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Amiga computer related discussion => Amiga Marketplace => Topic started by: Cosmos Amiga on December 19, 2012, 03:27:48 PM

Title: For sale : Subway clockport USB
Post by: Cosmos Amiga on December 19, 2012, 03:27:48 PM
For sale this Subway for A1200 with :

- original manual
- two USB connectors
- CDRom with the Poseidon update
- a 8 Gb USB key Hewlett Packard


Working pretty well : Sold !






:-)
Title: Re: For sale : Subway clockport USB
Post by: Bamiga2002 on December 19, 2012, 03:46:23 PM
Is the first number in the price a typo? ;)

Anyway isn't the USB stack interfering with WHDLoad if one intends to play WHDLoad games on the usb stick?
Title: Re: For sale : Subway clockport USB
Post by: Cosmos Amiga on December 19, 2012, 03:52:29 PM
Quote from: Bamiga2002;719683
Anyway isn't the USB stack interfering with WHDLoad if one intends to play WHDLoad games on the usb stick?


I'll check tomorrow with making the video !
Title: Re: For sale : Subway clockport USB
Post by: AmigaClassicRule on December 19, 2012, 04:47:40 PM
Quote from: Cosmos;719684
I'll check tomorrow with making the video !

 
Shouldn't the price be more than 190? After all this is no more manufactured and it is going to be very RARE item which is already is.
Title: Re: For sale : Subway clockport USB
Post by: Bamiga2002 on December 19, 2012, 04:53:22 PM
Now don't start! I bought mine NEW for something over 90€.
Greed is a disease, don't spread it... :hammer:
Title: Re: For sale : Subway clockport USB
Post by: AmigaClassicRule on December 19, 2012, 05:02:12 PM
Quote from: Bamiga2002;719689
Now don't start! I bought mine NEW for something over 90€.
Greed is a disease, don't spread it... :hammer:

But it is true though isn't it? I mean if there is a handful amount of item left and there is a huge or great demand and no one is making them anymore...the price will go up. It is a fact, not greed.
 
This product will NO LONGER be made and when I bought mine from AmigaKit, the NEXT FOLLOWING day it was announced it is no longer going to be made. So I completely saved my skin AND LET ME TELL YOU having a USB for classic Amiga (Amiga 1200) IS AWEEEESOOMME!!
 
I mean at least he should sell it for 250 for now....in the future as time pass by it will go higher for sure.
Title: Re: For sale : Subway clockport USB
Post by: dannyp1 on December 19, 2012, 07:38:21 PM
If it is a fact why doesn't it hold true for other Amiga items?  A4000T's, A3000T's, A4000's, Cyberstorms, ppc, etc. etc. etc.   None of these things sell for what they cost new.  The list goes on and on and on.  The Subway is not rare.
Title: Re: For sale : Subway clockport USB
Post by: AmigaClassicRule on December 19, 2012, 08:57:57 PM
Quote from: dannyp1;719711
If it is a fact why doesn't it hold true for other Amiga items? A4000T's, A3000T's, A4000's, Cyberstorms, ppc, etc. etc. etc. None of these things sell for what they cost new. The list goes on and on and on. The Subway is not rare.

Well because those Amiga's you mentioned you can easily get a PCI USB card and hook it in your PCI slot or zorro. Those are easy to get by, but A1200 you need custom to hook into the clockport, unless you wish to spend a fortune expanding your A1200 to a tower with all the bottlenecks up to finally getting a PCI upgrade to finally get PCI USB.
Title: Re: For sale : Subway clockport USB
Post by: Lurch on December 19, 2012, 10:46:43 PM
TBH mentioning rare, vintage and other BS words is what's wrong with the Amiga world.

Good for the seller, especially bogus auctions on ebay. However at the end of the day it's up to the seller what he wants to sell it for.
Title: Re: For sale : Subway clockport USB
Post by: magnetic on December 19, 2012, 11:41:57 PM
Quote from: dannyp1;719711
 The Subway is not rare.


Umm yes it is quite rare and in demand. Why is this another thread with people complaining about rare amiga hardware prices. Its quite damn simple. NO SUPPLY HIGH DEMAND = HIGH PRICE. I paid $200 us for mine 6 months ago and thought it was a deal!
Title: Re: For sale : Subway clockport USB
Post by: Gazbonk on December 19, 2012, 11:58:46 PM
Just to rub it in I got two of them but have not installed into my Amigas yet.

Think I paid about £70 / £80 brand new & they are not for sale.

PS - Good luck with the sale.
Title: Re: For sale : Subway clockport USB
Post by: AmigaClassicRule on December 20, 2012, 12:37:11 AM
Quote from: Gazbonk;719743
Just to rub it in I got two of them but have not installed into my Amigas yet.
 
Think I paid about £70 / £80 brand new & they are not for sale.
 
PS - Good luck with the sale.

Is it me or did you just rubbed it in?
Title: Re: For sale : Subway clockport USB
Post by: LoadWB on December 20, 2012, 12:42:51 AM
Quote from: lurch;719731
however at the end of the day it's up to the [strike]seller[/strike] buyer what he wants to [strike]sell[/strike] buy it for.


ftfy
Title: Re: For sale : Subway clockport USB
Post by: Lurch on December 20, 2012, 06:20:32 AM
@LoadWB True, the seller can put whatever price but who's buying?
Title: Re: For sale : Subway clockport USB
Post by: danbeaver on December 20, 2012, 01:29:53 PM
Seems like the posts ought to be "Interested" or "I'll pass" in the Marketplace section.
Title: Re: For sale : Subway clockport USB
Post by: Akiko on December 20, 2012, 03:14:29 PM
The price is reasonable, surprised it is not sold already.  If it is still available when I next get paid on the 2nd January please consider me interested.



Quote from: AmigaClassicRule;719746
Is it me or did you just rubbed it in?


Don't worry when Jens eventually gets around to making a replacement, Subway's will be at those prices again ;)
Title: Re: For sale : Subway clockport USB
Post by: danbeaver on December 20, 2012, 03:54:50 PM
And remember, Vesalia had a bunch of new ones in last month, which did sell out in one week; but you never know.  Maybe the Thylacine remakes will be in a clockport version?
Title: Re: For sale : Subway clockport USB
Post by: Musicman on December 20, 2012, 05:00:06 PM
Will it work on a B2000?
Title: Re: For sale : Subway clockport USB
Post by: Darrin on December 20, 2012, 07:52:56 PM
Quote from: Musicman;719803
Will it work on a B2000?


2 issues:

#1:  B2000 has no clockport (unless you have a Zorro card like the Buddha IDE controller that adds one).
#2:  The USB stack requires a 68020 or greater, so you'll need a CPU card.  However, there is another USB stack that will work on a 68000, but is extremely limited in terms of speed and drivers.
Title: Re: For sale : Subway clockport USB
Post by: AmigaClassicRule on December 20, 2012, 08:47:50 PM
Quote from: Darrin;719817
2 issues:
 
#1: B2000 has no clockport (unless you have a Zorro card like the Buddha IDE controller that adds one).
#2: The USB stack requires a 68020 or greater, so you'll need a CPU card. However, there is another USB stack that will work on a 68000, but is extremely limited in terms of speed and drivers.

Hehehhehe....the thought of an Amiga 500 getting a USB port gets me all tickly from the inside :D :D :D Why am I in love with the Amiga is beyond me...but I am in love with it!!
 
This is one computer where LEGO is an understatement...lol
Title: Re: For sale : Subway clockport USB
Post by: Blinx123 on December 20, 2012, 10:03:05 PM
Talking about rarity.

Both, the Blizzard SCSI Kit IV and Micronik Z3i are considered pretty rare. Yet both are sold for considerably less than what is being asked here for this not at all too rare Subway USB.

Anyways. Perhaps it's time to think about a new set of rules for the marketplace. Something similar to what Amibay does (e. g. "don't ask, don't tell"), but solely restricted to the marketplace.
Title: Re: For sale : Subway clockport USB
Post by: psxphill on December 20, 2012, 10:15:05 PM
Quote from: AmigaClassicRule;719826
Hehehhehe....the thought of an Amiga 500 getting a USB port gets me all tickly from the inside :D :D :D Why am I in love with the Amiga is beyond me...but I am in love with it!!

If you're in love with the Amiga, then USB is not relevant. We didn't need it in 1986, why should we need it now?
Title: Re: For sale : Subway clockport USB
Post by: Methuselas on December 20, 2012, 10:33:47 PM
You know, that's one thing I just don't get. Why would you end production on the subway, when it's a popular and a still asked for product? Sometimes, amigaland is frakking stupid..... *shakes head*
Title: Re: For sale : Subway clockport USB
Post by: Blinx123 on December 20, 2012, 10:46:11 PM
Quote from: psxphill;719833
If you're in love with the Amiga, then USB is not relevant. We didn't need it in 1986, why should we need it now?


More like: If you love the Amiga, spare it from the unnecessary overhead.

But seriously. What do people need USB for their Amigas these days? Mouse and keyboard are better plugged in using PS/2. Printers and external HDDs are also kind of useless, if you don't have like hundreds of gigabytes of content and are restricted to a really slow internet connection or don't have a spare CF.
Title: Re: For sale : Subway clockport USB
Post by: Musicman on December 20, 2012, 10:48:59 PM
Quote from: Darrin;719817
2 issues:

#1:  B2000 has no clockport (unless you have a Zorro card like the Buddha IDE controller that adds one).
#2:  The USB stack requires a 68020 or greater, so you'll need a CPU card.  However, there is another USB stack that will work on a 68000, but is extremely limited in terms of speed and drivers.

Thanks for answering, I was not sure if anyone answers 2000 questions... I have a Fusion Forty card which, I think, would have a 68040 on it.
As for a Buddha IDE controller, if available, would it run without a Bridgeboard?
Last but not least, this is really trying to figure how to download using my PC and getting it to Amiga. don't have modem on Amiga nor a CD drive. Also no 3.5 on PC! I guess I would like to go to 3.9 from 3.1
Thanks again
Title: Re: For sale : Subway clockport USB
Post by: AmigaClassicRule on December 21, 2012, 12:20:08 AM
Quote from: Blinx123;719839
More like: If you love the Amiga, spare it from the unnecessary overhead.
 
But seriously. What do people need USB for their Amigas these days? Mouse and keyboard are better plugged in using PS/2. Printers and external HDDs are also kind of useless, if you don't have like hundreds of gigabytes of content and are restricted to a really slow internet connection or don't have a spare CF.

To me it is the BEST feature ever and external HD for me is not useless but super useful. To me using a USB external DVD player is AWESOME and helps me a lot to using CD games where if I was forced to use a VisualCD it would consume big on my HD and memory.
 
I believe I have done the best purchase when I get my USB. In your opinion Blinx it waste of money and useless for others it is a life saver from outdated scsi ports and taking away the PCMCIA for internet connection and all other things that USB could do and free off the PCMCIA port.
 
It all comes down to preference and since the market gives us choices this is what I love. Why I love Amiga so much? Because it is a machine that can be customized to the liking of the user and not limited like C64 hardware or Apple II hardware. I do not have to love it by being loyal to the 1986 usage...either.
Title: Re: For sale : Subway clockport USB
Post by: ChaosLord on December 21, 2012, 12:39:17 AM
@AmigaClassicRule

As long as you understand that USB wastes (notice I said "wastes" not "uses") horrendously huge amounts of cpu power to transfer data.  It will completely drag down your cpu.

That is just the way USB is designed.  They needed an excuse to force ppl to buy 3000 Mhz cpus so they invented a way to waste as much cpu power per bit as possible.

USB even drains your CPU power while the device is doing nothing.

Merely having any USB device connected is enough to start continuously draining your cpu power.

If you are still using a 50Mhz 030 u r in for a severe shock.
Title: Re: For sale : Subway clockport USB
Post by: AmigaClassicRule on December 21, 2012, 12:58:55 AM
Quote from: ChaosLord;719852
@AmigaClassicRule
 
As long as you understand that USB wastes (notice I said "wastes" not "uses") horrendously huge amounts of cpu power to transfer data. It will completely drag down your cpu.
 
That is just the way USB is designed. They needed an excuse to force ppl to buy 3000 Mhz cpus so they invented a way to waste as much cpu power per bit as possible.
 
USB even drains your CPU power while the device is doing nothing.
 
Merely having any USB device connected is enough to start continuously draining your cpu power.
 
If you are still using a 50Mhz 030 u r in for a severe shock.

:D The good news I only use the USB port when I want to transfer something or use the external USB CD to run games on CD. But other than that when I do not need to use the port all devices are removed from it.
Title: Re: For sale : Subway clockport USB
Post by: Blinx123 on December 21, 2012, 01:16:15 AM
Quote from: AmigaClassicRule;719855
:D The good news I only use the USB port when I want to transfer something or use the external USB CD to run games on CD. But other than that when I do not need to use the port all devices are removed from it.

Good luck with that one.

As ChaosLord said, it really produces a tremendous amount of overhead.
I don't think they made it purposely so, btw. The sad truth is that 9 out of 10 hardware/software engineers are vastly incompetent. Been that way ever since computers went past the 1GHz barrier (perhaps even a bit earlier)

Lastly. Your statement about the C64 made me choke a little.
The C64 is incredibly versatile. More so with the current wave of new hardware (can you say Chameleon?)
Title: Re: For sale : Subway clockport USB
Post by: AmigaClassicRule on December 21, 2012, 02:41:36 AM
Quote from: Blinx123;719856
Good luck with that one.
 
As ChaosLord said, it really produces a tremendous amount of overhead.
I don't think they made it purposely so, btw. The sad truth is that 9 out of 10 hardware/software engineers are vastly incompetent. Been that way ever since computers went past the 1GHz barrier (perhaps even a bit earlier)
 
Lastly. Your statement about the C64 made me choke a little.
The C64 is incredibly versatile. More so with the current wave of new hardware (can you say Chameleon?)

 
Chameleon is only one major hardware upgrade and as I am aware of it, it is simply another means of replacing the original disk drive, making transfer of games easier to it and being a stand alone commodore 64.
 
However, major and many different hardware upgrades such as increase of RAM, provide upgrade to the sound and graphics and other upgrades are not as versatile as the Amiga is. Maybe there is no need for it in C64 as there will be no software ever developed for it...but then again it lacks in many hardware upgrade as Amiga does. With classic Amiga if I wish to enjoy using it for more than what Commodore Inc Intended for...I have this option and there is benefit in return because I can enjoy the media of it more than say C64. If I wanted to watch movies in C64 for example I cannot and will never be able to...and if classic Amiga cannot provide that to me (with your argument) at least there is a PPC version of it such as AmigaOS 4 for example, MorphOS or even AROS...heck even WinUAE.
 
But then again you guys are working hard to convince me otherwise, why? This is all just my opinion on the matter and I love hearing your counter opinion which is what you are doing and I appreciate your input on it:). But this is just what I think on the matter and nothing else.
 
Perhaps USB on classic Amiga is slow, but maybe I can get something out of it on a 68060 at least.
Title: Re: For sale : Subway clockport USB
Post by: danbeaver on December 21, 2012, 05:15:24 AM
Yes you can use USB on a stock A2000 using the PD stack, you can add a ZII Clockport for 50 something. There are Clockport adapters on Amigakit. You can wait for an inexpensive Thylacine card or buy one that pops up so often. The Subway is really meant for the A1200.  There are Algor and Highway cards out there. The Deneb is pure genius.

As to the need or usefulness of USB on an Amiga, you will always hear the squeaky wheel; nothing is ever right with them, they will complain about anything and everything to appear smart or clever.
Title: Re: For sale : Subway clockport USB
Post by: Lurch on December 21, 2012, 05:35:28 AM
In the new year will be looking at subway usb, but will be looking at selling/swapping my indi ecs
Title: Re: For sale : Subway clockport USB
Post by: Bamiga2002 on December 21, 2012, 06:15:51 AM
Quote from: Blinx123;719831
...
Anyways. Perhaps it's time to think about a new set of rules for the marketplace. Something similar to what Amibay does (e. g. "don't ask, don't tell"), but solely restricted to the marketplace.
NO! Don't copy Amibay marketplace rules, there you can't rant about prices like you can here :D. It's just discussion you know. And I like the "Freedom of speech" statement :)
Title: Re: For sale : Subway clockport USB
Post by: Bamiga2002 on December 21, 2012, 06:23:02 AM
Quote from: AmigaClassicRule;719692
But it is true though isn't it? I mean if there is a handful amount of item left and there is a huge or great demand and no one is making them anymore...the price will go up. It is a fact, not greed.
The price will go up ONLY if the seller(s) decide to PUT them up. Simple isn't it? But we all do have a different perspection on these matters. But it's always interesting to debate and rant about them!
Title: Re: For sale : Subway clockport USB
Post by: som99 on December 21, 2012, 06:43:34 AM
I would buy, but my wife would kill me if I buy around Xmas :/ Good luck getting it sold, wont be hard for that price :)
Title: Re: For sale : Subway clockport USB
Post by: Bamiga2002 on December 21, 2012, 06:53:43 AM
You swedes just can't handle your wives can you? :razz:
Title: Re: For sale : Subway clockport USB
Post by: som99 on December 21, 2012, 07:10:55 AM
Quote from: Bamiga2002;719872
You swedes just can't handle your wives can you? :razz:

Haha ;) I am lucky enough to have a good one who understands my computer interest, but we have had a quite big chunk of recent expenses, married 3 months ago, honeymoon 3 weeks ago and I spent a lot on PC parts recently. So I'll take it easy until Xmas is over at least :)
Title: Re: For sale : Subway clockport USB
Post by: Gilloo on December 21, 2012, 10:04:43 AM
Quote from: Darrin;719817
2 issues:

#1:  B2000 has no clockport (unless you have a Zorro card like the Buddha IDE controller that adds one).
#2:  The USB stack requires a 68020 or greater, so you'll need a CPU card.  However, there is another USB stack that will work on a 68000, but is extremely limited in terms of speed and drivers.

I agree with the limitation in term of speed, but not agree for the numbers of drivers: ANAIIS is nearly 95% compatible with the Sirion API. So if a driver exists for AmigaOS4.x, it can be used with ANAIIS... if you compile it for 3.x. ANAIIS is able to manage hubs, mouse, keyboard, HID (joysticks, keyboards with special keys, mouse with extra buttons), printers, camera (not webcam, but outdated things for taking still pictures), massstorage, iPhone and iPad. What else ?
Title: Re: For sale : Subway clockport USB
Post by: Blinx123 on December 21, 2012, 12:00:10 PM
Quote from: som99;719874
Haha ;) I am lucky enough to have a good one who understands my computer interest, but we have had a quite big chunk of recent expenses, married 3 months ago, honeymoon 3 weeks ago and I spent a lot on PC parts recently. So I'll take it easy until Xmas is over at least :)


My condolences ;)
Title: Re: For sale : Subway clockport USB
Post by: danbeaver on December 21, 2012, 02:28:04 PM
Quote from: Bamiga2002;719868
NO! Don't copy Amibay marketplace rules, there you can't rant about prices like you can here :D. It's just discussion you know. And I like the "Freedom of speech" statement :)


There are plenty of forums for discussion of prices, general negativity, and other observations. You can not sell an item being "trolled to death" by others. Let the seller and buyer use this forum for Selling and Buying ;)
Title: Re: For sale : Subway clockport USB
Post by: Cosmos Amiga on December 21, 2012, 02:32:05 PM
Still for sale !

The video : http://youtu.be/Xmrt-kVqCc8






:)
Title: Re: For sale : Subway clockport USB
Post by: Bamiga2002 on December 21, 2012, 02:50:15 PM
Cool, so it works after all! :)
Title: Re: For sale : Subway clockport USB
Post by: Akiko on December 21, 2012, 02:55:27 PM
Quote from: Bamiga2002;719892
Cool, so it works after all! :)


Yep, I read somewhere recently that the latest Whdload no longer conflicts with the Poseidon stack. :)
Title: Re: For sale : Subway clockport USB
Post by: Lurch on December 21, 2012, 06:35:46 PM
Quote from: Cosmos;719890
Still for sale !

The video : http://youtu.be/Xmrt-kVqCc8






:)


What spec 1200 are you using Cosmos?
Title: Re: For sale : Subway clockport USB
Post by: Cosmos Amiga on December 21, 2012, 07:03:48 PM
Blizzard IV 68030@50
Title: Re: For sale : Subway clockport USB
Post by: paul1981 on December 21, 2012, 07:12:27 PM
Quote from: AmigaClassicRule;719860
If I wanted to watch movies in C64 for example I cannot and will never be able to...

You can watch Dallas!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IXLv7UosQXs
Title: Re: For sale : Subway clockport USB
Post by: AmigaClassicRule on December 21, 2012, 07:28:35 PM
Quote from: paul1981;719910
You can watch Dallas!
 
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IXLv7UosQXs

Speechless...
Title: Re: For sale : Subway clockport USB
Post by: Blinx123 on December 21, 2012, 07:40:29 PM
Quote from: AmigaClassicRule;719860
Chameleon is only one major hardware upgrade and as I am aware of it, it is simply another means of replacing the original disk drive, making transfer of games easier to it and being a stand alone commodore 64.
 
However, major and many different hardware upgrades such as increase of RAM, provide upgrade to the sound and graphics and other upgrades are not as versatile as the Amiga is. Maybe there is no need for it in C64 as there will be no software ever developed for it...


No offense, but ignorance much?
Amiga users dream of the kind of support the C64 still receives.
There are like 5-10 new games released for it every year and tons of great software.

Quote

but then again it lacks in many hardware upgrade as Amiga does. With classic Amiga if I wish to enjoy using it for more than what Commodore Inc Intended for...I have this option and there is benefit in return because I can enjoy the media of it more than say C64.


The C64 got the SuperCPU, the Chameleon and many more upgrades.

Quote

If I wanted to watch movies in C64 for example I cannot and will never be able to


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QATUjaFYbJ4

It can do video plenty fine.
Audio is were the troubles lie.

 
Quote

Perhaps USB on classic Amiga is slow, but maybe I can get something out of it on a 68060 at least.


It's still performance wasted on luxury.
I dare say you can't play games like Quake or Duke 3D from USB, since the USB protocols produce too much overhead.
Title: Re: For sale : Subway clockport USB
Post by: J-Golden on December 21, 2012, 07:57:34 PM
Quote from: paul1981;719910
You can watch Dallas!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IXLv7UosQXs

Absolutely AMAZING!

I had an Apple IIe growing up.  I bet there are some super cool demos for that!

Lemme see here...  Youtube search...  Checking Results...  YES!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GfTJD8tvxi4
Title: Re: For sale : Subway clockport USB
Post by: platon42 on December 21, 2012, 08:14:34 PM
Quote from: ChaosLord;719852
@AmigaClassicRule

As long as you understand that USB wastes (notice I said "wastes" not "uses") horrendously huge amounts of cpu power to transfer data.  It will completely drag down your cpu.

USB even drains your CPU power while the device is doing nothing.

Merely having any USB device connected is enough to start continuously draining your cpu power.


This is only the case with the Highway/Subway controller chips -- and only for keyboards/mice or other devices that need interrupt transfers. With the Algor and Deneb cards, there's no such drawback -- the more sophisticated controller chips take care of the protocol overhead with no host side interaction.
Title: Re: For sale : Subway clockport USB
Post by: platon42 on December 21, 2012, 08:27:56 PM
Quote from: Blinx123;719919

It's still performance wasted on luxury.
I dare say you can't play games like Quake or Duke 3D from USB, since the USB protocols produce too much overhead.


You can repeat that as much as you like, but it doesn't turn make it any more real. Transferring via Mass Storage Device uses an "overhead" of a 31 byte command packet and a 13 byte status packet PER COMMAND. I.e. if you read 4 MB of data, you have to handle two extra packets out of 8192 bulk data packets. In my calculation that's a protocol overhead of 0,024%.

My Deneb did 8.5 MB/sec reading from MSD devices. That's almost as fast as the internal A4000T SCSI controller. You know what? Most of the time is spent on the data transfer and not on the protocol overhead. Raw bus speed.

Using a Deneb with an USB Ethernet dongle will get you the fastest Ethernet solution available for the Amiga (somebody posted a result of 1.8 MB/sec recently with Roadshow). You will get the cheapest sound card solution with USB Audio.

Oh whatever...
Title: Re: For sale : Subway clockport USB
Post by: AmigaClassicRule on December 21, 2012, 10:50:28 PM
Quote from: Blinx123;719919
No offense, but ignorance much?
Amiga users dream of the kind of support the C64 still receives.
There are like 5-10 new games released for it every year and tons of great software.
 
 
 
The C64 got the SuperCPU, the Chameleon and many more upgrades.
 
 
 
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QATUjaFYbJ4
 
It can do video plenty fine.
Audio is were the troubles lie.
 
 
 
 
It's still performance wasted on luxury.
I dare say you can't play games like Quake or Duke 3D from USB, since the USB protocols produce too much overhead.

Hey do not get me wrong I LOVE COMMODORE 64 to the tea...but you are right I am ignorant on that matter. You couldn't by any chance direct me to the website where new games (5-10) come out to it, could you? I wouldn't mind downloading new stuff for the C64.

Heck if it comes to a lot of new games I wouldn't mind buying the original hardware's again!!
Title: Re: For sale : Subway clockport USB
Post by: Blinx123 on December 22, 2012, 12:05:37 AM
Quote from: AmigaClassicRule;719945
Hey do not get me wrong I LOVE COMMODORE 64 to the tea...but you are right I am ignorant on that matter. You couldn't by any chance direct me to the website where new games (5-10) come out to it, could you? I wouldn't mind downloading new stuff for the C64.

Heck if it comes to a lot of new games I wouldn't mind buying the original hardware's again!!


Well. Most of the new games can't be downloaded for free. They're available for a price. Either as downloads or fully packaged product.

There's a whole host of publishing companies.

Your best bet is to follow this thread.

http://www.lemon64.com/forum/viewforum.php?f=6&sid=933d1f7253778345f866fd8c35bcba04

Names that will commonly appear are RGCD, Protovision,  Psytronik Software, and Flimsoft (although that last one I don't really like, as he's made a huge fuzz about his whole business and created infightings that lasted for a total of two weeks and almost got some of us banned).
Title: Re: For sale : Subway clockport USB
Post by: AmigaClassicRule on December 22, 2012, 01:00:10 AM
Quote from: Blinx123;719949
Well. Most of the new games can't be downloaded for free. They're available for a price. Either as downloads or fully packaged product.
 
There's a whole host of publishing companies.
 
Your best bet is to follow this thread.
 
http://www.lemon64.com/forum/viewforum.php?f=6&sid=933d1f7253778345f866fd8c35bcba04
 
Names that will commonly appear are RGCD, Protovision, Psytronik Software, and Flimsoft (although that last one I don't really like, as he's made a huge fuzz about his whole business and created infightings that lasted for a total of two weeks and almost got some of us banned).

Question! What about Amiga classic? Are there a community out there making 5 to 10 games a year commercial for Amiga classic?
Title: Re: For sale : Subway clockport USB
Post by: Blinx123 on December 22, 2012, 01:23:20 AM
Quote from: AmigaClassicRule;719952
Question! What about Amiga classic? Are there a community out there making 5 to 10 games a year commercial for Amiga classic?

I don't think so.
There used to be, but not anymore.

It's also a lot more work to develop 5-10 Amiga games a year.
C64 games are rather easy to make, once you've figured out ASM. Graphics only take a few hours rather than days. For me, the hardest part was always the audio.

Of course, the Amiga is a lot easier to code for, since there are tools like AMOS, Gamesmith (C/ASM), Amiblitz, AmigaE, TADS, Storm-C and the likes, whearas C64 developers are basically restricted to ASM and BASIC* (there are some nice and easy tools like SEUCK or Game Creator, but none can be really used for a commercial quality title. Although a bunch of people tried just that in the past and ended up selling not quite a lot of copies).

*There are also a bunch of C compilers like CC65 or Power C, but I wouldn't advise their use. 64kb isn't quite a lot of memory.
Title: Re: For sale : Subway clockport USB
Post by: ChaosLord on December 22, 2012, 02:17:46 AM
Quote from: platon42;719930
This is only the case with the Highway/Subway controller chips -- and only for keyboards/mice or other devices that need interrupt transfers. With the Algor and Deneb cards, there's no such drawback -- the more sophisticated controller chips take care of the protocol overhead with no host side interaction.


Woah!  I never knew that!  Thanx for telling me that Chris!

I guess all the negative reports I heard were with Subway and maybe Highway too.

I will be sure in the future to not criticize Algor or Deneb.

So I can buy a Deneb or Algor card and use USB without any drawbacks?!??

I don't know anything about them.  Can I get one for my A1200T or A3000D?

While we are discussing USB, did WHDLoad ever fix the problem where no WHDLoad games would work while your USB stack was running?

What is the status of that problem?  I need to know so I can inform ppl correctly.

p.s. Thanx for coding such awesome USB stacks!
and quadruple thanx for tlsfmem!
Title: Re: For sale : Subway clockport USB
Post by: AmigaClassicRule on December 22, 2012, 02:54:52 AM
Quote from: ChaosLord;719959
Woah! I never knew that! Thanx for telling me that Chris!
 
I guess all the negative reports I heard were with Subway and maybe Highway too.
 
I will be sure in the future to not criticize Algor or Deneb.
 
So I can buy a Deneb or Algor card and use USB without any drawbacks?!??
 
I don't know anything about them. Can I get one for my A1200T or A3000D?
 
While we are discussing USB, did WHDLoad ever fix the problem where no WHDLoad games would work while your USB stack was running?
 
What is the status of that problem? I need to know so I can inform ppl correctly.
 
p.s. Thanx for coding such awesome USB stacks!
and quadruple thanx for tlsfmem!

Do not worry ChaosLord, with the newest version of WHDLoad you can now easily play WHDLOAD game and still use your USB. WHDLoad games will now WORK with USB stack running.
Title: Re: For sale : Subway clockport USB
Post by: danbeaver on December 22, 2012, 03:12:43 AM
Anyone selling a Subway USB?
Title: Re: For sale : Subway clockport USB
Post by: Darrin on December 22, 2012, 03:47:43 AM
Quote from: AmigaClassicRule;719968
Do not worry ChaosLord, with the newest version of WHDLoad you can now easily play WHDLOAD game and still use your USB. WHDLoad games will now WORK with USB stack running.


That's good to know.  I always used to disable it on my A4000 first.  Is this due to WHDLoad being updated and if so, which version?
Title: Re: For sale : Subway clockport USB
Post by: ChaosLord on December 22, 2012, 03:50:13 AM
Quote from: danbeaver;719972
Anyone selling a Subway USB?


Get an Algor or a Deneb.  They don't bog down your cpu and are fast and system friendly.
Title: Re: For sale : Subway clockport USB
Post by: AmigaClassicRule on December 22, 2012, 04:35:10 AM
Quote from: ChaosLord;719974
Get an Algor or a Deneb.  They don't bog down your cpu and are fast and system friendly.


Hehe, that is for Amiga 4000 right? So only Amiga 1200 have this issue?
Title: Re: For sale : Subway clockport USB
Post by: ChaosLord on December 22, 2012, 04:47:56 AM
I went to Amigakit to read up on Algor and Deneb and got this msg:

There is no product that matches the search criteria.


I just can't win. :confused:  :(   :huh:   :cry:
Title: Re: For sale : Subway clockport USB
Post by: Lurch on December 22, 2012, 06:38:01 AM
Quote from: ChaosLord;719974
Get an Algor or a Deneb.  They don't bog down your cpu and are fast and system friendly.


None of those options work with a clockport, unless theres an adapter and it fits in a wedge :-)
Title: Re: For sale : Subway clockport USB
Post by: Cosmos Amiga on December 22, 2012, 06:42:22 AM
Quote from: Blinx123;719957

Of course, the Amiga is a lot easier to code for, since there are tools like AMOS, Gamesmith (C/ASM), Amiblitz, AmigaE, TADS, Storm-C and the likes, whearas C64 developers are basically restricted to ASM and BASIC* (there are some nice and easy tools like SEUCK or Game Creator, but none can be really used for a commercial quality title. Although a bunch of people tried just that in the past and ended up selling not quite a lot of copies)


Amiga Classic need absolutly a GOOD compiler C/C++, bug free and able to create one exe with auto CPU (000 to 060) detection into...
Title: Re: For sale : Subway clockport USB
Post by: Lurch on December 22, 2012, 06:42:23 AM
If there is a USB option I'd swap my indi ECS for it :-)
Title: Re: For sale : Subway clockport USB
Post by: ChaosLord on December 22, 2012, 07:11:44 AM
Quote from: Cosmos;719978
Amiga Classic need absolutly a GOOD compiler C/C++, bug free




SASC is a great C compiler.  So is DICE.

No C++ but C++ suxx0rz the life out of ur CPU.  C++ = bloatware.

If u want C++ "stuff" just use E.  E is massively better.

If you want C then just use SASC or DICE.  SASC Source Level Debugger is lightyears ahead of GCC or VBCC.


Quote
and able to create one exe with auto CPU (000 to 060) detection into...
 There is no need to detect cpu by the C compiler.  What would it do?  Have 10 different exes all compiled into 1 like on Windoze?  Nobody on Amiga wants 5MB exe size for a simple cli command.  

No bloatware on Amiga!
Title: Re: For sale : Subway clockport USB
Post by: danbeaver on December 22, 2012, 08:37:39 AM
In response to my question, "Anybody selling a Subway USB?" The gentle man or gentle woman said,
Quote from: ChaosLord;719974
Get an Algor or a Deneb.  They don't bog down your cpu and are fast and system friendly.

Obviously forgetting that this thread is in the Marketplace section because Cosmos has a Subway USB for sale. Lets not lose sight of the forest for the insane ravings of a lunatic madman.
Title: Re: For sale : Subway clockport USB
Post by: Akiko on December 22, 2012, 10:46:01 AM
Quote from: ChaosLord;719976
I went to Amigakit to read up on Algor and Deneb and got this msg:

There is no product that matches the search criteria.


I just can't win. :confused:  :(   :huh:   :cry:


Here ya go..  Happy Christmas :)

https://amigakit.leamancomputing.com/catalog/product_info.php?products_id=795
Title: Re: For sale : Subway clockport USB
Post by: magnetic on December 22, 2012, 11:14:18 AM
Quote from: platon42;719930
This is only the case with the Highway/Subway controller chips -- and only for keyboards/mice or other devices that need interrupt transfers. With the Algor and Deneb cards, there's no such drawback -- the more sophisticated controller chips take care of the protocol overhead with no host side interaction.



Platon
Thanks for posting, nice to see you still read this board. Good info on the various usb options.
What confuses me is that usb products is one product that is actually commercially viable. There is a worldwide demand for usb hardware for the classic platform. Someone mentioned Thyaciline, is that board being manufactured again?

The Deneb seems like some miracle board for classics as well and is no longer made. Will there ever be a comparable product for amigas?  btw "Deneb" interesting and msytical name. Its starting to dawn on me there is a lot of symbology and ancient world iconagraphy in the amiga world.  Your avatar has esotreric meaning as well. Or am I just up too late?
Title: Re: For sale : Subway clockport USB
Post by: ChaosLord on December 22, 2012, 11:32:23 AM
Quote from: Akiko;719996
Here ya go..  Happy Christmas :)

https://amigakit.leamancomputing.com/catalog/product_info.php?products_id=795


Thanks Akiko!

Seems like it won't work on my A1200.  This card makes me wish I had not given away my A4000.  When I gave it away I could not think of a single card I would ever want to plug into a slot.  I should have just held onto it a few more years.  Oh well....

I could plug it into my A3000 but I would have to upgrade my buster chip and maybe some other chips.  And I would have to ship my A3000 off to have it done.  Would end up costing quite a bit of $$$.  I will think carefully if I should do it.

I never knew anything about the Deneb or the Algor card until right now and I still know nothing of Algor.
Title: Re: For sale : Subway clockport USB
Post by: Bamiga2002 on December 23, 2012, 10:13:08 AM
Just to let you know that not all WHD games work with USB stack. For example Addams Family works, but Batman the Movie does not.
Title: Re: For sale : Subway clockport USB
Post by: utri007 on December 23, 2012, 03:04:09 PM
Seems that there will be new batch of thylacine usb card. Though this is happy thing only for big box amiga users. Price will be 91€
Title: Re: For sale : Subway clockport USB
Post by: ChaosLord on December 23, 2012, 05:52:33 PM
Is Thylacine as good as Deneb?
Title: Re: For sale : Subway clockport USB
Post by: ChaosLord on December 23, 2012, 05:54:17 PM
Quote from: Bamiga2002;720096
Just to let you know that not all WHD games work with USB stack. For example Addams Family works, but Batman the Movie does not.

What is the technical reason why Batman the Movie won't work with a USB stack enabled?

And how did Addams Family start to work but not Batman?
Title: Re: For sale : Subway clockport USB
Post by: Bamiga2002 on December 23, 2012, 06:02:57 PM
I really don't know. Maybe because Batman WHD-slave is older and lacks some functionality that is in Addams Family(?).
Maybe someone who know about WHDLoad and slave coding could shed some light.

edit: bah, Batman slave is infact newer, but still could lack something that prevents USB stack usage at the same time...
Title: Re: For sale : Subway clockport USB
Post by: utri007 on December 23, 2012, 07:16:38 PM
Reason is same why whdload games doesn't work if TCP/IP stack is running, hardware interrups.
Title: Re: For sale : Subway clockport USB
Post by: magnetic on December 26, 2012, 06:26:58 AM
Quote from: utri007;720113
Seems that there will be new batch of thylacine usb card. Though this is happy thing only for big box amiga users. Price will be 91€



Who is it that manufacturing the Thylacine boards again? Also, when and where is it available to purchase?
Title: Re: For sale : Subway clockport USB
Post by: Lurch on December 26, 2012, 07:43:23 AM
Quote from: magnetic;720330
Who is it that manufacturing the Thylacine boards again? Also, when and where is it available to purchase?


http://www.amibay.com/showthread.php?t=38712&highlight=thylacine