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Amiga computer related discussion => General chat about Amiga topics => Topic started by: ElPolloDiabl on December 06, 2014, 03:40:25 AM
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Here is the MIPS creator. If you don't like ARM we could port to this one instead.
http://www.extremetech.com/extreme/195369-mips-creator-ci20-the-raspberry-pi-competitor-that-isnt (http://www.extremetech.com/extreme/195369-mips-creator-ci20-the-raspberry-pi-competitor-that-isnt)
I'm going go read the specs of the MIPS. It is 1.2 GHz dual core. 1GB RAM and will cost $65
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Here is another link with specs. Sorry it is in little endian by default.
http://elinux.org/CI20_Hardware#Tech_Spec_overview (http://elinux.org/CI20_Hardware#Tech_Spec_overview)
edit: Would it be worth it to ask for a big Endian version?
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Just use a faster 68K and Bob is your uncle.
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edit: Would it be worth it to ask for a big Endian version?
A lot of MIPS processors (but not all) can run user programs in big endian mode by setting the RE bit in the COP0 Status register. It would be interesting to see whether this one supported it.
Some can also be configured with a pin on the CPU. It would require a hardware change and all the software would need recompiling and flashing (and maybe even modification).
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I prefer MIPS to ARM for sure, because the assembler is much easier to understand and keep track of, the addressing modes are simpler and more flexible, and I love SGI hardware too. Since IRIX runs Big Endian too, there is little chance this board would be of any use, let alone the fact that IRIX is not source available or free.
MIPS is also quite fast for its clock speeds, but here RAM may be a limiter.
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Another dead hardware platform to support? What comes next? AmigaOs on SPARC? Come on...
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Mips is still very much in use, buried deeply into embedded systems where you don't know or care what CPU it is. It doesn't have the mass-market brand appeal that ARM has. ARM has potential for "desktop" compute platforms in that there are high-performance parts planned and coming soon, with desktop style connectivity involved. I'm not aware of anything MIPS like that. (If anyone does, I'd be interested in learning) MIPS would still leave us mostly in hardware limbo, as there are not desktop boards or laptops being made that we could make use of.
IMHO, if AmigaOS moves away from PPC, there are only two destinations that make sense. Either x86-64 or ARM64. Due to the availability of hardware that makes sense for those available or coming...
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Another dead hardware platform to support? What comes next? AmigaOs on SPARC? Come on...
You beat me to it!
But at least we'll have even more security through obscurity! :-)
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A SPARC Powered by AmigaOS !?
Ok, now I understand what means Amiga Everywhere.
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MIPS as a post-PPC "Amiga NG" architecture would be even more insane than staying with PPC...
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MIPS as a post-PPC "Amiga NG" architecture would be even more insane than staying with PPC...
Not sure how your logic works; At worst I would say it is equally insane. And at best it is less insane and a bit more commercially practical than PPC.
The problems with PPC as a business started a long time ago. When the captain of the ship goes mad and is repeatedly making questionable choices, those who can swim jump ship. In this scenario the mad captain is IBM, and those who couldn't swim earlier are learning how to, fast.
I was always a big fan of the Power and PowerPC architecture. And I am a fan of the MIPS and the SPARC architecture. But most people don't give a flying f#@% about microprocessor architecture, and when they see someone like me geek out over these things they think Loco! :crazy:
We've all seen Morphos' roadmap and their plans to eventually move off of PowerPC, and if some day in the not too distant future A-Eon with or without Hyperion decide to move away from PPC the likely choices would be either ARM or x86. But if those two where not an option, MIPS gets my vote. I've said as much, multiple times.
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Anyone interested on what the Chinese are doing with MIPS please check out
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Loongson
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Mips is still very much in use, buried deeply into embedded systems where you don't know or care what CPU it is. It doesn't have the mass-market brand appeal that ARM has. ARM has potential for "desktop" compute platforms in that there are high-performance parts planned and coming soon, with desktop style connectivity involved. I'm not aware of anything MIPS like that. (If anyone does, I'd be interested in learning) MIPS would still leave us mostly in hardware limbo, as there are not desktop boards or laptops being made that we could make use of.
IMHO, if AmigaOS moves away from PPC, there are only two destinations that make sense. Either x86-64 or ARM64. Due to the availability of hardware that makes sense for those available or coming...
Desktop motheboards:
http://mattst88.com/blog/2010/11/12/The_Loongson_3A_%28Godson_3A%29_looks_nice!/
Notebooks:
http://www.technogog.com/review/alpha-400-mips-400mhz-128mb-1gb-7-linux-ultralite-note/
http://www.amazon.com/Screen-Lemote-Yeeloong-8101_B-Netbook/dp/B005XH10NQ
http://technologer.net/2009/05/15/iunika-gyy-netbook-is-low-in-specs-but-solar-powered/
That only in a 1 minute google search; if you search more in deep sure you find more
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I searched "mips 64" and I did find one big endian board that runs Debian.
Broadcom BCM91250A: 800mhz dual core
http://mattst88.com/computers/bcm91250a/ (http://mattst88.com/computers/bcm91250a/)
There is not a lot of software support. I'll check back in few months.
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Why?
Maybe AROS can be made to run on a MIPS based mobo, but what would be the reason?
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@above
I really liked the assembler code. It is a lot like 68k. If the assembler code is nearly identical maybe it would be easier to port to.
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Imagination paid a lot of money for MIPS, and they are definitely doing the right thing releasing a low cost hobby board based on their CPU/GFX IP. But the board is around the same price as an equivalent ARM board, but with less mature developer tools and far less investment (I wouldn't expect to see a MIPS desktop/server capable board any time soon).
I find myself tempted to get one... But there are better ARM boards for the money.
-edit- The HummingBoard is very exciting :-)
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Imagination paid a lot of money for MIPS, and they are definitely doing the right thing releasing a low cost hobby board based on their CPU/GFX IP. But the board is around the same price as an equivalent ARM board, but with less mature developer tools and far less investment (I wouldn't expect to see a MIPS desktop/server capable board any time soon).
I find myself tempted to get one... But there are better ARM boards for the money.
-edit- The HummingBoard is very exciting :-)
There are already desktop/server capable board
Cavium have up to 48-core 2.5GHz MIPS64 SOCs
http://www.cavium.com/newsevents_Cavium_Unveils_48-core_OCTEON-III_MIPS64_Processor.html
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Another dead hardware platform to support? What comes next? AmigaOs on SPARC? Come on...
OMG, I'd buy that! :roflmao:
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There are already desktop/server capable board
Cavium have up to 48-core 2.5GHz MIPS64 SOCs
http://www.cavium.com/newsevents_Cavium_Unveils_48-core_OCTEON-III_MIPS64_Processor.html
Lol, perhaps I should have also added "...that I can buy!".
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Here is the MIPS creator. If you don't like ARM we could port to this one instead.
http://www.extremetech.com/extreme/195369-mips-creator-ci20-the-raspberry-pi-competitor-that-isnt
I'm going go read the specs of the MIPS. It is 1.2 GHz dual core. 1GB RAM and will cost $65
I have to admit that I have always found MIPS interesting.
But with shipping this is $75.
I just received two 2GB quad core 1.8 GHz A17 based set top boxes that ran about $80 each.
And running Android, these are more practical for the every day uses I have for them.
I might still order one of these MIPS based boards, but it isn't that practical a purchase.
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Already pre-ordered a couple. Been watching for these since they were announce a couple months ago. Anyone thinking mips is dead might check out the markets they're shooting for. Wearable tech for one.
Plaz
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I have to admit that I have always found MIPS interesting.
But with shipping this is $75.
I just received two 2GB quad core 1.8 GHz A17 based set top boxes that ran about $80 each.
And running Android, these are more practical for the every day uses I have for them.
Android - when you care enough to run a crappy, non-portable "run anywhere" branded language / environment which tries to support as many viruses and Trojans as Windows...
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Android - when you care enough to run a crappy, non-portable "run anywhere" branded language / environment which tries to support as many viruses and Trojans as Windows...
I know some amigans who would sell their soul, to have AmigaOS (or MOS or AROS) selling 1/10th of the "crappy, non-prortable and virus-plagued language/environment"...
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Android - when you care enough to run a crappy, non-portable "run anywhere" branded language / environment which tries to support as many viruses and Trojans as Windows...
Interesting opinion, but Android has always worked well for me.
"branded language / environment" ?
I'm pretty sure the term is still "OS" (short for Operating System).
And..."tries to support as many viruses and Trojans as Windows".
Those require support?
I always thought their presence was a good indicator of the size of the user base of an OS and its general popularity.
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Now that andoid is mentioned: Mips64 is one of the three supported cpus of Android lollipop
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Android - when you care enough to run a crappy, non-portable "run anywhere" branded language / environment which tries to support as many viruses and Trojans as Windows...
I find complaining about viruses support in an amiga forum kind of weird. The only OS I have ever been infected by a virus was my Amiga. Not on Linux, not on Android, not even on Windows.
"Something wonderful has happened Your AMIGA is alive !!!"...
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it appears HP are making some new kind of computer and creating a new OS for it... http://www.technologyreview.com/news/533066/hp-will-release-a-revolutionary-new-operating-system-in-2015/ (http://www.technologyreview.com/news/533066/hp-will-release-a-revolutionary-new-operating-system-in-2015/)
maybe this could be the new platform for AmigaOS ;)
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HP
"shaking up its own troubled business"
They should concentrate on getting their server systems back in gear. Loosing Itanium had to hurt a lot. Our shop cancelled multi-year, multi-million dollar contracts because if it and you'll find similar stories all over. If this news is that HPUX will now run on other CPUs then maybe there's hope.
Plaz
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it appears HP are making some new kind of computer and creating a new OS for it... http://www.technologyreview.com/news/533066/hp-will-release-a-revolutionary-new-operating-system-in-2015/ (http://www.technologyreview.com/news/533066/hp-will-release-a-revolutionary-new-operating-system-in-2015/)
maybe this could be the new platform for AmigaOS ;)
Early prototype in 2016, that should align nicely with the release of AmigaOS 4.2 ;)
What HP are doing is more important than what they produce; They are looking at what compromises have been made in the past and are questioning if we still need to be making them. This is a key mindset for innovation.
Server computing is where companies spend gazillions of $ each year and makes sense to launch to these customers, most of which are dealing with power consumption issues for their ever demanding server loads.
Personal computing is migrating over to the personal devices like notebooks, tablets, and smartphones. Even in the corporate sector here in Oz most companies issue a notebook to their staff. Denizens of desktops seem to be developers, gamers, and professionals in the video and CAD/CAM segments. Oh and the nouveau-retro Amiga hobbyists.
It's all a moot point anyway. Until someone decides to open-source AmigaOS 4.x we are stuck with PowerPC. More like MoneyPC.
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Is there a server that shares RAM? or does each unit need its own RAM and hard drive?
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Interesting opinion, but Android has always worked well for me.
"branded language / environment" ?
I'm pretty sure the term is still "OS" (short for Operating System).
The Java-like environment negates many of the possible advantages of running on a GNU/Linux OS. It's the worst of both worlds.
And..."tries to support as many viruses and Trojans as Windows".
Those require support?
I always thought their presence was a good indicator of the size of the user base of an OS and its general popularity.
That's a myth. There's a reason there are no active, actual viruses for BSD (Mac OS X included) or GNU/Linux. Sure, there are plenty of Trojans, but Trojans and viruses are not the same things.
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ElPolloDiablo: sounds like what you describe is what we call a cluster of servers. A proper cluster operating system runs on several computers, and processes can share resources like ram and disk across the nodes in the cluster. Since the topic has turned to HP here, they are the current owners of OpenVMS Galaxy, which is a cluster operating system.
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Desktop motheboards:
http://mattst88.com/blog/2010/11/12/The_Loongson_3A_%28Godson_3A%29_looks_nice!/
Notebooks:
http://www.technogog.com/review/alpha-400-mips-400mhz-128mb-1gb-7-linux-ultralite-note/
http://www.amazon.com/Screen-Lemote-Yeeloong-8101_B-Netbook/dp/B005XH10NQ
http://technologer.net/2009/05/15/iunika-gyy-netbook-is-low-in-specs-but-solar-powered/
That only in a 1 minute google search; if you search more in deep sure you find more
Heh. Cool. Are any of those still available? The geeks netbook is flagged as unavailable. The server/desktop boards sound nice, and even use AMD chipsets like X1000 does, kindof. The 10" notebook I find two "offers" available, which does not sound like an ongoing sale of a still manufactured product, that's how clearance or out of print things end up.
Which is sortof the situation we are already in with PPC, where do we actually buy hardware? Sometimes we can, sometimes there is not anything to buy at all, not even used.
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The Java-like environment negates many of the possible advantages of running on a GNU/Linux OS. It's the worst of both worlds.
What would those negations be?
Performance isn't an issue as illustrated by many games, with many GHz making low level optimisation a banal task best left to the 90s for 90% of modern development, for that other stuff there's also Android's Renderscript.
The sandboxed runtime prevents some security leaks, which is better than no prevention.
Managed memory prevents memory and related overrun leaks.
Built in optimisation for coders who don't know or need to know how to optimise.
General high compatibility whatever the hardware be it Android on a Tegra, MIPs etc devices.
A source language using improved syntax (over C++ and assembly) which comes with a standard string class, async io, threading libraries and common hardware interfacing.
Or did you mean something else?
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I find myself tempted to get one... But there are better ARM boards for the money.
...or for less money: Odroid-C1
-edit- The HummingBoard is very exciting :-)
Lookup the firefly board, it's more powerful.
The AMD A1100 has a proper desktop style board but it's only a (rather expensive) dev board at the moment.