Amiga.org
Amiga computer related discussion => General chat about Amiga topics => Topic started by: Lurch on April 07, 2014, 10:12:26 AM
-
Well after modding the hell out of my A1200, I'm thinking it might be time to sell up and purchase an NG.
Getting all the hardware/software mods to work together was and still is enjoyable, yet frustrating task.
With the slow updates on mediator drivers for both the Voodoo 5 and Radeon 9200 it's really holding AmigaOS 3.9 back. Rattes updated Radeon driver was looking like the answer but Elbox trampled that.
Also getting any information/response from Elbox is impossible. Which adds to my frustration when spending quite a bit on their products.
Reliability is another factor, with all those different hacks/patches running it feels unstable now and then. The most annoying part is getting RTG/AGA switching working with WHDLoad, which wouldn't really be a problem with an NG. I've given up on this and run in AGA most of the time, although I don't get the pretty 1920x1080 with AFA OS/Zune desktop.
I have Quake/Quake 2 running great using Warp3D/MiniGL at 640x480. However Quake2 can be flaky and I get the odd software fault and it wont load. Another frustration.
Duke Nukem is fairly smooth except for a slight pause when some sounds load, but this would be resolved with using a FastATA, however it doesn't fit with the Indivision AGA MK2 and Mediator. :-/
Browsing is very useable, Ibrowse is fantastic. Although due to it's out dated browser engine a few websites don't display correctly. NetSurf is fantastic though, can feel slower than Ibrowse though but I think this is because it loads the entire page in one hit instead of loading parts of the page.
Flash, even with the Ibrowse plugin is a no go. Java stuff seems to timeout most of the time so I turned this off.
iGame/WHDLoad works really well (once you are running an AGA workbench) and the speed at what games load at is amazing. Forget floppy disks! :-)
99% of the demo's work great, no issues.
PPC stuff, I maybe tempted to purchase a PPC card for the A1200 but price wise I'd be better off buying an NG. The amount of money would buy me a nice setup, unless I can find someone throwing a card out (yeah right).
As a day to day machine, almost possible. The A1200 does an okay job :-)
Anyway I think I've accomplished (95% anyway) what I set out to do, I'll probably regret selling it. You always get that doubt with Amiga hardware, especially putting so much time into it. You become attached.
I'll go back to pondering it :-)
-
>classic
there is no "classic", just "amiga" ;)
>Well after modding the hell out of my A1200, I'm thinking it might be time to sell up
isnt it fun enough just using it?
>Also getting any information/response from Elbox is impossible.
is it these days? they were actually rather helpful every time i called them, but maybe its just me and its anyway a miracle they still exist at all.
> The most annoying part is getting RTG/AGA switching working with WHDLoad, which wouldn't really be a problem with an NG. I've given up on this and run in AGA most of the time, although I don't get the pretty 1920x1080 with AFA OS/Zune desktop.
problem solved because an ng wouldnt have aga at all? i suppose from the perspective of emulation winuae would be even more comfortable a solution, and a free one. personally ive never cared so much for aga rtg switch as i dont see it as so much hassle to switch inputs on the screen.
>Flash, even with the Ibrowse plugin is a no go. Java stuff
flash will stay no go anyway also on ng, same for java i guess and javascript may today be too heavy fro whatever amigalike except maybe aros x86
all in all i advise against getting ppc accel for amiga. you may check aros distributions with built in emulation. thats probably the simplest thing, but i cant tell as i am not using it. getting a ppc machine mos is probably least risky and still cheap, but thats common knowledge.
-
Reliability is another factor, with all those different hacks/patches running it feels unstable now and then. The most annoying part is getting RTG/AGA switching working with WHDLoad, which wouldn't really be a problem with an NG.
On NG you have to maintain alternate AmigaOS setup in UAE to run AGA games. It can be floppy based if you prefer or use WHDLoad/RTG like on your old Amiga.
@wawrzon
flash will stay no go anyway also on ng, same for java i guess and javascript may today be too heavy fro whatever amigalike except maybe aros x86
PPC is certainly fast enough to run most Javascript sites.
-
Personally I'd keep your A1200, trust me, you'll miss it when it's gone - plus the classic hardware only keeps increasing in value over the years.
I think it depends what you use your machine for, and in your case I think you would benefit from an "NG" system if you spend a lot of time in the OS, browsing etc.
Your requirements sounds similar to mine, so do what I did... keep your A1200 for old-skool games, demos, nostalgia and enjoying pushing the old hardware to the limits. I have a MAS Player to play MP3, ACA030 accelerator with 64mb of RAM, 160 GB hard disk, Ethernet NIC, Indivision AGA II - it really is the machine I always dreamed of when I was a kid and I get a kick out of using it.
Keep the 1200 but also buy a Mac Mini G4 or a PowerMac G4 (they can be had for next to nothing) and run MorphOS for your NG needs, it's like using a high-end Amiga with graphics card, fast processor, heaps of RAM, you can watch videos, surf the web and the OS is very fast and fluid. You can get a MorphOS setup for under €200 easy.
-
Dual boot AROS. Classic could not handle internet anything. NG must be great as a hobby, but as a primary OS it could not do much.
-
Well after modding the hell out of my A1200, I'm thinking it might be time to sell up and purchase an NG.
Getting all the hardware/software mods to work together was and still is enjoyable, yet frustrating task.
Well you've certainty taken the Classic a lot further than I've ever had the energy to do ;)
The 030 A1200 can of course run 97% of Classic games, an 060 will get you to 99% and PPC will only get you that last 1%....does that give a good perspective on things ;)
If you really want to have RTG then a big boxer is a better bet than going the A1200 to Tower + Mediator (IMHO).
At this point I wouldn't recommend to anybody that they upgrade a Classic to PPC (OS4 Classic want-to-be-users included!), if you really want to try an NG 'Amiga' then maybe have a look at MorphOS or AROS.
:)
-
If you want to use your Amiga for a day-to-day desktop replacement, then go NG. If you just want to tinker and play old software, than keep what you've got. I expect this post to devolve into a flame war in 3... 2... 1...
-
I expect this post to devolve into a flame war in 3... 2... 1...
Can't see why, if he gets a cheap MorphOS machine or runs AROS on his PC there should be no need to sell up the A1200 setup, MOS/AROS machines can be had for pennies. Best of both worlds then.
I'd probably sell the PCI bus and graphics cards and put the A1200 back to AGA and use MorphOS on a PPC Mac for the RTG/NG experience. The cash he gets for those will easy cover a PPC Mac and MOS licence with plenty left over.
-
I'd be very cautious and recommend you weigh your use case before taking anyones advice that any NG Amiga can be a day to day, desktop replacement for a more mainstream machine like a Windows, Linux or Mac box.
I love my NG systems, but the idea that I could use them to do my day to day business on them is laughable. They are great machines for what they are, but the truth is I couldn't even get my daily work tickets off GDocs on either MOS or my OS4 machine. The browsers puke too much.
Honestly, and I know how much people hate the emulation route - it's hard to go wrong with an Amithlon or even dedicated UAE box if you are intent on running older software. I've got both an Amithlon box and a dedicated UAE machine (XP base, boots right into WB 3.1, never even see Windows) and most people would be hard pressed to even recognize they are emulated machines if they were parked in front of them if an old Miggy KB and mouse were there.
-
I would try either Aeros or Arix (when it's here) since you could use any old PC you have and have a NG experience since they'll be suing Linux drivers as their backbone. If you have an old Apple PC around then you can try out MorphOS as I beleive they have a try out period before registering. If you want to try out AmigaOS4.x then you can get a used Sam440 system for a good price nowadays since many users are upgrading to Sam460 & X1000 and good thing is if you choose to upgrade you will always find a buyer for your 440.
I don't recommend selling your classic gear yet until you feel satisfied with the NG experience. Personally I'm a hardware tinkerer guy and glad I kept my classic stuff now that i have more space in my man cave since it always costs you more to re-purchase stuff you sold in the past.
-
I'd be very cautious and recommend you weigh your use case before taking anyones advice that any NG Amiga can be a day to day, desktop replacement for a more mainstream machine like a Windows, Linux or Mac box.
I completely agree. However if your usage is fulfilled by the software, hardware and horsepower available then it can be a very enjoyable route to go.
I love my NG systems, but the idea that I could use them to do my day to day business on them is laughable. They are great machines for what they are, but the truth is I couldn't even get my daily work tickets off GDocs on either MOS or my OS4 machine. The browsers puke too much.
I do have occasional problems with GDocs, but I've been more impressed by the availability and stability of MS Web apps (aside from the occasional menu bar malfunction when it first loads).
Honestly, and I know how much people hate the emulation route - it's hard to go wrong with an Amithlon or even dedicated UAE box if you are intent on running older software. I've got both an Amithlon box and a dedicated UAE machine (XP base, boots right into WB 3.1, never even see Windows) and most people would be hard pressed to even recognize they are emulated machines if they were parked in front of them if an old Miggy KB and mouse were there.
I personally don't hate emulation, in fact I enjoy emulation for old games - I just wouldn't want to go back to setting up and maintaining an OS3.9 setup again, even under emulation.
I've got way too comfortable with the things NG (MorphOS in my case) provides out of the box, or with a simple one-click installation with no missing dependencies.
A multi-booting MorphOS/OSX/Linux powerbook/macmini covers all my likely software needs, although I can't remember the last time I booted OSX or Linux - probably some time in January when I was doing my accounts looking for old spreadsheets and invoices.
Having said that, if you enjoy tinkering with the older hardware (and setting up your 'dream amiga' system that you longed for as a teen but could never afford), then keep onto your classic, or upgrade to something more stable (A4KT).
You might also find that you feel like you don't have much left to do with a stable, powerful system that's already got pci, rtg, usb, tcp/ip built-in.
Regarding Amiga always going up in value... so far it has quite steadily increased in value over the last decade or so (unless/until that day when you press the switch and nothing happens. :) )
-
Went further than I was wanting to go but it just snow balls, first the 060, then the mediator... on and on :-)
I do enjoy using it and it's looking good in it's new home.
@danwood - Well said, I have an old G4 tower that had MorphOS on it. Tried it many years ago. Not sure if I liked it or not. Looking at an Apple machine might have been it.
Was going to put it in another case, but now the G5 is supported I may look at that. A mac mini is a nice size, always wanted a cube though. A shame MorphOS doesn't support it.
@Novacoda - You know you're in trouble when you try to update your signature with all the mods and it takes up a couple of paragraphs :-) I don't think I'd ever buy a PPC card, for the price it's not really worth it. If it was a similar price to the 060 maybe. Can get a okay AmigaNG setup for less :-)
@itix - Possible to copy over an existing setup from my current A1200 and run it I guess? That would mean I wouldn't have to make too many changes.
@klx300r - Yeah this would be my second time purchasing/selling classic hardware. It has been more expensive this time round but I didn't take the modding as far as I have this time round.
@Oldsmobile_Mike - Hoping there isn't a flame war, some good healthy discussion would make a nice change.
After reading through I'll probably keep my A1200. I may look at a mac mini again, or a cheap G5. Although the G5 is massive in size :-/
Speed wise I guess the mac mini would be okay?
-
So I had a look for a mac mini locally but can only find a 32MB version. I'm guessing the 64MB is rare?
-
About 68k web browsers
It is sad that there is no proper version of Netsurf for 68k Amigans Chris has made a quite lot work to keep 68k version possible.
Current 68k version is based to framebuffer frontend wich is meant to be used for debuggin and no gui systems. I also havehigh doubs about using SDL to this.
What Netsurf team thinks about it is quite obivous, they don't accept it to here : http://www.netsurf-browser.org/downloads/
About speed : > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GUrkzRAc5zs
It does display imges when loading and it is MUCH faster with Atari Falcon
-
@itix - Possible to copy over an existing setup from my current A1200 and run it I guess? That would mean I wouldn't have to make too many changes.
You still have same issues maintaining dual AGA/RTG setup when trying to run old games and demos with WHDLoad. So in the end you ave nothing.
For gaming purposes and watching old demos it could be better idea strip down Amiga from RTG and make it AGA only setup. NG is better reserved to RTG stuff if you want that.
So I had a look for a mac mini locally but can only find a 32MB version. I'm guessing the 64MB is rare?
It is very rare. Only 500,000 units were built which is not many, really.
-
always wanted a cube though. A shame MorphOS doesn't support it.
Hardware Compatibility
On this page, you find a list of hardware that is directly supported by MorphOS 3.x.
[...]
Apple PowerMac Cube***
[...]
* * * - Lacks support for the bundled USB audio hardware.
http://morphos-team.net/hardware
:)
-
If you want to use your Amiga for a day-to-day desktop replacement, then go NG. If you just want to tinker and play old software, than keep what you've got. I expect this post to devolve into a flame war in 3... 2... 1...
No...not really.
You're all making a lot of sense.
I'm hard core blue, but you'll notice in my signature that I keep an A2000 around.
For practical purposes, NG makes sense, and I use Odyssey on my MorphOS system daily.
But I wouldn't ditch the A1200 either.
-
I'm NG all the way, me......
.. well, apart from the A500 with a PowerPC board (the KCS one :) ), the A600, the A1200/030, the three A1500s and the two A4000s with 200MHz and 350MHz PowerPCs respectively (the 350MHz is my work machine).
APART from that, I'm completely NG as well.
(In other words - don't sell the "classic" unless you have to. You'll regret it. All the NG systems are great, these days, but there are times when you just want to go back to the good old OS3)
-
I'm NG all the way, me......
.. well, apart from the A500 with a PowerPC board (the KCS one :) ), the A600, the A1200/030, the three A1500s and the two A4000s with 200MHz and 350MHz PowerPCs respectively (the 350MHz is my work machine).
APART from that, I'm completely NG as well.
(In other words - don't sell the "classic" unless you have to. You'll regret it. All the NG systems are great, these days, but there are times when you just want to go back to the good old OS3)
+1 and sing it again brother:)
-
As much as I hated seemingly always fiddling around fixing something on my old BV/PPC/040 A1200, I do miss the darned thing. I'm not much of a purist, but there's a lot to be said for the "Real McCoy" hardware wise - and I say that as someone with a SAM, a bulletproof stable Amithlon rig, and a dedicated straight to WB UAE machine owner.
Remember, costs you nothing to keep the old hardware! Keeping it around and only using it once or twice a year costs you nothing if you get some enjoyment out of it at all, and you'll never lose money on classic Amiga HW if you chose to sell it a few years down the road. Stuff will only go up in value.
-
I sold my 68 stuff a few years off and am MorphOS only these days. I must say I don-ät miss the 68k stuff too much. If you have the space though, keep the 68k gear and add a ppc machine. I recomend a Mac mini or a powerbook.
-
"classic" better know as real amigas= all
sams and x1000 "ng" better know as amiga-like= expensive harware for emulate real amiga software with a reasonable browser
-
sams and x1000 "ng" better know as amiga-like= expensive harware for emulate real amiga software with a reasonable browser
"NG" doesn't just mean OS4, there are several ways to get a very similar (if not better) "NG" Amiga experience for many times less money than the X1000 or Sams - MorphOS or AROS have already been mentioned in this thread and make more sense for a user on a budget or who doesn't need a specific element that only OS4 offers.
-
@danwood - Well said, I have an old G4 tower that had MorphOS on it. Tried it many years ago. Not sure if I liked it or not. Looking at an Apple machine might have been it.
Was going to put it in another case, but now the G5 is supported I may look at that. A mac mini is a nice size, always wanted a cube though. A shame MorphOS doesn't support it.
Well I've used Macs for years so I'm not anti-Apple, that's never bothered me - it's just a cheap way of getting a PPC motherboard really that's got professional build quality.
I bought an A1XE years ago and after living with the DMA bugs, the USB problems, the Articia chipset design flaws, non-working onboard sound, flat battery stopping boot, spending over $200 trying to get working RAM modules that were compatible and other many other oddities, random lockups, boot failures etc. I learned my lesson and won't buy another obscure low-production numbers board like that again, moving to a PPC Mini with a more professional mass-market, thoroughly tested design and no quirky bugs was very refreshing actually. I don't even notice it's a Mac, the machine sits under my desk so I can't see it, in my mind when I'm using it I just go into a fantasy work that it's 1999 and I'm using a Boxer or something :)
I didn't realise the 64MB Mini was that rare, mine is a 64MB version, I have heard that's the one to get though for best experience. You might be better off with Powermac G4 or G5 though as you can just install your own GFX card. A G5 Mac will also give you the fastest "NG Amiga" experience too, I quite like their design, considering one myself, got a great workstation look.
-
For what it's worth all the Acube and A-Eon machines have FAR fewer problems than the Eyetech machines.
(That said my A1XE has never given me any trouble at all... maybe I'm just lucky)
-
"classic" better know as real amigas= all
Indeed :cool:
-
"classic" better know as real amigas= all
sams and x1000 "ng" better know as amiga-like= expensive harware for emulate real amiga software with a reasonable browser
Why that hate towards amigaos4? have you a childhood trauma because AmigaOS4 raped you when you were a child or what?
-
@ Fransexy
no point getting upset as that's par for the course over here unfortunately & I don't understand it either since 99% of us are here because of our classics and still enjoy our NG miggies. Anyway I'm just happy that this stuff is on the appropriate thread at least :laugh1:
-
Why that hate towards amigaos4? have you a childhood trauma because AmigaOS4 raped you when you were a child or what?
OS4 did try to lure me into a vehicle with candy, but I resisted. :lol:
-
"NG" doesn't just mean OS4, there are several ways to get a very similar (if not better) "NG" Amiga experience for many times less money than the X1000 or Sams - MorphOS or AROS have already been mentioned in this thread and make more sense for a user on a budget or who doesn't need a specific element that only OS4 offers.
Yes, aros is a good idea but need more time to advance, morphos is faster than amigaos4, more compatible and with better and cheap hardware.
-
Why that hate towards amigaos4? have you a childhood trauma because AmigaOS4 raped you when you were a child or what?
The only trauma is to see your nickname and avatar.
-
NG = OS4 and MorphOS..
If you want to add AROS or whatever to the list..then do so..just keep this damn thread clean. Jesus Christ..first Linux vs the world and now this...again.
-
Yes, aros is a good idea but need more time to advance, morphos is faster than amigaos4, more compatible and with better and cheap hardware.
Don't start freaking me out supporting my OS of choice, kickstart.
We all know you as a legacy fanatic.
-
NG = OS4 and MorphOS..
If you want to add AROS or whatever to the list..then do so..just keep this damn thread clean. Jesus Christ..first Linux vs the world and now this...again.
Then the rule is talk just following your rules? No one say nothing wrong.
-
Well after modding the hell out of my A1200, I'm thinking it might be time to sell up and purchase an NG.
Getting all the hardware/software mods to work together was and still is enjoyable, yet frustrating task.
With the slow updates on mediator drivers for both the Voodoo 5 and Radeon 9200 it's really holding AmigaOS 3.9 back. Rattes updated Radeon driver was looking like the answer but Elbox trampled that.
Also getting any information/response from Elbox is impossible. Which adds to my frustration when spending quite a bit on their products.
Reliability is another factor, with all those different hacks/patches running it feels unstable now and then. The most annoying part is getting RTG/AGA switching working with WHDLoad, which wouldn't really be a problem with an NG. I've given up on this and run in AGA most of the time, although I don't get the pretty 1920x1080 with AFA OS/Zune desktop.
I have Quake/Quake 2 running great using Warp3D/MiniGL at 640x480. However Quake2 can be flaky and I get the odd software fault and it wont load. Another frustration.
Duke Nukem is fairly smooth except for a slight pause when some sounds load, but this would be resolved with using a FastATA, however it doesn't fit with the Indivision AGA MK2 and Mediator. :-/
Browsing is very useable, Ibrowse is fantastic. Although due to it's out dated browser engine a few websites don't display correctly. NetSurf is fantastic though, can feel slower than Ibrowse though but I think this is because it loads the entire page in one hit instead of loading parts of the page.
Flash, even with the Ibrowse plugin is a no go. Java stuff seems to timeout most of the time so I turned this off.
iGame/WHDLoad works really well (once you are running an AGA workbench) and the speed at what games load at is amazing. Forget floppy disks! :-)
99% of the demo's work great, no issues.
PPC stuff, I maybe tempted to purchase a PPC card for the A1200 but price wise I'd be better off buying an NG. The amount of money would buy me a nice setup, unless I can find someone throwing a card out (yeah right).
As a day to day machine, almost possible. The A1200 does an okay job :-)
Anyway I think I've accomplished (95% anyway) what I set out to do, I'll probably regret selling it. You always get that doubt with Amiga hardware, especially putting so much time into it. You become attached.
I'll go back to pondering it :-)
From my experience MOS on a Powerbook is a decent system. It can't do many HD formats well, but most 720p plays just fine. Browsing is very decent with OWB 1.23. All the applications I used on Classic hardware works fine. The user experience for the OS via Ambient is a great desktop. To me it feels like what Amiga OS 3.x should have evolved into. The authors of the OS are a great bunch who constantly update and enhance the product.
Looking at the total cost of ownership, MOS is the best value and experience for an NG Amiga...
I sold my 1200 and I don't miss it, I never enjoyed hacking at it to get it to work. Big box Amigas are more reliable and expandible. I still prefer certain things on my classic amiga, mostly for nostalgia. I always have had a soft spot for the 3000 and still find reasons to use it even if it could be done in MOS...
For games MOS is fast and fun, Quake 1-3, Duke, and RTCW all work great and at very playable speeds.
-
We covered compatibility and and now cost is the determining factor.
If Morphos does everything you want it too, then that is the one to go for.
Check Youtube there are vids of OS4 and the rest.
-
Okay so I've decided to hold on to my 1200, after all the effort, time and money spent I cant let it go.
I had a look at what options there are, and taking on the feedback I've read I'm now in the market for a Mac Mini. Looking locally I can only find 32mb versions so may have to go with that, going by what I have read most FPS games should be okay and it will give me a taste.
Will check Amibay, and the market place here,first, but then I have to ask if the PSU is switchable? Needs to be 220/240v to work here.
Tempted to register too, so 64mb ram would be better :)
-
I'd be very cautious and recommend you weigh your use case before taking anyones advice that any NG Amiga can be a day to day, desktop replacement for a more mainstream machine like a Windows, Linux or Mac box.
I love my NG systems, but the idea that I could use them to do my day to day business on them is laughable. They are great machines for what they are, but the truth is I couldn't even get my daily work tickets off GDocs on either MOS or my OS4 machine. The browsers puke too much.
Honestly, and I know how much people hate the emulation route - it's hard to go wrong with an Amithlon or even dedicated UAE box if you are intent on running older software. I've got both an Amithlon box and a dedicated UAE machine (XP base, boots right into WB 3.1, never even see Windows) and most people would be hard pressed to even recognize they are emulated machines if they were parked in front of them if an old Miggy KB and mouse were there.
Amithlon was really the win that we lost. I have it as I purchased it when it was still available for purchase, and I have it installed on a machine in my closet. I also have an A1200T/060/PPC that runs 4.1. It's good. It's slow. I really want what 4.x has to offer but I don't $1000 want it in a NG Amiga.
I picked up a G5 Mac Pro to run MorphOS but I haven't gotten around to it yet. Just been busy. As much as I have solutions all around I still poke around for NG hardware that doesn't make my wallet wanna puke.
-
Go with a G5 if you're gonna do MorphOS. Seriously, it's much much better hardware and the prices aren't much different. I got mine on CL for about $90.
-
Go with a G5 if you're gonna do MorphOS. Seriously, it's much much better hardware and the prices aren't much different. I got mine on CL for about $90.
Down here the G5 is about $100NZD more than a mac mini, plus finding one locally with an ATI card is near impossible. They all have Nvidia cards which of course MorphOS doesn't like.
So I looked at buying an ATI card and the prices were expensive :-(
I also notice that anything including and above the ATI Radeon 9550 doesn't support W3D.
-
Down here the G5 is about $100NZD more than a mac mini, plus finding one locally with an ATI card is near impossible. They all have Nvidia cards which of course MorphOS doesn't like.
So I looked at buying an ATI card and the prices were expensive :-(
I also notice that anything including and above the ATI Radeon 9550 doesn't support W3D.
Im in the same seat, ive had my Mac mini 1.52GHz with 32MB vram and morphOS for a long time but I recently wanted to give the Power mac a go but where I live G5 power macs go for 600$+ and it feels a bit to much :/ The G4 ones go for next to nothing tho so might pickup and try one of those instead :)
Not to complain the Mac mini is sufficient enough but I want to be able to expand more :)
Edit: Maybe you where talking about laptops?
-
Im in the same seat, ive had my Mac mini 1.52GHz with 32MB vram and morphOS for a long time but I recently wanted to give the Power mac a go but where I live G5 power macs go for 600$+ and it feels a bit to much :/ The G4 ones go for next to nothing tho so might pickup and try one of those instead :)
PowerMacs, don't really want a Mac laptop I've had a bad run of those with logic boards.
The PowerMac G4 is a good option, although not something I want on my desk. (or under it).
So will hang out looking for a Macmini or a G5.
-
After looking some more I can pickup Xserve G5's for around $100NZD. Which also have an ATI card.
Worth the risk installing MorphOS?
-
After looking some more I can pickup Xserve G5's for around $100NZD. Which also have an ATI card.
Worth the risk installing MorphOS?
I do not know much about the Xserve's but you will loose the ability of having AGP or PCI-E that the Power Macs have and be limited to PCI (talking about future W3D support).
If and how much it's compatible with MorphOS I do not know, but if MorphOS do not work on it you might have other use for it (use it as a server)?
-
After reading up on it I might give it a miss, there's a few other things missing compared to a tower :-/
-
@Lurch
My advice would be, keep your A1200 (if you can) and buy a Sam440ep-flex or a Sam460ex if you want a faster one, AmigaOS 4.1 fully upgraded to Update 6 :)
No patches needed there, it's all included in OS4 by default already :P...
-
Contrary to what others have said, I sold my A1200 Blizzard 1260, Mediator etc and have no regrets (well maybe I could have got more money) but I do of course have a Minimig, CD32 and an A500 with an 020.
However an AGA only A1200 with an 030 is a nice games machine.
-
I wouldn't bother with a BPPC, complete waste of money since it can cost as much or more than a Sam440 and won't be as fast. NG is definitely better for RTG stuff than than any 68k based system.
In my experience OS4 and MorphOS are far better than AROS for everyday use(admittedly I have burnt off an AROS boot CD for a while but when I do it only ever gets booted once).
A PPC Mac can be picked up cheaply and good deals on OS4 can sometimes be found too.
OS4 looks and feels closer to 3.x (more Amiga like) than MorphOS but some people prefer MorphOS so if you can get a chance to use them before laying down any money it would be good to see which you prefer.
If you can pick up a compatible PPC Mac for under £100 just go for it anyway. The trial version of MorphOS is free to use and if you don't like it you should have much trouble getting your money back by selling it.
-
@amoskodare - How do you find your setup with the Sam440ep-flex? I was originally looking at that exact same spec setup. The price is about right and it appears to be the best OS4 bundle for the price.
@Rob - 3rd time round buying and selling, always get a pang of nostalgia and buy again. Loosing a lot of money doing that. Will hold on to the 1200 :-)
-
@amoskodare - How do you find your setup with the Sam440ep-flex? I was originally looking at that exact same spec setup. The price is about right and it appears to be the best OS4 bundle for the price.
I have a sam440ep-flex also, to be honest I use my Mac Mini with MorphOS a lot more, but the sam440 is fast enough or my OS4 needs, I got it at a great price so I do not regret buying it :)
-
@amoskodare - How do you find your setup with the Sam440ep-flex? I was originally looking at that exact same spec setup. The price is about right and it appears to be the best OS4 bundle for the price.
@Rob - 3rd time round buying and selling, always get a pang of nostalgia and buy again. Loosing a lot of money doing that. Will hold on to the 1200 :-)
Not wanting to sway you too much, but as others have said, try before you buy. I speak objectively as an OS4 and MorphOS user, a Sam 440 is too slow for me to be comfortable with at 400-667mhz and with just one PCI slot (which you'll fill with a graphics card) there isn't really any expandability over say a Mac Mini (which is more than double, if not triple the speed). Heck, I even find my A1XE a bit too slow at 933mhz, watching the CPU meter spike up to 100% whenever I load a more than basic web page or open programs etc, even taking a screenshot sends it way up, I certainly feel the difference between my 1.5ghz mini and my A1XE. On the Sam 440 you're not going to have much joy with video files and DVD playback.
At the end of the day, it's really down to OS4 or MorphOS, personally I use both and like Som99 above me, I also spend a lot more time in MorphOS these days, I found development on the OS4 at OS level seemed to have slowed a lot in the last year where as MorphOS has jumped 4 major revisions, most of the recent major components like Odyssey, MUI 4, MPlayer etc. all have the latest versions on MorphOS and are backported to OS4 some time later, also a big part of my "NG" experience is using old Amiga apps too, I find the ones I use regularly seem to work better and have more compatibility in MorphOS. I also find it more stable and get less crashes, although that's more than likely down to the instability and flakyness of the A1XE board.
I will say OS4 does feel more like OS3 as it still uses Workbench, but if that's a major thing for you, you can always replace ambient with Workbench if you wanted, I personally like Ambient now I know my way around it though, Workbench feels bit basic in comparison.
No flame wars from me, you make up your own mind, but I used OS4 for years and since my A1XE got flakier over the years I was looking to replace it, for a decent OS4 experience I needed a SAm 460 or X1000, the cheapest option of which was still close to a grand. I used OS4 daily from 2007-2011 and would have loved an X1000 but the bank balance (and the missus) ruled that one out, since getting my Mini in 2011 I've grown to prefer the experience anyway.
You would certainly be happier with a Sam 440 than a classic PPC card, but don't write off MorphOS just because you don't like the look of a Powermac G4 (which will likely be hidden under your desk anyway, or put it in a new case?) or the Mac Mini G4, not sure what limitations put you off the mini but I can't say I notice any.
Another option would be a used Pegasos 2, you can run both on that machine, iirc there's one on Amibay at the moment for 600 euro.
Just my 2c.
-
MorphOS looks very polished but it just doesn't interest me that much. I could buy a used Mac and get it up and running cheaply but I don't think I'd actually use it much. Same story with OS4 on NG but the entry fee is much higher. Upgrading a Classic machine to run OS4 appears to be a very frustrating experience from what I've read.
I think I'll just stick with my Classic AGA machine for a while. I'll have to replace it one day though, prob with either A3000/A500/FPGA/WinUAE
-
I will say OS4 does feel more like OS3 as it still uses Workbench, but if that's a major thing for you, you can always replace ambient with Workbench if you wanted, I personally like Ambient now I know my way around it though, Workbench feels bit basic in comparison.
I bought MorphOS about a year ago and loaded it on a Quicksilver G4 to try it. It seems plenty fast and responsive. I haven't used it much because it was much less Amiga-like than I expected out of the box. There seems to be software, themes, palettes, icons, etc for it, but, I haven't had time (Linux is starting to fascinate me!) to sorted thru the mass of it to find a familiar Amiga environment. Did anyone compile a list of OS3.9 add-ons for folks like me who are easily disoriented by Ambient?
I've never tried OS4.
-
I bought MorphOS about a year ago and loaded it on a Quicksilver G4 to try it. It seems plenty fast and responsive. I haven't used it much because it was much less Amiga-like than I expected out of the box. There seems to be software, themes, palettes, icons, etc for it, but, I haven't had time (Linux is starting to fascinate me!) to sorted thru the mass of it to find a familiar Amiga environment. Did anyone compile a list of OS3.9 add-ons for folks like me who are easily disoriented by Ambient?
I've never tried OS4.
It's pretty old, but it may still work?
http://aminet.net/package/docs/help/AmigaWBOnPegasos
-
So I tried MorphOS on a Quicksilver box, apart from the on board sound everything was supported.
It's very quick, was frustrated a little trying to navigate around, there are some things that are similar to workbench but other things that are not.
I installed Pack Chrysalis which uses about 55MB of VRAM LOL so had to remove some items. Tried a couple of games and browsed around with OWB it all works as advertised, quick too!
It's a very polished OS and has come a long way since I installed 2.7. It's an amazing OS and stands on it's own two feet well. But I just couldn't get into it, missing my AFA_OS/WB.
The link to aminet with the how to install WB looks interesting, although a little worried that it's from 2005. But doesn't matter I can always reinstall :-)
I lost interest in the mini as locally there were only 32MB versions, however I found a 32MB 1.42GHz one that I've put down a really low bid on that was too tempting so will see how that goes. Will just have to tweak it as it looks possible after doing some reading to have an okay setup with lower res/VRAM.
I looked at G5 macs too, but again no ATI cards in any of them and looking online people know this and charge the earth.
As for Sam boards these are rare and are out of stock.
I wonder what the X3500 will go for price wise? :-)
Still waiting for Amibay to finish there upgrading too :-/
-
@Lurch
My Sam flex is pretty responsive, it feels almost faster (honestly) than my Windows box with an i7 CPU at 3.4Ghz and 8 cores (threads).. Unless I'm doing something really CPU-intensive tasks, otherwise it is up for the job.
However, all video decoding, heavy-websurfing, photoshopping, ripping, game-emulation (WinUAE), backuping and all that "heavy" stuff I do on my Win box anyway so CPU power isn't that big issue to me...
On the Sam I mostly code (no prolem here unless I compile a very VERY large C project (almost never)), and play some games, play music and do some "light" browsing (like browsing Amiga-forums and OS4Depot and such) and play around in Workbench and programs and so forth.. But from time to time also fire up heavy Facebook (however m.facebook is pretty snappy) or heavy Gmail to fix something and there it's noted that some more grunt in the CPU department would be very welcome...
> As for Sam boards these are rare and are out of stock.
:S Have you checked http://amigaworld.net/modules/classifieds/
> I wonder what the X3500 will go for price wise? :-)
I wonder that too :) My plan is to buy X5000 once it is released...
-
Here's a video on my Sam440ep-flex 800MHz and OS4.1:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=87DeoBqGSeA
I also recommend this video by Dan Wood:
Why use AmigaOS 4 in 2009
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Fx3q2wFIn6k
And also this:
Why use OS4, MorphOS, AROS or OS3
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s1RsvEm7UrU
-
I would personally say that MorphOS is a system that has to grow on you. But once it has you will probably like it and get used to the things that are different to AmigaOS 3.1. If a perfect copy of the original in structure is most important, AmigaOS 4 or AROS might be a better choice.
And get a PowerMac G5 instead of a Mac Mini if space isn't a problem. Even the low end 2.0 GHz is fast enough for Full HD video and a Radeon 9600 Pro 128 MB VRAM are plentiful and cheap on Ebay. If they aren't already included.
-
I don't actually think there is a link at all between Commodore Amigas and Next Gen Amigas to be honest (be it the hardware on PPC boards or OS4/Morph etc) but that is not an insult so no flaming please.
I really only use my Amigas as they were intended, A2000 for coding with the nice keyboard and simple HD option, A1000 for OCS/ECS gaming and a spot of Dpaint and Digi-View and A1200 for Super Stardust and other good AGA games. I also keep a CD32 because there are about 10 AGA games on there that are nice to have without disk swaps...and you can make it boot into WB 3 with various cover CDs.
I always thought trying to make the Amiga do what a 10 dollar Pentium 1 or Playstation 1 does was madness and surely you can put up with the crap 2 mainstream OS choices to just surf the web (use a good browser that suits you, I love Opera myself now Chrome turned to crap) or download/playback various types of media.
Trying to make a NG Amiga into even an old 2009 i7 PC is never going to happen and trying to make a Commodore Amiga of any specification do the same is even more of a challenge. If you enjoy the challenge in either case then I salute your perseverance so again no flaming please. I just find it easier to play Wipeout 2097 on my original release PS1 or endure my OS4 skinned XP Pro machine to watch movies or waste time on pootube :)
I guess I am just lazy and the Amiga now lives with all my other wonderful retro machines in the 'dungeon' rather than my office desk. Sure I could run my business on a C64, let alone my 4.5mb A1000 but that's a no brainer however I will still need to go online to process payments and communicate with my loyal customers so ultimately I just gave in.
What really frustrates me is that in 1988 instead of trying to win various Cinemaware games I should have been programming the worlds first real-estate visually rich and GUI'd system using my A1000, Amos and Digi-view....wow could have made a fortune whilst proving the Amiga even with KS 1.2 was the future that was here and now. Meh, anyone fancy a game of Super Stardust? :)
-
Not wanting to sound like a flame, but honest question... why do you not think that OS 4 is the link between the original Amigas and the Next Gen Amigas? AmigaOS 4 is still AmigaOS at its heart - that's a pretty big link!
-
Has been a most helpful thread, glad to see it hasn't turned into the usual flame war. I'm thinking that I might be leaning towards OS4.
The problem is there isn't an easy/convenient way of obtaining OS4 hardware, so much easier to find an old Mac although it's proving hard to find a 64MB mac mini.
I'll possibly give MorphOS a longer try, going to attempt using workbench so will see how that works out :-)
Might see if there is an OS4 theme LOL.
-
Has been a most helpful thread, glad to see it hasn't turned into the usual flame war. I'm thinking that I might be leaning towards OS4.
The problem is there isn't an easy/convenient way of obtaining OS4 hardware, so much easier to find an old Mac although it's proving hard to find a 64MB mac mini.
I'll possibly give MorphOS a longer try, going to attempt using workbench so will see how that works out :-)
Might see if there is an OS4 theme LOL.
I like my 1.67 GHz Powerbook with MorphOS pretty much. It's of small size and really silent. Speedwise it is very conveniant. And with a cardbus WLAN card lack of a driver for Airport eventually got rendered rather void. It's the best "Amiga" I ever owned in my personal Amiga history of ~ 25 years. And with only about 250 EURs (ebay) a few years ago it was an easy decision to just get it.
-
Can always try before you buy with an OS4 machine. I'm sure an OS4 owner wouldn't mind letting you VNC into their machine so you could poke about a bit and see how you enjoy it.
-
Has been a most helpful thread, glad to see it hasn't turned into the usual flame war. I'm thinking that I might be leaning towards OS4.
The problem is there isn't an easy/convenient way of obtaining OS4 hardware, so much easier to find an old Mac although it's proving hard to find a 64MB mac mini.
I'll possibly give MorphOS a longer try, going to attempt using workbench so will see how that works out :-)
There are a few options you can configure to make Ambient behave more like workbench (mainly disabling new fetures: disable browser mode, disable autosorting, etc) - see here (http://www.morphzone.info/modules/newbb_plus/viewtopic.php?forum=9&topic_id=7196&viewmode=flat&sortorder=0&start=12) for a previous discussion on the subject.
Might see if there is an OS4 theme LOL.
There's an OS3.9 skin:
http://korni.ovh.org/morphos-skins/?i=AmigaOS3.x_Skin.png
I thought there was an OS4 skin somewhere, just can't seem to find it atm.
-
I thought there was an OS4 skin somewhere, just can't seem to find it atm.
there are actually a couple, but i've not found them terribly good, TBH. on the other hand klesterjr came up with a brilliant (http://www.five-star.com/kens_icons/screenshots/FourOne.png) AOS4 theme (http://www.five-star.com/kens_icons/screenshots/FourOne_2.png) for MOS, but for various reasons, isn't planning on releasing it. :(
i've hacked my ambient setup to mimic workbench as much as possible, and although i still very much prefer using AOS4, MOS is certainly a nice alternative -- especially considering the much better price/performance of the hardware platforms it supports. both are a good choice.
-- eliyahu
-
Not wanting to sound like a flame, but honest question... why do you not think that OS 4 is the link between the original Amigas and the Next Gen Amigas? AmigaOS 4 is still AmigaOS at its heart - that's a pretty big link!
Not a problem. NB my reasons are only personal to me though and might not make sense to others so I hope nobody takes offence. It's just a feeling I have now compared to how I felt using machines 3 decades ago.
It's not that there is no link at all between an Amiga 4000/040 from Commodore and AmigaONE x1000 and other Next Gen Amigas in my opinion, theres is a spiritual link back to the OS ethos in Workbench/Kickstart for sure. They don't look like either OSX or Windows design choices either that's for sure. It's just for me the Commodore Amiga's were more than just their OS. They were from a different time where your host hardware took the brunt of the workload through well thought out exclusive custom chipsets to make the use of the machine more pleasurable whereas the newer machines are all 100% software type solutions. Sign of the times and I am not passing negative judgement on the new machines though (it's not like you will get a virus as often as even a Linux based machine haha and for some people that is worth every single dollar invested in any Amiga system).
In a way for me it feels like computers have come full circle back to the original Commodore PET in 76? (arguably the worlds first 'modern' mass produced commercial public targeting computer) which just had some nice features built into the system comprising hardware for sale to any company...like for example the very useful PETSCII graphics set for making simple games (look out for PET Moon Patrol one day haha)
After a couple of decades of ingenious custom/bespoke components from all manufacturers we are back to the very early times. Maybe one day someone will write an OS specifically for Oculus Rift to make a radical new path for domestic computers but for now we are back in the 'quality computer=quality software/firmware included in the package running on generic components'.
But even if all you do is run WinUAE you're still an Amigan, which is why semantics like emulator users, Commodore Amiga collectors and NG Amiga owners today are part of the same group. But hey I still only have CRT TVs in the house but watch HD movies on them just to be awkward* :)
(well technically I am just feeding a broadcast quality signal into the TVs to approximate the quality of analogue TV transmissions which at the time were far superior to the non-HD options for TV set top boxes today btw so not crazy at all IMO)
-
So I have the G4 quicksilver hooked up to the KVM. To be honest I'm still going back to the A1200.
When I get some free time will copy over some of the programs/games I use at the moment I don't have much installed on the G4.
Will look at setting up WHDLoad etc and see how that goes.
After the easter break I'll take another serious look at OS4 hardware, and look at resurrecting my WindowsXP/WinUAE box :-)
I enjoy playing around with different OS's/hardware, I think I'm still looking for that same buzz I had opening up the A500 all those years ago.
-
...I think I'm still looking for that same buzz I had opening up the A500 all those years ago.
I remember that buzz. I got it when I brought the A500 home, every time I bought a coverdisk, when I upgraded to OS2.1, A570, HDD, etc. I even caught it when finding some of the other classic platforms that I couldn't afford when they were new.
My employer sent me a new computer, tablet and smartphone - just tools and tracking devices.
-
It's not that there is no link at all between an Amiga 4000/040 from Commodore and AmigaONE x1000 and other Next Gen Amigas in my opinion
correct me if im wrong but hardwarewise i dont see any link at all.
os4 is claimed to be derived from amiga operating system sources, which may well be the case, hard to tell for anybody except those who had seen the closed sources. user observable fact is that its ui tries to mimic 3.x workbench behaviour where it apparently scores over the morphos/ambient or other alternatives.
-
correct me if im wrong but hardwarewise i dont see any link at all.
That's a good thing - can you imagine sticking a 1.8GHz processor on any custom chipset? It would be so much slower than the mainstream alternatives these days. What would be ideal would be a custom version of a mainstream chip like the RadeonHD chips which included AGA compatibility - but it'll never happen, partially because there's no point (nothing uses bitplanes now anyway, and it's easy to emulate the full AGA chipset these days).
os4 is claimed to be derived from amiga operating system sources, which may well be the case, hard to tell for anybody except those who had seen the closed sources. user observable fact is that its ui tries to mimic 3.x workbench behaviour where it apparently scores over the morphos/ambient or other alternatives.
It's not mimicking anything, it is Workbench. That's its greatest asset and its greatest liability at the same time (Ambient is arguably better, but it's not Workbench - whether that's a good or a bad thing is subjective).
One thing is certain, though - AmigaOS4 is AmigaOS. That is the link.
-
That's a good thing - can you imagine sticking a 1.8GHz processor on any custom chipset? It would be so much slower than the mainstream alternatives these days. What would be ideal would be a custom version of a mainstream chip like the RadeonHD chips which included AGA compatibility - but it'll never happen, partially because there's no point (nothing uses bitplanes now anyway, and it's easy to emulate the full AGA chipset these days).
i have not in any way judged it, i just said that there is no link. thats all.
It's not mimicking anything, it is Workbench. That's its greatest asset and its greatest liability at the same time (Ambient is arguably better, but it's not Workbench - whether that's a good or a bad thing is subjective).
One thing is certain, though - AmigaOS4 is AmigaOS. That is the link.
just one paragraph later you contradict your argumentation from above. custom chipset and amiga hardware standards in general cannot keep up with the current ones so drop them. on the other hand you defend keeping workbench against even a slightly more modern solution such as ambient because its the legacy in your eyes.
-
I completely agree with there being no hardware link - you're right. But the OS is a link as it's the same OS (just a later version of it).
I wasn't actually defending Workbench (or attacking Ambient) - my point is just that AmigaOS 4 is - for better or for worse - AmigaOS, and that includes Workbench.
Ambient and Workbench both have strengths and weaknesses - as I said, Workbench is both AmigaOS 4's greatest strength (it is to many people what makes it "AmigaOS") and also its greatest liability (it's missing a lot of things expected of a modern desktop environment).
-
I remember that buzz. I got it when I brought the A500 home, every time I bought a coverdisk, when I upgraded to OS2.1, A570, HDD, etc. I even caught it when finding some of the other classic platforms that I couldn't afford when they were new.
Use to get it with the C64, even going to the local computer store and going through the games on sale.
Use to bike over to Milford, about 30-45 minute or so ride to the nearest Amiga store and look at all the new Amiga's on the shelf.
Miss purchasing Amiga mags and trying out cover disks. I remember a friend of mine giving my 100's of cover disks that was I good weekend. :-)
Amazing buzz swapping games on the weekend, and walking into a friends downstairs room full of 1000's **cough** pirated game disks and Amiga's humming away. He got caught when the copyright laws changed here though.
Anyway off topic, hopefully have some time tomorrow to give MorphOS another thrashing tomorrow. Will post how I get on.
-
Use to get it with the C64, even going to the local computer store and going through the games on sale.
Use to bike over to Milford, about 30-45 minute or so ride to the nearest Amiga store and look at all the new Amiga's on the shelf.
Miss purchasing Amiga mags and trying out cover disks. I remember a friend of mine giving my 100's of cover disks that was I good weekend. :-)
Amazing buzz swapping games on the weekend, and walking into a friends downstairs room full of 1000's **cough** pirated game disks and Amiga's humming away. He got caught when the copyright laws changed here though.
Anyway off topic, hopefully have some time tomorrow to give MorphOS another thrashing tomorrow. Will post how I get on.
I think the "buzz" you're talking about goes by another name "nostalgia".
Its like people who who prefer old cars. I have a 1999 Mercedes and a 2005 Mazda6. I like the styling of the Mercedes, and the solidity of the build. It was my dad's car and I have good mmeories about it. But every time I swap to the Mazda6 is obvious that its quicker, quieter, handles far better, uses less fuel, brakes better, is safer-this in car that cost 40% of the Mercedes (without accounting for inflation-might be about 25% in real terms).
We choose to ignore the limitations because they remind us of the good times, and the people of our past.
-
I think the "buzz" you're talking about goes by another name "nostalgia".
How could that be when the buzz occurred when you were experiencing it for the first time?
I enjoyed games more when I was younger, not because they were better than they are now but because they were better than anything I'd seen at the time.
Plus I was young and care free.
-
correct me if im wrong but hardwarewise i dont see any link at all.
Well the thing to remember is the Amiga 1000 on launch day was the more advanced machine compared to its rivals at the time by a margin that will ever be repeated again for a combination of things not just hardware IMO.
1. Elegant design comprising a tiny footprint and near silent operation (OK except the damned floppy drive lol)
2. A very very resource efficient custom OS that multitasked so well it could be used as the basis for a scientific or military computer system.
3. The most advanced and flexible audio visual independant custom hardware.
Sadly 1 and 3 are no longer relevant to OS4 development and even today point 3 is not part of any machine design for joe public consumer products. So I can see why others think it's OK for the link to be in the OS design ethos.
The only way the Amiga could have ever come back as a viable OS and hardware solution in the same sort of way as Commodore Amigas is probably Playstation3 hosting OS4 not Linux from day one (with a very highly tuned edition bespoke to that machine's custom chipset).
I might try out MorphOS too if there is a nice G4 machine I can run it on, not G3 Mac though as this is too slow for me now.
-
How could that be when the buzz occurred when you were experiencing it for the first time?
I enjoyed games more when I was younger, not because they were better than they are now but because they were better than anything I'd seen at the time.
Plus I was young and care free.
That's an interesting point. I still remember feeling at the time that 'I can do anything' atmosphere at the time I owned my A1000. Today it's not quite the same feeling I get, just as nice though. It's like growing old with a friend, you notice different positive aspects about the Amiga over time and appreciate the machine's awesomeness in chronological terms more than ever but at the time I was still getting used to the limitless awesomeness of what the entire system had to offer. Of course the difference is also at the time we didn't know we'd be stuck with that Joke of an OS company Microsoft either with no design improvement 3 decades later :)
-
I think the "buzz" you're talking about goes by another name "nostalgia".
Nostalgia is something completely different, this is the buzz you get opening something new that you're excited about.
It's been a long time since I've had that feeling about anything, that's why I try different things looking for it.
-
Nostalgia is something completely different, this is the buzz you get opening something new that you're excited about.
It's been a long time since I've had that feeling about anything, that's why I try different things looking for it.
I agree that I would love to feel the excitement over a new computer.
The Amiga came at a time in the market where a bunch of elements made it possible. That time in the computer industry is well behind us. Even if we found an awesome group of tech folks with vision and even backing to product something truly revolutionary computer it wouldn't take over the market or even compete.
The industry has matured and is dominated by players that have the application base to solve problems. The computer market isn't expanding like it was in the 80's.
I'm grateful that I was part of the Amiga in the day with an active user group and many friends enjoyed them. When I bought my 3000D it felt very special and a great sense of pride knowing it's capabilities were beyond apple and microsoft.
My way of feeling part of it, is to still use my classics today. I have good fun to purchase add on's and tweak them here and there... They were such a great computer they still can be used very productively today. It is nice to see my family use them and appreciate the applications written for it.
I do enjoy MOS greatly and it feels like where the Amiga would have evolved to in time (imho), it is the modern Amiga for my usages. It doesn't get me excited adding to the boxes, it is more of a tool... Need to play a RTG game really fast? Need to browse the web? Need to manipulate pictures? Need to connect to work? ...Use MOS... If not then I'm on the classics.
-
@matt3k - You summed it up better than I could, I'll continue to enjoy my A1200. But I don't think we'll see another period in time like the birth of the home computer again. The market is too sewn up for a small company to come out of the blue and take hold, although I'd love to be proven wrong.
The desktop era is probably dwindling too, I must admit I use my smartphone more than my laptop/desktop these days.
-
How could that be when the buzz occurred when you were experiencing it for the first time?
No, but thats the feeling you're trying to *recapture*
I enjoyed games more when I was younger, not because they were better than they are now but because they were better than anything I'd seen at the time.
Plus I was young and care free.
^^^Thank you thats exactly what I meant.
FYI, my now 18 y.o son feels the same way about when as a 10 year old he got his Gamecube and Mario Kart booted up-the *WOW* he got playing Mario Kart double Dash on a 80 inch CRT with component cables: pin-sharp graphics, vibrant colors, 60 frames per second smooth frame rate. And with 3 other mates going nuts over it. He'll never part with it.
-
@matt3k - You summed it up better than I could, I'll continue to enjoy my A1200. But I don't think we'll see another period in time like the birth of the home computer again. The market is too sewn up for a small company to come out of the blue and take hold, although I'd love to be proven wrong.
I just designed my first PCB and I have to admit it did give excitement. I am sure current maker movement with 3D printing, Arduino, Raspberry Pi, etc. gives to some people the same excitement to people as Amiga did to us.
Times are different but not worse.
-
I just designed my first PCB and I have to admit it did give excitement. I am sure current maker movement with 3D printing, Arduino, Raspberry Pi, etc. gives to some people the same excitement to people as Amiga did to us.
Times are different but not worse.
Now there is a sentiment I can get behind.
I've been doing some hacking myself and its fun with a capital "F".
Even helping a friend run off a batch of 80 column display boards for the old Tandy Color Computer was a kick in the ass (since it used a Yamaha V9958 which is one cool VDP).
And I've been discussing a 68HC000 project with the designer of the Kiwi (a very cool computer that uses a V9990).
You guys want that old feeling?
Starting learning how to design and build something.
There is some cool stuff out there and its cheap.
OR embrace something different and start using ARM or PPC.
Ditch the X86, fu*k Windows, at the very least use Linux or better yet something REALLY exotic.
COME ON guys.
This used to be fun.
It can be again if you don't join in with the sheeple.
-
correct me if i'm wrong but hardware-wise i don't see any link at all.
Not directly as there never where any hybrid Amiga computers, the transition started whit what happened after Commodore died.
There where many possible routes, one was DEC Alpha, another was going PowerPC, and there where many more ideas about what route to take.
In the end it was Phase5 who made the decision by creating the CyberStormPPC and BlizzardPPC, add-on CPU modules, and there plans for A/BOX, a next generation computer that never came to be.
While the CyberStormPPC and BlizzardPPC was running an other operating systems, PowerUP and WarpUP, it was start of a split in Amiga community about what was best Phase5 PowerUP, or Hagge&Partner WarpUP, latter WarpUP became part of AmigaOS3.5 and AmigaOS3.9 as bundled package.
Amiga Inc was not really interested in hardware, nor where they interested in the OS, all they wanted was recreate the glory of Amiga by creating an Game Engine, they called it AmigaDE, was based on Intent, (They tried rally hard to sell this idea to the community but not many liked it.).
But as people begged for a updated version of AmigaOS3.x, Hagge&Partner was contracted to do that work, Hagge&Partner had a long history whit Amiga and PowerPC, plans where made for a PowerPC based next generation Amiga, but after a while relationship between Hagge&Partner was broken.
So Hyperion entertainment did take over the development of AmigaOS, but this time the target hardware was PowerPC, they know they needed to support classic software so they created Petunia to translate legacy programs at run time. plus A wrapper for WarpOS was also created so that games like WipeOut2007, PayBack and Heratic II and other games where possible to run.
As some games that needed WarpOS where ported to AmigaOS4.0, the interest in WarpOS wrapper was lost, it was also tricky to get it working on all types of PowerPC CPU's like the AMCC4x0 chips.
But lets cut a long story short, and just say it was the Phase5 accelerator cards that is the hardware link to Classic Amiga computers.
Phase5 accelerator cards where used as development platform during early days of AmigaOS4.x development, even to this day you can run AmigaOS4.1 on a Phase5 PowerPC accelerator.
-
No, but thats the feeling you're trying to *recapture*
^^^Thank you thats exactly what I meant.
FYI, my now 18 y.o son feels the same way about when as a 10 year old he got his Gamecube and Mario Kart booted up-the *WOW* he got playing Mario Kart double Dash on a 80 inch CRT with component cables: pin-sharp graphics, vibrant colors, 60 frames per second smooth frame rate. And with 3 other mates going nuts over it. He'll never part with it.
FYI, my now 18 y.o son feels the same way about when as a 10 year old he got his Gamecube and Mario Kart booted up-the *WOW* he got playing Mario Kart double Dash on a 80 inch CRT with component cables: pin-sharp graphics, vibrant colors, 60 frames per second smooth frame rate. And with 3 other mates going nuts over it. He'll never part with it.
Yes I agree, some times nostalgia makes people blind to other revolutions.
One example is the graphic card revolution on PC, its mazing what it has done for 3D graphics, the powerful GPU's that where able to scale and resize textures in blink of a eye, overlay technology was the standard way to display videos, but as graphic cards got faster overlay became redundant, and so overlay was removed from newer graphic cards.
When I talk whit people who bit younger then me, they are nostalgic about Nintendo, PS1, and so on, maybe not to the same degree as we are, but to think that we are the only platform that has ben revolutionary is abit naive.