Amiga.org
Amiga computer related discussion => General chat about Amiga topics => Topic started by: bloodline on October 25, 2010, 12:50:33 PM
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I've not posted for a while (getting on with real life and playing with my new Mbed and Arduino microcontrollers), but I thought I would share my view of the tech world right now, a quick look at what is coming our way in the next 12moths is really exciting, and should make you happy no matter what computing platform you prefer!
AROS finally moves on the the 68k as a complete system, very exciting for me as we can then use UAE with no copyright issues! Classic hardware gets an oS upgrade :)
AOS4 is getting a PPC classics version, again something to look forward to!
MOS is pushing ahead on the PPC Mac platform, so a nice cheap supply of hardware there!
MacOS X is merging the iOS and OSX lines... I guess we should see the next generation of user interfaces grow from this.
Windows, Steve Balmer has gone on record to say that the next version will be the most innovative yet (ok, Microsoft have said that before each Windows release), but with proects like MinWin and the need to get a differential in the OS Market, we could see something pretty cool come from this!
Not sure what the Linux/BSD crews are up to, but the fact that they are still here and major hardware vendors are activly supporting them, this has to be good news!
Obviously the AROS and OSX/iOS news are the big ones for me as those are the two I use/play with... But as you can see there is pretty much good stuff all around :)
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And queue the who cares about windows/macosx/linux, this is amiga site, posts :)
I for one agree with these thoughts. Computing is getting exciting again
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And queue the who cares about windows/macosx/linux, this is amiga site, posts :)
I for one agree with these thoughts. Computing is getting exciting again
I forgot to mention Hiku and Symbian/Meego etc (I have to my shame perhaps, included Android in the Linux, point)... There is so much happening right now, it does feel a bit like the 70s/80s again :)
If anyone here took the time look at the hobby microcontroller boards, there are some really powerful devices around to be had for a few quid, with complete cross platform (Mac/Linux/Win) development environments! Ordinary users can write their own RTOS on their own hardware platform... Indeed I have, and it's fun :)
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It is a big like the 70's or early 80's again, but software is the new frontier...
Steven
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MinWin
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Not sure what the Linux/BSD crews are up to, but the fact that they are still here and major hardware vendors are activly supporting them, this has to be good news!
They have OSS ATI drivers that are finally worth a damn :D
No more messing with binary blobs that only worked with very specific configs :)
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I've not posted for a while (getting on with real life and playing with my new Mbed and Arduino microcontrollers)
Ahh, a fellow embedded tinkerer!
I never really bothered with the Arduino stuff. My interpretation of Arduino was that it provides a fast prototyping solution whereby you don't have to concern yourself with the intricacies of the development environment or the programming language, instead it's designed to be as easy to get up and running as possible, with a small burden in terms of program efficiency.
I have already invested a lot of time into the development environments I used and I'm already comfortable with the C language (and assembly but C is my language of choice) so I didn't feel like I "needed" Arduino.
However, the mbed products have caught my eye. There have been quite a few good projects around those in Elektor magazine. I haven't played around with them yet because I'm still tinkering with my new PIC32 development board, but I plan to have a look at them in the future!
I think that the Amiga community could benefit from members with Embedded electronics skills. There are a lot of current Amiga related problems that could be solved with homebrew designs I think. Open Hardware and Open Source Software designs would be the most helpful (take the recent Hxc floppy emulator as an excellent example).
I quite like the idea of an open hardware accelerator for classic machines. That would be a good project I reckon. Unfortunately my time is constrained by University work for the next couple of years but as soon as I finish, who knows perhaps I can start something like that, or contribute to someone else's project if they've already got something off the ground. It's all very exciting, and Amiga computing is what you make of it really!
AH.
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?
They have OSS ATI drivers that are finally worth a damn :D
No more messing with binary blobs that only worked with very specific configs :)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MinWin basically stripping Windows back to the kernel and using a layered approach to add components... So simply put, making Windows a bit more like *nix ;)
Yeah, I've seen quite a bit of hardware support for the open source OSs of late, and that is a VERY positive thing for everybody :D
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@AppleHammer
Arduino is just a nice complete development package, it uses C++ and a custom I/O library all wrapped up in a multiplatform package... My attraction to it was the USB link and MacOS development tools. The AVRMega328 mcu is a great and very cheap little microchip, that I have no reservations about using in a project.
The mbed is a bit of a dark horse... The development platform is web based so, no Internet, no development (unless you are prepared to mess around with some of te custom gcc build chains that are floating around). But other than that, it is a very very powerful platform (it is weird using floats on a microcontroller), plenty of IO and a built in USB support (USB is vital for any project :) )... The standard IO library is all object oriented and quite elegant.
My thoughts lean to using an ARM M3 microcontroller to emulate a 68k, it has enough CPU power and enough IO, and the chips cost about £10... :)
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?
They have OSS ATI drivers that are finally worth a damn :D
No more messing with binary blobs that only worked with very specific configs :)
I didn't know anyone had good driver for ATI cards - That truly is good news (in keeping with this positive theme :) ).
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I didn't know anyone had good driver for ATI cards - That truly is good news (in keeping with this positive theme :) ).
I think you mean AMD, ATI as a brand has been dead for quite a while now :)
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I think you mean AMD, ATI as a brand has been dead for quite a while now :)
Still says ATI on this here 200M ;)
mototrucker, everything works on the driver now - so full hardware 2d and overlay and 3d support. It should be noted however that the 3d support for this particular chip (and I would imagine others as well) does need to be optimised somewhat.
But it does work quite nicely for all that :)
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Optimized? Hey its jusy amazing that enough information has reached open developers to do this at all.
For some reason ATI has always wanted to keep the exact way their products operate a deep dark secret (and Nvidai hasn't been much better). Then they've tried to force us into lame proprietary drivers.
It would be nice to have a competitive third company in the market that was serious about open drivers.
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Optimized? Hey its jusy amazing that enough information has reached open developers to do this at all.
Yes, optimised, as it stands the 3d portion is a little on the slow side.
As for amazing? A year ago the OSS driver was little more than a Vesa frame buffer with those words crossed out and replaced with "ATI display driver" put in in crayon. Since then, the full gamete of 2d capabilities has been added and yes whilst slow, usable 3d (more than fast enough to run compiz type effects, or basic games for instance) has come into being. It is a testament to their dedication that they've come this far, this fast.
For some reason ATI has always wanted to keep the exact way their products operate a deep dark secret (and Nvidai hasn't been much better). Then they've tried to force us into lame proprietary drivers.
In of itself I have no truck with this, as nVidia shows, it can be done well. However the proprietary drivers for ATI/AMD graphics products has always been a hateful, spiteful experience. One which, if you're exceedingly lucky, you might get working, but more often than not will leave you frustrated and cursing the Canuks who created them.
To have something that works out of the box, won't break every time you update the kernel is a wonderful thing :)
It would be nice to have a competitive third company in the market that was serious about open drivers.
Intel for starters, I believe that VIA's graphics drivers are with a few exceptions quite open too.
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Ah the tablet world, I love my tablets, both iPad and Android. Now that I have a serious Android tablet it's time to get UAE up and running on it! I may buy RIM's Playboy tablet too. Lots and lots of good stuff happening...
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@AppleHammer
Arduino is just a nice complete development package, it uses C++ and a custom I/O library all wrapped up in a multiplatform package... My attraction to it was the USB link and MacOS development tools. The AVRMega328 mcu is a great and very cheap little microchip, that I have no reservations about using in a project.
Yep I think you're right - there is nothing wrong with using an Arduino as the base for an embedded project. And, if I was starting out fresh now, I think the Arduino would be a good platform for introduction to embedded programming because most of the learning curve is associated with intricacies of the language/micro architecture and dev environments in the beginning. The Arduino can help soften that learning curve, I think.
Also, I should add that I have absolutely nothing against AVR Micros. I always tend to stick with Microchip PIC, but that's not because I'm one of those PIC fanboys, it's just because I started out with PICs and have had no good reason to change since.
The mbed is a bit of a dark horse... The development platform is web based so, no Internet, no development (unless you are prepared to mess around with some of te custom gcc build chains that are floating around). But other than that, it is a very very powerful platform (it is weird using floats on a microcontroller), plenty of IO and a built in USB support (USB is vital for any project :) )... The standard IO library is all object oriented and quite elegant.
Yeah I'm not quite sure I like the idea of web based development. It has some clear advantages of course, but there are some disadvantages as well. All the same, it's an interesting platform and I'd like to take a look at it.
My thoughts lean to using an ARM M3 microcontroller to emulate a 68k, it has enough CPU power and enough IO, and the chips cost about £10... :)
I agree, 68K emulation is the way to go. Especially if a system capable of >68060 speeds can be designed. That would be fantastic!
AH.
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In of itself I have no truck with this, as nVidia shows, it can be done well. However the proprietary drivers for ATI/AMD graphics products has always been a hateful, spiteful experience. One which, if you're exceedingly lucky, you might get working, but more often than not will leave you frustrated and cursing the Canuks who created them.
To have something that works out of the box, won't break every time you update the kernel is a wonderful thing :)
nVidia proprietary drivers are a bliss indeed. apt-get install nvidia-glx nvidia-kernel-dkms and be done with it. Updates nicely even with custom-built kernels (assuming you use make-kpkg). I don't know what AMD are trying to do but they're doing it wrong.
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Ive generally stuck it with Nvidia and had no problems at all in recent years. Everything works great :)
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Ive generally stuck it with Nvidia and had no problems at all in recent years. Everything works great :)
Yup. Unfortunately I didn't have much say in the matter of my laptop (it was a trade). So to go from really nasty to downright usable is great.
I did like Nvidia though when I had a desktop system.
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@AppleHammer
Well, I started playing with microcontrollers earlier this year... With a couple of 16F916s and a borrowed programmer, which didn't really work as I had to use a USB->serial dongle (none of my machines have serial ports any more)... It was really flakey, but PIC Asm was fun and I really got into it... So I looked for a Mac/USB system I could use and the Arduino was top of the list, the AVRMega328 Asm is very much more like 68k Asm than PIC too :)
I have always had a soft spot for ARMs so the Mbed was the perfect choice to give it a go... And I've not been disappointed, the mbed team at ARM are really nice too, and can always be found having a laugh on the forum :)
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@Bloodline... on the happy juice for the most I see, but heck....
dismissing my own negative thoughts on most else, just wanted to +1 you on your messing with Arduino microcontrollers :D
I've been playing with a UBS (USB Bit Wacker) myself... brought me backs years :)
Tom UK
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The one techy/geeky thing I'm excited about these days is my Roku box. Streaming Netflix stuff is awesome (quite happy with the quality), but all the other channels too are a lot of fun. Leo Laporte's even got his own channel and Hulu is coming soon. Might be old news to some of you, but since I just "un-bundled" myself from cable/internet/phone - I'm happy with the cost savings and exposure to new 'channels' thanks to trying something like this out.
Can't say that modern "computing" is becoming any more fun for me, but I do plan on getting a multi-core Intel based Mac someday soon. At this point though, all I care about is how quickly I can get things done. How fast programs load, behave and how stable they are - that's all I expect anymore. The latest version of Safari, as quick as it is, crashes on my G5 often and when it does, takes several passes of clearing caches, cookies, etc. before I can re-launch it.
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Just want to add one more fun factor to the list :)
IPv4 address exhaustion will kick in early next year, making it nearly impossible to get new IPv4 addresses, forcing emerging companies and new tech over on IPv6 at last.
Just about any player in the market is prepared for this, not much prevents any ISP from switiching to IPv6 only on the customers since 99.99% of the installed systems of the user base run OSes and software that is prepared and with the preasure that is coming, many service providers that have been experimenting with IPv6 will finally set them in production.
Many OSX and Windows users here probably use IPv6 already withuout knowing it, via automatic tunnelling techniques like Teredo (default turned on since Windows Vista) and 6to4 (Apple's Airports have been doing this since 2007).
One example is that as of today, the 26th of october 2010, more than 70 norwegian news sites will be available on IPv6.
And how is this related to Amiga?
There is no IPv6 support in amiga land what-so-ever, the writings on the wall have been ignored for 10+ years - soon enough people will have other worries than just their browser not being up-to-date. The only developer who ever spoke of doing IPv6 stack for Amiga was Holder Kruse, but that ofcourse never materialized.
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There is no IPv6 support in amiga land what-so-ever, the writings on the wall have been ignored for 10+ years - soon enough people will have other worries than just their browser not being up-to-date. The only developer who ever spoke of doing IPv6 stack for Amiga was Holder Kruse, but that ofcourse never materialized.
And this is positive... how, exactly?
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And this is positive... how, exactly?
Could've been worse, from kolla! That's gotta count for something.
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Just want to add one more fun factor to the list :)
IPv4 address exhaustion will kick in early next year, making it nearly impossible to get new IPv4 addresses, forcing emerging companies and new tech over on IPv6 at last.
Just about any player in the market is prepared for this, not much prevents any ISP from switiching to IPv6 only on the customers since 99.99% of the installed systems of the user base run OSes and software that is prepared and with the preasure that is coming, many service providers that have been experimenting with IPv6 will finally set them in production.
Many OSX and Windows users here probably use IPv6 already withuout knowing it, via automatic tunnelling techniques like Teredo (default turned on since Windows Vista) and 6to4 (Apple's Airports have been doing this since 2007).
One example is that as of today, the 26th of october 2010, more than 70 norwegian news sites will be available on IPv6.
And how is this related to Amiga?
There is no IPv6 support in amiga land what-so-ever, the writings on the wall have been ignored for 10+ years - soon enough people will have other worries than just their browser not being up-to-date. The only developer who ever spoke of doing IPv6 stack for Amiga was Holder Kruse, but that ofcourse never materialized.
what is it when l click on in windows 7 network propertys l seen l just configure
the version 4 protocol what is the difrence seems same settings . do you mean there ruuning out possible web address
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And this is positive... how, exactly?
Because I'm sure he was just about to follow it up with a note on some kual new home router that will allow you to use IPv4 internally and proxy/NAT it out via IPv6 so you won't have to worry.
I'm sure that's where he was going...
:)
desiv
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Could've been worse, from kolla! That's gotta count for something.
Trufax :D
Because I'm sure he was just about to follow it up with a note on some kual new home router that will allow you to use IPv4 internally and proxy/NAT it out via IPv6 so you won't have to worry.
I'm sure that's where he was going...
:)
:roflmao:
Aaaaaaand we're back :D
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what is it when l click on in windows 7 network propertys l seen l just configure
the version 4 protocol what is the difrence seems same settings .
As far as Windows goes, don't worry about it. When the switch comes, you probably wont notice much of a difference :)
do you mean there ruuning out possible web address
No, an ip address is different to a web address
Google.com's current IP address is 216.239.51.99
Now its that sets of numbers that we're running out of.
This might help explain it a bit more (http://www.ipv6.com/articles/general/IPv6-Beginners_Look.htm).
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It is positive!!! Think about it, as everyone moves to IPv6 address space... That leaves the entire IPv4 space free for the Amiga to play in... And err talk to itself ;)
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Pirate IPv4 networks popping up around the internet! Kind of reminds me of HECnet. (http://www.update.uu.se/~bqt/hecnet.html)
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Pirate IPv4 networks popping up around the internet! Kind of reminds me of HECnet. (http://www.update.uu.se/~bqt/hecnet.html)
Showing your age a bit there ;)
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Not quite old enough to have used DEC machines professionally (at least not in their heyday,) I just managed to grab a couple of machines for free recently.
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Not quite old enough to have used DEC machines professionally (at least not in their heyday,) I just managed to grab a couple of machines for free recently.
Fair play :)
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Because I'm sure he was just about to follow it up with a note on some kual new home router that will allow you to use IPv4 internally and proxy/NAT it out via IPv6 so you won't have to worry.
That's what eveyone in amiga land must be hoping for - please let me know when you find such a router. :)
Edit: I'm also curious on how you think such a router will work - one rfc 1918 address per potential IPv6 peer? Good luck with that :)
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Ah the tablet world, I love my tablets, both iPad and Android. Now that I have a serious Android tablet it's time to get UAE up and running on it! I may buy RIM's Playboy tablet too. Lots and lots of good stuff happening...
More tablets than an 80yo.....
Don't anti-depression tablets keep you positive..?
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And this is positive... how, exactly?
Well, it is positive that this cannot be ignored for much longer :)
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Well, it is positive that this cannot be ignored for much longer :)
Oooooooh, nice save there sir! :D
I think this might also do for BeOS and Zeta, Haiku afaik uses a modified BSD stack.
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The only thing I am excited about is all the amazing tech coming out of no-name brands in China for peanuts. For example a GPS Sat Nav with 4.3" widescreen, EU Maps, 2GB for MP3 and MP4/AVI playback. All for 50 bucks or less. Ditto for 1/10th price iPhone 4G rip-offs that actually can surf Flash based websites.
And then there is all the hilarious pointless bickering between Adobe and Apple over support of Flash on iOS...finally Apple has made a MASSIVE mistake and their shitty overpriced phones/tablets may stop selling.
Now all I need is for a judge to decree Microsoft and Apple ripped off Amiga when they produced a desktop multitasking GUI and the billions to be forcefully ploughed into resurrecting the MOS factory and a new Amiga company developing a PS3 beating chip set which will sell for £399 in a complete tower unit with 16gb of RAM and life would be perfect...lol
As for the MinWin vapourware, that has been wheeled out every year since before Vista. First it was Vista, then it was meant to be Win7 (Windows Vienna) and now it is meant to be the next big thing *yawn* XP is the LAST time Windows became remotely efficient/effective. Everything later is slower/everything before less reliable or feature rich. It was a peak they will never repeat nor Apple approach. And how is Flash debacle going to pan out if iOS and OSX merge, as I understand it Apple is still trying to flex muscles with Adobe and ban Flash running on their next OS (Stupid Jobs if it's true, Adobe made Apple a viable platform all by themselves NOT Jobs and his fancy shmansy suits lauding over the world of MP3 players and phones)
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That's quite an imagination you've got there.
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I think this might also do for BeOS and Zeta, Haiku afaik uses a modified BSD stack.
Haiku can use FreeBSD hardware drivers, they just need a recompile on/for Haiku - the IP(v4) stack was written from scratch, inspired by BeOS Network Environment, BONE.
But Haiku at least acknowledge that this is a problem and had a GSoC project for developing IPv6 stack this summer, I'm not sure how far it got, but at least some code was commited.
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Not sure what the Linux/BSD crews are up to, but the fact that they are still here and major hardware vendors are actively supporting them, this has to be good news!
Linux -
Check out what Google is doing with Android and multiple hardware vendors -HTC, Motorola, Samsung, DELL, etc. both on Smartphones and Tablets. Looks like they are poised to take over the Smartphone market but we'll see if RIM can hold onto the lead.
Ubuntu 10.10 with the new Unity UI with support for touchscreens.
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Since when have RIM been in the lead of the smartphone market.
Please dont try and suggest a blackberry is a smartphone :)
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How is it not a smartphone?
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How is it not a smartphone?
How *is* it a Smartphone?
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Linux -
Check out what Google is doing with Android and multiple hardware vendors -HTC, Motorola, Samsung, DELL, etc. both on Smartphones and Tablets. Looks like they are poised to take over the Smartphone market but we'll see if RIM can hold onto the lead.
Ubuntu 10.10 with the new Unity UI with support for touchscreens.
http://deviceguru.com/android-to-be-number-2-mobile-os-this-year/
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Windows, Steve Balmer has gone on record to say that the next version will be the most innovative yet (ok, Microsoft have said that before each Windows release), but with proects like MinWin and the need to get a differential in the OS Market, we could see something pretty cool come from this!
I have no complaints with Windows 7, compared to Vista, it's running better and it's looking better.
And I'm looking forward to IE9, beta is good, but not great yet.
Yeah most are gunning down Microsoft, but for the first time in years I can actually say it doesn't suck anymore.
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I don't like the Windows 7 taskbar at all. It makes no distinction between currently running programs and quicklaunch icons. Not having text descriptions of programs is a step backwards too. I'm used to the classic interface and know my way around it, so not having it as an option is a big problem for me. Performance-wise it's pretty great though.
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I don't like the Windows 7 taskbar at all. It makes no distinction between currently running programs and quicklaunch icons. Not having text descriptions of programs is a step backwards too. I'm used to the classic interface and know my way around it, so not having it as an option is a big problem for me. Performance-wise it's pretty great though.
Are there no alternate skins available for 7?
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There probably are, but I only had Windows 7 for a few months because it was an evaluation copy, and now I'm back to using Vista.
I think I'm one of the few people that actually likes Vista. Ever since the first service pack, I've had only a few minor annoyances.
Windows ME was the same for me. Everyone hated it, but I never had any real issues with it.