Amiga.org
Amiga computer related discussion => General chat about Amiga topics => Topic started by: MiAmigo on September 22, 2012, 12:57:38 AM
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:huh:Is this a sensitive subject, or is it just me?
Last weekend, while exorcising the demons out of one of my A2000s, I accidentally fried some very expensive cards. (Don't want to talk about it!)
IaccidentallyattachedthedatacablebetweenaVarIOandDelfinawrongsending5voltsdirectlytogroundsubsequentlyfryingthecableandpossiblybothcards!
Anyhows, now I'm shopping for a new VarIO and a new Delfina. Both of these cards are expensive, one obscenely more than the other. Even the tiny little cable that goes between them is expensive, that is if you can even find somebody to sell it to you alone, on the outside chance that maybe one of your cards survive the raging inferno! :flame:
Such is the case with most Amiga accessories, unless one shops eBay.
Is this, uh, price gouging? Even essential floppies (like those containing CD filesystems) can cost upwards of $30 - $40. Why?
Is this how we're going to catch up with Bill Gates, Google and Apple?
As for my little mishap: I was tired, it was about 3:00AM, more than 12 hours into that particular session, and anyway, I had had them both for over 8 years, so I was well past due!
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I have to admit, one of the things I've never liked about the Amiga design is that some things CAN be plugged in either way and fried.
It wouldn't have been that hard to key the slot so it can only plug in one way.
Or, worst case and this is the design you have, add some diodes or something to protect the accidental reversal.. ;-(
Either way, good luck..
desiv
(Although it doesn't break anything, I always thought using the same ps2 connector for both mouse and keyboard, but it will only work the right way was dumb. Can't tell you the number of times a "computer isn't working" was just someone had plugged those in backwards!!!)
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I would love to have real amiga hardware again, but everytime I think about it I just think about the endless rabbit hole you go down.
First, you get the amiga, **** now I need a monitor for temp till I get a scandoubler, (1084's are expensive and costly to ship) **** now I need some system discs, hd controller or just hd, cf cards, joysticks, add ons, accellerator, ram, it never ends.
It can get extrememly expensive fast, and seems like it never ends, there is always sometihing you want to add or expand.
Now I just have a 3ghz pc with 4 gigs of ram, a fast video card. It has xp underneath that boots straight to os3.9 and that pc cost like 60 bucks.
You get rtg, can run ANY classic software pretty well. No scandoublers,
no failing flaky hardware. Same pc also multiboots to windows xp, linux
and aros...
Even that, I still want to work on, sometimes I want to customize it with amiga boingball keyboard and mouse and some other stuff, but I haven't
yet... I jokingly call that system my amiga 5000.
I feel bad for people off endlessly searching for hw and paying the ridiculous
prices for it. I don't miss the rabbit hole much...
Now, mostly I spend my time trying to collect every bit of amiga software I
can.... and playing my old favorites on a dedicated system with all my amiga goodness (demos, games, apps) in one place and a familar feeling.
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Amiga goods are priced the way they are for one reason: because sellers know they can be. It's a vicious cycle: reseller acquires an Amiga part, checks the last sold price for it (or gets a valuation from community members,) asks equal or more, leaves it on the shelf until some Amiga user desperate enough comes along to buy it for that price, the next seller to have that part in stock takes notice, asks slightly more than that, and so on...
The hell of it is, you can't just tell Amiga fans to boycott the sellers, because Amiga equipment does wear out and there is no other way to get replacements...oy.
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Amiga goods are priced the way they are for one reason: because sellers know they can be. It's a vicious cycle: reseller acquires an Amiga part, checks the last sold price for it (or gets a valuation from community members,) asks equal or more, leaves it on the shelf until some Amiga user desperate enough comes along to buy it for that price, the next seller to have that part in stock takes notice, asks slightly more than that, and so on...
The hell of it is, you can't just tell Amiga fans to boycott the sellers, because Amiga equipment does wear out and there is no other way to get replacements...oy.
Too true! That's why I picked up that stickered motherboard (because it was so cheep!), and that's why I shop long and hard on eBay and other sources for the best possible prices.
Unless its an emergency, I say:
1. Buy in bulk - entire systems whenever possible (especially those marked 'for parts'.)
2. Keep everything - even stuff that you think is trash.
3. Maintain a network - like this forum, since other users will sometimes come to your rescue for the price of postage (or a brew!).
4. Go to flea markets and yard sales, because the 'world-at-large' often doesn't know what it has, where Amiga stuff is concerned.
5. Buy from overseas. I list this one last because shipping can sometimes ruin a great price.
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Indeed. #4 especially - I've gotten tons of great stuff from people who just want to clear out their attics...
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I would really like to have an amiga 4000 with 68060 accellerator, rtg, usb, network card, 80 gigs storage, a 20 inch monitor that switches between aga and rtg automatically, dvd-r drive, a couple of great joysticks, and more. Thats pretty much my dream system, but...
but the 50$ pc serves the same purpose. I need better joysticks though. Sometimes I think I should just put everything Amiga on my main pc, but I'm afraid I would just play games constantly and never get any work done.
Did anyone else ever go full virtual and then go back to the rabbit hole?
Maybe I should go back down there...
Should I start asking for donations? :angry:
:lol:
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I went down the same path as you...
I had a decent-spec A1200, then picked up an A4000 & A3000, but found it frustrating to get things set up just the way I wanted.
Then I sold my real Amiga hardware and installed all of my old drives and software on WinUAe and have never looked back.
I now have the ultimate Amiga - running 16 bit AHI and a 24-bit Full HD Workbench...
It's far faster than any real Amiga hardware, with less compatibility issues (WinUAE is almost infinitely tweekable in that sense) and far greater reliability.
I also have the added advantage that I can boot into WinXP or Linux Mint...
Mike.
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In 2008, I started buying up old kit to relive my youthful Amiga days. PPC card, A1200, BVision, ethernet, etc. While I enjoyed it overall, I found it to be a hideously cobbled together mess in the long haul.
After that I got a SAM 440ep, and I use that for the new gen stuff.
For the old stuff that isn't 100% friendly with the PPC rig, I've got both an Amithlon and a WinUAE rig that work just super.
I was originally one of these guys that wanted the A1200 for nostalgia sake, you know that nice old school keyboard feeling, etc. I got over that pretty quick, to be honest. Nice mechanical keyboard and modern mouse on the Amithlon/UAE rigs, best "Amiga" I've ever owned.
That being said, I still fully understand the hardware purists out there. I simply realized I no longer have the patience I had 20 years ago to fiddle around with cantankerous old hardware and finding parts on ebay to keep them running.
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In 2008, I started buying up old kit to relive my youthful Amiga days. PPC card, A1200, BVision, ethernet, etc. While I enjoyed it overall, I found it to be a hideously cobbled together mess in the long haul.
After that I got a SAM 440ep, and I use that for the new gen stuff.
For the old stuff that isn't 100% friendly with the PPC rig, I've got both an Amithlon and a WinUAE rig that work just super.
I was originally one of these guys that wanted the A1200 for nostalgia sake, you know that nice old school keyboard feeling, etc. I got over that pretty quick, to be honest. Nice mechanical keyboard and modern mouse on the Amithlon/UAE rigs, best "Amiga" I've ever owned.
That being said, I still fully understand the hardware purists out there. I simply realized I no longer have the patience I had 20 years ago to fiddle around with cantankerous old hardware and finding parts on ebay to keep them running.
I'm rather different. I'm not really in to emulators. I have Amiga Forever and C64 Forever, and I never use them. I want the real thing, nothing else will do!
The only emulator I've ever used with any regularity is MAME. (And even for MAME, I built a real arcade cabinet to run the games in.)
I don't mind rasslin' with the old hardware - its what I do. AAMOF, I actually prefer old hardware and software in many cases (even PCs) over newer stuff. A personal quirk of mine!
The expense of these old machines does suck, on that I of course agree. But I don't think it really has to. That's by choice of the vendors, who think that 'if its rare-ish, and you really want it, that means I get to bend you over for it.'
I don't want to call it greed, but it does smack of price gouging.
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I guess thats how it falls, some people demand the real thing, but virtual is
almost free, just alot of time.
My dream amiga 4k system would cost at least 1,500$ and I don't think it would
provide me with any less enjoyment than the virtual amiga 5000.
To each his own...
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Figure this one out! :)
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I know exactly why I prefer the old machines - the actual articles. I have a few reasons, the most significant of which actually had to be revealed to me by a friend - something he noticed about me.
First of all, I couldn't really afford some of these systems when they were first released - now I can - and I want the real thing - with all the bells and whistles! :crazy:
(I'm the same way about PC video games - I wait a few years until the price goes down and I can justify the expense - then I get them. I'm usually about 4 or 5 years behind the current game market.)
Secondly, the old, authentic Amigas don't work. My friend told me once, when I was complaining about this hardware issue and that one, that he noticed that I was always 'fixing computers', and didn't seem to be happy unless they were not working. He said I was only happy when my computer wasn't working right.
He was right.
Another thing about me, my 3 Amigas, 6 notebooks, 6 robots, and 17 PCs. I either built or re-built them all, and I'm constantly tinkering on them - and everything else I can get my hands on - its what I do. I've spontaneously repaired strangers's PCs, copiers and printers in doctor's offices, and even an old microwave abandoned for dead.
HOWEVER, once the thing is up and running perfectly, I immediately and completely lose interest. When my current A2000 project is completed repaired and fully functional, and my A500 is the same way, I will in all likelihood let them sit untouched for months, and never even go near them! Then I'll be shopping for an A1200.
However, if one were to break down...:laughing:
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Did anyone else ever go full virtual and then go back to the rabbit hole?
Actually, I started on emulators, and got into hardware from there - haven't touched UAE since I got back into Amiga hardware in 2010. I'm not going to bag on emulators, they're great for what they are, but for me they don't feel real, because I know that they're really not.
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Another thing about me, my 3 Amigas, 6 notebooks, 6 robots, and 17 PCs. I either built or re-built them all, and I'm constantly tinkering on them - and everything else I can get my hands on - its what I do. I've spontaneously repaired strangers's PCs, copiers and printers in doctor's offices, and even an old microwave abandoned for dead.
Nothing wrong with enjoying fixing things that are broken or just not working properly. Let me know when you want to come visit my place. As one of my good friends describes it, my house is where computers come to die. I have more computers or other electronic equipment that is either dead, or has been taken apart for one reason or another and I haven't made the time to put them back together.
Some times it can be 6 months or a year before I get back to a project and put something back together, with, or without the changes or improvements that I took it apart to do in the first place.
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The cable is just a clockport cable, isn't it? It can be easily made for <$2.
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I went for emulation when I got back into amiga's before getting real kit. Currently emulation doesn't have any interest for me but I totally get the appeal, so not judging.
I think it can be done for reasonable money, provided you aim at a mid tier system, and don't go too crazy.
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Nothing wrong with enjoying fixing things that are broken or just not working properly. Let me know when you want to come visit my place. As one of my good friends describes it, my house is where computers come to die. I have more computers or other electronic equipment that is either dead, or has been taken apart for one reason or another and I haven't made the time to put them back together.
Some times it can be 6 months or a year before I get back to a project and put something back together, with, or without the changes or improvements that I took it apart to do in the first place.
Mein Gott! Your place sounds like Paradise with a capital 'P'!:hammer:
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I think it can be done for reasonable money, provided you aim at a mid tier system, and don't go too crazy.
Agreed! Even if you only want one (Amiga) system, you almost have to do that, or you will surely go broke, or drive yourself nuts looking for a better price.
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Actually, I started on emulators, and got into hardware from there
Exactly the same here...
Emulators are just the gateway drug to get you hooked into mainlining hardware..
er..
Well, you get the idea...
Now, I still use emulators for lots of things.
I have an Arcade cab I had an emulator in (it was Vantage instead of MAME for hardware reasons). I now have a 60-n-1 board, which is still an emulator.
I'll probably eventually put a nicer computer with MAME back in there eventually.
But my 2nd cab (in need of a new Big Blue CAP I think, it's currently not working) is original. I toyed with making it a racing multi CAB (it's Pole Position II), but decided to leave it original.
And I use WinUAE/Amigaforever for config and testing things frequently before trying them on my real hardware.
desiv
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A few years ago I managed to get an A500, a CD32, a 1084s, and a bunch of peripherals for under $200 by checking CL every day for months. Since then I haven't seen anything even close to those prices. Now people are asking close to $200 for just an A500 with no monitor.
A2000s are typically much more. It's absurd, and I don't see myself ever buying classic hardware again.
I'll probably buy one of Jens' accelerators and maybe an FPGA clone board, but no more dusty old hardware.
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There's still loads of classic Amiga goodies to be had for not a lot.
Amiga 500s you can get very cheap. I just bought an A600 for £20. I've bought a 68030 accelerator for the A1200 for £50, and then bought another for £60 shortly after.
You just need to watch eBay carefully, that's all. The 600 went at a funny time of day, so was cheap. The A1200 accelerators - one of them had a capacitor come off (5 seconds with a soldering iron fixed that), and the other one was advertised as a "ROM upgrade" despite the fact it was clearly an accelerator.
Point is, if you go to the established sellers you're going to pay a lot more. If you look around and be patient, you will find a bargain. Heck, the thing I've been playing with most was a bridgeboard that someone sent to me for the price of postage, can't get much better than that.
Remember - just because some people have put a high price tag on an Amiga thing, doesn't mean they'll actually get that price....
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There's still loads of classic Amiga goodies to be had for not a lot.
And of course, it helps if you live in the UK..
Certain other places, it's not quite as common....
I swear it seems like they are tripping over all the excess Amigas they have in the UK sometimes...
And then they go on about SCART.. Oh, you don't have SCART? How do you watch Dr. Who and The IT Crowd and..
Oh, you have to pay extra for BBC America on cable???
er..
um..
sorry, got sidetracked for a second...
Still, if you're patient, you can get a decent deal.. ;-)
desiv
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'tis true, we're lucky in the UK. Heck, it's a few years back now but it's not that long ago that I bought three working Amiga 1500s for £60 including keyboards and a few spare (populated) PCBs. I got an A500 complete in box for £10 just at the beginning of the year though.
A1200s are a bit more pricey, though, normally about £50 more or less.
Maybe you should get one from the UK, probably still be cheaper even after postage. :)
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The cable is just a clockport cable, isn't it? It can be easily made for <$2.
Yes it is. However I was told by the original manufacturer that it would be 'expensive' to sell alone, and, of course, to ship: about 20$ total to get one to me across the big pond.
I'm hoping against hope that at least one of my cards survived. In the mean time, I've put the cards in my shopping cart at Softhut.com, but its been over a week since I contacted them with a question before I purchase - with absolutely no answer. I sent another email out Friday night, but I don't think I'll get a response.
No response means I won't also be sending my money (a lot of it!) down a blind hole, so to speak.
I wonder...are they still in business, or is the website just a Flying Dutchman?
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'tis true, we're lucky in the UK. Heck, it's a few years back now but it's not that long ago that I bought three working Amiga 1500s for £60 including keyboards and a few spare (populated) PCBs. I got an A500 complete in box for £10 just at the beginning of the year though.
A1200s are a bit more pricey, though, normally about £50 more or less.
Maybe you should get one from the UK, probably still be cheaper even after postage. :)
I got a really great deal from Amiga Retro Experience in the UK on my A500 system. Shipping was fast, less than a week, but expensive, also...
I had to get a step up/step down transformer for the power conversion, and I also picked up a Universal Grounded Adapter Plug which I eventually didn't need because the converter (the transformer) already had one built in.
But its true, they do seem to have a LOT of Amiga stuff over there!