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Amiga computer related discussion => Amiga Hardware Issues and discussion => Topic started by: Robert1234 on May 28, 2013, 10:17:31 AM

Title: A4000 doesn't recognize AGA properly!
Post by: Robert1234 on May 28, 2013, 10:17:31 AM
Hi, I've got a problem with bought A4000 desktop and I expect to find someone competent here which would help me to fix it.

OK, so the problem is that system doesn't recognize AGA chipset. Here are some facts:
1. In Early Startup Control there is no option called "Best Available". Only "Original" and "Enhanced".
2. When the system boots I can only choose OCS modes e.g. Lores 32 colors and Hires 16 colors.
3. Interesting fact: when the system boots with "Cache Disabled" in Boot Menu the computer starts with distorted graphics but the ECS modes are available now.
4. Replacing ROMs didn't solve the problem.

Is there someone which can guess what's faulty in this A4000? Is it possible that it's something with processor board?
Title: Re: A4000 doesn't recognize AGA properly!
Post by: Dr.Bongo on May 28, 2013, 11:04:13 AM
Maybe a defective or incorrect kickstart chip. What are the revision numbers?
Title: Re: A4000 doesn't recognize AGA properly!
Post by: Robert1234 on May 28, 2013, 12:05:49 PM
Quote from: Dr.Bongo;736166
Maybe a defective or incorrect kickstart chip. What are the revision numbers?
As I mentioned I replaced kickstarts (ROMs) and the problem didn't solve. I tested with 3.1 and 3.0 kickstarts (proper A4000 kickstarts). Is it possible that:

- something is wrong with motherboard,
- something is wrong with processor board? (my guess)

I must mention that SetPatch prints "Advanced Graphics Modes Available", but actually there are no such modes in ScreenMode preferences program.

Thank you for any help!
Title: Re: A4000 doesn't recognize AGA properly!
Post by: Havie on May 28, 2013, 12:31:26 PM
Do AGA games work?
Title: Re: A4000 doesn't recognize AGA properly!
Post by: Robert1234 on May 28, 2013, 12:37:35 PM
Quote from: Havie;736169
Do AGA games work?

Yes, they do. The problem is with the system screen modes.
Title: Re: A4000 doesn't recognize AGA properly!
Post by: Dr.Bongo on May 28, 2013, 01:39:04 PM
Quote from: Robert1234;736168
As I mentioned I replaced kickstarts (ROMs) and the problem didn't solve.


Not seeing that. If you had said so I wouldn't have suggested it.
Title: Re: A4000 doesn't recognize AGA properly!
Post by: zipper on May 28, 2013, 02:38:36 PM
Setpatch  enables the AGA modes.
Title: Re: A4000 doesn't recognize AGA properly!
Post by: Ezrec on May 28, 2013, 02:55:39 PM
Quote from: zipper;736188
Setpatch  enables the AGA modes.


Yes, C:SetPatch from v3.x is required to enable AGA modes.

Until C:SetPatch is run, the AGA is disabled, since when AGA is enabled, there are additional restrictions to the internal memory alignment of bitmaps (from x2 byte to x16 byte row alignment) that are incompatible with OCS/ECS games.

Similarly, if you want to use the other features of SetPatch, but need the old OCS/ECS compatibility, use the following line in your S:Startup-Sequence:

C:SetPatch NOAGA

This will disable the AGA support, and allow more old games to run from Workbench, but you won't have access to AGA modes.

(If you're booting a game from floppy, this doesn't matter, since the game will probably not care about the various driver fixes in SetPatch).

One thing I like to do is to have a special 'NoAGA' bootable (> Install DF0: ) floppy for Workbench games that require OCS/ECS bitmap alignments.

(The 'LoadWB' at the end is for a 'minimal' Workbench - if you like, you can replace that with 'Execute S:Startup-Sequence' to run HD0's startup-sequence)

:C/Assign (any AmigaOS)
:C/SetPatch (from v3.x)
:S/Startup-Sequence
 C:SetPatch NOAGA
  Assign SYS: DH0:
  Assign C: SYS:C
  Assign L: SYS:L
  Assign Libs: SYS:Libs
  Assign S: SYS:S
  Assign Devs: SYS:Devs
  Assign Fonts: SYS:Fonts
  MakeDir RAM:T
  Assign T: RAM:T
  LoadWB
  EndCLI
Title: Re: A4000 doesn't recognize AGA properly!
Post by: Oldsmobile_Mike on May 28, 2013, 04:28:58 PM
Quote from: Robert1234;736164
1. In Early Startup Control there is no option called "Best Available". Only "Original" and "Enhanced".


Semi-related question, does C:SetPatch execute before the Early Startup Control screen is loaded?  Seems odd that this would be the case, but I recall that when I was trying to get the "Nessie" easter egg to display it would only show up on the Early Startup screen if you have 3.9 installed, not 3.1 (even though the ROM is identical).
Title: Re: A4000 doesn't recognize AGA properly!
Post by: zipper on May 28, 2013, 04:47:11 PM
Nessie displays only after soft reset meaning Setpatch has been run. So the best available option should be there after a soft reset. 3.9 does the soft reset by default.
Title: Re: A4000 doesn't recognize AGA properly!
Post by: rvo_nl on May 28, 2013, 09:00:24 PM
this doesnt make sense. 'best available' should be in early startup display options before setpatch has loaded. in fact if you disconnect your hard drive it should still be there.
Title: Re: A4000 doesn't recognize AGA properly!
Post by: paul1981 on May 28, 2013, 09:13:42 PM
Quote from: Robert1234;736164
Hi, I've got a problem with bought A4000 desktop and I expect to find someone competent here which would help me to fix it.

OK, so the problem is that system doesn't recognize AGA chipset. Here are some facts:
1. In Early Startup Control there is no option called "Best Available". Only "Original" and "Enhanced".
2. When the system boots I can only choose OCS modes e.g. Lores 32 colors and Hires 16 colors.
3. Interesting fact: when the system boots with "Cache Disabled" in Boot Menu the computer starts with distorted graphics but the ECS modes are available now.
4. Replacing ROMs didn't solve the problem.

Is there someone which can guess what's faulty in this A4000? Is it possible that it's something with processor board?

Silly question, but are you sure your Workbench installation is okay? Workbench 3.0 or above is required for AGA screen modes. So for instance, 2.1 Workbench is not capable of AGA screen modes even with an AGA capable Setpatch such as the one that came with 3.0/3.1.

If you haven't already checked, do a COLD boot from a 3.0 or 3.1 Workbench floppy and load the Screenmode prefs program from the Extras3.0/3.1 disk and verify the problem. You've more than likely already done this, but just wanted to double check. :rolleyes:
Title: Re: A4000 doesn't recognize AGA properly!
Post by: Tumbleweed on May 28, 2013, 09:29:01 PM
It's possible that you have a hardware problem. My A4000 doesn't allow me to select AGA screen modes in workbench. The reason is the battery has leaked and damaged the motherboard. Have you checked for leaking battery/caps damage?

Weed
Title: Re: A4000 doesn't recognize AGA properly!
Post by: freqmax on May 28, 2013, 09:49:10 PM
A tricky idea, write a RTG driver for AGA provided you have AmigaOS 3.5 or higher? ;)

That way it doesn't have to know about AGA at boot time.
Title: Re: A4000 doesn't recognize AGA properly!
Post by: Robert1234 on May 28, 2013, 10:34:49 PM
Quote from: Tumbleweed;736208
It's possible that you have a hardware problem. My A4000 doesn't allow me to select AGA screen modes in workbench. The reason is the battery has leaked and damaged the motherboard. Have you checked for leaking battery/caps damage?

Weed
I'm not too experienced in A4000, but on the right side of the motherboard is a battery, and there is a kind of white semi-translucent liquid. So it's the battery leak, right?
Title: Re: A4000 doesn't recognize AGA properly!
Post by: freqmax on May 28, 2013, 11:46:28 PM
Sounds like it. Photo?
Title: Re: A4000 doesn't recognize AGA properly!
Post by: Robert1234 on May 29, 2013, 06:21:51 AM
Will make photo in a couple of days (probably tomorrow). If this is a battery leak is there a way to fix it? What if the motherboard was corroded, is there a chance to bring it to full working condition with the AGA modes available?
Title: Re: A4000 doesn't recognize AGA properly!
Post by: Djole on May 29, 2013, 08:02:19 AM
Damaged boards by leaking batteries can be repaired, depending on the extend of the damage. Mostly, such repairs are done by removing the battery, cleaning the boards and bridging the damaged tracks. If the damaged tracks are on outer layers the repair is very easy, if the damage is in the inner layers, repairs can be tricky. Anyway if your battery has leaked be sure to remove it as soon as possible to avoid more damage.
Title: Re: A4000 doesn't recognize AGA properly!
Post by: freqmax on May 29, 2013, 01:30:10 PM
Any tip on chemical to neutralize the battery fluid with? (without frying the pcb..)
Title: Re: A4000 doesn't recognize AGA properly!
Post by: Robert1234 on May 29, 2013, 09:02:15 PM
I attach the photos of the battery (leak).
Title: Re: A4000 doesn't recognize AGA properly!
Post by: spaceman88 on May 29, 2013, 09:23:55 PM
Quote from: Robert1234;736339
I attach the photos of the battery (leak).


That's a coin battery, they ususaly don't leak. Is your motherboard a 4000CR version? Or did someone replace the leaky type with this?
Title: Re: A4000 doesn't recognize AGA properly!
Post by: spaceman88 on May 29, 2013, 09:27:43 PM
Quote from: freqmax;736297
Any tip on chemical to neutralize the battery fluid with? (without frying the pcb..)


I used vinegar, then baking soda then isopropanol alcohol to clean everything off.
Title: Re: A4000 doesn't recognize AGA properly!
Post by: Robert1234 on May 29, 2013, 09:30:12 PM
Quote from: spaceman88;736342
That's a coin battery, they ususaly don't leak. Is your motherboard a 4000CR version? Or did someone replace the leaky type with this?

As previous owner of this Amiga told me this is a replacement battery of the old one. Do you see a leak on the photo? Because it seems that it's present.
Title: Re: A4000 doesn't recognize AGA properly!
Post by: Oldsmobile_Mike on May 29, 2013, 09:35:16 PM
Quote from: Robert1234;736345
As previous owner of this Amiga told me this is a replacement battery of the old one. Do you see a leak on the photo? Because it seems that it's present.


That looks like hot glue.  Poke it with your finger, it should be hard.  Of course it may also be hiding whatever damage might have occurred from the previous "barrel" type battery that was installed prior to the modification...
Title: Re: A4000 doesn't recognize AGA properly!
Post by: spaceman88 on May 29, 2013, 09:35:35 PM
Quote from: Robert1234;736345
As previous owner of this Amiga told me this is a replacement battery of the old one. Do you see a leak on the photo? Because it seems that it's present.


I can't seem to blow the picture up big enough to be sure. I think I see some silicone sealant.
Title: Re: A4000 doesn't recognize AGA properly!
Post by: lolof on May 29, 2013, 11:05:00 PM
You can loose the AGA if the battery leaked and damaged one of the 2 first IC left from the battery(I think it is the second one but I am not sure). If the battery leaked and it was not properly cleaned, it means each IC lift up and clean the PCB under. Then with time the remaining acid can damage the ICs and/or tracks and avoid the A4000 to boot in AGA, only ecs would be possible. if I were you, I would first go to pref time and look if it is possible to save the time. If not, you have battery damages...

Yes, there was a leak.
Title: Re: A4000 doesn't recognize AGA properly!
Post by: freqmax on May 30, 2013, 06:24:18 AM
Looks like hot glue to me.