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Amiga computer related discussion => Amiga Hardware Issues and discussion => Topic started by: RealHomer on August 15, 2014, 03:31:59 AM
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I just discovered my collection of Amiga hardware and software after having thought it was all lost 5 years ago when I went through a drastic downsizing and move to my current home.
My garage has been piled to the ceiling with everything that would not fit into house from the move. I had sorted through about half of the garage a couple of years ago but it was filled up again after my daughter moved in and my ex dumping her storage unit's contents into my garage. This summer I was determined I was going clean out the entire garage and toss out or remove everyone's junk so I could use the garage as a place to park my car (what a novel idea for a garage)
When I got to the back wall I was excited when I came upon all of my Amiga gear. I was especially happy to pull out the A2000 which had been my main Amiga and a fairly loaded unit; 2mb Agnus, Picasso II+, Zeus 040 28 mhz, Opal Vision Board, Zip Drive, CD-R, other goodies plus OS 3.5. Just a couple years before it had gone into storage I had sent the 2000 out to have the battery replaced with a lithium battery to prevent battery acid leakage. I was pretty confident that the old 2000 would boot up when I plugged it in.
I was pretty disappointed when the screen remained blank after I turned it on. I double checked the cables to make sure I had it set up right but nothing happened. So I popped the case off to check that all the chips were seated. I removed the floppy drives to work on the motherboard and found battery corrosion all over the board and a leaking barrel battery installed on the board. Where was that lithium I had paid good money for, sigh....
Right now I have a rev 6A A500 that is working. I have an ICD AdSpeed and AdRam unit but the 500 always ran flacky with them installed and I only kept it to run old games and do simple video titling through a cheap genlock.
I also have a couple AGA machines; an A1200 and a CD32 with a Paravision SX1. The 1200 had been my main go to machine before I bought the A2000. The CD32 was used in the living room attached to the TV as a games and karaoke machine when we had friends over to the house. When I pulled the CD32 out plugged it in, at first it would only run with SX1 disconnected. After cleaning the connectors which were oxidized I did manage to get the SX1 to partially work. The RGB, floppy drive, AT kb connector work. The hard drive boots up into 3.1 but occasionally I am getting hard drive errors. The memory does not work on the SX1, when I enable the jumper for the memory the CD32 freezes and does not boot, when disabled unit boots just fine. The memory is listed but is not accessible. I tried to use some add memory programs but they either freeze or nothing happens.
After the initial excitement and disappointment with the 2000 I am pondering if I should try to get my machines cleaned, updated and running again or not. I had a lot invested in these machines but they are getting long of tooth and all of them now have some issues and TLC that needs to be applied to get themup and running again. I haven't used an Amiga in a while but feel the bug. Just debating if I should restore these units or set up a PC with AROS and Amiga Forever.
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For some people, emulation just isn't the same. That being said, UAE or Amiga Forever is a good and cheap way to dip your toe back into the scene before you invest what may be serious amounts of cash on old legacy hardware. I recommend AmiKit, personally. It's extremely easy to use.
But for a lot of people, emulation just doesn't scratch the itch for them, and I understand that too. To each his own, and all that jazz.
I spent a lot of money years ago tweaking out an A1200, never really could get it as stable as I'd have liked. I'm far more happy with my emulation, Amithlon and NG solutions now. Guess I just don't have the patience and time to fritter away fighting with old hardware anymore, heh.
Best of luck!
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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HXJkLBj6G1k
Now that is out of the way...
I love having my real Amiga. Do I use it a lot? Well, when I get an itch I fire it up. But a lot of the fun (for me) is tweaking it and trying to get it to work just right and fast. Emulation is boring to me 'cause 'it just works'. Then again, I just love to tinker with crap, and didn't really get a chance when the Amiga was huge. I had an Atari Mega STe (well still do, but not sure if it'll start up or not, my monitor is dead), and it just wasn't quite as hackable as the Amigas were/are.
I say fix 'em up, and enjoy 'em.
slaapliedje
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There are at least 2 camps on the current retro scene: those that love the hardware and like to restore it, and those that love the retro games played on any device. The are a fair number of hybrids out there too.
Personally, I grew up on computers and programming, then fell in love with the Amiga hardware and the Amiga OS. I've used my Ami for office work way more than gaming, and after tweaking the living hell out of my A4000T, bought an X1000.
But you have to ask yourself, not "do you feel lucky," but what is the experience you want?
There is a strange pride to restoring a vintage computer with a life expectancy designed for years and not decades, but the simplicity of the old games can de-stress folks as they remember a simpler life.
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Good luck getting those boxes running. I have emulated using Amithlon and I have to say the real thing just feels better. If you need to send it in for repairs, we have plenty of trustworthy chaps here who'd be happy to take a crack at fixing it. You did take the Nicad battery out... Right?
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After the initial excitement and disappointment with the 2000 I am pondering if I should try to get my machines cleaned, updated and running again or not. I had a lot invested in these machines but they are getting long of tooth and all of them now have some issues and TLC that needs to be applied to get themup and running again. I haven't used an Amiga in a while but feel the bug. Just debating if I should restore these units or set up a PC with AROS and Amiga Forever.
Welcome! If I were you I'd have a go at getting them running again (without spending a fortune in the process).
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Every time I boot up one of my Amigas, I reboot the memories, emotions, and feelings of the time. Pure nostalgia, but also therapeutic and stress relieving. Whether I play a game for 30 mins or a .mod for 3mins. After i stand up and walk away I feel better than when I sat down. The basis of the meaning if life. I don't get that from WinUAE, it's more functional, or an end to a means.
Priceless.
IMO you should get a new MB for your 2000.
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BTW, the title should be Amiga Stash Woes.
I thank the thread for the encouragement. It was a little bit of a roller coaster and a downer to find that my Amiga's are in bad shape from neglect. I think the course of action is to restore the A2000 and A1200 first. First order of business is to clean up the 2000 and see what can be done. The corrosion doesn't look extreme and it could be a case of cleaning up the board and possibly swapping the socketed chips one by one to see if I can get it to boot. Of course I will need to trouble shoot the traces and see if they are bad and can be fixed.
Any recommendations on what chemicals to use to clean the board? I have heard it should be cleaned with alcohol and that an anti-corrosive should be applied after all the work is completed for the restoration.
The 1200 was towered before but now is back as a desk top. It needs a new hard drive I need to test it to make sure it is still working. If it boots up I will send the motherboard off to be recapped and the PCMCIA port replaced(couple of the pins are problematic.
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For the CD32 problem I can say the SX32 e.g. have problems with the cheap connectors of my SX32 (silver connectors). Probably the SX1 has the same problem - then this is nearly unpossible to fix for again a long function I read on the net (http://www.a1k.org). The SX32pro is better because it has gold connectors. So if it works without the SX1 connected then you are lucky to not have the problems with the leaking capacitors - at least yet - but this problem is the same for all the newer classic Amigas.
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What @gertsy said. I could never get the hang of emulation, didn't like it at all. For me it's real hardware or nothing! Glad to hear you're getting 'em fixed! Search the forums here for all kinds of tips on cleaning that battery acid, where to send them to have them re-capped, etc. Folks here will get you right in no time. :)
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While car batteries use hydrochloric acid, the barrel battery contains potassium hydroxide, or lye. First neutralize the lye with an acid such as acetic acid (white vinegar), and rinse with distilled water until the residue is gone. Whether you rinse with 91% isopropyl alcohol next or later, let the motherboard dry for at least 24 hours. Unfortunately the lye will dissolve the copper traces within the layers on the motherboard causing "invisible" damage that can only be diagnosed using a schematic and multimeter.
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Dan, thanks for explanation, I had read elsewhere to use ascetic acid and I wasn't sure that it was correct to use acid to neutralize "acid" damage. Your explanation cleared it up for me.
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Some experts don´t suggest the vinegar...
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Some experts don´t suggest the vinegar...
Ask 1000 people you get 1001 answers. ;)
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Some experts don´t suggest the vinegar...
Well, I don't suggest either apple vinegar or lemon juice due to the contaminates, and in the lab I would probably rinse with 0.01 molar HCL using litmus paper to test the effluent for a pH of 7 as a pH meter would require an expensive micro probe -- I mean we're talking $4,000 for the probe. However using plain deionized water to wash away the precipitation leaves the alkali salt still attached to the copper metal; while one might be able to use a reducing compound or abrasive to clean the metal, I have absolutely no idea why one would go to such trouble when a simple acid wash followed by a clean rinse is so much easier. I suppose to each his own...
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I agree with a lot of people here that emulation...just doesnt' feel the same. I've got my mac mini and lcd monitor sitting on top of my A2000 hooked up with a kvm and let me tell you, nothing quite like firing up my A2000, hearing the floppy drive and knowing you've got the real deal right in front of you...Plus, even if I don't end up turning on the amiga, it's cool just seeing it there everyday. Now if I could only use my amiga keyboard and mouse with my mac...:roflmao:
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RealHomer,
I, personally use lemon juice then followed by IP and a distilled water rinse. I have done alot of A2000s this way. The biggest problem is it can go under the sockets of the CPU, ROM, and such, and can be hidden that way. If this is the case, you will have to unsolder the sockets and put new sockets in. If you can solder, this is easy, but if you can't, this can really hinder the progress.
If you can solder, I would also suggest replacing the caps at this time also, as you already have the motherboard stipped out anyways.
If you can't solder, then finding another A2000 (if you are in North America) may be an easy and cheaper alternative, and transfer everything over to the new machine. Nice thing is you don't have to re-install from scratch, just plug and play as you old hard drive is already set up.
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What REV is the 2000 mother board BTW? If it's 5 or below it's probably better sourcing a REV 6.3 or 6.5.
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Right, it is an older revision 4.2 that has been heavily modified over the years. I don't even know what half of the mods are for. I have already considered about finding a replacement board or complete replacement 2000 or 3000 and salvage the Picasso, 040, 2mb Agnus, and the Opal board.
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I unpacked all the Amiga computers now and started testing them one by one.
CD32 with SX1 runs but can't get the memory in the SX1 to autoconfig but it does show up under Showconfig. I tried swapping out some simms to see if the one I had was defective but same issue, system locks if I set the jumper to autoconfig. I searched Aminet and found Addmem program to add non-configured memory and as soon as I can connect my A1200 my broadband I will download and try it out.
A1200, I had this installed in a tower case that I sold when I picked up the A2000 way back in 1999. I had all the parts packed away but I assembled everything together in the desktop case and booted it up. The hard drive is dead but that wasn't unexpected because I had bought a new one before I tore it down from the tower because it was already going bad. The new hard drive is formatted but I ordered a 4gb CF drive instead that I will install OS 3.5. The 1230 XA 030 mhz with 128 mb of memory works like a champ. The floppy is one of the rare Amiga HD drives. I am considering changing it with an ADF floppy replacement drive. Other upgrades I will add will be the Indivision AGA and a Wifi card for the PCMCIA slot. I am going to keep the A1200 in the desktop, never was happy with the quality of the A1200 tower kits.
A2000, removed the battery, too busy to tear it down and give it the lemon juice and ISP treatment right now.
A3000, this was dead when it went into storage. Someone gave it to me with a A3640 and AMax II+ card. It had battery acid damage that had been repaired and new battery installed. Lot of the traces had to be jumped and it was always quirky and finally died many years ago. I kept it for a person in my old user group that managed to pick up a couple of A3000+ prototype boards. He was going to install them and see if they would boot. I don't know what happened to him or the boards as I lost contact with him. I plugged the A3000 in and the power supply fan comes on but nothing else, as expected.
A1000. I have 2, one of the with a broken case that is heavily yellow. Plugged them in and both work but the one with a good case has a dead floppy drive. I tried to use the old DD drive from the A1200, it works but doesn't align with the slot and I would have to keep the face plate off. I swapped drives from the other A1000 but it is missing the button and the button from the dead drive is not compatible. So for now I have to use a slot screw driver to eject the disk. The good news is that the A1000 booted right up and I ran some old tunes and anims on it. It is stock without any upgrades and not good for much more than decoration and playing tunes. If the ACA 1000 ever comes out?
A500, darn I remembered after I unpacked it that I had given the AdSpeed and AdIde to my brother in law for his A2000. I have the 4mb ram card and the daughter board that allows you to use an external floppy drive as df0: (its missing the floppy drives as I gave those to my brother in law too) I can install the old dd floppy from the A1200 but same issue as the A1000, no eject button. I may use parts from the A500 to try and trouble shoot the A2000 though. I will still want to get the A500 up and running so I know the parts are good.
As much as I liked the A1200 and AGA I still preferred the big box A2000 with the Picasso, Opalvision, and 040. I have a Supergen genlock and loads of video and graphics software and other goodies that I used to produce videos back in my Amiga days and would be nice to boot all that stuff up again.
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The lemon juice contains Ascorbic acid (vitamin C) and contaminants that are not terribly soluble; if you just want to neutralize a base and do nothing else, use a pure acid, however if you wish to something else, then go for it.