Amiga.org
Amiga computer related discussion => General chat about Amiga topics => Topic started by: TheBilgeRat on May 06, 2011, 04:52:44 AM
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NOT counting a Natami, or Minimig, or other FPGA thingamabob :lol:
I would like some new PPC/68K accelerator for the 1200s and 4000s
or some sort of ZorroII/III fast storage solution (IDE or SATA)
Heck, I'd like some sort of AIO Network, Storage, Sound card thingy, like an Xsurf/tocatta/SATA card...
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For my A500+ I'd like a 68030 accelerator I think. But they're a bit expensive on Ebay and ideally I'd also like the accelerator to feature an IDE port.
For my A1200T I'd like a Powerflyer because mine seems to have self destructed and we can't buy them anymore. Oh, and a SharkPPC. You did say "ideal".
AH
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A PPC card.
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To replace all hard disks with a quiet SSD or similar solution (must be over 40 gigs or no deal :))
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Hmm... I'd have to say a USB card that can run at USB2 speeds for me A1200's... :)
Failing the a little trapdoor on the top where a singing onion pops out every time you fart or burp and sings "I Did It My Way" in the voice of Arnold Stimely the not so well known Working Mens Clubs vocalist and keyboard player... that would be nice... :)
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I'd like:
1) A combo '060 + PPC card for both the A1200 & A4000 & if it could use current memory modules
2) A Bridgeboard card with an i7 hectacore CPU that could run Windoze 7+
3) Maybe E3B could develop a Z3 Thunderbolt port card :/
4) Definitely need a PIO Accelerator like Elbox's FastATA Cards for the A1200 & A4000 since they're no longer building them. It would be nice if either Individual Computer or E3B could work out an agreement to produce them & offer Elbox a percentage for the rights to manufacture & sell it.
Don't worry, I was only kidding about #3.
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How about the unreleased Wildfire 4000, and a magic Delfina that doesn't crash and decodes AAC.
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SHark or PPC/060 CPU card (512MB ram) with built in RTG and scan doubler.
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NOT counting a Natami, or Minimig, or other FPGA thingamabob :lol:
I would like some new PPC/68K accelerator for the 1200s and 4000s
or some sort of ZorroII/III fast storage solution (IDE or SATA)
Heck, I'd like some sort of AIO Network, Storage, Sound card thingy, like an Xsurf/tocatta/SATA card...
-A new 3D GFX card for blizzardPPC
-Zorro II/III bridgeboard with a Socket 1156 (real bridgeboard, not an STB with zorro conector)
-FPGA 68k accelerator or a new BlizzardPPC/cyberstormPPC like accelerator (With PA6T would be ideal)
I know, i know; Dream is cheap but a man can dream, can dream
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Well I'd like to see -
A new accelerator for the CD32, no need for anything fancy, such as serial, parallel ports etc.. Just some provision for using modern medium like Compact Flash, maybe with the option of having a 030, additional Ram and clockport.
A new PPC card for the A1200 and A4000, running OS4.1 and Morphos. It should be powerful enough to play DVD's and Surf the web comfortably. It would ideally have onboard Sata and a local expansion bus allowing AGP graphics cards etc to be used at reasonable speeds.
Now if only I could win the lottery and make this happen.:)
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Lazer mouse, I think I been spoilt by my PC wich I have logitech Darkfeild mouse that can even track on glass and is ultra sensitive and tracks perfectly, going back to my real Amiga recently was a bit of a pain because I haven't got USB ports for it and so still using the old track ball, and boy it did feel bad. I was considering getting a ps/2 connector for it but it quite a bit of money for something I dont use as much as I use to.
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Indivision AGA mkII, and PCMCIA ethernet
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Hello All,
I pray Jen's makes an Indivision for a genuine A4000T sooner than later than not at all!
Thanks in advance,
Merv Stent
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I'd love to see OS4 ported to 68k and run it on my A4000/060.
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060 or FPGA processor with a new graphics chip ;)
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Wildfire 2000
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Fast FPGA card for the A1200 that could have the NatAmi N68050 core loaded onto it (and later the N68070), with 256MB fast RAM. Maybe also with an RTG solution in the FPGA, or via a PCI bus from the FPGA.
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I'd love to find a cheap accel card for this A1200 I have, then add a flickerfixer and stuff the works into a rackmount 1U case to run my BBS on. As nice as UAE is, it's still not a "real Amiga" feel.
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You should then consider an ACA 1230 turbocard.
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What would your ideal upgrade be right now for your Amiga(s)
A clean desk to set one of them up on.
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A clean desk to set one of them up on.
How about a dark & dirty basement with a worn out oil lamp?
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For me, a new accelerator with the following:
1) Full 68030/68060 with FPU.
2) Level 2 cache (I've read that this is possible).
3) Fast DMA SATA.
4) Can hold up to four gigabytes with new sticks (you get 4 gigs-16 megs of free memory).
5) DMA USB2.
6) DMA ethernet, either wired or wireless (option).
7) Part of the memory has a second bus for the DMA devices.
So, that's it, unless I've forgotten anything ;)
Another idea would be some sort of system that allows you to connect multiple A1200 mobos through the CPU slots, so we can have dual view and multiple CPUs :)
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A professional-level 68040 overhaul to bring performance up closer to modern standards (maybe take the Pentium Pro approach and run the instruction set on a smaller, faster microarchitecture.) Hey, I can dream, can't I?
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Indivision mkII for A1200 to do Highgfx with AGA
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Forgot to add, they really should bring back the FastATA MKIII boards (they are harder to find these days than Lord Lucan)... :)
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Forgot to add, they really should bring back the FastATA MKIII boards (they are harder to find these days than Lord Lucan)... :)
You got that right, I only have three left.
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You got that right, I only have three left.
Oh yeah... go on... rub it in... for those of use who only have two... :furious:
I've got 4 4xEDIE boards but they're naff in comparison... :(
Jammy bugger... :(
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The more I think of it, the thing that makes the most sense would be an adapter to fit the FPGA arcade or NatAmi into the classic Amiga case of your choice. ;-) Seriously, you're talking about duct taping a new built 68k/PPC card, graphics, SATA, networking, USB 2 board onto a 30 year old computer? When you're done you're only using the mouse & joysticks from the original Amiga....
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@ JimS
You've just given Barry an entire production plan for his next project... :(
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A way to towerize my A4000D
Any basic 060 accelerator with some RAM
USB
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The more I think of it, the thing that makes the most sense would be an adapter to fit the FPGA arcade or NatAmi into the classic Amiga case of your choice. ;-)
Who says they do not already fit? I know at least one that does :)
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Seriously, you're talking about duct taping a new built 68k/PPC card, graphics, SATA, networking, USB 2 board onto a 30 year old computer? When you're done you're only using the mouse & joysticks from the original Amiga....
If you're talking about my accelerator idea, then no, no graphics (and no PPC). That way you use the A1200 hardware, except the CPU and the IDE port. It would be a great board, and it would simply slide into the CPU slot, so no duct taping is needed at all.
As for 'a 30 year old computer', while true, the Amiga is quite a modern computer. Current peecees are basically the same idea (just much faster): Motherboard with stuff on it in a box; just connect it, turn the power on and go. Only tablets are more modern. Come on, Amigas aren't pre '80s machines. It's in the early '80s that computers were becoming modern, and essentially very little has changed (the big exception is performance, and performance isn't necessarily a factor when determining how modern something is).
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A professional-level 68040 overhaul to bring performance up closer to modern standards (maybe take the Pentium Pro approach and run the instruction set on a smaller, faster microarchitecture.) Hey, I can dream, can't I?
Back in the day I used to dream that AMD gave the Thunderbird treatment to the 060 ISA rather than x86.
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Who says they do not already fit? I know at least one that does :)
Hmmm..
Images of replacing (delicately storing the original of course) my A1000 motherboard with something like this.
A backplate should be no problem, as the 1000 has that slide in backplate..
Just need some adapters (floppy drive (eject button positioning might be tricky if you use a standard PC floppy), LEDs, Power, Keyboard (A1000 original of course, unless there is a replacement that fits nicely under the A1000 and is the same color scheme), joystick ports)...
Hmmm.. Depending on the fit, would a laptop IDE optical drive fit so it ejects where the expansion slot without cutting anything???
Then, all I'd need is a monitor that fits inside a 1084s case... :)
Hmmm....
desiv
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I like the idea of a Natami based cpu accelerator for the A1200 (and possibly 4000). Add on a high speed ide port and you are in business.
Since thats not very practical, a new run, or revision of the IDE-Fix Express. These really need to be available again. I would like to see the 40 pin connectors removed (or become removable) and just concentrate on the 44 pin. SATA would be nice for SSD drives but probably not practical either.
New Indivision AGA 1200 run (or the MKII). Why the hell aren't these available again yet? Its not like they didn't sell like hot cakes or anything. Would be nice to see a better mounting method as they can be finicky to keep secured. Perhaps DVI as well VGA?
External SD/FF. I know the image quality isn't going to be quite as sharp as an internal unit, but installation is brain dead easy and doesn't require modding to make it fit (or to keep it from moving around). While many of us have multiple Amiga's, how often do you have several hooked up at once? Would be nice to have a "portable" SD/FF to use.
A proper aftermarket desktop case for the A1200. Something similar in size to the A1000 or classic pizza box style Mac. I personally don't care for tower conversions, but I do like the fact they allow you to use some of the accelerators that just don't fit correctly (or get too hot) in the A1200. This is something I am actually thinking of working on. Slim optical drive up front (maybe...or perhaps slot in style?) and a place for a floppy drive (perhaps locate it on the side to clean up the front of the case?)
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@ JimS
You've just given Barry an entire production plan for his next project... :(
Well..... there's a difference between slapping a generic pc mobo into an amiga-like box, and slapping a fan-built Amiga clone into a real or Amiga-like box.
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Who says they do not already fit? I know at least one that does :)
Hmm.... Wonder which one that would be. ;-)
But my point was that when you look at all the stuff you'd want to add to a classic Amiga to bring an old Amiga up to date, it makes more sense to start from scratch with a new motherboard.... just like y'all are doing.
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But my point was that when you look at all the stuff you'd want to add to a classic Amiga to bring an old Amiga up to date, it makes more sense to start from scratch with a new motherboard.... just like y'all are doing.
Except when you're only interested in classic Amigas (680x0+OCS/ECS/AGA). I wish I was a billionaire. Then I could just buy Amiga, and start producing real Amigas again (at a loss, so what, it's a hobby :)).
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If you're talking about my accelerator idea, then no, no graphics (and no PPC). That way you use the A1200 hardware, except the CPU and the IDE port. It would be a great board, and it would simply slide into the CPU slot, so no duct taping is needed at all.
As for 'a 30 year old computer', while true, the Amiga is quite a modern computer. Current peecees are basically the same idea (just much faster): Motherboard with stuff on it in a box; just connect it, turn the power on and go. Only tablets are more modern. Come on, Amigas aren't pre '80s machines. It's in the early '80s that computers were becoming modern, and essentially very little has changed (the big exception is performance, and performance isn't necessarily a factor when determining how modern something is).
I wasn't talking about your accellerator idea specifically, just the idea of things added on to old hardware. While I agree the Amiga is a fairly modern computer design wise, the actual hardware is between 15 and nearly 30 years old. It just seems to me that if you're going to go to the expense of designing, building and testing something, might as well start with a clean slate. I'm thinking about what I'd want to see to make me shift over to using the Amiga as a day-to-day computer again rather than some retro fun... (not that there's anything wrong with that. ;-) ) ... and when I look at all the stuff I'd want, a new motherboard would be saner.
That's why I like the Replay, and Natami, although I'd prefer the latter to be open.
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I'd just want the option of installing AmigaOS natively onto my x86 hardware and do away with everything else. The mild panic I go through when my A4000 doesn't start up right away is something I can do without.
That's not so much to ask is it?
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I wasn't talking about your accellerator idea specifically, just the idea of things added on to old hardware. While I agree the Amiga is a fairly modern computer design wise, the actual hardware is between 15 and nearly 30 years old. It just seems to me that if you're going to go to the expense of designing, building and testing something, might as well start with a clean slate. I'm thinking about what I'd want to see to make me shift over to using the Amiga as a day-to-day computer again rather than some retro fun... (not that there's anything wrong with that. ;-) ) ... and when I look at all the stuff I'd want, a new motherboard would be saner.
That's why I like the Replay, and Natami, although I'd prefer the latter to be open.
Okay, fair enough :)
What we really need, is new software for 680x0+chipset+KS3.0 (and no, not ports, especially not Fire Fox ports, yuk :(). What our classic Amigas are doing today isn't very impressive at all, and it can be vastly improved.
The OS is firmly stuck in the past, and there's no need for this if one got written from scratch (incompatible with AOS, start from scratch completely). It could be faster and more stable than AOS, and provide the perfect platform for modern applications that run well on '030s with chipset. There are plenty of applications that aren't heavy when they're well written, and there's certainly no need for a billion exa hertz CPU (I'm willing to bet that we'll see the same crappy bloatware as on teh peecee with Winblows/Linsux if our Amigas become up to date speed wise, and this is a big no no).
To me, it's about the software, not the hardware, hence my want for accelerators with standard 680x0 CPUs and some much needed connectivity features (and a shit load of ram for the novelty value ;)).
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Custom desktop case and keyboard for my A4000T.
Yes, I want a compact desktop case in brushed aluminium and a matching keyboard and silver mouse for my A4000T mobo. Think late 90s Technics amplifier, that's the kind of deal I want.
Probably on the hardware side all it is missing is a Deneb, I have everything else I want for it: a PPC, PIV with Concierto and also 3 x DKB3128.
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Okay, fair enough :)
To me, it's about the software, not the hardware, hence my want for accelerators with standard 680x0 CPUs and some much needed connectivity features (and a shit load of ram for the novelty value ;)).
I'm kinda with you on the software... Those old productivity aps like the Deluxe series, Pagestream, Videoscape and so on were pretty good. Especially for folks who weren't experts in those fields. I think sometimes I'd rather use Deluxe Paint than Photoshop. An upgraded Amiga with better graphics, networking, sound, and speed would be killer.
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I'd just want the option of installing AmigaOS natively onto my x86 hardware and do away with everything else. The mild panic I go through when my A4000 doesn't start up right away is something I can do without.
That's not so much to ask is it?
AROS + Emumiga should fit that bill nicely.
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Well, I'd like a CPU card ('060 + PPC, maybe a nice G4) with integrated PCIe bus, connecting to a PCIe daughterboard. Of course the CPU card has fast local memory (256 MB to 2 GB), a NIC, a few SATA and USB ports and a somewhat decent audio chip.
Dropping Zorro altogether (sorry, Dave) has the advantage of not having to care about DMA and addressing, so you could put more than 128 MB on the card.
The only thing missing would be a sweet little PEG graphics card of your choice and you'd have a completely new machine without missing anything you love.
Impossible you say? Well, not really... The hardest parts would be sourcing the CPUs and writing drivers for this Erlkönig.
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Indivision probably, so I can get rid of this external scan doubler dangling off my machine :)
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AROS + Emumiga should fit that bill nicely.
It's been a month since the last Emumiga update :(
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ACA030 with CF storage for my CD32.
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ACA030 with CF storage for my CD32.
Bullseye :-)
I have done it all in the Amiga land, I want to retire now with an expanded CD32 that I can easely get out of storage when I want to go back to 1995.
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I would LOVE to finally get a mediator board for my a1200T :)
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Hmm... I'd have to say a USB card that can run at USB2 speeds for me A1200's... :)
Likewise I'd like the same basic thing, but ethernet. Unfortunately I think we're both stymied on that one.
Full-blown USB2 transfer rate is something like 320 Mbit/sec for bulk transfers. I'm really not sure what you could connect to your A1200 to get that sort of sustained throughput especially to/from system memory. Your best bet would be a GRexx PCI with some sort of USB2 card fitted, assuming all the necessary drivers exist.
Ideally, someone would bring out a new accelerator card with all this gear on board already. Sort of an all-round accelerator rather than just a faster CPU.
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Of course, you could argue that's exactly what the NatAmi is, albeit one that doesn't need the rest of your system. :)
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Likewise I'd like the same basic thing, but ethernet. Unfortunately I think we're both stymied on that one.
Full-blown USB2 transfer rate is something like 320 Mbit/sec for bulk transfers. I'm really not sure what you could connect to your A1200 to get that sort of sustained throughput especially to/from system memory. Your best bet would be a GRexx PCI with some sort of USB2 card fitted, assuming all the necessary drivers exist.
Ideally, someone would bring out a new accelerator card with all this gear on board already. Sort of an all-round accelerator rather than just a faster CPU.
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Of course, you could argue that's exactly what the NatAmi is, albeit one that doesn't need the rest of your system. :)
Hmmm.... despite the fact I grudgingly agree with what you say here... ;)
I'm in cream puff right now over our other wee debacle /debate in that other thread today, so I'm not talking to you today, so there and na na na na na can't hear you (well I know it's really can't read you but that doesn't sound right)... :)
So stop posting things that agrees with what I say or I'll end up in a bigger sulk and end up spamming the Sky News website and taking it out on those poor journos over there, I gave the poor sods an earbashing yesterday... :(
So leave me out of things for today as I canny be bothered and I'll just end up peed off and start ranting again about anything and everything... :(
I'm off to take some of me meds as I've either missed them today or they don't work anymore... or perhaps it's time for a wee stay in the loony bin again... :)
Anywhoo, I'm going to bile ma heid and see if that helps...
PS: Me bloody useless dog hasn't died today , now I'll need to figure out what wrong with him now... :(
Feck, I have everyone and everthing....
Oh look a squirrel... :D
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My Amiga needs tits and an ass.
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My Amiga needs tits and an ass.
Plenty of asses in Amigaland.... and not exactly a shortage of boobs either. ;-)
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Hmmm.... despite the fact I grudgingly agree with what you say here... ;)
I'm in cream puff right now over our other wee debacle /debate in that other thread today,
It's the internet, heated disagreements are normal behaviour (it's how you go about disagreeing that matters). I would be far more worried if everybody agreed on everything all the time...
so I'm not talking to you today, so there and na na na na na can't hear you (well I know it's really can't read you but that doesn't sound right)... :)
Well, you know the other problem for high speed USB is that it is very interrupt heavy. When transferring large amounts of data from one high speed USB hard drive to another on my PC, I can track the interrupt overhead by watching /proc/interrupts. Servicing said interrupts ties up the CPU, which on linux shows up as abnormal amounts "%sy" (system) CPU.
So, even assuming we had a fast enough bus to put a high speed USB2 controller on, we'd probably find that the classic amiga hardware can't service the interrupts fast enough to get it going at full speed (high speed ethernet has the same problem too, but the packets are bigger and therefore fewer are generated per unit of data transferred).
Pity firewire didn't usurp it as it was a far better hardware protocol (including DMA, for example), but that's another one of those VHS/Betamax debates.
So stop posting things that agrees with what I say or I'll end up in a bigger sulk and end up spamming the Sky News website and taking it out on those poor journos over there, I gave the poor sods an earbashing yesterday... :(
So leave me out of things for today as I canny be bothered and I'll just end up peed off and start ranting again about anything and everything... :(
Sorry :lol:
Ok, this is the last one then for today.
I'm off to take some of me meds as I've either missed them today or they don't work anymore... or perhaps it's time for a wee stay in the loony bin again... :)
Anywhoo, I'm going to bile ma heid and see if that helps...
PS: Me bloody useless dog hasn't died today , now I'll need to figure out what wrong with him now... :(
Does he do it often?
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:sealed:
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NOT counting a Natami, or Minimig, or other FPGA thingamabob :lol:
I would like some new PPC/68K accelerator for the 1200s and 4000s
or some sort of ZorroII/III fast storage solution (IDE or SATA)
Heck, I'd like some sort of AIO Network, Storage, Sound card thingy, like an Xsurf/tocatta/SATA card...
hi,
I would like to see PPC/68K support come back, and also OS 4.0 for the classic Amiga's.
Although it still isn't as fast like Amiga Forever, it would be some relief for our slow 68 series cpu's.
smerf
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For my A4000D VT/Flyer: increase the Warp Engine ram from 64 to 128mb
My A3000D would benefit from having the Warp Engine scsi functioning. Then I would install the AD516 sound card and a dedicated audio harddrive
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My ideal upgrade would be some kind of scandoubler and a PPC card, maybe a 68060 card. Towerizing my A1200 would be neat as well.
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Well, you know the other problem for high speed USB is that it is very interrupt heavy. When transferring large amounts of data from one high speed USB hard drive to another on my PC, I can track the interrupt overhead by watching /proc/interrupts. Servicing said interrupts ties up the CPU, which on linux shows up as abnormal amounts "%sy" (system) CPU.
So, even assuming we had a fast enough bus to put a high speed USB2 controller on, we'd probably find that the classic amiga hardware can't service the interrupts fast enough to get it going at full speed (high speed ethernet has the same problem too, but the packets are bigger and therefore fewer are generated per unit of data transferred).
I have thought about this, as a side note of thinking about USB Mice and Keyboards for my MiniMig. I would think that a fairly cheap Arm processor could handle the USB stack and then interface to the Amiga in whatever protocol the Amiga could handle. The idea being that to the Amiga it looks like a standard disk drive, and to the USB device it would look like an Arm computer. Using this method you could use 100% of the the processor for the USB stack and interface to the Amiga, as that is the only task the Arm processor would be responsible for. This would be useful for interfacing USB hard drives, USB keyboards, and USB mice.
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I have thought about this, as a side note of thinking about USB Mice and Keyboards for my MiniMig. I would think that a fairly cheap Arm processor could handle the USB stack and then interface to the Amiga in whatever protocol the Amiga could handle. The idea being that to the Amiga it looks like a standard disk drive, and to the USB device it would look like an Arm computer. Using this method you could use 100% of the the processor for the USB stack and interface to the Amiga, as that is the only task the Arm processor would be responsible for. This would be useful for interfacing USB hard drives, USB keyboards, and USB mice.
Like a modified raspberry pi device... seems imminently doable.
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Like a modified raspberry pi device... seems imminently doable.
Raspberry Pi, running AROS/UAE... That would be my next Amiga! ;)
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Exactly. The Rasbarry Pi already supports USB 2.0, so we know that it can handle that. Add the interfaces for connection to an Amiga (or other retro system) and your ready to go.
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I'd like everything you could put on a Mediator without the mediator!:afro:
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Exactly. The Rasbarry Pi already supports USB 2.0, so we know that it can handle that. Add the interfaces for connection to an Amiga (or other retro system) and your ready to go.
I have been thinking about something like this... maybe using the Propeller chip as controller. The trick would be connecting to the Amiga. Do the ARM chips have the old school address & data bus interface to memory, or just SPI? I suppose you could use a sort of clockport style interface and have a service routine on the ARM do the grunt work of reading it then passing it off to or from the I/O devices.
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Retromasters UFE SD card floppy emulator so that we can have a 1541 ultimate type device for amiga with keyboard overlay control software for ease of use. I wish this item would get produced, been drooling over it for two years now...
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Raspberry Pi, running AROS/UAE... That would be my next Amiga! ;)
That would be fantastic! :)
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It's been a month since the last Emumiga update :(
Oh, sorry about that. I've been quite busy doing other stuff the last couple of months. (Was actually in UK for two weeks recently).
I'm trying to find the same level of inspiration I had two years ago and get somewhere with this project.
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I have been thinking about something like this... maybe using the Propeller chip as controller. The trick would be connecting to the Amiga. Do the ARM chips have the old school address & data bus interface to memory, or just SPI? I suppose you could use a sort of clockport style interface and have a service routine on the ARM do the grunt work of reading it then passing it off to or from the I/O devices.
That's what I was thinking. The reason that is always given on why these retro systems cannot use USB is because the system (real retro) or the system they are recreating cannot handle the USB load, and don't have the USB software stack to handle it.
By doing all of the USB on the Arm, and just outputting in whatever format is the most convenient for the retro system, the ability of the retro system to handle a USB stack becomes irrelevant. At the very least, it should be trivial to make a USB gamepad/USB keyboard/USB mouse to 9-pin joystick/PS/2 keyboard/PS/2 mouse adapter. This would give all of the new retro systems the ability to use new periphrials.
Making data storage and network would be a little tougher, but shouldn't be over the top hard.
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Hi,
I am thinking of ripping the guts out of my A4000 Desktop and putting in a Quad Core Intel board then running Cloanto's Amiga Forever on it, then my A4000 will be one of the meanest fastest Amiga's in town.
What an upgrade.
smerf
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Well, you know the other problem for high speed USB is that it is very interrupt heavy. When transferring large amounts of data from one high speed USB hard drive to another on my PC, I can track the interrupt overhead by watching /proc/interrupts. Servicing said interrupts ties up the CPU, which on linux shows up as abnormal amounts "%sy" (system) CPU.
So, even assuming we had a fast enough bus to put a high speed USB2 controller on, we'd probably find that the classic amiga hardware can't service the interrupts fast enough to get it going at full speed (high speed ethernet has the same problem too, but the packets are bigger and therefore fewer are generated per unit of data transferred).
You recognize that the Deneb is a High Speed USB 2.0 card available for years now that can have a throughput of over 8.5 MByte/sec on an Amiga Classic system? And about the interrupts: well, it very much depends on the controller and the driver. The Deneb transfers double buffered chunks of 24 KB each per interrupt. That's a lot bigger than your average 1500 Byte Ethernet frames... Even the Subway/Highway does not cause an interrupt for every 64 bytes transferred...
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You recognize that the Deneb is a High Speed USB 2.0 card available for years now that can have a throughput of over 8.5 MByte/sec on an Amiga Classic system? And about the interrupts: well, it very much depends on the controller and the driver. The Deneb transfers double buffered chunks of 24 KB each per interrupt. That's a lot bigger than your average 1500 Byte Ethernet frames... Even the Subway/Highway does not cause an interrupt for every 64 bytes transferred...
Is this the reason for the quick throughput on ethernet dongles on a Deneb?
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Is this the reason for the quick throughput on ethernet dongles on a Deneb?
Shouldn't be as most frames are smaller than 1500 bytes.
If you are transferring big files, yes, but there is a lot of chatter and small stuff traffic...
Possibly better buffering...
A more efficient driver can relay frames quicker also, and any decrease of latency is a huge plus...
desiv
(Hey, I just said "shouldn't be" and then mentioned buffering, which was mentioned above.. D'oh! In that case, (me actually reading) yes.., but probably not the larger packets unless you are doing lots of file transfers..)
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You recognize that the Deneb is a High Speed USB 2.0 card available for years now that can have a throughput of over 8.5 MByte/sec on an Amiga Classic system?
Which is certainly impressive, but 8.5MB/s, whilst fast for a classic Amiga is not high speed as per USB2 standards for bulk transfers, ~30MB/s is. My reply was on the basis of achieving the latter, ie USB2 transfer rates comparable to what everybody else is used to.
And about the interrupts: well, it very much depends on the controller and the driver. The Deneb transfers double buffered chunks of 24 KB each per interrupt. That's a lot bigger than your average 1500 Byte Ethernet frames... Even the Subway/Highway does not cause an interrupt for every 64 bytes transferred...
Of course, but that's an implementation issue. There's not a lot in the standard that I'm aware of that dictates how much data a hardware device should buffer. I've seen USB2 controllers that will happily generate an interrupt every packet. Likewise, I've seen ethernet adapters that seem to implement a sensible degree of buffering and don't produce quite the same overhead - very important given the speeds they can reach.
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Man, an RTG graphics card that I could afford for my A1200T!
Please!
Sorry, but 2MB CHIP RAM is lousy!!!
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Which is certainly impressive, but 8.5MB/s, whilst fast for a classic Amiga is not high speed as per USB2 standards for bulk transfers, ~30MB/s is. My reply was on the basis of achieving the latter, ie USB2 transfer rates comparable to what everybody else is used to.
Of course, but that's an implementation issue. There's not a lot in the standard that I'm aware of that dictates how much data a hardware device should buffer. I've seen USB2 controllers that will happily generate an interrupt every packet. Likewise, I've seen ethernet adapters that seem to implement a sensible degree of buffering and don't produce quite the same overhead - very important given the speeds they can reach.
You know that most Amiga classic systems have a memory bandwidth in one direction (i.e. read OR write) of often less than 15 MB/sec? Let alone a transfer between TWO ports (i.e. read AND write). Did you ever benchmark the USB bulk performance of real USB devices? Then you would know that the theoretical 30 MB/sec raw bandwidth of the USB spec are not reached in practice. Even on a Pegasos or MacMini, I never got much faster than around 23 MB/sec.
And the fact that some Windows deseased USB devices only support single USB transfers of up to 64KB does not really help it (there is no such limit defined in the Spec).
Get real, USB1.1 maxes out at 1MB/sec, and everything over that is USB2.0 highspeed.
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Been thinking, as I'm no expert or have much knowledge about chip design, then hopefully someone who does would be able to answer this question... :)
To me with all the modern technology available and with being able to quite literally cram an old computer onto a single chip. Would it not be possible for one of the big chip manufacturers to make 060 chips in a modern format that could run at speeds far in excess of the rather limited 50Mhz of most 060 chips... :)
Think about having an 060 Amiga accelerator board running at several hundred Mhz or more for our miggies, that would be neat... :)
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You know that most Amiga classic systems have a memory bandwidth in one direction (i.e. read OR write) of often less than 15 MB/sec?
Absolutely, which is why I said in my first post about it that actually finding something inside the amiga to connect it to that could handle full USB2 bulk transfer speeds would be a problem (the interrupt load comment came after that). I actually suggested that something like a USB2 card attached by GRexx might be a viable option *if* a sensible stack and driver set existed.
Let alone a transfer between TWO ports (i.e. read AND write). Did you ever benchmark the USB bulk performance of real USB devices? Then you would know that the theoretical 30 MB/sec raw bandwidth of the USB spec are not reached in practice. Even on a Pegasos or MacMini, I never got much faster than around 23 MB/sec.
Actually, I have several high speed external USB2 drives. The highest USB2 bulk transfer I've achieved copying data from one to another on my PC is around 28MB/s when copying files of around 1GB in size. I've never seen it go higher than that, but as I said, it does put a measurable load on the system in terms of interrupt handling. Fortunately, being a quad core system, that still leaves plenty of CPU for other tasks.
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Been thinking, as I'm no expert or have much knowledge about chip design, then hopefully someone who does would be able to answer this question... :)
To me with all the modern technology available and with being able to quite literally cram an old computer onto a single chip. Would it not be possible for one of the big chip manufacturers to make 060 chips in a modern format that could run at speeds far in excess of the rather limited 50Mhz of most 060 chips... :)
Think about having an 060 Amiga accelerator board running at several hundred Mhz or more for our miggies, that would be neat... :)
The 060 design doesn't exist for modern chip processes so it's a no go.
A better idea is to take a cheap SoC (system on a chip, the type of chip you find in smart phones) and run an emulator on it... Thus my keeness on the £15 Raspberry Pi computer :)