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Amiga computer related discussion => Amiga Hardware Issues and discussion => Topic started by: jupo42 on January 03, 2016, 12:02:16 AM
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Hey all,
Has anyone had success with the "official" Cloanto 3.X ROMS on an A3000D?
Everything was fine with 2.0 before I ordered these chips, but after getting them installed, now every floppy I have comes up as a non-DOS disk. For the life of me I haven't been able to find one of my external floppy drives yet, but a spare internal drive did the exact same thing, and again, it was just working perfectly before the upgrade.
Any ideas on something I might have messed up in the process? I can't boot up with the 3.X disk set, I can't copy the workbench.library onto the HD...
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Has anyone had success with the "official" Cloanto 3.X ROMS on an A3000D?
Unsure if this is at all related to your issue, but I had a customer recently send an A3000D board for repair with some new Cloanto v40.55 EPROMs. Ignoring the original faults which were fixed, the board worked fine using a set of v40.68 test ROMs or standard OS2.x masked ROMs. But with the official Cloanto ROMs, operation was very unstable and erratic. Frequent crash/lockup using bare basic Workbench or even the early startup screen. I don't think I got to the point of testing floppy disk access in this state.
The ROM data appeared to read out OK, so there didn't seem to be any obvious programming issues with them as the usual ASCII strings looked normal, seemed to be more timing related. Even with the ROM timing jumpers (http://amiga.serveftp.net/A3000_HardwareGuide/jumpers.html) set to the longest possible time, it was still unusable. Operation was even less stable with any faster ROM access timing configured, often failing to even get to the early startup screen.
I wasn't sure of the history of these new EPROMs, perhaps they had been damaged in some way or one of the devices had a legitimate fault from new, so I suggested the customer contact Cloanto for a replacement set under warranty. Haven't heard the outcome from this yet as it was a fairly recent job.
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Thanks. Got an external drive hooked up and the same issue. Ripped it all down and put the 2.0 ROMS back (what a pain - the A2k is so much easier to get to), and the drives work fine once again. *SIGH* Guess I get to send the chips back.
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Dumb question, but what's an "official" Cloanto 3.X ROM? Never heard one referred to in this way. Is this something someone burned with the data from Amiga Forever?
FYI AmigaKit has 3.1 ROM's for A3000 for $29. Probably easier and save yourself some headache. Good luck!
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Cloanto made updated ROMs for each system based on the work they'd done with Amiga Forever. They call it 3.X because it includes a lot of the 3.5/3.9 fixes. Their license to distribute the OS includes being able to sell physical copies, so even though it is pretty much a burned EPROM with a professional label on top, it's the closest to an official ROM that's being made currently.
Like the A4000T it moves workbench.library to disk to make room for the patches.
Really really wish I hadn't lost my two A2065s. Null modem transfers back and forth from the PC are painful.
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Cloanto made updated ROMs for each system based on the work they'd done with Amiga Forever. They call it 3.X because it includes a lot of the 3.5/3.9 fixes. Their license to distribute the OS includes being able to sell physical copies, so even though it is pretty much a burned EPROM with a professional label on top, it's the closest to an official ROM that's being made currently.
Like the A4000T it moves workbench.library to disk to make room for the patches.
Really really wish I hadn't lost my two A2065s. Null modem transfers back and forth from the PC are painful.
Not sure that workbench library should be relocated as well as having AGA stuff on an A3000.
Something funny here.
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Dumb question, but what's an "official" Cloanto 3.X ROM? Never heard one referred to in this way. Is this something someone burned with the data from Amiga Forever?
No, he's referring to physical EPROMs which were purchased from a legitmate source and have Cloanto labels on the devices that have a licence code which you can register on the Cloanto website to download a copy of that ROM image.
@jupo42
I just noticed that I happened to still have a copy of the data I read out of the v40.55 ROMs in question when diagnosing the said issue. The data is certainly valid as a checksum recalculation matches the ROM data. Besides, the machine would red screen otherwise. And I got the v40.55 image working on UAE and floppy support works. I could flash the image into a pair of 55nSec test devices and check on actual A3000 hardware, but I suspect it'll be fine. Probably nothing wrong with the contents.
Just a theory at the moment, so don't go giving anyone grief, but it's possible that the EPROMs being sourced for these Cloanto labelled ROM sets don't actually meet the minimum access timing for the A3000. The EPROM access speed is shown in a section of the part number etched on them, e.g. 27C4000-12 = 120nSec. I didn't see what was on the said suspect devices, as I didn't want to peel off the sticker and void the customer's warranty.
In saying that, I've seen a number of instances where grey market component vendors alter the manufacturer's laser etched device part numbers, so you're actually getting something different to what's shown on the part. Again, I have no evidence to say that this is the case here.
Contact the place you bought them from in the first instance. If multiple customers are having the same issue, then they need to look at their source of blank parts. Feel free to refer them to this thread or pass on my contact details. It's in everyone's best interest to sort this out if it's going to be an ongoing problem.
http://amiga.serveftp.net
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Just a theory at the moment, so don't go giving anyone grief, but it's possible that the EPROMs being sourced for these Cloanto labelled ROM sets don't actually meet the minimum access timing for the A3000.
I thought about that too, but since I've got a 030/25 system, I don't think I can slow down the timing any further than the default, as far as real world testing.
I'll report it to the store and to Cloanto, but I'm not super upset since they were pretty cheap, so is there anyone who wants to dig deeper into this, either with another A3k or testing equipment I don't have?
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Hi, as far as I know the latest Cloanto kickstart rom are v45.61 not 40.55. Perhaps your v40.55 is an old build.
Anyway, even in this case (v45.61), Cloanto has provided little information about them. There is not a changelog and a mention of the responsible developer that did the rom build, so unluckily you are on your own on this. I suggest going back to CBM v40.68 which has been stable and thoroughly tested and we actually know what is inside and how to fix its shortcomings.
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Hi jupo42 do you have any news on this topic?
By the way, i have same issue with ROM 3.X Amiga 1200 (two chips) from Cloanto.
I have two floppy drives that are connected to my A1200. One gotek as internal, one real floopy driver as external. None of them can read floopies after installing Cloanto ROM 3.X
the error message i get is " non-DOS disk "
so i opened a problem ticket to the seller and waiting their response.
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Maybe exec.library 45.21 is the one to blame.
If you have exec.library v45.20 you can try to load it with loadmodule, and see if it fixes the issue.
Jus a thought :)
Update:
I have just been told that the matter is being investigated :)
So a solution might be just around the corner.
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I have a similar problem with Cloanto 3.X ROMs. I have an Apollo 1230 fitted. I have found that disabling the Fast RAM on the 1230 (either by setting the jumper or by removing the SIMMs) then the floppy drive problem goes away. So with 3.X ROMs, you can have Fast RAM, or a working floppy drive, but not both.
Definitely a 3.X ROM issue. It's all fine if I go back to 3.1 ROMs.
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Hi, as far as I know the latest Cloanto kickstart rom are v45.61 not 40.55. Perhaps your v40.55 is an old build.
Anyway, even in this case (v45.61), Cloanto has provided little information about them. There is not a changelog and a mention of the responsible developer that did the rom build, so unluckily you are on your own on this. I suggest going back to CBM v40.68 which has been stable and thoroughly tested and we actually know what is inside and how to fix its shortcomings.
Hi,
I'm new to the Amiga.Org community but not new to Amiga. Background: I have an A3000 with the A3640. This required the 40.68 ROMS for Floppy and SCSI to function correctly along with the new revision custom chips. I was lucky to get a hold of the 40.72 ROMS. (Best Amiga Day, that day!)
I have a second A3000 with the 40.68 ROMS (sold by SoftHut). I could easily put the old ROMS (2.04) back in. Just an offer. I just don't know how to go about sending, trading or selling parts here. Your name is on them if you want.
Cheers!!
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jupo42
You live in AZ. I can send 'em from LA. Besides 40.68 ROMS, I may have some of the upgrade rev. chips as well. Have to check the stash.
Cheers!!
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I guess I found the issue : into _IVPORTS, it's UW in the structure, not L...
Another little bug in REVISION, it's $15 and not $14...
Since there is no history.txt, here I am :
- bug .L in _IVPORTS
- bug in the REVISION number
- very tiny optimizations here and here (st, pea, bcc, movem...)
- __scanBounds_512 and related simplified
- IntAckFix included (Bert Jahn)
- fix tst.b R_Alert (Harry Sintonen)
(Note for some professionnal trollers like kolla : I have nothing to do with this new Kickstart 3.X)
:)
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(Note for some professionnal trollers like kolla : I have nothing to do with this new Kickstart 3.X)
:)
I know! :laughing:
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Not sure that workbench library should be relocated as well as having AGA stuff on an A3000.
Something funny here.
Uncommon, yes, but funny, not really.
Space is very tight in this particular ROM version, due to the updated FastFileSystem and scsi.device drivers being in there, among others. These drivers take up more space than the original versions, and as little as that might appear to add, it won't allow for all compontents to fit. Dropping workbench.library out is the straightforward solution to this problem. Commodore did the same with the A4000T ROM due to space constraints.
The AA graphics.library variant has a fall-back for ECS/OCS and won't blow up on the A3000. The only drawback I can see in the use of this graphics.library variant is that it takes up more space than the ECS version.
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(Note for some professionnal trollers like kolla : I have nothing to do with this new Kickstart 3.X) :)
Maybe if you did it wouldn't be so messed up! :hammer:
:lol:
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Anyone made a patch for this exec.lib ?
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I'm considering getting a set of these for my A1200 - is this issue resolved in the latest versions of the ROM's?
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issue with floppy drive is resolved. i bought 2 of the last set for A3000.
but... there's an issue with sfs formatted drives.
they appear twice on the workbench. normally, and greyed icon.
i contact cloanto about this, they investigate, and told me the bug is in sfs itself, bug with indentification...
they send me a patched sfs wich solve the problem. but nowdays, sfs for 68k seems "dead". so idk if they can officialy release a patch at the moment.
and, they are wrongly labeled for the A3000.
i bought 2 set at vesalia, and all 2 have their label U180 U181 swapped... so, the first time i tried... i let you guess what happened, until i try swapping them.
so maybe you can face the same for the A1200 chips.
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Hi.
Just wondering if there has been any resolution to this?
I have licensed 45.061 roms in my amiga 2000 that I purchased, that have been working fine, right up until I install fast ram expansion. As soon as I put a 4mb module into my accelerator, I get the NDOS error on my floppys.
I see that later versions of the rom, I think they are up to .64 or .65 now, have a floppy fix in the patch notes.
I've tried contacting cloanto through his website, and through amiga forever, and never got a response or acknowledgement.
If there was a fabulous new feature that I wanted, i wouldn't mind buying an updated rom, but this is a basic system breaking fault.
I wouldn't even mind if I had to use a patch file on boot, but my google-fu has failed me (plus I'm really not that familiar with amigas). I bumble my way through hardware/software setup guides, and fiddle until its completely broken or working.
Does any one have a rom image they can share for the latest? I can prove that i have licensed roms, if needs be. Otherwise, I guess I'll wipe the rom, and just put 3.1 kickstart on it.
Thanks, Joe
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I've tried contacting cloanto through his website, and through amiga forever, and never got a response or acknowledgement.
you may have to be a bit patient. they took 1 month to reply me.
but once they did, i was followed regulary by one person, unitl the problem solved.
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issue with floppy drive is resolved. i bought 2 of the last set for A3000.
but... there's an issue with sfs formatted drives.
they appear twice on the workbench. normally, and greyed icon.
Thanks - I couldn't find anything on their website or Google indicating this (maybe I didn't look hard enough) so I appreciate the quick follow-up!
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I have these same problems with the 3.X ROM in my A2000 with an A2630 + BigRAM2630. I have to remove the BigRAM to use the floppy. I need to buy a stock 3.1 ROM to replace the 3.X ROM. I believe it to be the cause.
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I have these same problems with the 3.X ROM in my A2000 with an A2630 + BigRAM2630. I have to remove the BigRAM to use the floppy. I need to buy a stock 3.1 ROM to replace the 3.X ROM. I believe it to be the cause.
What rev of the 3.x rom do you have? Mine was the 45.061 rev.
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you may have to be a bit patient. they took 1 month to reply me.
but once they did, i was followed regulary by one person, unitl the problem solved.
It's been over a month now..