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Amiga computer related discussion => Amiga Hardware Issues and discussion => Topic started by: AmiDelf on January 29, 2004, 04:05:06 PM
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I wonder. I am not a hardware expert, but for me when I watch something, I watch it. I get the pics wich is on my screen, thinking how it is and how it should be.
For me, Dreamcast have the best ever picture quality of all consoles, even if its dated 1998. It dosent have this blurred 3D games or screen at all, wich GameCube have and also X-BOX.
When you connect a Dreamcast to VGA monitor, the screen is just amazing good! And I mean it.
Would this technology be nice for a future Amiga computer?
Regards,
Michal, www.amigaworld.org
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I'm not sure... but the chip used in dreamcast is of the same family of Kyro I or II?
Anyway a Matrox G550 probably will provide a quality as good if not better than DC and will allow you to use AGP, so you'll be able to upgrade or change your card easily.
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The Dreamcast used the PowerVR 2. A PC version of the PowerVR3 was called the Kyro (and II). PowerVR licenses their cores, including newer cores than the ones used in both the DC and Kyro.
But even with slight improvements, the cores of the Kyro could be made competitive with modern video cards.
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I know. But PowerVR got a powerfull 3D sollution as well. Matrox is stunning in 2D, but Parhelia or what its called. Dosent perform 3D as much as digital news papers claimed before the release.
Now PowerVR is here, and everyone (most of people) knows how good Dreamcast picture is. It beats out PS2, GameCube and X-BOX in picture quality. And at the same time, also powerfull at 3D.
Regards,
Michal, www.amigaworld.org
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The image quality of the Kyro's rock! :-D
Period!
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The PowerVR does tile based rendering, it only renders what the eye sees. The end result is it doesn't require the bandwidth other gfx chips do.
Basically IMO it would be a great chip to use on *present* Amigas, but drivers would be terribly hard to do.
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@redrumloa
I'd highly recommend you check out the PowerVR website then. The PVR's drivers are open-source and documentation is easy to get. There was a point I wanted to use the PVR in my Eddas design, but I can't afford the licensing costs.
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Yep.
Another fact worth noting is that it's very hard to implement a T&L sollution that works with tile-based rendering.
I remember PowerVR developing some kind of external T&L unit for the Kyro II though. It was labelled KyroII SE.
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the Kyro series are quite good indeed but its limited in ways of coding + it costs a lot to get the liscense , and most of all as earlier replied by others , it only renders whats on the screen.
also the DC didnt die because of the hardware or the software, it died because of SEGA's lame way of marketing their products and maybe most of all they turned every developer down due to they wanted to kill it themself (almost like nintendo GC 1 year ago, but it has resurected!).
want to put this chip in an amiga? , do u know what the liscense cost? , who will develop a devkit for it? , i wish it would have been an easier chip to program :)
cheers
pps:not a bad suggestion indeed but can you afford it?
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@lempkee
I actually do know the cost of licensing, but can't state it due to NDA.
Hint, you're talking 6-figures minimum, more likely 7 in the longer term.
I'm almost tempted to offer licensing my design to this poor guy.
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downix wrote:
>The PVR's drivers are open-source
No they're not. The Linux drivers have a partially open-source section to interface with the kernel, but the actual drivers are binaries.
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AmiDelf wrote:
I
When you connect a Dreamcast to VGA monitor, the screen is just amazing good! And I mean it.
Oddly enough, if you connect something to a monitor you'll get a better picture than if you connect it to a TV. The picture quality of any modern graphics card (leaving aside hardware effects like anti-aliasing, which is hardly the PowerVR's strong point) is primarily determined by the quality of the digital to analog conversion hardware rather than the graphics chip itself. Different cards with the same ATI chip will have different picture qualities. The PowerVR was a moderately decent chip with some innovative ideas, but in terms of performance it's worse than most other stuff on the market and the quality is no better.
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downix wrote:
@redrumloa
I'd highly recommend you check out the PowerVR website then. The PVR's drivers are open-source and documentation is easy to get. There was a point I wanted to use the PVR in my Eddas design, but I can't afford the licensing costs.
Why aren't you logged into AIM? :hammer:
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@mjg59
I could have sworn they were, I'll download and look.
For anyone interested in developing for the PowerVR, click here (http://www.pvrdev.com/).
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16-bit quality rules. (Yes, I know that the chip uses internal 32-bit rendering)
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What sort of NDA's are you talking about? Yes, I would love to work with someone like you downix.
I would love to create a new Amiga team. I would love to build it up slowly. Getting hardware people tougether. Because a Amiga with PowerVR custom mainboard replacing AGA would doo lots.
In the end, AmigaOS4 could be licensed. Maybe a PayPal account could be created, to gather money for such project like this?
This project can show what Amiga people really wants...
Regards
Michal, www.amigaworld.org,
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amidelf: u dont know what an NDA is ? ..ok..
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Yes, but I didn't understand his NDA? About what? ehrm.. :)
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@Lempkee:
"also the DC didnt die because of the hardware or the software, it died because of SEGA's lame way of marketing their products and maybe most of all they turned every developer down due to they wanted to kill it themself (almost like nintendo GC 1 year ago, but it has resurected!)."
IMHO one of the points that helps a console to sell well is piracy. N64 sold bad because it was hard to pirate games and the solutions to pirate games came too late (like in the DC). PS1 sold well because it was dead easy to pirate games. Same with PS2. XBoxes are sold because it's easy to pirate games. I didn't see GameCubes until someone found a way to boot games from normal cdroms (=pirate games).
With the GC the same has happened, it only was sold in few quantities until someone found a way to execute code in the console using its network card, now it's possible to use pirate games so now it's selling well.
My theory is that if a console is more or less easy to pirate and has lots of titles it will sell well.
As the companies that make these consoles are big and they sell lots of units and hundreds of games are sold even if the piracy level is high, developers still have profits. Users buy a few originals and pirate lots of games but as there are hundreds of thousands of users, developers still have profits.
In our market it's really stupid to piraty anything as we have so few titles that a few users buying a product makes a huge difference.
So in conclusion... consoles easy to pirate sell well. It doesn't matter if the other consoles are better if their games are harder to pirate, users will choose the one with more pirate games.
That happened with amiga and pc in the early 90s too... people bought pcs due to the easy way of getting pirate games/apps and not because it was better/worse than amigas. When they said "why you use an amiga? it doesn't have programs!" they mean that their friends couldn't pass them pirate apps/games.
This is sad but true. And DC sales was smashed by PS1 even thought in some technical aspects it was better than the PS2 :-(
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@Crumb
You are 100% rigth! Consoles that can be modified to run pirated games
sell. Consoles that don't are not selling. Sad but true. I mean the
GameCube is a beauty but the Playstation did better since you can put
a modchip in there.
Coder
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AmiDelf wrote:
What sort of NDA's are you talking about? Yes, I would love to work with someone like you downix.
Well, I'm right here
I would love to create a new Amiga team. I would love to build it up slowly. Getting hardware people tougether. Because a Amiga with PowerVR custom mainboard replacing AGA would doo lots.
You have a lot of options, including full-custom solutions. Depends on how much money you want to spend
In the end, AmigaOS4 could be licensed. Maybe a PayPal account could be created, to gather money for such project like this?
This project can show what Amiga people really wants...
Regards
Michal, www.amigaworld.org,
OS4 is one option, MorphOS is another and so is AROS. you'd have the pick of the litter, so to say. Don't waste any advantage like that by playing to sides.
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It looks as if you have been doing the same internet browsing as me recently!
I was very interested in your ideas about creating a new 'classic amiga'. Sorry I haven't read all 6 pages of it, and while I agree the community needs something special going back to the days of AA/AAA isn't practical for all the reasons mensioned in that post.
But what was REALLY special about Amiga and why it still has a following today is that it did so much with so little. Efficient design of the O/S and of the Hardware. The two worked in unison to create the amiga experience.
Part of that was down to developers knowing they had a firm specification to build for. (I know hitting the hardware is frowned on these days but that's what made so good (Insidentally that's why I think so many people are against the AmigaDE ideals, an "abstraction layer, no I want to program the chips dirrectly.") Back onto subject ...sort of)...
That's why console games can (just about) keep up with the more powerful PC hardware configs; a firm base line on which to work to, a minimum spec. That's why a like the Game Boy Advance, it does a lot with the minimal hardware it has. PowerVR has a similar sort of idealogy (ahhh the point at last!)
What would be great is a new Amiga based on a PDA version of the PowerVR. I've been 'researching' the idea of a pda Amiga; running UAE on a established PDA. Using a Dragonball CPU which is based on a 68000 anyway. But the custom chips are too hard to emulate and it would require alot more than a 66MHz (Currently the fastest 68k based Dragonball) to emulate OCS let alone AGA.
So the solution is to add Custom hardware. I toyed with the idea of a CF/SD device but bandwidths are surely too low.
So what about a new start, a custom(ish) PowerVR 3D chip making a 3D 'Amigaboy'. Now that would embody the Amiga ideals of design efficency, and give us a new classic to be prowd of.
This is not as far fetched as it all seems, I'll post some html links when I find them again. Technology is moving in this direction time to stop looking at the past and embrace the future. I'd buy one...probably.
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@AmiDelf
Seeing as you are taking this forward (or trying to at least) do you have a business plan ? Or are you hoping to just get "there" by luck and think of it "it's only a hobby" ? Seems you want to go back to Los Gatos kind of setup..
Maybe you should contact Jeri Ellsworth, set up some kind of meeting with some people here (Downix seems to be willing to lend a helping hand) and discuss this "dream" of yours (and plenty of others) in "private..
Just a suggestion.
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I don't think the piracy has a strong influence for selling a gameconsole. The PS1 for instance, was already selling very well before cd's could easily being copied.
And copying games for the Amiga was far easier than copying games for the SNES or Megadrive.
And btw. about that gfx thing; didn't Amiga inc. cooperate with Matrox?
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Unless you plan to do this as a hobby only or perhaps as a hobby business I don't think it's a very good idea. It'll never become a serious contender outside the Amiga geek world unless it offers something unique, something better than the rest. Efficiency only sells to engineers, it means nothing to anyone else.
The Amiga was good because it was fast, The Mac did everything in software whereas the Amiga did a lot of stuff in hardware so not only graphics and sound were faster so was everything else because the CPU was freed up.
These days everone uses the same approach, CPUs are now so fast you don't need to use hardware and the only area it's needed is for 3D and thats done very nicely by ATI, Nvidia and Sony.
Want to build a new "Classic Amiga", firstly dump the idea of using a 68K or compatible, even a low end PowerPC with JIT will outgun them. For the hardware use a FPGA, they're fast and cheap these days, anything else will cost you *vast* sums of money. For other graphics (3D) use an embedded graphics chip, ATI do them and there'll be supplies for a long time, they'll also kick the Kyro's ass.
The best addition you could include is a PCI connector - so you can plug it into a PC - and in doing so increase you potential market from hundreds of units to millions of units.
Oh and yes, speaking to Jeri is probably a good idea - she already has parts which could go into an Amiga emulator...
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The PowerVR chip rules! It has loads of interesting features that even the newest Gfx-chips hasnt. If you wonder, I love the Dreamcast! Dreamcast Scene (http://www.dreamcast-scene.com)
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This project ittends to be open as much as possible. Amigans will be forming it tougether.
Whats choosen is:
- PowerVR custom based motherboard replacing AGA
- PPC will be used
- USB Amiga keyboards
More to come.
Regards,
Michal, www.amigaworld.org
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@seer
Hehe. I dont want to be a new Commodore, not telling anything at all. Thats how Amiga Inc is today and keeps Amigans waiting and waiting.
I believe that when AmigaOS4 is out, people will be very happy. I will get myself a AmigaOne aswell, but this project tries to create the Amiga as it was.
I hope that this can be done, but if not. Well, then I've tried atleast.
Regards,
Michal, www.amigaworld.org
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AmiDelf wrote:
This project ittends to be open as much as possible. Amigans will be forming it tougether.
Whats choosen is:
- PowerVR custom based motherboard replacing AGA
- PPC will be used
- USB Amiga keyboards
More to come.
Regards,
Michal, www.amigaworld.org
What design requirement requres the PPC? a MIPS would be nicer, but expensive, why not go with a bottom end Athlon64 (cheap, 64bit, widely supported and uses Hypertransport busses!)
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whats the best design for usb keyboard/mice really? , anyone know? ..
as we all know how amiga and mac and pc acts under optical usb mouse etc, even on a 3ghz x86 , its slowing everything down!..
any thought? ,
and btw amidelf why is USB keyboard and mice a must? ..
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as we all know how amiga and mac and pc acts under optical usb mouse etc, even on a 3ghz x86 , its slowing everything down!..
eh? What?
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USB is the next best thing to originally Amiga mouse and Joystick ports.
Forget PS/2 keyboards or mouse if you want to be a good drawer. I dont expect annyone going for the Amiga, Atari, Sega Megadrive, C64++ standards again. So USB is the next best thing to it all.
Regards,
Michal, www.amigaworld.org
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Knows anybody actually if there might be a new gfx chipset being developed from the makers of the PowerVR? Would be an interesting one for the A1.
I still think Amiga should develop a nice gameconsole aside the A1. They got the name for it and if it gets a bit publicity, it could sell very well.
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I actually agree with you there. Could be a great and new marked, for those wich wants to buy a great computer from the start.
Lets say that:
Amiga 6000 became the next-generation Amiga
AmiCast or something for a next-gen game console
That would be nice! I am sure of it!
Regards,
Michal, www.amigaworld.org
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AmiDelf wrote:
I actually agree with you there. Could be a great and new marked, for those wich wants to buy a great computer from the start.
Lets say that:
Amiga 6000 became the next-generation Amiga
AmiCast or something for a next-gen game console
That would be nice! I am sure of it!
Regards,
Michal, www.amigaworld.org
But why did you choose the PPC? I don't understand how it fits your needs!!
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@Speelgoedmannetje
Check out their website, there are newer cores from them, such as the MBX.
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USB == great way to turn that 3Ghz computer into a 200Mhz computer.
PS/2 ports are dedicated interfaces, and can be given Amiga-like control capabilities. To do the same with USB takes a *lot* of glue logic, upping the price.
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downix wrote:
USB == great way to turn that 3Ghz computer into a 200Mhz computer.
I hope you can back that claim up! My 3Ghz machine is not affected by the chain of USB devices and Hubs pluged into it!!
PS/2 ports are dedicated interfaces, and can be given Amiga-like control capabilities. To do the same with USB takes a *lot* of glue logic, upping the price.
but every computer has to have at least USB 1.1 now, since 99% of all equipment uses it, and with good reason.
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bloodline wrote:
downix wrote:
USB == great way to turn that 3Ghz computer into a 200Mhz computer.
I hope you can back that claim up! My 3Ghz machine is not affected by the chain of USB devices and Hubs pluged into it!!
I notice fully well how much my 1.5Ghz Athlon does when using USB peripherals. Under heavy USB 2.0 loads, the Athlon is noticably slower than otherwise. Of course, include an I/O processor and USB's shortcomings vanish. (many motherboards nowadays do include one)
PS/2 ports are dedicated interfaces, and can be given Amiga-like control capabilities. To do the same with USB takes a *lot* of glue logic, upping the price.
but every computer has to have at least USB 1.1 now, since 99% of all equipment uses it, and with good reason.
Noone is saying *not* to have USB. I was presenting the arguement that USB is not necessarily the only way to do the situation.
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And FireWire?
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Firewire works closer to how SCSI does, that is it has its own controller and doesn't need to continuously poll the CPU.
USB more like IDE without ATA, that is the more load on the system, the more work on the CPU.
That's why top-end Intel machines (and several machines from other vendors) have been including low-end IOP's to handle the load from things like USB.
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So I assume it's too expensive to use as a standard connector for everything outside the computer. (is it actually fast enough to use with a monitor or so?)
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USB isnt slowing things down at all. What are you all talking about? Ever used USB things on a Amiga? No problem at all!
Windows aint the best OS,.. so well. USB is fine and dosent harm your hardware if you unplug something when the system is on.
Regards,
Michal, www.amigaworld.org
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PowerVR chip in the DC was indeed powerful, and the Kyro/Kyro II for the PC are even more powerful. IN all honesty, I loved the Kyro II, tile based rendering is still a VERY good thing. As it only renders polygons which you see on the screen, instead of every polygon at one time.
Dreamcast games in it's later life were just as good as todays games on PS2 and Gamecube are.
Soul Calibur Year: 1999
(http://dcmedia.ign.com/media/previews/image/soulcaliburimages/bg13.jpg)
(http://dcmedia.ign.com/media/previews/image/soulcaliburimages/bg12.jpg)
(http://dcmedia.ign.com/media/previews/image/soulcal/bg30.jpg)
Headhunter Year: 2001
(http://dcmedia.ign.com/media/previews/image/headhunter/bg55.jpg)
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(http://www.planetdreamcast.com/games/reviews/skiesofarcadia/skies_3b.jpg)
Screen of Skies Of Arcardia for Dreamcast
Yes indeed. Dreamcast is powerfull thanks to its PowerVR chip. A Amiga with it, would blow lots of minds. With 512MB DDR RAM and 600MHz G3 PPC cpu and AmigaOS4. This Amiga 6000 could be "the" ultimate entertaining computer.
I will update everyone on how it all goes with this project.
Regards,
Michal, www.amigaworld.org
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Headhunter :-)
That game sure does bring back some fantastic memories
I really miss my Dreamcast
THIS AMIGA 6000 PROJECT SHOULD TAKE OFF!!
If I had a few millions I'd put one of them into getting an Amiga 6000 with custom chips into existence without a doubt :-)
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AmiDelf you should make a site for the A6000 project
I would love to help you out on such a project like on the site and stuff.
I like the idea of an Amiga 6000 with custom chips :-)
Skies of Arcadia, now there's a classic :-)
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Ah the Dreamcast! Probably the greatest tragedy of video gaming. Why didn't this machine do better? It was much easier to program than, say, the PS2. Even though the DC was the less powerful, it was still good enough. Quake 3 was awesome. Has anyone tried any emulators for the Dreamcast, what are they like. Unfortunately, i didn't get chance to, my one broke, due to the "crashing problem". Did anyone else get this problem with their Dreamcast?
Cheers,
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AmiDelf wrote:
Yes indeed. Dreamcast is powerfull thanks to its PowerVR chip. A Amiga with it, would blow lots of minds. With 512MB DDR RAM and 600MHz G3 PPC cpu and AmigaOS4. This Amiga 6000 could be "the" ultimate entertaining computer.
I will update everyone on how it all goes with this project.
Regards,
Michal, www.amigaworld.org
Why did you choose the PPC?
Why did you choose the PPC?
Why did you choose the PPC?
Why did you choose the PPC?
Why did you choose the PPC?
Why did you choose the PPC?
Why did you choose the PPC?
Why did you choose the PPC?
Why did you choose the PPC?
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@AmiDelf:
If you want to be able to finish this project in a reasonable time, I suggest that you choose the following route:
1. Buy an AmigaOne/PegasosI/PegasosII.
2. Buy a KyroI/KyroII graphics card.
3. Sign the appropriate NDAs to get the AmigaOS4/MorphOS SDK and the Kyro developer documentation.
3. Write a 2D/3D driver for the KyroI/KyroII graphics card.
When you have completed these steps you will have both hardware and software matching the specs of your project very well.
/Patrik
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@ CU_Amiga
Has anyone tried any emulators for the Dreamcast, what are they like. Unfortunately, i didn't get chance to, my one broke, due to the "crashing problem". Did anyone else get this problem with their Dreamcast?
I still play my DC, what a great console. I've had more fun with half-life on the DC than most any other game/platform. I think the PowerVR/Kyro could be a great choice. I've used an Atari 800 emulator to play one of my other classic favorites on the DC..... MULE.
Now that's retro. I've also run the Atari 2600 and Super Nintendo emulators, tons of fun.
Have you checked to see that the cooling fan is spinning well and doing it's job? A DC will shut down or reboot if it gets to hot. If your fan isn't working properly, pop it open clean, replace and/or oil that old fan and see if that help.
Plaz
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Why did you choose the PPC?
Why did you choose the PPC?
Why did you choose the PPC?
Why did you choose the PPC?
I, I, I, Th - Th - Think (damn, it's catching...)
I think they don't have much of a choice.
AROS may run on x86 but on PPC they also have the choice of MorphOS and AOS 4.
Also x86 being so big also has a big disadvantage for a project like this, This will be done in very small numbers unless they find someone with pots of money to help out. If they have a support question that needs answering where do you think AMD or Intel are going to put it in thier list of priorities?
PPC is sold into embedded markets and this ranges from millions of units down to hundreds (handled by resellers), you're more likely to get better support from someone who already deals in small numbers.
Also PPC is much lower power so is a much better bet for something portable. In this respect Kyro II is a good deal as it has just been licensed for Phones chipsets by Samsung.
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The info for you:
Name: Amiga 6000 (final first goal!)
CPU: PPC G3 600MHz
GFX chipset: PowerVR 2 or 3??
SOUND: Zorro3 soundcard boundled
PORTS: 2x STANDARD Amiga connectors, 4x USB 2.0 for Amiga keyboard USB and more
SLOTS: 1x AGP, 3x PCI, 4x Zorro 3
MEM: 2x DDR-RAM slots
Our first ever prototype name will be Amiga 5200. This will be our prototype 1. Created and being tested. If there is any interest, this one could also be produced for people wanting it. First this prototype needs to work.
I've got a interesting company wich is indeed interested in developing and creating this new PPC motherboard, but I need them to send me papers that they are willing to do so. When I get them, I can announce that.
This is a Amiga created with Amiga community tougether. Its aim is to give Amiga people what they allways wanted.
One have to start somewhere and the beginning is indeed good, when companies shows interest in this project.
More to come,..
Regards,
Michal, www.amigaworld.org
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Darn, these screenshots of the Dreamcasts makes me wanting one.
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AmiDelf wrote:
The info for you:
Name: Amiga 6000 (final first goal!)
CPU: PPC G3 600MHz
Why such a low aim ? Why not G4/5 or atleast one of the newer G3s
(which should be just as "easy" to get as the 600MHz models).
GFX chipset: PowerVR 2 or 3??
And how do you plan to get these ? And why not something a tad more modern ?
SOUND: Zorro3 soundcard boundled
Zorro3 is buggy, slow and expensive (both on mobo and card). And that could
actually be quote from Dave Haynie ....
Having Zorro may be nice, but please please only for legacy use.
PORTS: 2x STANDARD Amiga connectors,
You mean 9-pin joystick-ports ? Noone builds anything new for these, and if someone
really needs them he can build an adapter easily.
On the other side, if it only costs a few dimes ...
4x USB 2.0 for Amiga keyboard USB and more
SLOTS: 1x AGP, 3x PCI, 4x Zorro 3
Which means it will ge beyound ATX, and big-towers have been out of fashion for
years (and may I say "god riddance".
MEM: 2x DDR-RAM slots
But what I'm still missing here, is what you are targeting.
a) Something like the C=One, a cool toy for some (few) freaks, that everybody knows
will be completly outdated.
b) Something that is good enough to bring the Amiga back into normal stores.
a) means it gonna be a complete hobby-project, and you will find no big company
supporting you (beyond selling you some chips). You would have to work very very
hard to even get the basics working, and even a optimstic view would put this in an
>2 years timeframe.
b) means you would need atleast a multi-million $ budget, and good contacts.
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(http://www.amigaworld.org/project/Projectlayout1.jpg)
This illustration is showing what I am thinking. I know that I alone would never ever create such computer or prototype at all. I am not a engineering expert, but I do know how well Dreamcast works, and I do know about PPC, PowerVR ++. The decision to go for PowerVR instead of Emotion Engine is done by you, The decision to go for PPC instead of ColdFire is done by you.
The goal her is to get the community wich is "interested" involved.
Regards,
Michal, www.amigaworld.org
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minator wrote:
Why did you choose the PPC?
Why did you choose the PPC?
Why did you choose the PPC?
Why did you choose the PPC?
I, I, I, Th - Th - Think (damn, it's catching...)
I think they don't have much of a choice.
AROS may run on x86 but on PPC they also have the choice of MorphOS and AOS 4.
Also x86 being so big also has a big disadvantage for a project like this, This will be done in very small numbers unless they find someone with pots of money to help out. If they have a support question that needs answering where do you think AMD or Intel are going to put it in thier list of priorities?
PPC is sold into embedded markets and this ranges from millions of units down to hundreds (handled by resellers), you're more likely to get better support from someone who already deals in small numbers.
Also PPC is much lower power so is a much better bet for something portable. In this respect Kyro II is a good deal as it has just been licensed for Phones chipsets by Samsung.
Who said anything about x86? :-)
I just don't get the point of a THIRD PPC mobo... we have two already! Why doesn't Amidelf dream something more interesting. :-?
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I think some of you need to realise that the aim of this project is to build a new AMIGA computer.
First of all ask yourselves what is the hardware best known for the AMIGA computer? It is a machine using custom chips based on Motorola 68k series processors.
That was years ago you might say.
Well ask yourselves what is the next natural step up from the 68k family? It is the PPC range of processors.
So just like AAA was going to be the next step up from AGA, the Amiga 6000 will be next proper step up from the Amiga 4000, equipped with the next natural processor; the PPC.
I don't see why the PPC should be a 600MHz G3.
For starters, when you are involved with the Apple Community like me, you realise that Amiga is still a fair bit behind, even with the likes of AmigaOne.
With the G5 now released, the G3 only has a short bit of life ahead of it before G4 is the new low end processor and G5 for everything else. I think some sort of G4 would be a good low end spec, say for example, an 800MHz G4? Maybe 1GHz.. as it will take time for it to be made and released, by which time a 600MHz G3 will be an antique near enough.
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A realistic idea would be to have a Pegasos II mobo and stuff, with 2 USB(2) joysticks, newest PowerVR video card (with drivers), DC emulator (optionally, automatically detects DC gd-roms) automatically booted, DVD-rom drive with GD-rom capability, all this put in a gameconsole case and et voila: you got your gameconsole! Let's say, the DC2 (would Sega be interested in this?)
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HopperJF wrote:
I think some of you need to realise that the aim of this project is to build a new AMIGA computer.
First of all ask yourselves what is the hardware best known for the AMIGA computer? It is a machine using custom chips based on Motorola 68k series processors.
That was years ago you might say.
Well ask yourselves what is the next natural step up from the 68k family? It is the PPC range of processors.
So just like AAA was going to be the next step up from AGA, the Amiga 6000 will be next proper step up from the Amiga 4000, equipped with the next natural processor; the PPC.
I don't see why the PPC should be a 600MHz G3.
For starters, when you are involved with the Apple Community like me, you realise that Amiga is still a fair bit behind, even with the likes of AmigaOne.
With the G5 now released, the G3 only has a short bit of life ahead of it before G4 is the new low end processor and G5 for everything else. I think some sort of G4 would be a good low end spec, say for example, an 800MHz G4? Maybe 1GHz.. as it will take time for it to be made and released, by which time a 600MHz G3 will be an antique near enough.
You don't know your history... The Natural Step from the 68k is the HP PA_RISC, That CPU was going to become the next Amiga.
So if you really wanted to "Follow The Amiga Spirit" then you would have to use an Itanic CPU...
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The reason for choosing G3 now,is because its the cheapest choice. Start with simple, then if people like it, go on.
Offcourse when this Amiga (if ever) getting released. It will be in 2-3 years time. Then G3 will be outdated, but if it would be possible to come up with a G3 prototype that works arround Christmas time this year. Would be nice,.. and it would be even better if the final version of AmigaOS4 would be out then as well.
Regards,
Michal, www.amigaworld.org
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ACE wrote:
What would be great is a new Amiga based on a PDA version of the PowerVR. I've been 'researching' the idea of a pda Amiga; running UAE on a established PDA. Using a Dragonball CPU which is based on a 68000 anyway. But the custom chips are too hard to emulate and it would require alot more than a 66MHz (Currently the fastest 68k based Dragonball) to emulate OCS let alone AGA.
So you want to shrink advanced graphical hardware to the point you can use it on your PDA? For some reason, I find the idea of playing Unreal Tournament 2003, or Halflife, or on a little screen the size of two or three stamps far from appealing.
And if the idea is to create an Amiga-like PDA, you can buy AmigaDE, write an 'engine' for your favourite PDA, and develop games for such a combination. AmigaDE was created for exactly that purpose.
Perhaps I'm missing something very obvious here, but so far I'm at a complete loss as to why anyone would want a 'PDA version of the PowerVR'.
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AmiDelf wrote:
The reason for choosing G3 now,is because its the cheapest choice. Start with simple, then if people like it, go on.
Offcourse when this Amiga (if ever) getting released. It will be in 2-3 years time. Then G3 will be outdated, but if it would be possible to come up with a G3 prototype that works arround Christmas time this year. Would be nice,.. and it would be even better if the final version of AmigaOS4 would be out then as well.
Regards,
Michal, www.amigaworld.org
I really don't get this at all!!! IF you HAVE to go with the PPC (for some reason), then just use a PegII or an A1... don't bother reinventing the wheel for a fouth time!! Just stick a KryoII GFX card in one of those and you have your new machine!!!!!
Spend your time making a PCI-ZorroII/III bridge instead.
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AmiDelf wrote:
Name: Amiga 6000 (final first goal!)
Perhaps I missed it in the heat of this and the previous discussion, but what exactly were you trying to achieve by creating this 'custom' Amiga? What feeling is it supposed to convene? Why is a normal PC, or better yet an A1 or a Peg (I or II) with Kyro-card not good enough?
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Just stick a KryoII GFX card in one of those and you have your new machine!!!!!
Hm.. Guess he's thinking about putting the Kryo onboard, but then why not go for the MicroA1..
As for Z3, really why ? Everybody is moving away from Zorro to PCI... Up the price of your Amiga6k by putting an expensive Z3 soundcard in it ?? Maybe just a video slot as an optional extra.. Somebody might be able to get the toaster working..
If you really want to make something special, then indeed, do that, but what you're doing now isn't making much sense as it's just an A1/Peg with a standard GFX card included and expensive expansion option hardly anybody, if any at all is going to use.
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Hi Plaz
Plaz wrote:
@ CU_Amiga
Has anyone tried any emulators for the Dreamcast, what are they like. Unfortunately, i didn't get chance to, my one broke, due to the "crashing problem". Did anyone else get this problem with their Dreamcast?
I still play my DC, what a great console. I've had more fun with half-life on the DC than most any other game/platform. I think the PowerVR/Kyro could be a great choice. I've used an Atari 800 emulator to play one of my other classic favorites on the DC..... MULE.
Now that's retro. I've also run the Atari 2600 and Super Nintendo emulators, tons of fun.
Have you checked to see that the cooling fan is spinning well and doing it's job? A DC will shut down or reboot if it gets to hot. If your fan isn't working properly, pop it open clean, replace and/or oil that old fan and see if that help.
Plaz
I heard abour Half Life for Dreamcast, but never even knew it got released. Unfortunately, i got rid of my Dreamcast, as i couldn't solve the problem. Apparently, it was a common problem with the first batch of Dreamcasts (which was what i had).
You could fix it (but not permanantly) buy bending 6 prongs on the DC mobo forward so they would have better contact with the PSU psb thingy (i think, it was a long time since i done it). It would also do no harm in cleaning the prongs with a bit of WD40.
Running emulators on the DC is something i have always wanted to do but never got round to it. Having said that you can get DC now for around £20! :-) Also DC still seem to be selling well in Japan, outselling the xbox even. DC games still make the Japanese top 10 charts and Sega have started to make games again (Puyo Pop). Also classic games such as King Of Fighters 2003/03 are out on DC as well. Maybe the DC isn't dead yet! :-)
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Maybe this new Amiga could have Dreamcast game compatibility. More on this project will come :)
Regards,
Michal, www.amigaworld.org
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AmiDelf wrote:
Maybe this new Amiga could have Dreamcast game compatibility. More on this project will come :)
Regards,
Michal, www.amigaworld.org
Then why not port AROS to the Dream Cast... bingo your new amiga...