68k processor. Depending on how you tell the program to internally lay the gates can affect the speed of the fpga, it is a hardwired coding. Just because it is not an original 68k chip doesnt mean it isnt a true processor, if you program this code to an asic, is it still an emulator, i dont think so
-
I think you're over playing the mask rom and state machine in the 68000 to build a straw man.
Yes. So was Iggy. Obviously a 68000 isn't an emulator as it's the real thing and to emulate something you have to try to appear to be something else.
It appears to be a 68K outside, but inside it's all an interpreter running microcode on an entirely different machine. (-:
Yes, of course it is a bogus argument. In the end, what matters is the performance and consistence of the machine. An FPGA programmed to appear to be a 68000, is an emulation. The vampire could also be programmed to emulate a c64 or pc if you put the effort in.
I wouldn't say so. It would be an emulation if it would run as code on a different type of CPU platform, which it does not. It runs on programmed gates in an FPGA. Same as the 68K: It does not run natively on silicon. It runs as microcode on a machine we do not know exactly.
It's really a strange kind of argument - where do you want to draw the line? What is "real" and what is "emulation?". Is the 68060 an emulation of the 68000 because the former does *not* implement the same microcode engine as the 68000?
I tell you what I think: It doesn't really matter. As long as the resulting chip is fast enough to execute my code, and consistent enough, I don't bother. "Consistent enough" means that it avoids one particular problem typical emulators have: Executing some parts of the target architecture blazingly fast, while crawling at other tasks.
That's why I don't like winuae (comparably slow and inconsistent at the chipset emulation).
-
...It doesn't really matter...
Thanks Thomas, as the owner of an Altera DE-1, I'd tend to agree with you.
Its a moot point. But we are talking microcode here, not dedicated silicon. Code guys, not some how magically "becoming a 68000".
-
An FPGA is a programmable logic array and i set to be a 68k. Its not emulation. Its a bit more complicated than that. The way they work though is all in hardware and native for the most part once you program all the logic gates as if they were the real CPU.
-
I think you're over playing the mask rom and state machine in the 68000 to build a straw man.
Obviously a 68000 isn't an emulator as it's the real thing and to emulate something you have to try to appear to be something else.
An FPGA programmed to appear to be a 68000, is an emulation. The vampire could also be programmed to emulate a c64 or pc if you put the effort in.
You might think that Vampire is great and winuae is %&$#?@!%&$#?@!%&$#?@!%&$#?@!, but both are emulators. They are just different types of emulators. Deal with it.
Hmm, What would you call it if it was an ASIC chip? still emulated?
-
Hmm, What would you call it if it was an ASIC chip? still emulated?
No, UNLESS it was created via a similar method as the coding used to operate an FPGA, which DOES NOT directly emulate 68K hardware.
Then again, we're back to Thomas' "moot point".
-
No, UNLESS it was created via a similar method as the coding used to operate an FPGA, which DOES NOT directly emulate 68K hardware.
Then again, we're back to Thomas' "moot point".
If it can cold boot a game floppy I'm good!
-
If it can cold boot a game floppy I'm good!
I Agree with this one.
-
I Agree with this one.
As do I, its not an important distinction.
It passes something similar to the Turing test, it appears real enough to be convince anyone using it.
-
I am in Thunder Bay, not north Bay, there is also someone selling their v600 board. Once they receive their order we cannot prevent the resale of it, if people want to take the opportunity to try to make extra cash then it is up to them to face the wrath of the forum boards :)
looks like you guys need some NDA'S signed for beta-testers:rtfm:
& sorry for confusing the Bays:biglaugh:
-
Anyway, isn't it the new 68080? You can't emulate something that doesn't already exist.
-
When I remember how much I was struggling with parts, designs and how much time is spend to see this working it makes me sad to see things like this:
http://www.ebay.ca/itm/Amiga-600-Vampire-600-V2-with-128-MB-of-RAM-/262612824686?hash=item3d24f1b26e:g:354AAOSwdIFXz1pU
But, those are things you can't stop and anyway money earns not the one who worked hard. Instead money always goes to someone else. But as I said money is not the point in Vampire project. Or is it? Right now I m struggling to finance V1200 project, in fact right now I m struggling to finance any future projects. It is doable but on the edge because my bitcoin stock. All of this makes me wonder did I calculated everything right. With just few sales like this one I could finance connectors or anything I want. Instead of that I need to solder 6-7 cards who are sold together at the same value as this one but with zero profit, in fact not zero but with total losses. Don't ask me how I get bunch of FPGA at lower prices, because it was pure luck and that's why I was able to sell cards at 90Eur, played fair. Now I m wondering what is kipper2k doing, man is in constant loses also unable to finance future development. How much BigGun and ceiach earned also zero, at least I was able to buy myself oscilloscope from the money left, also I got one as a present like bunch of other stuff. But to the point where tooling fees for connectors are in 4K USD range + price of the connectors I start to wonder where I made mistake. For sure there will be version of V500 who will be sold only on ebay and money earned will be used in future development's. That is the only way and my stock of cheap FPGA is nearly gone. I m an idiot, instead of selling cards and finance things with the profit I gave bunch of them for free, not even for 90Eur, yes you read it right I was giving away some cards for free for various reasons...
-
Just to add some more to the previous post. When we started to do the BOM for the Vampire 2, we wanted to make this as affordable to the masses as we could, Majsta spent a lot of time trying to find the best components that were available at the time of initial design. This was also at a time when the $USD was at a lower value, it has since climbed over 25% and reduced the profit to almost minimal, add to that failed boards/components and we really did underestimate the cost. Initial preorders on Amibay were offered and honoured at 120 euro so he has lost money.
As a result the talk on forums has constantly been slamming us for the slow production rates, deservedly so because of our desire to make an affordable value product for people. This has meant a lot of manual labour for us to try to catch up and orders are actually still coming in faster than we can get out. Prices of FPGA's have also increased and so have other associated costs.
For me, I need the payment from the current batch in order to pay for the parts to complete that batch which does not help the cause. The reasons for batches are simple, we need to fund small batches and in the event of a bad batch we are not hurting (too) bad.
My thoughts on buying a vampire for profit: I do not like profiteering, it is preying on the desparation of people who want to have one at any costs. If someone does a deliberate profiteering on items i sell then i will not sell anything to them in the future if i find out who it is. I think most people are of the same opinion.
Enough rambling. byeee
-
You must have a good idea who it is considering they also had an A500 vampire also ... they're cant be many of them.
I'm in line somewhere (near the end!) to buy one so as an end user, its somewhat annoying to see someone buying to profit. It must be doubly so if you've lost money making them.
-
Majsta and kipper2k did you investigate options where the boards were partially or completely assembled at a factory? Between the low price and labor, you're losing money and probably sanity. There's no time for life and no enjoyment in what you're doing.
From what I've seen of small run products, it shouldn't cost you too much more and it would free you to do other things, enjoy life, earn a decent profit.
If another unnamed company is able to sell much lower performing boards for much more than you're charging for a much more capable board, you're doing it wrong.
The price that you're charging for the Vampire is ridiculous - ridiculously low. You haven't costed your bill of materials, labor or shipping correctly. The Vampire should cost minimum $300 US and probably more.
People see the performance of the Vampire. They see that it makes an Amiga faster than at any time in its history - by orders of magnitude. With everything that the Vampire provides - stellar performance, lots of very fast memory, fast SD storage, and video performance that every Amigan drools over.
I honestly don't think you would have any problems selling for $300 - $400. Heck, I think you'd sell out several production runs at $500. This would let you have the boards manufactured by a commercial assembler, yield would definitely improve, quality would improve with commercial pick and place and reflow, and factory tested. The only labor you would have is programming and shipping. Charge what it's really worth, what covers the COMPLETE costs plus 50% minimum. Charge more than that, whatever the market will bear! You should be charging more and profiting more than that other company. They've kept the classic machines alive and the community is very grateful to them for it but you are taking the Amiga into the future!
Life would be better for you, customers would be MUCH happier with wait times reduced and quality improvements, and more importantly you'd be able to focus on the more important tasks of development and MAKE MORE MONEY.
Sure,this started as a labor of love but how much love are you feeling right now? This needs to be a business that moves product and makes money! It needs to move on from the hobbyist stage as soon as possible.
-
Shouldn't this be a hint that the Amiga market is not as price sensitive as the Apollo team seems to believe?
You can jack up the component costs, the manufacturing costs, and the profits and still sell in spades. IMO.
-
Maybe Kipper2K and Majsta should put 1 or 2 on EBay every month to increase cash flow and do a small increase in price for the rest of us who don't have $800 to spend on retro computing.
-
Maybe Kipper2K and Majsta should put 1 or 2 on EBay every month to increase cash flow and do a small increase in price for the rest of us who don't have $800 to spend on retro computing.
That's what I was thinking. Maybe have members of the team sign the boards and sell them on eBay to raise money.
BTW, I'm on the waiting list for the 600 version and I have no problem paying more.
-
That's what I was thinking. Maybe have members of the team sign the boards and sell them on eBay to raise money.
BTW, I'm on the waiting list for the 600 version and I have no problem paying more.
In fact why not sell each and every of these cards via ebay or some bidding market. The price will simply be the result of demand and delivery. Trusted contributors can expect a special offer. And the development would be secured. Wouldnt that be fair? Especially instead of supporting speculants?
-
I would have suggested selling these through a distributor such as Amigakit. Sure, it might bump up the price a bit (because they'd need a cut), but it would insulate you from the stress of having to deal with the money, and also reassure your customers that they can pay with a credit card, instead of having to register and go through the "waitlist" process on Amibay. IMHO some people are still a little hesitant to buy things on that site, when it's much easier to just visit a webpage, check stock/availability on an item, and then plunk down a CC #. My .02 cents. ;)
Good luck, in any case, and thank you for all your efforts & hard work! :)
-
In fact why not sell each and every of these cards via ebay or some bidding market. The price will simply be the result of demand and delivery. Trusted contributors can expect a special offer. And the development would be secured. Wouldnt that be fair? Especially instead of supporting speculants?
Because market rules are not always the solution. I appreciate the fact, that they want to keep prices low. Wealthier ppl don't always deserve the exclusivness they are easily able buy for money.
IMHO it's good though to put a limited share of boards to ebay for quick access for those who can spend the money. Would benefit all - those who don't want to queue for a board can buy themselves out and the higher price will benefit all those ppl calmly willing to wait plus the developers.
-
I would have suggested selling these through a distributor such as Amigakit. Sure, it might bump up the price a bit (because they'd need a cut), but it would insulate you from the stress of having to deal with the money, and also reassure your customers that they can pay with a credit card, instead of having to register and go through the "waitlist" process on Amibay. IMHO some people are still a little hesitant to buy things on that site, when it's much easier to just visit a webpage, check stock/availability on an item, and then plunk down a CC #. My .02 cents. ;)
Good luck, in any case, and thank you for all your efforts & hard work! :)
Doesnt look like selling through a distributor would result in better pricing while the autors actually receiving more funds.
-
Because market rules are not always the solution. I appreciate the fact, that they want to keep prices low. Wealthier ppl don't always deserve the exclusivness they are easily able buy for money.
IMHO it's good though to put a limited share of boards to ebay for quick access for those who can spend the money. Would benefit all - those who don't want to queue for a board can buy themselves out and the higher price will benefit all those ppl calmly willing to wait plus the developers.
Right. I appreciate the attitude as well. Maybe my proposal reaches too far. Just making strategies complex provdes room for misuse.
-
There's a huuuuge discussion on this topic going on over on one of the Amiga Facebook forums (why the Facebook forums are more popular than sites like this I'll never know... Well wait, I do know, it just annoys me). Gist of which was that one of the price gougers was someone who hadn't even paid for the accelerator, but was a dev who'd gotten it for free in payment for doing some data entry work for the developers. Another of the people selling one (the guy who was including it with the junky A500, I think) was actually authorized to sell the thing, and was doing it as a test to gauge interest on that site. Anyhow, I'm paraphrasing, so I'll just leave you with this picture that someone just posted over there. Enjoy! :D
-
The Vampire is not a Blizzard or Apollo 1260. By this I simply mean that old and out of production hardware will always be objects of desire to collectors. They're priced high because they are rare and original 1990's hardware with real Motorola CPU's.
Even if the Vampire exceeded the 68060 performance by a factor of 1,000,000 times, it still wouldn't affect the cost of those original 68060 cards in todays second hand market. The Vampire market and the 'authentically classic' market can and will co-exist together.
Vampire is a great product without a shadow of a doubt, I hope it will take the Amiga forwards onto great things.
-
thats the problem with kipper2k, he has awesome stuff we would love to have and no real ways to get it out to the masses in a timely and profitable manner for them, they have and do owe it to themselves for all they do!
i still want a couple of his 8mb ide boards for my amiga 1000s. its great to have kipper2k and his projects, i would like to get an a500 and accelerator to add to my collection one day also.
hopefully kipper2k and crew can figure out a way to keep things going, give them more time for themselves and family and still make a tidy profit for all their hard work and time.
//kneehighspy
-
And here's the latest on the price increase...
http://www.kipper2k.com/updates.html
-
Adding more fuel to the fire (napalm?), I found this today on ebay.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/262632677230
-
Even if the Vampire exceeded the 68060 performance by a factor of 1,000,000 times, it still wouldn't affect the cost of those original 68060 cards in todays second hand market.
If vampire supported 68060+fpu+mmu and sold for a couple of hundred euros then I think it likely would hurt the price of the accelerators with real 68060's in them. But it looks like they are solving the issue by restricting the supply of vampires and pushing the price up (plus the real 68060 is still the only way to get the fpu+mmu).
-
@ Kipper2k
I sent an email a while back offer to help assemble for you guys. Never heard back. The offer still stands. I wasn't asking for a job, just offering to help with a couple boards a week or so. If anyone on the team is coming to Amiwest and wants to meet me just ask.
-
Moving from (s)low volume to faster board house assembly is the right thing to do but I assume it does mean lots of the "boring" test and admin is left to do with maybe (hopefully) only a bit of occasional rework.
Vampire boards will hopefully bring other opportunities for more third party hardware for classic Amigas and stand alone systems.
-
The Vampire is not a Blizzard or Apollo 1260. By this I simply mean that old and out of production hardware will always be objects of desire to collectors. They're priced high because they are rare and original 1990's hardware with real Motorola CPU's.
Even if the Vampire exceeded the 68060 performance by a factor of 1,000,000 times, it still wouldn't affect the cost of those original 68060 cards in todays second hand market. The Vampire market and the 'authentically classic' market can and will co-exist together.
.
Also considering that the Apollo core hasn't full MMU and FPU yet the native 060 accel is better. I had the original vampire v1 it was really cool. Kipper and majsta (and gunne and the others ) have worked har don this its a passion project. It sounds like they need more help with manufacturing and distribution. Its difficult to do testing, fabrication, and customer service, shipping, and fulfillment.
-
Adding more fuel to the fire (napalm?), I found this today on ebay.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/262632677230
Well that's pretty much what I suggested earlier in the thread....although I had hoped the price through the "regular" channel wouldn't go up quite as much......
-
Well that's pretty much what I suggested earlier in the thread....although I had hoped the price through the "regular" channel wouldn't go up quite as much......
Oh that's nothing, it gets much worse! Here is another new listing: http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Apollo-Vampire-II-600-BLACK-kit-for-Commodore-Amiga-600-/272383633901?hash=item3f6b5469ed:g:1JcAAOSwzaJX4Qew
-
Everyone has this choice... Vote with your wallet.
- The only true democracy.
-
yep, just don't buy it. I have a Vampire in terms of speed a good PC running UAE gets you things the Vampire can't. Like an FPU. My advice spend the time waiting for a Vampire configuring your system on CF card so when you get your Vampire you are ready to go. I had a 4 month wait. I have been scouring forums seeing what's up with the Vampire project since the start. So I ordered it early on.
-
Oh that's nothing, it gets much worse! Here is another new listing: http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Apollo-Vampire-II-600-BLACK-kit-for-Commodore-Amiga-600-/272383633901?hash=item3f6b5469ed:g:1JcAAOSwzaJX4Qew
Yikes! My car isn't worth that much ($1016 CDN).
-
in terms of speed a good PC running UAE gets you things the Vampire can't.
This is a point lost on most people it seems.
-
@kipper2k
When the Vampire A500 version is out, I will buy one.
-
@kipper2k
When the Vampire A500 version is out, I will buy one.
Then go on, this is the official sale by majsta, also now on ebay.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Amiga-500-accelerator-Vampire-500-V2-/262632677230?hash=item3d26209f6e:g:j8MAAOSwOyJX36jN
I will wait for availability at a shop or something like an order list. But I will also buy one for an A2k.
-
Then go on, this is the official sale by majsta, also now on ebay.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Amiga-500-accelerator-Vampire-500-V2-/262632677230?hash=item3d26209f6e:g:j8MAAOSwOyJX36jN
Why isn't it for sale on kipper2k's site?
EDIT: I'll pass on the ebay bidding wars.
-
Why isn't it for sale on kipper2k's site?
He's out:
http://eab.abime.net/showpost.php?p=1112315&postcount=345
I can fully understand that is not fun anymore when a lot of people want the card for free, totally ignoring that he works during his spare time on it which is just too much. And now, doing the right decision to let it produce forums are filled with complains and I don't want to know what emails he receives at the moment.
So, currently I don't know of any plans producing/selling the Vampire A500 except those ebay sales.
Edit: I've read it again, he said he will finish the Vampire project. I don't know if that means he will just finish the A600 Vampire order list or also produce the A500.
-
He's out:
http://eab.abime.net/showpost.php?p=1112315&postcount=345
I can fully understand that is not fun anymore when a lot of people want the card for free, totally ignoring that he works during his spare time on it which is just too much. And now, doing the right decision to let it produce forums are filled with complains and I don't want to know what emails he receives at the moment.
So, currently I don't know of any plans producing/selling the Vampire A500 except those ebay sales.
Edit: I've read it again, he said he will finish the Vampire project. I don't know if that means he will just finish the A600 Vampire order list or also produce the A500.
WOW!! The phrase "thats why we cant have nice things" applies. Some a**holes messed it up for the rest of us!
-
Here it is on one of the Facebook forums, as well. Good job, Internet. :(
----------------------------------------------------
Quote:
Guys here is an update from Kipper2k, he asked me to post this..
Hi All,
i want to let everyone know in more detail why pricing has gone up, There was no possible way that i could get it done, I have spent hours locked up in my room trying to get these completed, as well, i have fallen way behind in other orders as people can testify and this is having an impact wit my sanity and patience. The amount of work and co-ordination required to get this all done is probably harder than what most people think. Add to this the constant flaming about people complaining that this should be handed over to a board house to get this done, and now we have people are complaining about the increased price.
Whenever you import parts bit by bit you can sometimes get them in under the radar, whenever you import expensive items the customs people rub their hands with glee and will gladly accept visa and your first born. Some people are cancelling their orders now and TBH i can understand. When we started this project and decided on the price we wanted to make this available to the masses and expected a small demand for the A600. I will never believe people who say they dont like the A600 as it appears there are at least 1000 active users of the A600. we were naive to think we could get this done at a lower price and people were excited to see this great product at a basement price, (Which it was). Once we made the decision to get the boards done professionally (at the request of a lot of people) we have now offended people at the other end of the spectrum. I have been receiving hate mail from people who are cancelling their orders and being accused of gouging, and multiple other reasons that we have used to increase the price.
I always said when it is no longer fun what i am doing then it is time to stop, So i will stop, Once the Vampire/Phoenix project is complete then it will be time to me to sell off existing bits and pieces and disappear into the woodwork. I am getting too old for this stress,
Thanks to all who supported me and to the rest, goodbye.
-
I have been receiving hate mail from people who are cancelling their orders and being accused of gouging, and multiple other reasons that we have used to increase the price.
I guess I dont see why he just doesnt tell them "ok, dont buy it." and the hate mail, just tell them "F U too! Have a nice day! :-)" Thats what I'd do, works well :-)
-
and the hate mail, just tell them "F U too! Have a nice day! :-)" Thats what I'd do, works well :-)
It's really hard to ignore the a*holes in the world. I mean, just look at how often I respond to them on this forum! :laughing: :laughing: :laughing:
-
That's terrible news. I think he should name and shame those ars* holes and publish their emails for all to see.
I've bought a number of products from Brian for my A500 and A600, which were fantastic may I add, and now we shall not be able to get these any longer thanks to the childish and impatient and frankly sickening behaviour of MANY individuals, whom the Amiga community would surely be better off without. I hope their capacitors leak all over their A600 motherboards.
-
Amiga Lives Matter! :knuddel:
(http://www.amigafilm.com/Site/style/images/art/Amiga-30-7-full.png)
-
Hey, there's me! Of course I took that moment to have my eyes closed. :p
-
kipper2k either wants to make some money or he doesn't. Keeping pre-order customers happy is just part of business. He should have closed the pre-order waiting list if he felt it was getting out of control! $250 is an ok price to pay as long as your not someone who has pre-ordered it for a lot less!!! It's an example of bad business practice so maybe he just needed a business partner who was a bit more business savvy? It's a shame that this means there will be no more boards developed but then I can't buy a new DENEB board anymore either :-(
-
He's out:
http://eab.abime.net/showpost.php?p=1112315&postcount=345
.
well kipper has got a point! not having fun anymore and stress does not equal Amiga
-
kipper2k either wants to make some money or he doesn't. Keeping pre-order customers happy is just part of business. He should have closed the pre-order waiting list if he felt it was getting out of control! $250 is an ok price to pay as long as your not someone who has pre-ordered it for a lot less!!! It's an example of bad business practice so maybe he just needed a business partner who was a bit more business savvy? It's a shame that this means there will be no more boards developed but then I can't buy a new DENEB board anymore either :-(
The people in the queue registered interest. They are free to step down from it if the terms do not meet their ecpectations. Just as kipper as vendor has the right to adjust these terms if he feels that these do not correspond to his capacities anymore. There is nothing to complain about.
-
kipper2k either wants to make some money or he doesn't. Keeping pre-order customers happy is just part of business. He should have closed the pre-order waiting list if he felt it was getting out of control! $250 is an ok price to pay as long as your not someone who has pre-ordered it for a lot less!!! It's an example of bad business practice so maybe he just needed a business partner who was a bit more business savvy? It's a shame that this means there will be no more boards developed but then I can't buy a new DENEB board anymore either :-(
All of that may or may not be true, but none of it justifies people sending him hate mail and threats.
-
The people in the queue registered interest. They are free to step down from it if the terms do not meet their ecpectations. Just as kipper as vendor has the right to adjust these terms if he feels that these do not correspond to his capacities anymore. There is nothing to complain about.
+1
-
I don't get it. Even 250EUR is cheap for this! I'd easily pay 500-600 USD for the A4000 version. Mainly because trying to get any Cyberstorm is going to cost 700-1000, and it could blow up a week after you get it.
While sure I could understand being annoyed when you were told it'd cost half that, then suddenly the demand is too high so it doubles. Do people not understand supply/demand? Hell, I'd donate to keep kipper building stuff, I know I've ordered something from him (I think it was the PSX to DB9 adapters that I use all the time on my Falcon now).
I really want that A4000 Vampire though..
-
I don't get it. Even 250EUR is cheap for this! I'd easily pay 500-600 USD for the A4000 version. Mainly because trying to get any Cyberstorm is going to cost 700-1000, and it could blow up a week after you get it.
While sure I could understand being annoyed when you were told it'd cost half that, then suddenly the demand is too high so it doubles. Do people not understand supply/demand? Hell, I'd donate to keep kipper building stuff, I know I've ordered something from him (I think it was the PSX to DB9 adapters that I use all the time on my Falcon now).
I really want that A4000 Vampire though..
I'd pay 250 EU (around $280 I think..but I'd pay up to $300 USD for it) for the A500 version. $500 for the A500 version though? Nope.
If I had an A4k like you, 500-600$ for that, yes.
EDIT: Updated what I'd pay for A500 version.
-
Im using the A500 V2 to post this.. And I'm here to tell you.. As long as it's Majsta selling it on Ebay, and not some profiteering slimebag, I'd pay $500.00 if I had to to get this. Without a second thought.
This thing is way the hell faster than anything that's ever run on ANY Amiga Hardware before. It Blows UAE(running on my Corei5 at "max acceleration") away, speed-wise.. Boots OS 3.9 in less than 2 seconds.. Plays high bitrate stereo Mp3s at the same time as surfing the web at a very respectable speed, and talking on IRC, with PLENTY of CPU time left over.. And this is not even the "fast core" that the developers are talking about.. This is the x11 core..
So. Yeah.. heh. It has built in 32bit P96 RTG over HDMI, fast (11.5megs/sec)IDE, 128megs of the fastest ram ever put on an Amiga, and a cpu core than smokes 060s many times over for breakfast. I think it's worth $500.00.
The new 260euro pricetag will enable enormous reductions in production time. Noone is making any "profit" so to speak here. 100% gets either spent to speed up production, or reinvested in development costs for the next board designs. The original price was an attempt at something that was idealisticly admirable, but not feasible long term. If anyone has "paid the price" for this, it has been Majsta and the rest of the people who have tirelessly contributed to this thing over the last several years..
Count your lucky stars and thank God that the project is still going and noone is giving up. Everyone will hopefully get an opportunity to buy a Vampire for their Amiga at a price point significantly lower than a "vintage" Accelerator.
-
Im using the A500 V2 to post this.. And I'm here to tell you.. As long as it's Majsta selling it on Ebay, and not some profiteering slimebag, I'd pay $500.00 if I had to to get this. Without a second thought.
This thing is way the hell faster than anything that's ever run on ANY Amiga Hardware before. It Blows UAE(running on my Corei5 at "max acceleration") away, speed-wise.. Boots OS 3.9 in less than 2 seconds.. Plays high bitrate stereo Mp3s at the same time as surfing the web at a very respectable speed, and talking on IRC, with PLENTY of CPU time left over.. And this is not even the "fast core" that the developers are talking about.. This is the x11 core..
So. Yeah.. heh. It has built in 32bit P96 RTG over HDMI, fast (11.5megs/sec)IDE, 128megs of the fastest ram ever put on an Amiga, and a cpu core than smokes 060s many times over for breakfast. I think it's worth $500.00.
The new 260euro pricetag will enable enormous reductions in production time. Noone is making any "profit" so to speak here. 100% gets either spent to speed up production, or reinvested in development costs for the next board designs. The original price was an attempt at something that was idealisticly admirable, but not feasible long term. If anyone has "paid the price" for this, it has been Majsta and the rest of the people who have tirelessly contributed to this thing over the last several years..
Count your lucky stars and thank God that the project is still going and noone is giving up. Everyone will hopefully get an opportunity to buy a Vampire for their Amiga at a price point significantly lower than a "vintage" Accelerator.
Well said, agree with the ebay stuff as well. Tehy can sell em if they need to raise funds. Its the scum that gets them only to resell them (though they have the full right) that upsets me.
-
@wawrzon
The people in the queue registered interest. They are free to step down from it if the terms do not meet their expectations. Just as kipper as vendor has the right to adjust these terms if he feels that these do not correspond to his capacities anymore. There is nothing to complain about.
I didn't realise that. People should just accept that the demand exceeded the team of two's ability to cope with the interest. There was no contract and no money changed hands so there is nothing really to moan about.
-
@wawrzon
I didn't realise that. People should just accept that the demand exceeded the team of two's ability to cope with the interest. There was no contract and no money changed hands so there is nothing really to moan about.
Yep there is; It's the government's fault. Millennials, & Gen Ys :)
-
@Thread
This website cataloging the project's trials and successes really is amazing!
http://www.majsta.com/
-
The Amiga isn't cursed, it's the toxic emotionally unstable entitled lunatics that make up the so called ”community” that are a curse.
Time and time again stuff like this happens because of those freaks. I'd love to say it is a minority but as time has passed they have now become a majority sadly.
-
The Amiga isn't cursed, it's the toxic emotionally unstable entitled lunatics that make up the so called %&$#?@!%&$#?@!%&$#?@!8221;community%&$#?@!%&$#?@!%&$#?@!8221; that are a curse.
Time and time again stuff like this happens because of those freaks. I'd love to say it is a minority but as time has passed they have now become a majority sadly.
You hit the nail on the head.
What I find interesting is reselling stuff on ebay. Buying 1.. ONE *ONE* Vampire board for lets say $300 USD (just throwing out a price) and selling it for $600 usd. You make $300. Thats it. You dont have a board anymore and you're probably not getting another anytime soon.
All for $300?? What did that pay for? Part electric bill and something else? To me $300 profit is nothing if its a one time thing.
If you were kipper2k or Majsta and sold a few each month at $300 profit, then thats good, its worth it. Makes sense to those two guys. But to a regular person who only has one..you have to be dirt poor to resell something once, just for the money. To kipper2k and Majsta, raise it to $300 USD. Make it worth your while. Nothing is free in this world. Put me down for 1 at that price if you choose to sell it for that price. I can pre-pay, send me a PM.
If I dont get an A500 Vampire because some aholes messed it up for all of us, then I only have 1 word, a curse word, to say to the individuals that screwed it up for us... Starts with an F. Figure out the rest.
-
......
All for $300?? What did that pay for? Part electric bill and something else? To me $300 profit is nothing if its a one time thing.
...QUOTE]
Ipso facto paying an additional $300 in a one time purchase for something you really want??
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Supply_and_demand#/media/File:Supply-and-demand.svg
What's wrong with AORG starting up a "fund me" or a kickstarter? To help these guys get to where we want them to get?
-
Kipper was certainly important in recent months because he got the orders and manufactured the boards manual in spare time. Because of high interest (and more orders to come) this "business model" was not possible anymore. If I understand correctly the boards will be assembled professionally, then only someone has to test and send them (and collect the money). It is regrettable that now someone is personally hurt but kipper did not start the project and even if he leaves the project will not end. As far as I know he was only the man for collecting orders and production, development was and is done by majsta and core is developed by a team around gunnar. So all rumors that the project is dead now are wrong in my view.
-
Kipper was certainly important in recent months because he got the orders and manufactured the boards manual in spare time. Because of high interest (and more orders to come) this "business model" was not possible anymore. If I understand correctly the boards will be assembled professionally, then only someone has to test and send them (and collect the money). It is regrettable that now someone is personally hurt but kipper did not start the project and even if he leaves the project will not end. As far as I know he was only the man for collecting orders and production, development was and is done by majsta and core is developed by a team around gunnar. So all rumors that the project is dead now are wrong in my view.
The Vampire project is not dead but kipper2k will never again design nor build any Amiga hardware add-ons because of a bunch of losers with no social skills harassing him.
This is a major disaster. I despair at humanity sometimes.
-
The Amiga isn't cursed, it's the toxic emotionally unstable entitled lunatics that make up the so called ”community” that are a curse.
Time and time again stuff like this happens because of those freaks. I'd love to say it is a minority but as time has passed they have now become a majority sadly.
So called community. Yep, that's it right there. We don't have a community here, we have a collection of egos. If we had a community, we wouldn't have 73 Amiga operating systems, we might even have a viable platform. Instead we have the current mess and, just like every other time something comes along that promises to revitalize the platform, the "community" Fs it up.
I know that isn't the only reason why the platform didn't rise back up, but for the last 20 years it pretty much has.
-
@ metalguy:
Much of the "posterior" hurt going in is from folks that were looking to do what is a despicable trend in the Amiga scene. Source a piece of gear for as little as possible, purchase multiple units, then RESELL for as much as possible. Now that the price has risen the rats are leaving the ship as they always do. The poachers fail to underestimate the resourcefulness, resilience, and technical expertise of the team. Kippa and Majsta have been doing this lone wolf style for far too long, now with a team of guys taking some of the work of their back they will excel to even greater heights.
-
So many idiots among the Amiga users. Pretty sure i wont get a board now because off this . I dont get the stress you dont pay to be on that list.
-
Pretty sure i wont get a board now because off this .
and i dont get the panic. they have adjusted the price, probably an inevitable and way overdue move. im certain they have not and still are putting so much work into it just to give up now and lock everything away in an cellar. you will get your board sooner or later if you want it.
-
@ metalguy:
Much of the "posterior" hurt going in is from folks that were looking to do what is a despicable trend in the Amiga scene. Source a piece of gear for as little as possible, purchase multiple units, then RESELL for as much as possible. Now that the price has risen the rats are leaving the ship as they always do. The poachers fail to underestimate the resourcefulness, resilience, and technical expertise of the team. Kippa and Majsta have been doing this lone wolf style for far too long, now with a team of guys taking some of the work of their back they will excel to even greater heights.
+2 Great outcome.