Amiga.org
Operating System Specific Discussions => MorphOS => MorphOS -- Hardware requirements and availability discussion => Topic started by: Argo on March 25, 2011, 02:13:52 AM
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Just inquired about a G4 iMac offered on the local Freecycle list.
Here are the stats:
17 in. LCD display
800MHz processor (not intel, i forget what mac used before that,
but it's that)
80GB HDD
Apple SuperDrive (DVD-R/CD-RW)
nVidia GeForce4 MX series video
56K modem, 10/100 LAN
2xFireWire, 5xUSB, integrated Mic, space for AirPort Card (but no
card), mini-VGA out
includes Speakers, powercord, no mouse, no keyboard (both must be USB)
RUNNING OS 10.2 (but has disk for 9.something)
Not sure what model it is. Just that is is an 800MHz G4 CPU.
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Im using one right now cos me iMac G5 is still installing OSX again... :(
Same specs just the 20" version, gotta be honest it's fine for browsing the web but don't expect to be able to watch live video or any kind of online videos to be honest, it's more like watching a slidsehow than a video... :(
Browsing is pretty slow unless you use an adblocker to get rid of all those annoying flash ads, fit a bigger HD 80GB is useless on the thing go for at least 160GB... :)
Most stuff stuff runs quite well but not as fast as the iMacG5 and you'll need to upgrade from 10.2 to 10.4.11 (don't pay someone 300 quid to upgrade it though, boy was I ripped off)... :(
The main reason for upgrading to 10.4.11 is that most of the software you be running on it requires this, it's almost impossible to fin old 10.2 versions now and they are really naff if you do find them... :)
If you wanna know anymore send me a PM and I'll help you out... :)
PS: it's PPC and makes a great desk lamp... :D
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Might help if you elaborate as to what you want it to work with before people can tell you if it'll work? :)
Being that it's an amiga site Im going to assume you mean with MorphOS. If that is the case then I can only tell you that you'll need to replace the video card with an ATI/AMD card up to R300 based (if I recall correctly). Im sure others will be able to give you additional details.
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Hi,
@Franko,
I think what he wants to know and what I want to know is:
Will it run OS4.0
Will it run MorphOS
If you know of something better, HELP
smerf
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WELL, since this is Amiga.org and I AM posting in the MorphOS -- Hardware requirements and availability discussion subforum. I might perchance want to try running Morphos on it.
I've never used Morphos. This is free, so I'd like to try it. The computer isn't blazingly fast, but if it is enough to poke around and try various feature so I can get a feel for it. That would be okay.
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@ Argo
Nope it wont run MorphOS as Piru told me a wee while back when I asked about it... :(
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Aah, Id never noticed the forum category listed at the top of threads before. It's kinda hidden away in plain site.
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iMacs aren't supposed by MorphOS (yet), so you'll be stuck with OSX or Linux on that for now if you get it.
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Here's where you can find all the specs about that iMac model or any other for that matter... :)
iMac Specs (http://www.everymac.com/systems/apple/imac/stats/imac_800_17_fp.html)
PS:Forgot to mention MorphOS won't work with this model beacuase the GFX card isn't supported and you can't replace it cos it's integrated onto the motherboard, in fact the only things you can replace in these "table lamp" style models is the HD & DVD drive... :(
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Yeah, I just found the spec a few minutes ago and some searching here on AO. Look like it needs it would need an AGP slot. Oh well. I can always mess around with OS X.
Thanks Franko & Cammy.
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If you are going to muck around with it, try and upgrade the OS to it's max (OSX 10.4.11) it becomes very usable if you do so, 10.2 is really awful and not supported very much software wise... :)
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If you are going to muck around with it, try and upgrade the OS to it's max (OSX 10.4.11) it becomes very usable if you do so, 10.2 is really awful and not supported very much software wise... :)
10.5 is the last version of OSX that runs on these old machines.
http://leopardassist.sourceforge.net/supported.html
Just make sure to max out the RAM. (2GB usually)
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Yep, its not a matter of whether not not it has an AGP slot or ATI graphics, iMacs aren't supported under MorphOS.
On the other hand, Franko's right, its not a bad OSX machine (or Ubuntu for that matter).
See if you can upgrade to at least OSX 10.4 (Nicholas and Franko both have points here, 10.5 is better but you're going to need 10.4 at minimum).
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10.5 is the last version of OSX that runs on these old machines.
http://leopardassist.sourceforge.net/supported.html
Just make sure to max out the RAM. (2GB usually)
Hmmm... not sure who wrote that but he forgot to point out that on the iMAC G4 800Mhz PPC (table lamp version) it DOESN'T WORK with 10.5... :(
I've tried it myself on my fully expanded iMACG4 and yes you can install 10.5 but...
Expect countless "Application Not Responding" crashes & lockups...
Random and totally unpredictable and unexpected Freezes...
Utils & Apps that you download written for OSX 10.5 not to install and most will (if they do install) quit with random errors telling you all sorts of weird stuff...
Ended up having to reformat the drive and doing a total re-install of OSX 10.4 again... :(
Definetaly not worth even attempting to install 10.5 on these particular iMAC G4 Models as you'll soon realise if you do that it doesn't have the power or the GFX Board to cope with 10.5 apps... :(
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its not a bad OSX machine (or Ubuntu for that matter).
Actually, it is a bad Ubuntu machine, last I tried (and I seem to recall Franko trying as well) 10.04 and 10.10 didn't work on it, at least not without a lot of trouble.
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Hmmm... not sure who wrote that but he forgot to point out that on the iMAC G4 800Mhz PPC (table lamp version) it DOESN'T WORK with 10.5... :(
I've tried it myself on my fully expanded iMACG4 and yes you can install 10.5 but...
Expect countless "Application Not Responding" crashes & lockups...
Random and totally unpredictable and unexpected Freezes...
Utils & Apps that you download written for OSX 10.5 not to install and most will (if they do install) quit with random errors telling you all sorts of weird stuff...
Ended up having to reformat the drive and doing a total re-install of OSX 10.4 again... :(
Definetaly not worth even attempting to install 10.5 on these particular iMAC G4 Models as you'll soon realise if you do that it doesn't have the power or the GFX Board to cope with 10.5 apps... :(
Erm... Frank, that page is a listing of machines that DO run 10.5 when you use the Leopard Assist program linked at the top of that page.
It runs on lowly 450MHz G4 Cubes faster than 10.4 does. It's more stable too.
1. Install 10.4
2. Download this file and unzip it
3. Run LeopardAssist.app (Click Options and then Optimize for machines with crap graphics cards)
4. Insert 10.5 disc and continue.
5. Profit!
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Erm... Frank, that page is a listing of machines that DO run 10.5 when you use the Leopard Assist program linked at the top of that page.
It runs on lowly 450MHz G4 Cubes faster than 10.4 does. It's more stable too.
1. Install 10.4
2. Download this file and unzip it
3. Run LeopardAssist.app (Click Options and then Optimize for machines with crap graphics cards)
4. Insert 10.5 disc and continue.
5. Profit!
I did use LeopardAssist with the install and the results were as posted above, I also visited many MAC forums and almost everyone using this particular model of the iMACG4 had the same problems... (and other ones that I hadn't encountered yet) :(
People far more knowledgeable than me on these forums were explaining to others (like myself) that because of the type of GFX card, Bus speeds etc... that trying to run OSX 10.5 one this model is pretty pointless as most of the apps and utils written for 10.5 will as I've described either crash or will run so slowly and unresponsive as to make them unusable... :(
I've tried it myself and believe me unless all you want to do is run the OSX 10.4 version of Safari you regret ever installing 10.5 on an iMacG4 @ 800Mhz, (if you start to upgrade Safari to the 10.5 versions you end up with a browser that is so slow and unresponsive it makes the 10.4 version look super fast)... :(
If you don't believe me get yourself an old iMac G4 of the type mentioned and try it for yourself then you'll understand how bad it is. (heck even Apple themselves and their tech support will tell you the same)... :(
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I did use LeopardAssist with the install and the results were as posted above, I also visited many MAC forums and almost everyone using this particular model of the iMACG4 had the same problems... (and other ones that I hadn't encountered yet) :(
People far more knowledgeable than me on these forums were explaining to others (like myself) that because of the type of GFX card, Bus speeds etc... that trying to run OSX 10.5 one this model is pretty pointless as most of the apps and utils written for 10.5 will as I've described either crash or will run so slowly and unresponsive as to make them unusable... :(
I've tried it myself and believe me unless all you want to do is run the OSX 10.4 version of Safari you regret ever installing 10.5 on an iMacG4 @ 800Mhz, (if you start to upgrade Safari to the 10.5 versions you end up with a browser that is so slow and unresponsive it makes the 10.4 version look super fast)... :(
If you don't believe me get yourself an old iMac G4 of the type mentioned and try it for yourself then you'll understand how bad it is. (heck even Apple themselves and their tech support will tell you the same)... :(
I've got an even worse G4 here with 512MB RAM and a Mach64 or other such crap graphics card in it and it ran Leopard ok before I put MorphOS on it.
Firefox ran fine on it too, Safari is shite. :lol:
edit:
You have to remember to click the Options/Optimize button to disable the fancy gfx stuff though. If you don't it WILL run like shite.
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I've got an even worse G4 here with 512MB RAM and a Mach64 or other such crap graphics card in it and it ran Leopard ok before I put MorphOS on it.
Firefox ran fine on it too, Safari is shite. :lol:
edit:
You have to remember to click the Options/Optimize button to disable the fancy gfx stuff though. If you don't it WILL run like shite.
I visited many mac forums, contacted my local Apple stores tech dept and even contacted the guy who originally installed my iMacG4 (he's an apple engineer) before I tried this out as I didn't think it would be as bad as these folk claimed, however it turned out they were 100% correct it just doesn't help on these particular models... :(
http://www.everymac.com/systems/apple/imac/stats/imac_800_17_fp.html
I was given many technical explanations as to why it's pointless installing OS 10.5 on this type of iMac, but it's only after having tried it myself I can assure you while it may work on others (even of a lower spec) OSX 10.5 on this model makes 10.4 look like it's running in some sort of turbo mode... :)
All I can say is if you ever get the chance to try it on one of these models then you'll understand what I'm talking about here.. ;)
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I visited many mac forums, contacted my local Apple stores tech dept and even contacted the guy who originally installed my iMacG4 (he's an apple engineer) before I tried this out as I didn't think it would be as bad as these folk claimed, however it turned out they were 100% correct it just doesn't help on these particular models... :(
http://www.everymac.com/systems/apple/imac/stats/imac_800_17_fp.html
I was given many technical explanations as to why it's pointless installing OS 10.5 on this type of iMac, but it's only after having tried it myself I can assure you while it may work on others (even of a lower spec) OSX 10.5 on this model makes 10.4 look like it's running in some sort of turbo mode... :)
All I can say is if you ever get the chance to try it on one of these models then you'll understand what I'm talking about here.. ;)
You should sell both of them and get a G4 Tower with a Radeon to dual boot MorphOS and Leopard. :)
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You should sell both of them and get a G4 Tower with a Radeon to dual boot MorphOS and Leopard. :)
Nah... more than happy with the G5 (well apart from a 7 month old HD bloody failling and spending all day yesterday fitting a new one and re-installing everything)... :)
The simple reason I didn't buy a PC or other type of old Mac was I don't like towers or desktop boxes, the iMAC G5 is just perfect for me as it only takes up the same space as a 20" flatscreen TV and I only need it for browsing the web & uploading/downloading stuff... :)
Came to the conclusion that MorphOS is not for me, the iMac does it's job for the net and my Amigas cover every other computing need I have, all in all I'm more than happy with the way things are as they suit my needs perfectly... :)
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Nah... more than happy with the G5 (well apart from a 7 month old HD bloody failling and spending all day yesterday fitting a new one and re-installing everything)... :)
The simple reason I didn't buy a PC or other type of old Mac was I don't like towers or desktop boxes, the iMAC G5 is just perfect for me as it only takes up the same space as a 20" flatscreen TV and I only need it for browsing the web & uploading/downloading stuff... :)
Came to the conclusion that MorphOS is not for me, the iMac does it's job for the net and my Amigas cover every other computing need I have, all in all I'm more than happy with the way things are as they suit my needs perfectly... :)
What about the X1000?
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What about the X1000?
Still very interested in buying one but I'll have to wait (like everyone else) and see what the final specs are when it gets released, if it runs OS4.x it should be ok but if it's running MorphOS then I doubt I'll be buying one... :)
Again though being in a tower is not ideal for me with all my VIC20s, C64s, SNES & Amiga's taking up so much space already, reckon the NatAmi when it gets released will be better suited for me and to be honest more my type of machine ie: 68K... :)
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Actually, it is a bad Ubuntu machine, last I tried (and I seem to recall Franko trying as well) 10.04 and 10.10 didn't work on it, at least not without a lot of trouble.
That's surprising since those releases run fine on a 733Mhz Powermac.
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You should sell both of them and get a G4 Tower with a Radeon to dual boot MorphOS and Leopard. :)
Keep the G5, sell the other. Then follow Nicholas' recommendation.
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Still very interested in buying one but I'll have to wait (like everyone else) and see what the final specs are when it gets released, if it runs OS4.x it should be ok but if it's running MorphOS then I doubt I'll be buying one... :)
Again though being in a tower is not ideal for me with all my VIC20s, C64s, SNES & Amiga's taking up so much space already, reckon the NatAmi when it gets released will be better suited for me and to be honest more my type of machine ie: 68K... :)
Franko, its been repeatedly stated that MorphOS won't be ported to this. And why would that affect your decision to buy an AOs4 PPC based computer?
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Still very interested in buying one but I'll have to wait (like everyone else) and see what the final specs are when it gets released, if it runs OS4.x it should be ok but if it's running MorphOS then I doubt I'll be buying one... :)
Again though being in a tower is not ideal for me with all my VIC20s, C64s, SNES & Amiga's taking up so much space already, reckon the NatAmi when it gets released will be better suited for me and to be honest more my type of machine ie: 68K... :)
I thought you didn't like OS4?
I don't care for it much either these days, it's rapidly becoming a poor Linux clone with less compatibility for Amiga software than MorphOS.
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I thought you didn't like OS4?
I don't care for it much either these days, it's rapidly becoming a poor Linux clone with less compatibility for Amiga software than MorphOS.
Apparently he doesn't like OS4 or MorphOS, Nicholas.
Personally, I secretly suspect Franko actually likes OSX.
And I don't understand the posts about an 800Mhz iMac running Ubuntu or OSX 10.5 poorly as I've run both on more primitive equipment (although Franko may be right about 10.4 being better suited to slower hardware).
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Franko, its been repeatedly stated that MorphOS won't be ported to this. And why would that affect your decision to buy an AOs4 PPC based computer?
Sorry don't understand your question :confused:
@ nicholas
I don't like OS4 on a real Amiga with a PPC card cos it's slower than a dead donkey (although Karlos tells me it's ok if you have a GFX card)... :)
But, if the X1000 is built to handle OS4 and has good enough specs on it's final release then it should run OS4 at it's best... (I hope) :)
MorphOS even though Iggy has pointed out it wont be used on the X1000 is after much mulling over by myself not for me mainly due to the silly Licence you have to buy for it, far too restrictive in my opinion... :)
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Apparently he doesn't like OS4 or MorphOS, Nicholas.
Personally, I secretly suspect Franko actually likes OSX.
And I don't understand the posts about an 800Mhz iMac running Ubuntu or OSX 10.5 poorly as I've run both on more primitive equipment (although Franko may be right about 10.4 being better suited to slower hardware).
Visit some mac forums and you find that on these particular iMacG4 models the processing power needed for OSX 10.5 and the drain on resources just slows them down to an unusable state... :)
You can't change or upgrade anything in these models other than the HD & DVD drives as everything is incorporated onto the MB so your stuck with what you've got.... :(
From what I've learned from other Mac users on those forums it's mainly down to the particular GFX card on them and the bus speeds, simply put an iMAC G4 PPC 800Mhz is quite a good machine as long as you don't try and go beyond OSX 10.4.11... :)
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Sorry don't understand your question :confused:
@ nicholas
I don't like OS4 on a real Amiga with a PPC card cos it's slower than a dead donkey (although Karlos tells me it's ok if you have a GFX card)... :)
But, if the X1000 is built to handle OS4 and has good enough specs on it's final release then it should run OS4 at it's best... (I hope) :)
MorphOS even though Iggy has pointed out it wont be used on the X1000 is after much mulling over by myself not for me mainly due to the silly Licence you have to buy for it, far too restrictive in my opinion... :)
OS4 is tied to the hardware in much the same way as MorphOS is.
Say you break your OS4 box, you have to buy another OS4 licence when you buy a new box as it comes bundled with it and is priced accordingly.
You cannot buy any OS4 hardware without an OS4 license being bundled with it.
Same as when you buy an Apple computer, OSX is bundled with it and is priced accordingly. You cannot buy any Mac without an OSX license being bundled with it.
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@ nicholas
OS4 isnt tied to one machine or a single licence, I can install my on any Amiga own as all it requires is the serial/registration number printed on the disk envelope to work... :)
Heck. if I really wanted to I could give it away to everyone and they could download the OS4 cd ISO image from plenty of sites on the web and they would be able to run it easily on any machines they own with a PPC board... :)
So it's not tied to the hardware or needing another licence if one of my Amiga were to break all I have to do is install it on another Amiga and enter the number... :)
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@ nicholas
OS4 isnt tied to one machine or a single licence, I can install my on any Amiga own as all it requires is the serial/registration number printed on the disk envelope to work... :)
Heck. if I really wanted to I could give it away to everyone and they could download the OS4 cd ISO image from plenty of sites on the web and they would be able to run it easily on any machines they own with a PPC board... :)
So it's not tied to the hardware or needing another licence if one of my Amiga were to break all I have to do is install it on another Amiga and enter the number... :)
We weren't talking about Amiga's, we were talking about OS4 boxes (X1000/Sam/A1)
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We weren't talking about Amiga's, we were talking about OS4 boxes (X1000/Sam/A1)
I was talking about OS4 on my Amiga... :)
Anyway if the X1000 is released with OS4 and all that restricting licensing crap then just like my Macs it won't take me long to hack it so I can get rid of such restrictions... ;)
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Sorry don't understand your question :confused:
@ nicholas
I don't like OS4 on a real Amiga with a PPC card cos it's slower than a dead donkey (although Karlos tells me it's ok if you have a GFX card)... :)
But, if the X1000 is built to handle OS4 and has good enough specs on it's final release then it should run OS4 at it's best... (I hope) :)
MorphOS even though Iggy has pointed out it wont be used on the X1000 is after much mulling over by myself not for me mainly due to the silly Licence you have to buy for it, far too restrictive in my opinion... :)
The MorphOS license restriction complaint is valid. When I build a new PC I can move my copy of Windows to it, but with MorphOS I have to buy another key.
Franko, you DO have a point.
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The MorphOS license restriction complaint is valid. When I build a new PC I can move my copy of Windows to it, but with MorphOS I have to buy another key.
Franko, you DO have a point.
If I buy an OS which is after all just a piece of software and it's restricted to only be used on one machine I own and I have to pay for it again if I buy a new higher spec computer, then to me that's just a total rip off... :(
The way I see it I paid for it, it's mine to use as I see fit (despite the licence agreement) and if I want to use it on machines that I own then I do so even if it means hacking it... :)
Plain and simple some of these so called licence agreements are total BS and just ripping folks off... :)
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I was talking about OS4 on my Amiga... :)
Anyway if the X1000 is released with OS4 and all that restricting licensing crap then just like my Macs it won't take me long to hack it so I can get rid of such restrictions... ;)
Hack what exactly? There is nothing to hack.
When you buy the hardware to replace the broken hardware a new OS4 license comes bundled with it. Which will make you the owner of one broken board, one working board and two fully paid for licences of OS4.
What are you going to do with the second license?
Sell it? To who? For what purpose? All "designed for OS4" boxes come bundled with a license whether you want one or not?
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The MorphOS license restriction complaint is valid. When I build a new PC I can move my copy of Windows to it, but with MorphOS I have to buy another key.
Franko, you DO have a point.
Indeed, but Franko doesn't seem to realise that OS4 licencing is just as bad.
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Hack what exactly? There is nothing to hack.
When you buy the hardware to replace the broken hardware a new OS4 license comes bundled with it. Which will make you the owner of one broken board, one working board and two fully paid for licences of OS4.
What are you going to do with the second license?
Sell it? To who? For what purpose? All "designed for OS4" boxes come bundled with a license whether you want one or not?
That is an interesting point. I doubt the copy they ship with each board is generic. Meaning you probably can't use a CD copy of AmigaOS4 that was shipped with your SAM to install AOS on your Pegasos or original AmigaOne XE.
At least with a MorphOS license, if the original hardware fails you can ask the developers for permission to move to a new system. And if you buy a new system, you can sell the old one with its MOS license.
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Hack what exactly? There is nothing to hack.
When you buy the hardware to replace the broken hardware a new OS4 license comes bundled with it. Which will make you the owner of one broken board, one working board and two fully paid for licences of OS4.
What are you going to do with the second license?
Sell it? To who? For what purpose? All "designed for OS4" boxes come bundled with a license whether you want one or not?
Just one example on the mac, it comes with QuickTime Player but the save/export and stuff are disabled unless you pay Apple more dosh for a registration to "unlock it" so I said f' that and hacked it to unlock these features... :)
I wasn't talking about OS4 on OS4 "boxes" (whatever they are) I was talking about OS4 on real Amiga hardware... :)
If the X1000 comes with OS4 then fair enough but it's highly unlikely that their going to produce a new better model in the near future that I would be willing to pay that kind of money for to buy again, and if it broke within the first couple of years then you can be sure AEON would be hearing from me and I certainly would be paying for another one so I wouldn't have two licenses... :)
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Oh, well... didn't get it. The guy gave it to someone else.