Amiga.org
Amiga computer related discussion => Amiga Hardware Issues and discussion => Topic started by: nicholas on November 27, 2010, 09:56:49 PM
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Place your bets ladies and gentlemen!
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Better watch this and have fun
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9VDvgL58h_Y
It is the AROS spoon!
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While to me the Classic Amiga hardware will always be in my future, I voted for the FPGA 68K hardware + OS3.x , as I think this is what the Natami is going to be and would suit me the best personally, I'd really like to see that project reach fruition...
I'd also like to see all the others succeed too, except of course the last option as the Amiga will never die... :)
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we're all doomed
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adz you should be ashamed of yourself
tsk tsk tsk tsk *waves finger*
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I would like to see Morthos combined with AROS :)
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Better watch this and have fun
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9VDvgL58h_Y
It is the AROS spoon!
Now that's what I call funny... :roflmao:
Thank you for posting that, still laughing my head off right now... :roflmao:
Cheers... :drink:
[youtube]9VDvgL58h_Y[/youtube]
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That video was really funny :roflmao:(http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZN5PoW7_kdA&feature=related)
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Try this video. It's funny too! :roflmao:
[youtube]ZN5PoW7_kdA[/youtube]
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I would like to see Morthos combined with AROS :)
The Projects have shared code already. :)
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Matthew, your choice of answer has shocked me!
I expected "FPGA 68k hardware + AROS68k" or "x86 hardware + AROS" from you.
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I can't really participate in this vote as I think it should have been a multiple choice one. The community has gone in several different directions and I don't think there'll ever be a "sole survivor", nor does there deserve to be. Whilst it was still in production, the amiga was a lot of different things to a lot of different people. Now that it's not and people have taken steps to continue it's legacy in the direction they think is the right one, no one option is ever going to please everybody again.
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I can't really participate in this vote as I think it should have been a multiple choice one. The community has gone in several different directions and I don't think there'll ever be a "sole survivor", nor does there deserve to be. Whilst it was still in production, the amiga was a lot of different things to a lot of different people. Now that it's not and people have taken steps to continue it's legacy in the direction they think is the right one, no one option is ever going to please everybody again.
Just assume that Darwinian laws apply to the options in this poll and eventually only the strongest one will survive. Then pick one. :)
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Matthew, your choice of answer has shocked me!
I expected "FPGA 68k hardware + AROS68k" or "x86 hardware + AROS" from you.
FPGA 68k + AROS68k will be for the retro dudes... X86 + AROS will be for the die hard nerds that want Amiga + grunt... But realistically the average Joe is going to want a free emulator they can run on their desktop, and have a little nostalgia trip once in a while :)
While it's not the answer I would dream of, it's the most realistic from my perspective.
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FPGA 68k + AROS68k will be for the retro dudes... X86 + AROS will be for the die hard nerds that want Amiga + grunt... But realistically the average Joe is going to want a free emulator they can run on their desktop, and have a little nostalgia trip once in a while :)
While it's not the answer I would dream of, it's the most realistic from my perspective.
Agree, this should have been a multichoise poll :-) Though AROS likely playing a part in the OS part of the options .. X86 hardware, FPGA, and the Classic computers likely living their life out being well used as well.. Was there ever computers used for as long as Commodores ?? :-D They must have beat the records for any computers being used to death now !
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I'm going to have to agree with Bloodline for the most part.
I do think that the 'standard' install will be AROSx86 running an integrated AROS68K. This will would work directly on hardware, in an emulator, with new Aros software and with classic software.
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Quite frankly this topic has been done to death and I am sick and tired of talking about it.
It's over. We lost.
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Well, unless you have invented a time machine that will let you prevent the Amiga from ever being created, or the earth is completely destroyed in some kind of catyclism, the Amiga will exist in some form in the future.
The question is what form(S) will that be.
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Well, unless you have invented a time machine that will let you prevent the Amiga from ever being created, or the earth is completely destroyed in some kind of catyclism, the Amiga will exist in some form in the future.
The question is what form will that be.
Correction - forms
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Corrected...
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As far as I know the Ohio Scientific Challenger 1p is also protected from 'non-existance' by the apparent non-existance of a time machine, and persistent longevity of the earth.
But I don't think this is a 'future' just a 'past'.
That's why I surprised myself by selecting PPC + OS 4.
The rest seemed like retro - as unlikely as PPC + OS 4 is, PPC is still alive - with new CPU's being released, and OS 4 - the same.
Oh don't get me wrong, I almost picked 'no future', but, that's not quite true yet. it may not have much of a future, it may be a sick one - but it's not played out yet.
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Somebody should nominate the Amiga Computer for a Darwin award.....
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PPC hardware + Aros :p
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To me, the Amiga was that great system that existed back in the late 1980s, that amazed everyone and provided us with hours of enjoyment (and had the chance to take over the world!)...
It is (was?) the custom hardware, 68K CPUs and OS3.x...
The new amiga-like systems are interesting hobby projects, but don't represent the spirit of Amiga or what it represented in its day...
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To all those who voted to claim the Amiga is dead... :(
Living a life without hopes & dreams no matter how far fetched they may seem to others, is a sad and wasted life, a blinkered life where you merely follow the crowd blindly into a bleak and already pre-scripted future, a world of grey where nothing new or creative ever happens... :(
If it weren't for individuals in the past dreaming & believing that their ideas could come to fruition and who thankfully ignored those who scoffed at them and told them their dreams were nothing more than just dreams, then none of us would have ever heard of the word computer and be sitting here today using one of mans greatest ever achievements... :)
It's never too late to change your way of thinking you know... :)
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I'm the only one that voted for original hardware and OS. I like that.
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Living a life without hopes & dreams no matter how far fetched they may seem to others, is a sad and wasted life
I save my hopes and dreams for something bigger than an Amiga revival. Give me whirled peas!
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Give me whirled peas!
What are whirled peas?
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I save my hopes and dreams for something bigger than an Amiga revival. Give me whirled peas!
You can never have too many hopes & dreams tone007, let the Amiga be a small part of them... :)
(are whirled peas the same as mushy peas ???)
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This is why we don't have world peace, no one's heard of whirled peas!
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YUK!!
(http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3228/3021904940_993709deca.jpg)
(http://www.mmfoodsalcudia.co.uk/Images/sundries/MushyPeas.jpg)
(http://i52.tinypic.com/24voack.jpg)
Mushy peas! YUK!
BANGERS AND SPEW!
@ Franko is this a scottish recipe?
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YUK!!
@ Franko is this a scottish recipe?
Nah, mushy peas originated around Yorkshire (I think) I think they used them for repairing holes in their shoes back in the old days... :)
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Nah, mushy peas originated around Yorkshire (I think) I think they used them for repairing holes in their shoes back in the old days... :)
They wore shoes in Yorkshire? I thought it was just a London thing. :roflmao:
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They wore shoes in Yorkshire? I thought it was just a London thing. :roflmao:
Legend has it that there was only ever one pair of shoes in Yorkshire and everyone took a turn at wearing them, hence the need to repair the rather worn out old things with mushy peas... so I've heard, but don't quote me on that... :lol:
(I think the posh git's in London had 3 pairs... :) )
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Ask yourself, what can the Amiga architecture do that other machines can't presently ..?
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Ask yourself, what can the Amiga architecture do that other machines can't presently ..?
Um... well... it can inspire a fanatical following... that's about all I can think of...
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Ask yourself, what can the Amiga architecture do that other machines can't presently ..?
Answers: well other machines can't...
Play Paula audio with the exact same same quality that the paula actually produces...
Display interlace screens with the same annoying flicker that I actually quite like...
Run 68k code without the use of an emulator of some kind...
Beat the Amiga's bootup time...
Run lots of progs on only 2meg of chip ram...
They don't do screen dragging...
Allow you to get involved in a mad bidding war on ebay to pay a crazy price for a decade old or more piece of kit...
and many other quirks of the Amiga too numerable to mention...:)
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Answers: well other machines can't...
Play Paula audio with the exact same same quality that the paula actually produces...
Display interlace screens with the same annoying flicker that I actually quite like...
Run 68k code without the use of an emulator of some kind...
Beat the Amiga's bootup time...
Run lots of progs on only 2meg of chip ram...
They don't do screen dragging...
Allow you to get involved in a mad bidding war on ebay to pay a crazy price for a decade old or more piece of kit...
and many other quirks of the Amiga too numerable to mention...:)
1.76MB Floppys :)
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FPGA 68K + OS3.1, Natami FTW! :lol:
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Answers: well other machines can't...
Beat the Amiga's bootup time...
You haven't seen MorphOS boot have you Franko? If you have to boot your Amiga from a hard drive (not just rely on ROMs) , I think we may have you beat.
The POST that the machine performs before booting takes longer than booting the OS.
In that fashion MOS is very Amiga like (small, efficient, and quick to boot).
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You haven't seen MorphOS boot have you Franko? If you have to boot your Amiga from a hard drive (not just rely on ROMs) , I think we may have you beat.
The POST that the machine performs before booting takes longer than booting the OS.
In that fashion MOS is very Amiga like (small, efficient, and quick to boot).
Nope, your right their Iggy I haven't seen how quickly a MorphOS system boots. I can only speak for the couple of iMacs I've got and seeing other folk using PC's.
The iMacG4 can take anything upto 1minute 15 seconds to boot and this new iMacG5 I've got can take as long as 1minute 48 seconds and sometimes they take even longer to shut down, not exactly fast eh... :(
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Nope, your right their Iggy I haven't seen how quickly a MorphOS system boots. I can only speak for the couple of iMacs I've got and seeing other folk using PC's.
The iMacG4 can take anything upto 1minute 15 seconds to boot and this new iMacG5 I've got can take as long as 1minute 48 seconds and sometimes they take even longer to shut down, not exactly fast eh... :(
I just tested a warm reboot. From shut down to booted back up - 34 seconds.
This ain't OSX!
Btw - I must be spending too much time around the English and Scottish. Those mushy peas are digusting, but the bangers and mash are making me kind of hungry.
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It's not bangers and mash it's bangers and spew!
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The elegance of the PC os...
C:\WINDOWS C:\WINDOWS\GO C:\PC\CRAWL
Any questions?
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All this talk of food was making me feel hungry too, decided to have some nice steak pies for dinner... (no mushy peas... boak...)
What I don't get though is cooking instruction number 3. Encourage an even bake by rotating once during cooking...
I stood in front of the oven and turned around once like it said but they still came out burnt on the one side...
(http://i995.photobucket.com/albums/af79/frankosamiga/Funny/DSC00221.jpg)...(http://i995.photobucket.com/albums/af79/frankosamiga/Funny/DSC00219.jpg)
I ended up with this...
(http://i995.photobucket.com/albums/af79/frankosamiga/Funny/DSC00223.jpg)
Reckon next time I'll trying spinning around a few times, give a few cheers and a small round of applause and see if that helps... :)
(binned it & phoned for a nice home delivery Curry instead... :) )
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Any questions?
Yes...
Do you know where I left my good pen (you know the silver one that always writes first time) I put it down somewhere and now I can't find It... :confused:
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errmmm, is it up your kilt? Let's have a look shall we? :rolleyes:
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errmmm, is it up your kilt? Let's have a look shall we? :rolleyes:
Nah... that's just piles up thier... :eek:
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Hmmmmm... lets see what's on todays edition of The Daily Up Kilt
(http://www.iamtrex.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/06/ohmy.jpg)
(http://www.myspaceantics.com/images/myspace-graphics/funny-pictures/blown-kilt.jpg)
(http://www.veryfunnypics.com/pics/kids/images/kilt.jpg)
(http://annaleis.files.wordpress.com/2006/07/under_the_kilt_3.jpg)
(http://www.coool-stuff.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/04/kilt1.jpg)
(http://www.planetbears.com/members/galleries/640-480/9f59620f-b470-45ce-b260-983e69b26b5c-kilt-weekend-button-001.jpg)
(http://kiltblog.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/01/kiltcheckmovitationalposter.jpg)
Verdict? Interesting...
(http://www.iamtrex.com/?p=1170)
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How about an modern Amiga in spirit and not just name, nobody seems to be working on that...
You can never have too many hopes & dreams tone007, let the Amiga be a small part of them... :)
(are whirled peas the same as mushy peas ???)
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Verdict? Interesting...
Verdict? I seriously considered putting my own eyes out. I'd even eat the mushy peas if I could renounce those images.
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Verdict? I seriously considered putting my own eyes out. I'd even eat the mushy peas if I could renounce those images.
I'm not sure that would work. I'm pretty sure that's where mushy peas come from!
Ask Franko. But i'm pretty sure Yorkshire is somewhere up the kilt?
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persia, I have thought along the same track. What could be done on say 500 EUR that really rocks performance wise.
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Ewww we dont need those upkilt shots !! This is a family site :-P Where is the mods !! :-D
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Anyway we could stay more on topic? I'm surprised that post of Kesa's didn't get us shut down like the fat lady thread.
My ideal new system to carry forward the Amiga concept?
I'm not sure it wouldn't be too different from an Xbox360.
Multicore PPC related processor.
GPU on the same die as the CPU (only with a more integrated approach than the current Xenon).
Obviously more memory and expandability (and a keyboard and mouse).
Modern genlocking and VIVO components and high quality audio would round it all out.
All with a big enough backer and large scale production, yeah 500 Euros might be possible.
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Anyway we could stay more on topic? I'm surprised that post of Kesa's didn't get us shut down like the fat lady thread.
This IS a family thread! Were you offended when Marilyn Monroe's skirt went up because of that air vent below? I think not. How is the above any different? :confused:
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This IS a family thread! Were you offended when Marilyn Monroe's skirt went up because of that air vent below? I think not. How is the above any different? :confused:
I don't remember seeing Marilyn's rear or private parts. And I personal would have prefered that. Frankly, even though male, I find no particular beauty in male posteriors or genitalia.
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How about an modern Amiga in spirit and not just name, nobody seems to be working on that...
if you ask me, that sort of thing would be a game console
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Enough with the gay porn. Put some boobies on if you want though.
So for those people who said 'the future is dead' explain how the end will come.
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So for those people who said 'the future is dead' explain how the end will come.
Amiga is Betamax.
As far as the end goes, it'll dwindle as successive computer using generations come into their own. Right now there are people who have completed highschool who weren't even born whilst C= were still a going concern.
In a few years time they will be graduates. Whole generations who, outside of a tiny handful of geeks, will never hear about, much less use an Amiga.
@Archan RE the fpga stuff: They're much smaller than the original hardware less delicate due to age and if the minimig is anything to go by, cheaper than "original" hardware of a comparative spec. As for uses for one, excluding games?
Demoscene stuff.
/me goes back to lurking :)
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To all who say the Amiga is dead, then why do you hang around Amiga sites (and most likely still using an Amiga in some form) spouting your keech, do you have some kind of weird fetish for dead things, seems the only logical explanation to me... :)
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I suppose people will know what I voted, x86 + Aros.
However, I do have an X1000 beta on order as well as my A3000 and A1000 sitting here.
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As a big brand consumer item Amiga is dead. The people who remember the brand are now not of the age that buy computers regularly enough to warrant a revitalisation of the brand name. Not even Commodore (arguably a more widely known brand name) had any success revitalising their brand.
As a platform it is dead and the majority of clever people who used to develop for the platform have found more interesting things to do.
The reason we are here (on Amiga forums) is for one thing. Nostalgia. We like our classic Amiga's and remember the good old days.
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As a big brand consumer item Amiga is dead. The people who remember the brand are now not of the age that buy computers regularly enough to warrant a revitalisation of the brand name. Not even Commodore (arguably a more widely known brand name) had any success revitalising their brand.
As a platform it is dead and the majority of clever people who used to develop for the platform have found more interesting things to do.
The reason we are here (on Amiga forums) is for one thing. Nostalgia. We like our classic Amiga's and remember the good old days.
Well it's obvious that as a big brand consumer item the Amiga has been a long time dead. I don't get why you think age has anything to do with buying a computer regularly nor what it has to do with a revitalisation of the brand name. I know plenty of folk aged 50+ that constantly buy new computers or laptops (PC's)
On the subject of nostalgia, then why if it's just for the sake of nostalgia do some of the same people who voted no go on about looking forward to the continuing development of AROS, MorphOS and different processors to run as an Amiga, thats not nostalgia thats looking forward.
I've been using classic Amiga's since the very start and still do to this very day, so as far as I'm concerned it's nothing to do with nostalgia as I always have and always will use my Amigas as my main computer system... :)
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The reason we are here (on Amiga forums) is for one thing. Nostalgia. We like our classic Amiga's and remember the good old days.
While that's part of it, it wouldn't have been enough to get me back to the community after 12 years away. I came back because I want my daily computing experience to be more Amiga-like and want to find a way to make that happen. I'm sick and tired of waiting (in vain) for other OS's to provide what I loved from the Amiga.
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On the subject of nostalgia, then why if it's just for the sake of nostalgia do some of the same people who voted no go on about looking forward to the continuing development of AROS, MorphOS and different processors to run as an Amiga, thats not nostalgia thats looking forward.
Not really, it's about maintaining our hobby as the original machine fail. Like putting a Mazda mx5 engine into an old Triumph Spitfire, you do it because the engines are about the same size and built for a similar purpose, except the newer Mazda engine is more efficient, cheap spare parts and it basically bulletproof... So your old Spitfire can be enjoyed for a few more years (you can tell, I'm not a purist :) )
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(you can tell, I'm not a purist :) )
Glad to hear it. Rumour has it the spitfires were a ba**ard to fly anyway :)
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I know plenty of folk aged 50+ that constantly buy new computers or laptops (PC's)
And who did they tell? Word of mouth sells hardware and 50+ people barely have 1-2 friends if any.
if it's just for the sake of nostalgia do some of the same people who voted no go on about looking forward to the continuing development of AROS, MorphOS and different processors to run as an Amiga, thats not nostalgia thats looking forward.
Nah, it's just curiosity. Like poking a dead animal.
I've been using classic Amiga's since the very start and still do to this very day, so as far as I'm concerned it's nothing to do with nostalgia as I always have and always will use my Amigas as my main computer system... :)
How the feck do you manage? The classic Amiga sucks balls when it comes to video, audio and interweb. I'd bet money you're telling porkies... that you use your Amiga a lot for recreational purposes but use a PC/Mac for day-2-day work & interweb.
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I'm sick and tired of waiting (in vain) for other OS's to provide what I loved from the Amiga.
Heh, heh. I'm the other way around. I got sick and tired of waiting for AmigaOS to provide features which other OS's take for granted.
I wonder what the percentage of Amiga's never ever saw Workbench used ever? I bet it's in the high 90%+ range
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Heh, heh. I'm the other way around. I got sick and tired of waiting for AmigaOS to provide features which other OS's take for granted.
Well, lack of other things I needed was the reason I moved fully to Linux in '98/'99 and put up with all the crap that entailed.
I wonder what the percentage of Amiga's never ever saw Workbench used ever? I bet it's in the high 90%+ range
Sounds high. All of the people I knew that had Amigas while at school regularly used it for other things than games.
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Well it's obvious that as a big brand consumer item the Amiga has been a long time dead.
At least we can all agree on that point.
On the subject of nostalgia, then why if it's just for the sake of nostalgia do some of the same people who voted no go on about looking forward to the continuing development of AROS, MorphOS and different processors to run as an Amiga, thats not nostalgia thats looking forward.
Never know what can spark something new and advanced Amiga-like OS. Find good hardware that an sell and it might bring enough interest back from Devs to work on something that is truly Next Generation.
I've been using classic Amiga's since the very start and still do to this very day, so as far as I'm concerned it's nothing to do with nostalgia as I always have and always will use my Amigas as my main computer system... :)
Good for you. I as well as many others find it's not capable of doing modern day web browsing. Even the new OSs (MOS/OS4/AROS) lack hardware punch do to a lack of modern hardware or it's locked in step with 3.1 API that will not allow it to be fully use SMP hardware.
I see the poll result is a close race between Dead hardware and AROS on x86. Care to answer why that is Franko?
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And who did they tell? Word of mouth sells hardware and 50+ people barely have 1-2 friends if any.
My 73 year old mother owns a laptop and a netbook, both of which she picked out on her own (and figured out how to use on her own).
She still works part time 2 to 3 days a week as a nurse anesthetist (earning about $50K a year).
And to close, she probably interacts with more people in a day than you do in a month and undoubtedly has at least twice as much residual intellect left than you were born with.
As I approach 50, I'd ask you to keep your smug youth centric comments to yourself. Personally I see no evidence that youth has any advantage in intellect and it certainly hasn't any advantage in wisdom or common sense.
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Quite frankly this topic has been done to death and I am sick and tired of talking about it.
I tend to agree. But, I cannot believe so many here voted that the Amiga is dead. With all of the current projects there is surely hope. No matter what happens, I will at the very least use my current Amiga models until the silicon disintegrates (or I die, which ever comes first).
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motrucker, The original silicon will die, and the HDL files will reincarnate new silicon as needed ;)
The hardware, brand, software etc.. is likely dead. But not the spirit?, push hardware to the max in a low budget.
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Personally I see no evidence that youth has any advantage in intellect and it certainly hasn't any advantage in wisdom or common sense.
Since when have sales had anything to do with the intelligence of the buyer? Do you not think sales are influenced a lot by networking? And that that older people do less networking? It's a huge generalisation on my part and I'm sure you can find exceptions. Perhaps this generation will buck the trend?
That said older people have more money and tend to steal media far less (possibly cos they are incapable?) and so they still have a good market input... (just look at eBook readers!).
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Since when have sales had anything to do with the intelligence of the buyer? Do you not think sales are influenced a lot by networking? And that that older people do less networking? It's a huge generalisation on my part and I'm sure you can find exceptions. Perhaps this generation will buck the trend?
That said older people have more money and tend to steal media far less (possibly cos they are incapable?) and so they still have a good market input... (just look at eBook readers!).
Well, you've totally confused me with the polarized posts. And I do agree that generalizing is a poor form of judgement. I've found that its best to withold judgement of people until they really prove their character.
Trusting in my first impression (of a person) has led me to some big mistakes. These days, while I generally expect to be disappointed by people, I frequently find myself pleasantly surprised (a good arguement against prejudgdice).
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:eek:
And who did they tell? Word of mouth sells hardware and 50+ people barely have 1-2 friends if any.
Nah, it's just curiosity. Like poking a dead animal.
How the feck do you manage? The classic Amiga sucks balls when it comes to video, audio and interweb. I'd bet money you're telling porkies... that you use your Amiga a lot for recreational purposes but use a PC/Mac for day-2-day work & interweb.
Gawd knows what age you are mate but if you're over 50 and only have 1 to 2 friends, then nip doon ra vets n get yirself pit doon... :lol:
Ah suppose poking a dead animal is normal around Oxford... :eek:
Easy, same way as I've managed for the past 25 years, never been on the internet until about six months ago when I took a hairy fit and bought an old mac. Nae tall stories here mate the mac only gets used for the net (only thing it's good for) everything else is done on an Amiga (as should be)... :)
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Easy, same way as I've managed for the past 25 years, never been on the internet until about six months ago when I took a hairy fit and bought an old mac. Nae tall stories here mate the mac only gets used for the net (only thing it's good for) everything else is done on an Amiga (as should be)... :)
Only six months on the Net and you added links to your signature block? I find that hard to believe, TBH.
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Only six months on the Net and you added links to your signature block? I find that hard to believe, TBH.
Believe what you want mate, Im a fast learner... :)
If it takes you any longer than couple of weeks to figure out how to add a link to something then there's not much hope for you and you must be a PC user... :)
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To all who say the Amiga is dead, then why do you hang around Amiga sites (and most likely still using an Amiga in some form) spouting your keech, do you have some kind of weird fetish for dead things, seems the only logical explanation to me... :)
Well, you have agreed that as far as the market is concerned that it is indeed dead. No market, no future.
You say you have a used Mac to get you on the web and use your Amiga for everything else, why are you using a Mac to browse the web? Why isn't your Amiga capable of doing it as well? At the least, you can have your Amiga linked up through your Mac and cruise the internet with a Amiga browser?
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Well, you have agreed that as far as the market is concerned that it is indeed dead. No market, no future.
You say you have a used Mac to get you on the web and use your Amiga for everything else, why are you using a Mac to browse the web? Why isn't your Amiga capable of doing it as well? At the least, you can have your Amiga linked up through your Mac and cruise the internet with a Amiga browser?
No market, No future, then why do all things second hand and no longer produced have a profitable market on ebay... or is ebay something that I've just imagined in my short time here on the net... :)
There are plenty folk here who have given me advice on how to get the Amiga on the net, I just haven't got round to it yet (been too busy here chatting to good folk like yourself...) :)
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The lack of marketability is hurting the attempts to keep the Amiga alive, but its also placing the development in the hands of people that care about the system (they have to be commited - they sure aren't making much money).
And "Trickle Up Poverty"? That has been a phenomenon since Reagan was in office. You remember Reagan don't you? the President who made the largest increase in our national deficit in history (followed distantly by George W. Bush as the second highest deficit increaser).
Got love the people of Florida, they'd shoot themselves in the foot to elect the worst possible choice. At least my state (Delaware), a State that is just as or more conservative than Florida wasn't voting for the wacko candidate (Christine O'Donnell)
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Im not too sure things will change drastically, some people will continue to enjoy the amiga in whatever form(s) they have an interest, while others will continue to talk to themselves in the open about how dead it is, or question choices and/or efforts made by people that develop for the machine theyve been deeming dead for years. I've never understood these people, do they really think telling those that do enjoy thier "amigas" (in whatever form) things theyre not aware of ?
I enjoy my amiga hobby, but Im well aware that it has some shortcomings in regards to mainstream standards and expectations, but it gives me other things I cant get elsewhere as well.
As for those doubting a persons ability to make do soley with an Amiga, how is this so hard to believe ? Sure, the browsing leaves something to be desired on OS3.x, but there's not a lot of bases that cant be covered with some effort.
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The people that chose that Amiga is dead, well, besides of they are very negatives what demons do writing and continu in this forum? There is more optimistic, other systems, so go very well, for example MAC with its X86 expensives machines.
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You say you have a used Mac to get you on the web and use your Amiga for everything else, why are you using a Mac to browse the web? Why isn't your Amiga capable of doing it as well? At the least, you can have your Amiga linked up through your Mac and cruise the internet with a Amiga browser?
Well, I don't know about Franko, but not all of us have the money to throw around on the hardware required for decent Amiga-based web browsing :/
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Well, I don't know about Franko, but not all of us have the money to throw around on the hardware required for decent Amiga-based web browsing :/
We'll I aint a millionaire but I'm comfortably well off, no born with a silver spoon in the mouth here, working class & proud to call myself so, left school aged 15 worked damned hard for every penny I have until aged 37 when an accident which led to Ill health caused me to retire early but by then I had made enough to live off till the end of my days. (and before any one shouts sponger or living of the state, no I don't claim benefits of any sort as my savings put me way beyond that bracket). Hope that clears that one up... :)
So yes while I have the money to do whatever I want Amiga wise, it's only that I've not got around to buying the bit's and bobs yet to get my miggies on the net but I should be doing so in the near future... :)
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We'll I aint a millionaire but I'm comfortably well off, no born with a silver spoon in the mouth here, working class & proud to call myself so, left school aged 15 worked damned hard for every penny I have until aged 37 when an accident which led to Ill health caused me to retire early but by then I had made enough to live off till the end of my days. (and before any one shouts sponger or living of the state, no I don't claim benefits of any sort as my savings put me way beyond that bracket). Hope that clears that one up... :)
So yes while I have the money to do whatever I want Amiga wise, it's only that I've not got around to buying the bit's and bobs yet to get my miggies on the net but I should be doing so in the near future... :)
I don't know Franko. You might find web browsing on an Amiga a tad painful. Even using MorphOS has presented some compromise (flash support under OWB is awful).
Hey, I hear you've got some early season snow over there. How bad is it?
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I don't know Franko. You might find web browsing on an Amiga a tad painful. Even using MorphOS has presented some compromise (flash support under OWB is awful).
Hey, I hear you've got some early season snow over there. How bad is it?
I know it can't do everything but I'd like to give it a try anyway, Im not expecting to use it for YouTube and stuff like that, but I'd like to see just what it can do... :)
Well the thermometers at -8c just now and a good 12 to 14 inches has fallen since yesterday, my squirrels are buried up past their heads... :)
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I know it can't do everything but I'd like to give it a try anyway, Im not expecting to use it for YouTube and stuff like that, but I'd like to see just what it can do... :)
Well the thermometers at -8c just now and a good 12 to 14 inches has fallen since yesterday, my squirrels are buried up past their heads... :)
Yes, there's more to the internet than YouTube and I'm getting by quite well w/o flash.
As to the weather, you have my sympathy. It doesn't bode well when England and Scotland get foul weather this early in the year.
I live in a Mid-Atlantic State in the US that usually only sees a little snow each year and last year there was almost three feet in my back yard when they were trucking snow into the Canadian Winter Olympics.
Some people insist there no evidence of climate change, but if there isn't then Mother Nature has had a strange sense of humor recently.
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Some people insist there no evidence of climate change, but if there isn't then Mother Nature has had a strange sense of humor recently.
Those who claim there is no evidence of climate change soon change their minds when they get flooded out and lose all their belongings... :)
Scotland never really has much of a summer but for the past 4 years now we've had nothing at all, it's done nothing but pish doon and the sun is now nothing more than a myth we tell our grandchildren about... :)
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As a big brand consumer item Amiga is dead. The people who remember the brand are now not of the age that buy computers regularly enough to warrant a revitalisation of the brand name. Not even Commodore (arguably a more widely known brand name) had any success revitalising their brand.
.
While I'll agree it may be irrelevant today, I wouldn't say Amiga users are old/past it. At lot of us (particularly in europe) got them as kids. I'm 29 and buy new machines every 18 months-2 years. I got an A600 for xmas when I was 11, my younger brother is 23 and he remembers the Amiga very well, we still play Lemmings, Hired Guns, Lotus, etc. A lot of people in their late 20s-early 30s were Amiga users as kids, and people in their early-mid 20s will have have older siblings who owned Amigas so know them too.
I wouldn't say the ex-Amiga users are all now geriatric patients.
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Im not too sure things will change drastically, some people will continue to enjoy the amiga in whatever form(s) they have an interest, while others will continue to talk to themselves in the open about how dead it is, or question choices and/or efforts made by people that develop for the machine theyve been deeming dead for years. I've never understood these people, do they really think telling those that do enjoy thier "amigas" (in whatever form) things theyre not aware of ?
I enjoy my amiga hobby, but Im well aware that it has some shortcomings in regards to mainstream standards and expectations, but it gives me other things I cant get elsewhere as well.
As for those doubting a persons ability to make do soley with an Amiga, how is this so hard to believe ? Sure, the browsing leaves something to be desired on OS3.x, but there's not a lot of bases that cant be covered with some effort.
I think people overlook that there's more to the internet than web browsing and there's a lot more to computers than the internet :)
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I think people overlook that there's more to the internet than web browsing and there's a lot more to computers than the internet :)
Well said! :)
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The reason we are here (on Amiga forums) is for one thing. Nostalgia. We like our classic Amiga's and remember the good old days.
I second that Alex. For me its pure retro nostalgia.... doing things now with Amiga hardware that I could never afford or attain back when it was 'current'.
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Those who claim there is no evidence of climate change soon change their minds when they get flooded out and lose all their belongings... :)
Scotland never really has much of a summer but for the past 4 years now we've had nothing at all, it's done nothing but pish doon and the sun is now nothing more than a myth we tell our grandchildren about... :)
I love the Northern Irish weather. It matches the general undercurrent of emotion.
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I love the Northern Irish weather. It matches the general undercurrent of emotion.
I see what you mean, miserable and depressing... :lol:
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Well it's obvious that as a big brand consumer item the Amiga has been a long time dead. I don't get why you think age has anything to do with buying a computer regularly nor what it has to do with a revitalisation of the brand name. I know plenty of folk aged 50+ that constantly buy new computers or laptops (PC's)
agreed. My very first computer may have been an Amiga 2000 in 1989, but I have had more since then. Including another Amiga that I regularly used to make web pages, and write articles about ImageFX for an online magazine (which I got PAID for). AND make various animations for projects - which I got PAID for.
Imagine that! Amiga's can generate income. :)
plus, there's another subtle point that many people seem to miss. I'll try to explain but no guarantee that i will succeed.
When I got my Amiga there were no classes on computer animation/graphics. I learned how to do all that On MY Amiga. In my own time. Eventually I moved to LA which had a ton of computer (Amiga) groups at the time and I learned a bit from those people. But I also walked in there knowing a lot about what I had learned using DeluxePaint and AdPro and ImageFX, etc.
Here's the subtle part: Because the Amiga could multitask REALLY well, I learned how to have a certain work flow that continues to this day no MATTER WHICH OS I happen to be using. MAC, Linux, Windows....whatever. Amiga habits live on.
I used those same Amiga work habits when I did special effects. I became very good at figuring out software Because I had started out using an Amiga. When I went for jobs which used proprietary software, i impressed the potential employers with my VERY fast learning curve on software that I had never seen before. And I'm talking about MINUTES.
All that and more is possible because the Amiga is a great teaching machine. People may think the Amiga is "dead", but not in my life, it ain't.
I may not have touched an actual Amiga machine in a while, but the Amiga way of THINKING is in my head and it's not going anywhere.
It has left it's mark forever.
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@ cecilia
I too taught myself everything I know about computers since I got my first Vic 20 back around 82. I ran my own DTP/Grahics Design business around 87 with nothing more than 2 A500's and a couple of Star dot matrix printers and made a tidy sum from doing so.
But I have never left the Amiga since I got my first A1000 in 86, why some folk can't believe that I can achieve all I need from a computer from just using an Amiga is beyond me as is their disbelief that I've only been on the internet for about 6 months and because I can place a link in a post somehow makes me a liar.
The Amiga has taught me that you don't need gigabytes of ram and over bloated code just to achieve a simple task, it's a joy to use and teaches you how to code and perform tasks efficiently without the need for the latest super duper all singing & dancing processor.
No matter what the doubter have to say I don't need to prove myself to them and they can disbelieve all they want as it's not a problem to me. Being of an age where we didn't even have a computers at school and no one to teach us about them, I reckon that's the big difference between older folk like myself (gawd older folk I'm only 46) and the some of younger generations who were born into a world where computers were already established as part of everyday life.
I for one am glad and indeed feel privileged to have been around at the start of true home computing and really wish that some of the younger folk who don't understand this would open their minds to the simple fact that the need for speed and more lifelike graphics just to play a silly 3D game is not all that computing is about, but sadly for some of them I don't think they will ever see it that way. Oh well it's their loss not mine... :)
(and before you youngsters start jumping down my throat, I said SOME not ALL of you... :))
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I don't understand why posting a link is hard :confused:
Isn't it done automatically when you type a http://www.whatever.com address?
It's not rocket science.
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you see it just did then. when i typed http://www.whatever.com it came up underlined and as a link.
soooooo hard.
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I too taught myself everything I know about computers since I got my first Vic 20 back around 82.
The Amiga has taught me that you don't need gigabytes of ram and over bloated code just to achieve a simple task, it's a joy to use and teaches you how to code and perform tasks efficiently without the need for the latest super duper all singing & dancing processor.
No matter what the doubter have to say I don't need to prove myself to them and they can disbelieve all they want as it's not a problem to me. Being of an age where we didn't even have a computers at school and no one to teach us about them, I reckon that's the big difference between older folk like myself (gawd older folk I'm only 46) and the some of younger generations who were born into a world where computers were already established as part of everyday life.
I for one am glad and indeed feel privileged to have been around at the start of true home computing and really wish that some of the younger folk who don't understand this would open their minds to the simple fact that the need for speed and more lifelike graphics just to play a silly 3D game is not all that computing is about, but sadly for some of them I don't think they will ever see it that way.
This is what separates us nerds from the geeks Franko. :)
I started with a Commodore Plus/4. I had to code my own stuff, otherwise I'd have had nowt to use! Lol
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Pay $5, Eat $10 at Chick-O-Pea's Falafel Restaurant?
you see it just did then. when i typed http://www.whatever.com it came up underlined and as a link.
soooooo hard.
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their disbelief that I've only been on the internet for about 6 months and because I can place a link in a post somehow makes me a liar.
Dammy was probably just remembering how long it took him to master hyperlinks.
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Dammy was probably just remembering how long it took him to master hyperlinks.
looooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooool
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Pay $5, Eat $10 at Chick-O-Pea's Falafel Restaurant?
I think you took that a bit too literally i think. It was only a metaphor. :)
A question. Are there any www addresse's left? If the only one available is whatever.com then i think i have my answer
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I for one am glad and indeed feel privileged to have been around at the start of true home computing and really wish that some of the younger folk who don't understand this would open their minds to the simple fact that the need for speed and more lifelike graphics just to play a silly 3D game is not all that computing is about, but sadly for some of them I don't think they will ever see it that way. Oh well it's their loss not mine... :)
While I can appreciate the fact that latest/greatest computer hardware isnt necessary it is hard to go backwards in raw speed when used to something else, even on the Amiga. Movies (viewing and encoding), emulators (for amiga, not *of* amiga), compiling, 2d and 3d graphics, audio processing and many other things will be quicker with more powerful resources under the hood. Not to say theyre essential, but some people actually want faster gear for a practical reason. Would you prefer to render a scene in 4 days, while at the same time severely crippling your amiga, or 7 minutes and still have enough resources to continue using it ?
Dont misunderstand me, I enjoy the classic amiga, it's both my favorite computer and my most absorbing hobby and I too have been around since it's inception, but just because someone wants as much power as they can afford doesnt necessarily mean that they cant appreciate a machine with fewer resources, nor does it make them a mindless drone just trying to keep up with the Joneses. The computer landscape has changed today. Those that do want the latest and greatest in gaming hardware are, ironically, the same type of person that would have gone after an a500 in it's heyday.
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I don't think you can apply Death to amiga any more.. I think we all realise that the Amiga is out of the mainstream now for good, which is a shame.
AROS however given time is perfect for an open source desktop OS that could be mainstream, which is something that linux has been struggling to deliver for years and years.
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I don't think you can apply Death to amiga any more.. I think we all realise that the Amiga is out of the mainstream now for good, which is a shame.
AROS however given time is perfect for an open source desktop OS that could be mainstream, which is something that linux has been struggling to deliver for years and years.
yeah, Im sure IBM is minutes away from switching their business model to AROS.
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yeah, Im sure IBM is minutes away from switching their business model to AROS.
I fail to see how IBMs business model would affect domestic uptake of AROS. I know countless people who want to use an open source operating system, but cannot be bothered with the complexity of linux.
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AROS however given time is perfect for an open source desktop OS that could be mainstream, which is something that linux has been struggling to deliver for years and years.
AROS is decades out of date in terms of capabilities. If you want something as an alternative to linux/bsd, Haiku is in a far superior position in terms of what people would expect from a modern desktop, and tbh even it is somewhat out of date.
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I fail to see how IBMs business model would affect domestic uptake of AROS. I know countless people who want to use an open source operating system, but cannot be bothered with the complexity of linux.
IBM being a giant corporation who's software business model is very heavily based on linux ?
To be commercially viable you need corporations doing the heavy lifting and pulling. Sad but true.
People get discouraged because a wireless card needs a driver in linux, because it doesn't run Excel or it doesn't look like their windows desktop.
If people were eager to jump on an OS with very few applications, very little hardware support and no familiarity whatsoever, I imagine BEOS would have worked out a lot better than it did.
There's two types of people that use computers:
There's people who like figuring things out. They already use what they want to use.
There's people who use whatever came on the machine. They already use what they want to use.
The sad thing, even price is irrelevant in the comparison. People are so used to pirating windows and photoshop etc, that it doesn't make any difference that linux or AROS is "free". The linux people are okay, as they rule the embedded and server application markets. AROS people are okay, as they aim at retro guys and amiga fans.
Fighting over the desktop is pointless as long as there's pirated windows for free from your neighbour.
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IBM being a giant corporation who's software business model is very heavily based on linux ?
To be commercially viable you need corporations doing the heavy lifting and pulling. Sad but true.
I am under no illusions that any form of open source operating system will always play second (third?) fiddle to the big boys OS's however Ubuntu has gained a fair amount of traction as a desktop OS but has failed in the usability stakes due to the lack of intiutiveness of the GUI, if there is going to be an open source alternative to windows why can it not be AROS?
Software will come in time as will drivers, you have to start somewhere.
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Ubuntu has gained a fair amount of traction as a desktop OS but has failed in the usability stakes due to the lack of intiutiveness of the GUI
Really?
Not sure I agree with that, but I'd agree it's not for everyone.
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I am under no illusions that any form of open source operating system will always play second (third?) fiddle to the big boys OS's however Ubuntu has gained a fair amount of traction as a desktop OS but has failed in the usability stakes due to the lack of intiutiveness of the GUI, if there is going to be an open source alternative to windows why can it not be AROS?
Software will come in time as will drivers, you have to start somewhere.
Which GUI ? Gnome 2? KDE? XFCE ? Gnomeshell ?
What does "intuitive" mean in this context?
Here's a quick OS guide:
Windows: To do stuff you click on an icon or pull down a menu.
Mac OS: To do stuff you click on an icon or pull down a menu.
Amiga OS: To do stuff you click on an icon or pull down a menu.
Gnome/KDE/etc/etc/etc: To do stuff you click on an icon or pull down a menu.
When people say something is not "intuitive" to them on a computer, most of the time what they want to say is "Its not what I am used to, and I don't want to learn".
People with that mindset will never use linux, and they'll never use AROS.
And you know what? They don't need to.
You know what else?
The beautiful secret?
We don't need them to.
Live and let live.
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Really?
Not sure I agree with that, but I'd agree it's not for everyone.
Hello Karlos, how are you doing? its been a while!
regarding ubuntu, two words network manager , its terrible ( compared to the windows network GUI ) its fine for us to edit an interfaces file, but for the average joe it should be unnessesary
:-)
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The future and next present of the amiga is to talk about vapour and unfinished projects without enjoy the real things, sadly.
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Hello Karlos, how are you doing? its been a while!
regarding ubuntu, two words network manager , its terrible ( compared to the windows network GUI ) its fine for us to edit an interfaces file, but for the average joe it should be unnessesary
:-)
Assuming you are talking about Gnome here
whats wrong with system-administration-network tools ?
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If people were eager to jump on an OS with very few applications, very little hardware support and no familiarity whatsoever, I imagine BEOS would have worked out a lot better than it did.
BeOS failed partly because Microsoft threatened price favours to any PC supplier that bundled BeOS with their machines. Guess why bundled BSD/Linux machines takes so long.. :S
(link to Haiku (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Haiku_(operating_system)) compatible with BeOS)
There's people who like figuring things out. They already use what they want to use.
They use what's available. Although the available choices may suck.
There's people who use whatever came on the machine. They already use what they want to use.
They use what came with it because they are incapable of anything else.
There's a lot more computer users than in the home computer beginnings. Earlier it was easy to find "alikes" now they are harder to spot ;), the point being that just because people use a computer. They don't necessarly have the mind or interest to dig and learn by them self.
Any feature project may be more successful being focused on the type of people that found home computers in the beginning interesting.
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The future and next present of the amiga is to talk about vapour and unfinished projects without enjoy the real things, sadly.
I enjoy looking forward to what the Amiga future might be, call it vapourware if you want and I wouldn't blame you for that (because of all the vapourware and broken promises of the past), but I still hold out hope that things like the Natami, X1000 and MiniMigAGA will actually see the light of day.
But I use every day the "real things" and I assume most of us expressing our views here do also in one form or another, so unless your talking about yourself I don't quite get your point... :)
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Think of Amiga as in spirit not hardware.. ;)
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Think of Amiga as in spirit not hardware.. ;)
Amiga is blasting tracker tunes throughout the house, as Im cooking spaghetti
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RIAA black helicopters with men in black will soon arrive .. :P
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RIAA black helicopters with men in black will soon arrive .. :P
Yes! Remember, in the US, most legal issues revolve around property riights. That's what our grand promises of freedom and the pursuit of happiness have de-evolved into.
If the number of poor poeple in the US continues to increase (the way it has it recent years) we can take Steven Tyler's advice seriously and "Eat the Rich".
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It's interesting to see peoples thoughts here. Most people project thier own opinions of amiga in thier response to how they view computing, which is a make up of tastes and knowledge on the subject. If the amiga is retro or not is reflected in a persons use. People who use it as a main system tend to (by necessity) be a lot more aware of the system, it's software, and how to do things that a more casual/retro person would be.
All this taken into account and it appears amiga.org is mostly full of the casual/retro crowd.
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I believe an os should take the minimalist approach.
For example i am currently using Windows 7 Utimate. Which is apparently the better version of Basic and Professional. I have used both Ultimate and Basic and i can not tell what the difference is. I think Ultimate has better networking or something (?).
My point is that the vast majority of a modern os will never be accessed by the average consumer. Accessed meaning features available to be used actively by the operator and all the added complexity that happens that the user has no control/knowledge over.
My estimation is this majority above makes up about 90% of a modern os.
If half the stuff in my os doesn't apply to me then why is it there? I believe this is the potiental of AROS.
K.I.S.S. ! :rtfm:
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For example i am currently using Windows 7 Utimate. Which is apparently the better version of Basic and Professional. I have used both Ultimate and Basic and i can not tell what the difference is. I think Ultimate has better networking or something (?).
:rtfm:
Ultimate supports AD domains (among other things) and higher level enterprise networking features.
Other than that, the diff between Ultimate and the
home versions is essentially just shit the average user will never notice, lol.
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AmigaOS (and maybe Haiku) wins in the fast response, minimal memory and processor usage. By using unprotected memory there's at least a 2-3x speed gain on x86.
Btw, While the lawyers assist people in suing each other the Chinese may run circles around that circus. Not an efficient development.
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BeOS failed partly because Microsoft threatened price favours to any PC supplier that bundled BeOS with their machines. Guess why bundled BSD/Linux machines takes so long.. :S
BeOS had pretty much failed already when they made their desperate move to port to the Mac and then finally x86. Most of the initial excitement over BeOS was over the "full package" with their dual CPU PowerPC box.
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It's interesting to see peoples thoughts here. Most people project thier own opinions of amiga in thier response to how they view computing, which is a make up of tastes and knowledge on the subject. If the amiga is retro or not is reflected in a persons use. People who use it as a main system tend to (by necessity) be a lot more aware of the system, it's software, and how to do things that a more casual/retro person would be.
All this taken into account and it appears amiga.org is mostly full of the casual/retro crowd.
I reckon you've hit the nail on the head with that observation... :)
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Hey, I hear you've got some early season snow over there. How bad is it?
Just took some pics of the snow in my back garden, it's pretty bad this year the large bump on the right hand side were 7 foot tall hedges, now flattened to about 2 and half to 3 feet... gawd it cold... :(
(http://i995.photobucket.com/albums/af79/frankosamiga/Family/DSC00225.jpg)
(http://i995.photobucket.com/albums/af79/frankosamiga/Family/DSC00224.jpg)
(http://i995.photobucket.com/albums/af79/frankosamiga/Family/DSC00226.jpg)
(don't think that old fence is gonna last the winter either... :))
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I would have choosen Commodore amiga hardware + OS 3.x but have voted instead FCPGA 68k + OS 3.X, more realistic.
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Just took some pics of the snow in my back garden, it's pretty bad this year the large bump on the right hand side were 7 foot tall hedges, now flattened to about 2 and half to 3 feet... gawd it cold... :(
(http://i995.photobucket.com/albums/af79/frankosamiga/Family/DSC00225.jpg)
(http://i995.photobucket.com/albums/af79/frankosamiga/Family/DSC00224.jpg)
(http://i995.photobucket.com/albums/af79/frankosamiga/Family/DSC00226.jpg)
(don't think that old fence is gonna last the winter either... :))
I would like to post you also some nice pics of Paris under the snow, but although half the country is paralyzed, there is almost nothing here. :-)
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I kinda love old school CISC-ish CPUs for a weird and dumb reason. Sorry. :(
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I'd go for AROS... its the closes thing to an A1200. Let fate decide its future..
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@franko: the winter is about that too, here in berlin, must be even worse in my homeland, poland, so enjoy scotland. its made to suffer;)
as for the poll, the only alternative that beats "no future!" seems to be aros x68, and the rest remains in predicted order, with the usual culprits voting or their favourite, i can stand back.
i'd vote for the aros fpga, but lets see if they are worthy.