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Operating System Specific Discussions => Other Operating Systems => Topic started by: SysAdmin on August 16, 2013, 02:55:26 AM
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Anyone going to see the Jobs movie tomorrow? I never understood Steve Jobs getting excited about black & white computers in the 1980s or killing the Newton. But I did respect what he did for the iPod, iPhone, iPad & Pixar. He made the world less boring. Too bad he passed on the Amiga and was not a fan. A Steve Jobs Amiga would have cost $100,000 anyway.
http://jobsthefilm.com/
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Feh, no. There's already enough nauseating mythmaking and revisionism surrounding the guy with the iCult in real life. Why would I want to watch a movie about The Legend of Techno-Christ?
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Bet Amiga or Commodore does not even get a mention in this film!
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Anyone going to see the Jobs movie tomorrow? I never understood Steve Jobs getting excited about black & white computers in the 1980s or killing the Newton. But I did respect what he did for the iPod, iPhone, iPad & Pixar. He made the world less boring. Too bad he passed on the Amiga and was not a fan. A Steve Jobs Amiga would have cost $100,000 anyway.
http://jobsthefilm.com/
You forgot to mention NeXT :)
I've never wanted or own a Mac... But I only have NeXTStep based machines in my house and in my pocket now ;)
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@bloodline
NeXT was okay but I never owned one since they cost $6,000. The first ones were greyscale, LOL. I'm glad the computer world has moved on from black & white and greyscale computers. I never understood the appeal.
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Better off staying home and watching Triumph of the Nerds or Pirates of Silicon Valley if you are into the Apple scene.
Triumph of the Nerds documentary is a must see for anyone that was around in the early days of computing. Lots of Altair and such coverage there, but as usual the little guys get passed over.
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You forgot to mention NeXT :)
I've never wanted or own a Mac... But I only have NeXTStep based machines in my house and in my pocket now ;)
Yup, probably Steve Jobs greatest trick in the computer industry. Renaming the NeXT computer into the Mac. The Mac that old timers loved for some strange reason was dead and buried long ago.
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I'm not. I disliked Steve Jobs.
I do think Ashton Kutcher resembles him enough for the movie, though. But Noah Wyle(?) in The Pirates of Silicon Valley seemed to get that perky arrogance down pat. :roflmao:
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@SysAdmin
Yup, I never owned (or at the time wanted) a NeXTStep machine, but since 2005, I've been a very happy NeXTStep user... Sure it's now called Mac/iPad/iPhone, but I don't care about names :) :)
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I'm going to see this in about six hours. I'm not a Steve Jobs fan per say but I do respect what he was able to do in the 2000's. Without him everybody might be using Windows. I'll report back if it was any good. Hopefully Jon Cryer or Charlie Sheen makes a guest appearance in the movie.
:) (http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0001083/?ref_=tt_cl_t1)
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Any idea why he was not a fan?
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Any idea why he was not a fan?
Why Jobs was not a fan of Amiga?
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Any idea why he was not a fan?
Why Jobs was not a fan of Amiga?
There is an apocryphal quote attributed to Steve Jobs that he felt there was "too much hardware"... And in some respects he was right ;)
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I saw this movie yesterday and while I did enjoy it a lot sure was skipped. No iPhone, iPad, OS X and much more missing. Even the iPod only got a minute or two of screentime. A few too many black and white Macs for my liking. Those were the sh*tty ones, show the good stuff. I was surprised that the CBM Pet got a little screentime but of course as always the Amiga got screwed and not even a mention. These films love to pretend like the Amiga never even existed. Even Bill Gates got no airtime unless you count Jobs cussing him out over the phone. I don't like how the film suddenly just jumped ahead almost 10 years in the timeline skipping much. Anyone not already familiar with the Apple story would have got lost. Read this audiobook if you want the whole story. Don't expect the Amiga to get even a passing mention.
http://www.amazon.com/Steve-Jobs-Walter-Isaacson/dp/1451648537/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1376719978&sr=8-1&keywords=Jobs
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Knew the movie would be a bit thin, as it was said it'd end right at the iPod days. I was no fan of Jobs, but I always liked the story of how he turned the compant around when he came back. Apple was in serious trouble in those days. Hoping the Sorkin one will be a bit better, but hey - Pirates of Silicon Valley, just watch it, eh? It's on Vimeo and YouTube. That being said, the book you recommend is just great. Not an Apple fanboy here, but the Isaacson book is terrific. It's truly a great read even if you are the most vehement Apple watcher - though I recommend iWoz by Wozniak more if you're into more "general computer" reads. Covers a lot of the fun, renegade spirit that we all encountered during the early days of computing regardless of what platform you used. Woz's book is complete Computer Nerd Porn, but it's well work reading. The dude is an extremely talented and humble man.
I was always extremely interested in how things would have went if Apple had of bought the rights to BeOS versus buying NeXT out when it came time for them to update the Mac OS. Both were a diceroll, really. I loved BeOS, and still do. I've often been curious if Jean-Louis Gassee has had serious regrets about not selling it. I mean, he was asking $200 million and Apple offered $125 million. He stood his ground and Apple went with NeXT. I'm sure I'd like Apple computers more these days if Gassee had lowered his price, though I am not entirely sure things like the iPod would have come around had Apple not picked up NeXT and Jobs. Sculley did a hell of a lot of damage in the time he was there in regards to Apple's long term sustainability.
I used NeXTSTEP briefly back in the day and was never impressed with it bang for buck wise. They had a few NeXT boxes at the local university I fiddled with and really liked, until the computer lab manager mentioned they were $5000+ machines, heh.
None of 'em ever matched the uniqueness and sheer fun that the Amiga offered. Was very few machine then that could do it all, and Amiga was one of them. Gamers and productivity folks such as myself just adored them, and most still do.
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Cant say I have any interest in a film about a man whose talent was advertising and marketting.
Where's the Dennis Ritchie movie? A man who actually did something for the computer world, and not just his own pocket.
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Not sure why people want to watch these biog films to be honest. What is exciting about the life of a business man?
A film about the life of a rock star or film star whose life was full of controversy and an early death due to drugs, suicide or murder is a fun story.
A film about a bloke who made loads of money by being the head of a computer company? No thank you.
Can someone please tell me something exciting that happens in the movie that made you think WOW I love hollywood movies? I mean does he start flying, does he create a giant robot that saves the city from monsters? Does he go into space? Does he get chased through caverns by a giant bolder and almost loses his hat? Does he find the map to one eyed willys lost treasure?
As for commodore being missed out, there was a tv movie by the BBC about Sinclair and Acorn a couple of years ago and from that film you could of thought that the only 8 bits of note in the 80s were the Sinclair Amstrad and Acorn. They missed out the fact that Commodore was dominating the market.
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The big movie comes out next year, that's right Viva Amiga!
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I would watch an Amiga movie if it was a story about a boy growing up in the late 80's and early 90's who loves playing games and he imagines he is in a computer game when in real life situations so the film keeps changing from live action to amiga (amiga style) game footage.
I would not watch a film about some guy who works for Commodore and he makes money out of the Amiga
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I plan to watch it. Looks interesting enough.
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I saw this movie yesterday and while I did enjoy it a lot sure was skipped. No iPhone, iPad, OS X and much more missing. Even the iPod only got a minute or two of screentime.
Weird... For me the early Apple/Jobs story is quite interesting, but not that unusual (Microsoft story, the Acorn story, the Sinclair story, the Hi-Torro story etc were all around at that time)...
What is truly interesting is the Apple/Jobs story from 1996 onwards, he turned a failing company with no prospect of recovery into the biggest tech company on Earth. Love him or hate him, that is a fascinating story.
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I wouldn't mind watching an Amiga movie. Focus on the core 'fathers of the Amiga', start a bit before they met one another--working at Atari, whatever--and show how it came together by falling apart: needing money, and Commodore coming in,... the plane trip with "Joe Pillow" taking up a seat, on the way to convention, etc. The rise of Amiga, to the unveiling at Lincoln Center in New York. Credits roll with continued scenes to either side, showing further announcements of Amigas...the 500, the 3000, the 4000, etc. Stopping short of the bankruptcy in the mid-1990s. The movie would focus on the trials and tribulations along the way, by those who brought Amiga into being. Carl Sassenrath, Jay Miner, Dave Morse and so on. We'd see scenes...oh...certain programmer who worked in pajamas.... Mitchy running through the office, barking approval (or not) on this or that product... a programmer getting all zen-like with his practice of "guru meditation", in the face of frustration...
:laughing:
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Jack Tramiel deservs his own film. IMHO.
What a life story!
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I think there is an interview on YouTube with Dave Needle and RJ Michal... That give a really good idea of a garage full of guys trying to design what became the Amiga, long long before commodore... Every day they were on a knife edge of running out of money etc... :)
Also here... But this is a bit later...
http://youtu.be/9LAzSZKJ3o0
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Jobs was a flaming ass hole. From day one! The Woz was the brains behind most of Apple - why don't people give him the credit he deserves?
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Jobs was a flaming ass hole. From day one! The Woz was the brains behind most of Apple - why don't people give him the credit he deserves?
You are wrong, Steve Jobs was the genius of Apple. Woz is/was a brilliant engineer, but he had little idea how to direct his talents to making something that could be used by ordinary people. Steve Jobs was the guys who brought it all together, and Apple's strength always has been bring good ideas together in a form that people can use and more importantly want to use.
-edit- I came across too harsh there, my point was that apple is not about genius hardware aka woz... It is about cleverly mixing technologies, and that was Steve Jobs fortè :)
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Not sure why people want to watch these biog films to be honest. What is exciting about the life of a business man?
There's a big difference between tweaking a story to work better as a movie and just straight-up mythologizing under the pretense of historical accuracy.
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As for commodore being missed out, there was a tv movie by the BBC about Sinclair and Acorn a couple of years ago and from that film you could of thought that the only 8 bits of note in the 80s were the Sinclair Amstrad and Acorn. They missed out the fact that Commodore was dominating the market.
Are you talking about Micro Men?
That film was focused on the rivalry between Sinclair and Acorn for the BBC contract (which Acorn won, of course). If they were to cover the rest of the market at the time, then it would have been a 10-hour long biopic :) There were also Oric, Dragon, Tandy, Jupiter Catab., Grundy, EACA, Mattel... the list goes on and on and on.
Also, I'd guess you're from the US? Commodore did not come close to dominating the 8-bit market over here. The dominant machines were the Sinclairs, with Commodore being next and then Amstrad - but in no way at all did Commodore dominate the UK market, and that's what the film was dealing with.
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Micromen yes. I didn't want them to go overboard with commodore references just a bigger mention.
I`m from England and the shops had a lot more games with the red band than with the yellow or orange ones
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That's really odd! You must have been lucky then, around here it was mostly Spectrum (which was fine as I had a Spectrum! :) )
The Reg did an article here:
http://www.theregister.co.uk/2013/01/03/charted_1983_home_computer_sales_in_uk/
from actual sales figures, and it does back up how I remember it.
The real difference was the CBM overpriced the C64 in the UK, whereas the Sinclair retailed mostly for £129.
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You know the more I learn about the real Steve Jobs and Bill gates the more I think Amiga had the coolest Dad! As proven in my latest Youitube vid
The Father of Amiga
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mDL4La81R50
Here's to Jay. :drink: & Mitchy
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Jay Miner was a real swell fellow, and very approachable. A people's engineer, he was always more than happy to share his knowledge about computers with anyone who would ask. He especially took the time with young guys like me who showed interest in the hobby.
Heck, the guy ran an Amiga BBS out of his own house out of his own pocket. A machine he put together with his own two hands, messing with cryptic software he spent countless hours fiddling with, opening it up to public callers just to share his passion, which was the Amiga. I'd like to think Jay got as much enjoyment out of interacting with his users as we did with him.
R.I.P. Jay Miner and The Mission BBS
Short review of the Jobs movie by Woz himself: http://gizmodo.com/jobs-reviewed-by-steve-wozniak-1153771108
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Anyone going to see the Jobs movie tomorrow? I never understood Steve Jobs getting excited about black & white computers in the 1980s or killing the Newton. But I did respect what he did for the iPod, iPhone, iPad & Pixar. He made the world less boring. Too bad he passed on the Amiga and was not a fan. A Steve Jobs Amiga would have cost $100,000 anyway.
http://jobsthefilm.com/
I tend to disagree, he made everyone that use a computer a mindless idiot. Look at the deadheads using the iPod, iPhone and Ipad. I am completely happy that he passed on the Amiga because today we would be using a computer where the only thing you had to know about computing is where the on switch would be. He had you locked out of everything else.
As Steve once told me at a computer show in San Francisco, why would I want people ucking around in my system, those idiots would really screw up the computer. Oh, by the way I was a Commodore rep, working at that show, and the only way Steve impressed me was he had an ego that wouldn't quit. He thought he was digitals gift to computers.
I do agree with you though on the cost of an Amiga if Steve Jobs had it, but he probably would have disabled 90% of the OS.
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Weird... For me the early Apple/Jobs story is quite interesting, but not that unusual (Microsoft story, the Acorn story, the Sinclair story, the Hi-Torro story etc were all around at that time)...
What is truly interesting is the Apple/Jobs story from 1996 onwards, he turned a failing company with no prospect of recovery into the biggest tech company on Earth. Love him or hate him, that is a fascinating story.
Yeah, if you talked to him you would find out he was a real butt hole.
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@AmigaNG,
You are completely right, Jay was a really cool person, who had a lot of good idea's. The only thing was he worked for Commodore, and they wouldn't allow him to do half the stuff he wanted to try. Like when I was talking to him he really liked the 286 and 386 structure. He said if he knew those processors where going to be coming out, he would of loved to try them to see what they would do. Back when he chose the 68000 that was the chip of the day. I know I will get flamed on this one.
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@AmigaNG,
Like when I was talking to him he really liked the 286 and 386 structure. He said if he knew those processors where going to be coming out, he would of loved to try them to see what they would do. Back when he chose the 68000 that was the chip of the day.
The 80386, maybe, but I very much doubt the 80286.
Partially because the 80286 had already been out for a few years when the Amiga was designed (it was introduced in 1982) and partly because it was a bit rubbish, certainly compared to the 68000.
The 80386 is possible, though - starting at 16MHz and having a protected mode which was actually useful, I can see why he could have been interested in that one.
There was, of course, one catch. The 80386 was incredibly expensive at the time, so it still would have been impractical to have actually used one in an Amiga.
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You are wrong, Steve Jobs was the genius of Apple. Woz is/was a brilliant engineer, but he had little idea how to direct his talents to making something that could be used by ordinary people. Steve Jobs was the guys who brought it all together, and Apple's strength always has been bring good ideas together in a form that people can use and more importantly want to use.
-edit- I came across too harsh there, my point was that apple is not about genius hardware aka woz... It is about cleverly mixing technologies, and that was Steve Jobs fortè :)
I think Steve Jobs was a DOer. He knew how to get things done. But I don't believe he was at all revolutionary in his thinking--nor anything he brought forth particularly revolutionary (FROM HIM). One can't claim to be a PIRATE (stealing other people's ideas) and then claim to be a genius.
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Yeah, if you talked to him you would find out he was a real butt hole.
Believe me, I've never had any desire to talk to Steve Jobs :)
Carl Sassenrath on the other hand... ;)
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@AmigaNG,
You are completely right, Jay was a really cool person, who had a lot of good idea's. The only thing was he worked for Commodore, and they wouldn't allow him to do half the stuff he wanted to try. Like when I was talking to him he really liked the 286 and 386 structure. He said if he knew those processors where going to be coming out, he would of loved to try them to see what they would do. Back when he chose the 68000 that was the chip of the day. I know I will get flamed on this one.
I'm sure Jay would have been very interested in the 386, it was a pretty cool CPU for it's time... Frankly had the x86 line be 32bit (with a flat memory model) when the Amiga was being developed, I expect the intel chips would have been chosen over the Motorola ones.
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I am completely happy that he passed on the Amiga because today we would be using a computer where the only thing you had to know about computing is where the on switch would be. He had you locked out of everything else.
Well, on the good old Amiga days, lots of people only knew out to put a disk in the drive and power on the Amiga. Actually that's the only thing you needed to know. It's only later that you had to do more, since lots of things got complicated, hacked,...
And btw, the fact Macs hide most of the stuff doesn't mean you doesn't have access to the stuff if you want to... It's power and simplicity...
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I'm sure Jay would have been very interested in the 386, it was a pretty cool CPU for it's time... Frankly had the x86 line be 32bit (with a flat memory model) when the Amiga was being developed, I expect the intel chips would have been chosen over the Motorola ones.
The 386 wasn't that advanced - it still had a tiny register file, for example, they just kicked the registers up to 32 bits. (AFAIK you couldn't even address the "high half" as a separate register the way you could with the high/low 8 bits on the 8086/286.) It didn't even have any L1 cache. About the only really nice feature was the move to a flat memory model with an integrated MMU, and the removal of constraints on which registers could do what operations.
Whereas the 68000 had flat 32-bit addressing from day one, in addition to a large register file (which was more orthogonal than the 386's from the start) and extensive, flexible addressing modes, and by 1985 the 68020 was already out at speeds comparable to the 386 and with onboard cache, so there was a clear upgrade path (although Commodore certainly took their sweet time about exploiting it.)
And, as spirantho noted, when the 386 came out it was a pricey, high-end server/minicomputer CPU. It didn't even become common in PCs until the late '80s.
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You know the more I learn about the real Steve Jobs and Bill gates the more I think Amiga had the coolest Dad! As proven in my latest Youitube vid
The Father of Amiga
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mDL4La81R50
Here's to Jay. :drink: & Mitchy
Don't forget the new father of the Amiga.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=el6LUUdIvUU
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Don't forget the new father of the Amiga.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=el6LUUdIvUU
More like the Mother f***** of the Amiga.
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I'm sure Jay would have been very interested in the 386, it was a pretty cool CPU for it's time... Frankly had the x86 line be 32bit (with a flat memory model) when the Amiga was being developed, I expect the intel chips would have been chosen over the Motorola ones.
The original Pentium Pro was my favourite Intel CPU.
Lovely design compared to all the tat they came up with prior to it.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pentium_Pro#Microarchitecture
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Nope. Won't ever see it. Just the same as I won't see the Facephuq movie, either. I don't dig aggrandizement movies which add to the folklore and myths of something I feel is very close to my heart. Honestly, I wouldn't go see a Hollywood production about Jay Miner, either, because I want the flat truth rather than embellishment.
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Nope. Won't ever see it. Just the same as I won't see the Facephuq movie, either. I don't dig aggrandizement movies which add to the folklore and myths of something I feel is very close to my heart. Honestly, I wouldn't go see a Hollywood production about Jay Miner, either, because I want the flat truth rather than embellishment.
I don't like these "biopic" films either. It's bordering on idolatry tbh and I find that quite sad.
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Bordering, hell! By everything I've heard it is idolatry.
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I don't like these "biopic" films either. It's bordering on idolatry tbh and I find that quite sad.
Well... We all have our idols, we just don't call them that ;)
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I'm waiting for them to make "Steve Jobs Vampire slayer."
That will be worth seeing.
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I saw it last night, wasnt to impressed with it. Its not bad, but growing up in this time frame made for a lot of cool memories returning. The book is much better though.
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Well... We all have our idols, we just don't call them that ;)
Ah there's many things we Muzzies can be accused of but idolatry is not one of them Matt. :)