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Amiga computer related discussion => Amiga Hardware Issues and discussion => Topic started by: fondpondforever on May 02, 2016, 12:48:45 AM

Title: Best Accelerator for Amiga 4000T
Post by: fondpondforever on May 02, 2016, 12:48:45 AM
What is the best best Accelerator for Amiga 4000T?
Title: Re: Best Accelerator for Amiga 4000T
Post by: klx300r on May 02, 2016, 01:15:35 AM
for either 68k or PPC my moneys on the Cyberstorm MKIII
Title: Re: Best Accelerator for Amiga 4000T
Post by: fondpondforever on May 02, 2016, 01:26:23 AM
ok thanks.
Title: Re: Best Accelerator for Amiga 4000T
Post by: Acill on May 02, 2016, 01:47:57 AM
As an A4000T owner with a CSPPC I am partial to that, but if you only plan to use 68k stuff and dont care about the PPC side of things you can look for a CS MKIII. Both are identical in terms of 68k operation.

If you can find the Quickpack 060 board that came in the last of the 4000T machines they produced I would grab one for sure over a MKIII.
Title: Re: Best Accelerator for Amiga 4000T
Post by: paul1981 on May 02, 2016, 01:53:39 AM
Quote from: fondpondforever;807801
ok thanks.


Can you get me one while you're at it?
Title: Re: Best Accelerator for Amiga 4000T
Post by: BozzerBigD on May 02, 2016, 10:15:20 AM
The Cyberstorm Mk 1 actually runs faster than the Mk 2 from what I've heard. The benefit of the Mk 2 is that it contains a SCSI module built in and isn't modular. However the A4000T already has SCSI so the Mk1 pips the Mk2 for A4000T use. Saying that the QuickPak 4060T board is the best as it uses EDO ran and runs at 55Mhz as far as I've heard. Then the Cyberstorm Mk3 and then the Cyberstorm Mk1. If you want a PPC you are limited to the Cybertorm PPC boards but they are pricey and software/functionality of PPC classic machines is limited.
Title: Re: Best Accelerator for Amiga 4000T
Post by: UberFreak on May 02, 2016, 02:38:09 PM
Quote from: BozzerBigD;807826
The benefit of the Mk 2 is that it contains a SCSI module built in and isn't modular.


Incorrect, the SCSI on Mk2 is an add-on module, just like the Mk1.
Title: Re: Best Accelerator for Amiga 4000T
Post by: klx300r on May 02, 2016, 03:52:02 PM
Quote from: UberFreak;807838
Incorrect, the SCSI on Mk2 is an add-on module, just like the Mk1.

correct, only the CSMKIII has a built in scsi3 controller
Title: Re: Best Accelerator for Amiga 4000T
Post by: jack-3d on May 02, 2016, 11:41:44 PM
Quote from: Acill;807804
If you can find the Quickpack 060 board that came in the last of the 4000T machines they produced I would grab one for sure over a MKIII.
Why is Quickpak better then CSMK3? Friend of mine has one and it only fits to A4000T board and nowhere else you can use it. Also SCSI is missing there (BBOAH says SCSI is ready, only controller and ROM is needed). So I dont see any advantages over the CSMK3 there (unless you are collector and you want this as rare piece of HW).

From my point of view there is no better card then Cyberstorm MK3 / PPC (depends if you want to use PPC or pure 68k). Tower is pretty spacious so there is no problem with overheating memory controller and other chips on the card.
Title: Re: Best Accelerator for Amiga 4000T
Post by: Oldsmobile_Mike on May 02, 2016, 11:47:15 PM
Quote from: jack-3d;807863
Why is Quickpak better then CSMK3?

As has already been pointed out in this thread, because it supports EDO memory (if you care about that sort of thing), and it's faster by default, 56MHz vs 50MHz.

http://amiga.resource.cx/exp/eagle060

http://amiga.resource.cx/exp/cyberstorm3

Some people care more about the other features of the CSMK3, in which case that board is better for them.

 (http://amiga.resource.cx/exp/cyberstorm3)
Title: Re: Best Accelerator for Amiga 4000T
Post by: klx300r on May 03, 2016, 01:46:20 AM
Quote from: Oldsmobile_Mike;807865
As has already been pointed out in this thread, because it supports EDO memory (if you care about that sort of thing), and it's faster by default, 56MHz vs 50MHz...

CSMKIII 060 can be easily boosted to 75 or 80Mhz just by switching the crystal on the MB & no mines not for sale ;-)
Title: Re: Best Accelerator for Amiga 4000T
Post by: QuikSanz on May 03, 2016, 02:37:43 AM
Quote from: klx300r;807867
CSMKIII 060 can be easily boosted to 75 or 80Mhz just by switching the crystal on the MB & no mines not for sale ;-)


Hmm, If it's that easy and safe I'll push mine to 75Mhz, don't want to push it too hard.

Chris
Title: Re: Best Accelerator for Amiga 4000T
Post by: agami on May 03, 2016, 04:47:33 AM
The best and most cost effective accelerator is a PC running Amiga Forever ;)
Title: Re: Best Accelerator for Amiga 4000T
Post by: klx300r on May 03, 2016, 04:58:44 AM
Quote from: agami;807871
The best and most cost effective accelerator is a PC running Amiga Forever ;)

cough cough where exactly in Melbourne, Australia do you live as a few of us would like to visit with some wood torches for such sacrilege:hammer::smack::laughing:
Title: Re: Best Accelerator for Amiga 4000T
Post by: Rotzloeffel on May 03, 2016, 09:03:44 AM
Quote from: jack-3d;807863
From my point of view there is no better card then Cyberstorm MK3 / PPC (depends if you want to use PPC or pure 68k). Tower is pretty spacious so there is no problem with overheating memory controller and other chips on the card.

The biggest advantage of CS MKIII or PPC is the 64bit access to the Fastram.....
Title: Re: Best Accelerator for Amiga 4000T
Post by: klx300r on May 03, 2016, 05:10:14 PM
Quote from: QuikSanz;807869
Hmm, If it's that easy and safe I'll push mine to 75Mhz, don't want to push it too hard.

Chris

make sure you have Rev6 060 if you want to go to 75-80 else I was running a Rev1 for years at 66 with no issues at all.
Title: Re: Best Accelerator for Amiga 4000T
Post by: HammerD on May 03, 2016, 06:24:34 PM
Quote from: klx300r;807895
make sure you have Rev6 060 if you want to go to 75-80 else I was running a Rev1 for years at 66 with no issues at all.

Believe it or not but the phase 5 accelerators came with better software support, including CyberPatcher to patch missing 060 functions, and in general from what I found (I've owned all of them) has a slightly higher compatibility level than the Quikpak 060 - for example, with Shapeshifter the phase 5 board works better.

The Quikpak 060 is a good board, it came in two versions, a tower version and a desktop version.  The desktop version also had optional SCSI with the same connector as the phase-5 CS PPC or MK-3.  They are very rare though, especially the ones with SCSI.  The version I owned unfortunately had no SCSI, but I know of one user who did have SCSI on his desktop Quikpak 060 board.  And yes, the desktop Quikpak 060 board (the "XP" version) does work in the A4000T, and actually shipped in later Quikpak A4000T's as the default 060 card.

Overall you can't go wrong with either, but all things being equal I'd opt for a MK-3 or CS PPC.   You can also add a graphics card directly to a MK-3 or CS PPC (The CybervisionPPC) or you can add the GREX PCI expansion board, which is the fastest PCI solution for classics by far - because of the direct connection to the MK-3 or CS PPC.
Title: Re: Best Accelerator for Amiga 4000T
Post by: jack-3d on May 04, 2016, 09:21:50 AM
I will ask my friend to make Syspeed module and compare the memory performance between his Quickpak and my CSPPC(50MHz) and CSMK3(66MHz). Anyway as there was mentioned overall latest Cyberstorms are nice compact cards, have 64 bit memory access, fastest SCSI ever made on Amiga a good overclocking possibilities. Quickpak is nice a valuable rarity, but I prefer Cyberstorms as I use Amigas everyday.
Title: Re: Best Accelerator for Amiga 4000T
Post by: HammerD on May 04, 2016, 02:36:53 PM
Quote from: jack-3d;807924
I will ask my friend to make Syspeed module and compare the memory performance between his Quickpak and my CSPPC(50MHz) and CSMK3(66MHz). Anyway as there was mentioned overall latest Cyberstorms are nice compact cards, have 64 bit memory access, fastest SCSI ever made on Amiga a good overclocking possibilities. Quickpak is nice a valuable rarity, but I prefer Cyberstorms as I use Amigas everyday.


I have some information here on issues with the Quikpak 060 card and some comparisons using FPM ram vs. EDO ram.  EDO can make a big difference.

http://www.hd-zone.com/2011/05/quikpak-68060-information/

Darren
Title: Re: Best Accelerator for Amiga 4000T
Post by: Rob on May 04, 2016, 04:21:16 PM
Quote from: HammerD;807899
Believe it or not but the phase 5 accelerators came with better software support, including CyberPatcher to patch missing 060 functions.


For other cards you had Oxypatcher and I ended up using it on my Blizzard 1260 instead of Cyberpatcher.  

If you use HSMathLibs in conjunction with either patcher it should boost things a bit more.

http://www.hsmathlibs.de/index_e.html
Title: Re: Best Accelerator for Amiga 4000T
Post by: HammerD on May 04, 2016, 04:33:17 PM
Quote from: Rob;807928
For other cards you had Oxypatcher and I ended up using it on my Blizzard 1260 instead of Cyberpatcher.  

If you use HSMathLibs in conjunction with either patcher it should boost things a bit more.

http://www.hsmathlibs.de/index_e.html


Yes that is true.  I'm not sure you can still get Oxypatcher though?  I had mentioned Oxypatcher on my website in the link in my previous post.
Title: Re: Best Accelerator for Amiga 4000T
Post by: zipper on May 04, 2016, 06:21:56 PM
Thor's MMULib solution is number one. http://aminet.net/util/libs/MMULib.lha
Title: Re: Best Accelerator for Amiga 4000T
Post by: Oldsmobile_Mike on May 04, 2016, 06:49:07 PM
Quote from: jack-3d;807924
I will ask my friend to make Syspeed module and compare the memory performance between his Quickpak and my CSPPC(50MHz) and CSMK3(66MHz).

Was never a big fan of this type of comparison since results can vary so widely depending on what patches you both have installed, what versions of libraries, how optimized your systems are, etc.  Better than nothing though, I suppose!  ;)