Amiga.org
The "Not Quite Amiga but still computer related category" => Alternative Operating Systems => Topic started by: XDelusion on November 30, 2003, 03:11:30 AM
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I HATE Linux so don't say it! :)
I hear AROS will support this soon?
How about MorphOS, does that run on it, or how about BeOS?
Any other OS' you could mention would be great too!
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Hi mate, been a while since I saw you post :-)
I wouldn't doubt that AROS will run on similar machines eventually, I don't know however if they have such a machine to build for and test it on, you could always lend them it for a while ;-)
As for BeOS, I seem to remember reading about a PPC port that was never completed, however there is OpenBeOS, one of the target architectures for that project is the G3/G4 iMac. As far as I know, Zeta (the new name for BeOS, esentially) is x86 only.
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Weel if you tire of OS9.x.x
there's always OSX
It runs GREAT on a machine that slow, just max out the RAM and install it!
It has a different look and feel and if you change the 'skins' it can look cool!! Or if you install the windows one, it will look all windowy and stuff!!
http://homepage.mac.com/max_08/
You just have to be running 10.2 or higher.
OSX is so un-mac-like while still being cool and VERY-mac-like!!!
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Here you go:
- Mac OS 9.x / runs fast
- Mac OS X / Go for 10.2 (the others are slow). It'll run fast enough, but don't give it too many tasks.
- Linux PPC / (even SUSE has a PPC) I don't like Linux and won't advocate it's use, but hey... If it's your bag, it's more stable than Mac OS 9.x
- BeOS / Ah, my beloved OS. but sorry NO. It won't run. Be wanted to support G3s, but Apple wasn't having (or providing). Absolutely no G3s w/ BeOS.
As far as AROS, I don't know.
I have a Rev. A that I might be selling for parts.
Some stuff you might be into:
- The 4MB VRAM expansion for the Rage IIc
- A 128 MB RAM SIMM
- A 256 MB RAM SIMM
- The Game Wizards Voodoo II 8MB VRAM
- A daughterboard over-clocked to 300 Mhz
other stock stuff, 4GB HD, MB, CD-ROM, Keyboard, Mouse, modem card, etc...
Let me know if your into parts.
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I had an iMac 233, with Game Wizard, which was great, but don't expect any of the alternative OS's to support it.
I would second what other's have said.... BeOS did start life on PPC, but they never supported G3 and newer Mac's...thats ancient history now.
Anyway Mac OS X is great, I wouldn't choose any other OS to run on that machine. You can either just run the latest software, like most mac folks, or you can play around with the shell, cause it really does have the unix underpinnings. It's a great OS, slick and customizable at the same time.
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Hmm, well OSX is damn kool...
...for bloatware. But I ran it (the latest version) on my friend's G4 laptop which was about 1Ghz or so, and it was still pretty slow, even with 256Mb RAM. I'd hate to imagine it on a 233 or 300Mhz IMac. :)
So there is NO MorphOS support for the Mac then?!
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NetBSD or OpenBSD?
Darwin?
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I concur with XDelusion. I saw MacOS 10.2 running on G4 iMacs and a dual G5 tower at Circuit City, and I thought it was dog slow. Screen refreshes and animations seem OK, but windows have horrible delays when opening them. It didn't seem very responsive to me. It's hard to tell if it's the hardware or the OS, though. Apple is well known to skimp on the video hardware in their desktops. (You spend $2,500 for a G5 tower, and it only comes with a GeForce FX 5200 Ultra? WTF?)
Then again, I'm used to an original GeForce3 on an ABit IS7 mobo. My dad's friend just bought a P4 3Ghz laptop from Dell, and I swear it was less responsive than some Celeron 500 desktops.
I find it hard to believe that OS X runs even acceptably on older Macs.
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WOW.....
The slowest HW that I've run OSX (starting with 10.0!) on is a 355 G3 iBook (indigo) with an ectra 128MB of RAM added to the 64 MB built in.
It was slower, but it served the functions that I needed it for:
1. browsing (DU & BB)
2. designing CD labels
3. converting MIDI files (made on Amiga!!) to MP3
4. Quake 1 and 2
5. a letter or two!
It worked.
And the speed was bareable. But then it just seemed so compared to my (at the time!) 68040 A1200!!
Before choosing an OS, think about your needs. If speed is the ONLY issue, stick with OS 9 or use this as an excuse to UPGRADE!!!
Yellowdog is universaly hated on the Mac front, but it installs and sets up easy! AND it has decent HW support. Go figure!
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Then again, I'm used to an original GeForce3 on an ABit IS7 mobo. My dad's friend just bought a P4 3Ghz laptop from Dell, and I swear it was less responsive than some Celeron 500 desktops.
I find it hard to believe that OS X runs even acceptably on older Macs.
I think that 'responsivness' is a highly sujective measure. I find MacOS X 10.2/10.3 pretty zippy on my Dual 1GHz, earlier version looked too slow to me. Then again it doesn't even look as responsive as my A1200 with a 40 MHz 040 but I think this depends heavily on what apps you use. Anyhow w/o some eye-candy MacOS X is acceptable on older Macs, what it needs desperately is a bunch of RAM, 256 megs are an absolute minimum if you don't want to hear it swap brutally every time you launch an app.
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To the OS X doubters....
Hey, it's resource hungry just like XP.
My iBook 366 Indigo was completely usable.
Of course I was encodeing video with it. Just surfing, typeing, games, mp3s... That sort of thing.
But Damn! My buddy bought a New Sony Vaio w/ a 2.6Ghz P4 and XP feels just as peppy on my Dell w/ a PIII 800Mhz.
Here again we aren't talking about crunching mpegs, just day to day.
Nothing starts faster than AmigaOS 3.1 from a crachety old 40MBer. :)
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YOu know, from reading what half you guys are typing about this Zippy OS business, it is REALLY hard to believe any of you ever owned an Amiga.
So does MorphOS run on IMac?
Also I was planning on getting a 600Mhz G4 upgrade with Firewire for my Imac, would it be a better machine to do video editing on than my PeeSea?
Every Ati All In Wonder I have ever owned has sucked, has not worked, or just gave bad quality or corrupted videos. I hope the world of the Mac is better for this.
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XDelusion wrote:
YOu know, from reading what half you guys are typing about this Zippy OS business, it is REALLY hard to believe any of you ever owned an Amiga.
So does MorphOS run on IMac?
Also I was planning on getting a 600Mhz G4 upgrade with Firewire for my Imac, would it be a better machine to do video editing on than my PeeSea?
What was the PC setup?
Can that encode DivX (@TV PAL res) in real time?
Every Ati All In Wonder I have ever owned has sucked, has not worked, or just gave bad quality or corrupted videos. I hope the world of the Mac is better for this.
Can your statement apply to Radeon 9800 VIVO (with Catalyst 3.2)?
I don’t have video capturing problems the with my NV25 VIVO (Philips Electronics’ TV CODEC chip) based solution.
The test PC was;
AMD Athlon XP 3200+ @2.2Ghz, GA-7N400Pro2 (nForce2 400 Ultra**), NV25 VIVO, CL Audigy2 7.1 ZS**, 1GB PC3200 (dual channel mode), +200GB 7200 RPM HD(s). Sonic Foundry’s Vega 4.0 works fine with this setup. **Equipped with a total of 4 Fire-wire ports (i.e. 3 from GA, 1 from CL).
A similar test setup was fine with ASUS A7N8X Deluxe. I do have access to VIA based mobo IF additional test is required.
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But Damn! My buddy bought a New Sony Vaio w/ a 2.6Ghz P4 and XP feels just as peppy on my Dell w/ a PIII 800Mhz.
There are several factors that may slow down WinXP PC i.e.
1. Availability of physical RAM e.g. 1GB vs 512MB vs 256MB vs 128 MB
2. The RPM speed of the Hard Disk.
3. Front side bus speed.
4. Broken drivers.
5. GPU
6. APU/DSP(lesser extent)
7. Chipset and its companion chipset drivers.
Laptops usually have power saving regimes thus slowing things down i.e. what was the hard disk’s RPM in your laptop (e.g. 4200)?
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I had the original All In Wonder back when a 500 Mhz AMD was the top thing, and 128 Mb of RAM was a lot.
My most recent atempt was with my Dual 1000Mhz AMD ASUS MObo, 256 Mb of Kingston RAM, ATA 133 Samsung Hard Drive, and a Radeon All In Wonder.
I would encode in 640x480, NTSC and get crap quality, if I would set the Bit Rate too high, it would either stop itself after 20Mins or so, or when it finished, the play back was horrible!!!! I would stick on a frame, and play the sound, then maybe after 5 minutes move to the next frame.
I even formatted, re-installed XP with fresh drivers and Codecs, same thing.
Another thing that pisses me off about ATI is they put Macrovision protection on there damn cards so that you CAN NOT back up those old aging VCR tapes, which REALLY makes me mad.
I wrote ATI support a few times...
...no repsonce.
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You could run Boat Anchor OS.
It is perfect for such a computer and it is easy to install in your computer. Just attach a chain to the side of it and when you go fishing next, toss it over board. That is all there is to it.
Just becareful because it is easily attacked by viruses ( crabs , sharks etc).
:-P
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I think there is ppc versions of beos v4 and older
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Every Ati All In Wonder I have ever owned has sucked, has not worked, or just gave bad quality or corrupted videos. I hope the world of the Mac is better for this.
For quality capture/editing, you should not get this ati cards.. Even a cheap tvtuner based on BT chipset can produce better quality videos, with some tweaking... though the files will probably be big.. If you need hardware mpeg1/mpeg2 encoders, then wintv pvr 250/350 will be even better than the ati all in wonder cards.
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Laptops usually have power saving regimes thus slowing things down i.e. what was the hard disk’s RPM in your laptop (e.g. 4200)?
Both have the same drive IBM/40GB HD/5400RPM/8MB cache
The Dell is 3 (maybe 4 years old)
The Sony 1 month
Dell, PIII@800Mhz
Sony, P4@2.6 Ghz
Dell, PC133, 384MB RAM
Somy, DDR(266 i think), 512 MB RAM
Chips, bus etc...
No way app launches should be comparable.
Now at encoding? That is a different story. His new machine is much faster (not to mention haveing a much nicer screen).
You want fast? BeOS nuff said there.
Of course there's the whole thing about it being dead and all. :-o
OpenBeOS :-? We shall see? In the mean time, MorphOS? Now there might be something there. I am just not lucky enough to know anybody with one or any place I can try one.
Bummer.
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McNorris wrote:
Laptops usually have power saving regimes thus slowing things down i.e. what was the hard disk’s RPM in your laptop (e.g. 4200)?
Both have the same drive IBM/40GB HD/5400RPM/8MB cache
The Dell is 3 (maybe 4 years old)
The Sony 1 month
Dell, PIII@800Mhz
Sony, P4@2.6 Ghz
Dell, PC133, 384MB RAM
Sony, DDR(266 i think), 512 MB RAM
Chips, bus etc...
No way app launches should be comparable.
Note that a fast CPU doesn’t fix the problems of having a slow hard disk drive.
One could make a Pentium VI @3.2 machine preform like a tired old Pentium Classic machine e.g. installing 1995 era Conner hard disk drive. Bloated OSes has a greater dependency on faster drive performance.
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Crystall: I think that 'responsivness' is a highly sujective measure. I find MacOS X 10.2/10.3 pretty zippy on my Dual 1GHz, earlier version looked too slow to me.
Then again, the store might have turn on every graphics feature possible to make it look cool. I don't know what kind of options OSX has (like XP), to turn off the eye candy. All I can say is that it was rediculously slow on a Dual G5, and that turned me off right away.
Nothing starts faster than AmigaOS 3.1 from a crachety old 40MBer. :)
Well, the less hardware you have to initialize and diagnose on startup, the faster it boots. Nothing boots faster than MS-DOS! ;-)
XDelusion: YOu know, from reading what half you guys are typing about this Zippy OS business, it is REALLY hard to believe any of you ever owned an Amiga.
Yeah, just like those who say XP or Macs are slow have never used one. I have an Amiga 1200 and several PC's at home, and used Macs all the time in school and work, and used to be a Mac sysadmin. The Amiga is the most responsive machine I've ever used, but only if you run it in a 640x256 Workbench in no more than 8 colors, and don't switch between apps too often. A barage of crashes doesn't help, either. ;-)
I have so many horrible memories of MacOS 8-9, I can't forgive Apple no matter how good OSX is. My dad has XP and I run Win2K, and I simply refuse to upgrade. XP is too damn cluttered and slow. Every OS has its shortcomings.
Every Ati All In Wonder I have ever owned has sucked, has not worked, or just gave bad quality or corrupted videos. I hope the world of the Mac is better for this.
Early ATI hardware was notorious for bugs and a lack of screenmodes. Later on, it was only the drivers that sucked. Today's ATI hardware and drivers are very stable. I can't say anything about movie capture, though.
McNorris: But Damn! My buddy bought a New Sony Vaio w/ a 2.6Ghz P4 and XP feels just as peppy on my Dell w/ a PIII 800Mhz.
The Vaio laptops don't seem very impressive to me. My boss had one and it was a terrible machine to work on (uninstalling registry keys for Comcast tech support took about 20 minutes, about 40 mintues total).
Personally, I think most laptops are full of mismatched hardware. I've never worked on one that seemed even the least bit usable, boot in less than four minutes, and even came CLOSE to a desktop. Or maybe all my friends/bosses didn't know beans about selecting hardware.
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My most recent atempt was with my Dual 1000Mhz AMD ASUS MObo, 256 Mb of Kingston RAM, ATA 133 Samsung Hard Drive, and a Radeon All In Wonder.
I would encode in 640x480, NTSC and get crap quality, if I would set the Bit Rate too high, it would either stop itself after 20Mins or so, or when it finished, the play back was horrible!!!! I would stick on a frame, and play the sound, then maybe after 5 minutes move to the next frame.
Without knowing the specific motherboard/chipset (guessing an AMD 7xx) and ATI VPU generation, I'm guessing there's something wrong with your particlar setup. Was your software SMP aware?
An Athlon T-Bird @1.33Ghz with MSI-6330 V5 (VIA KT133A), 512MB PC133, UDMA100 40GB 7200 RPM Seagate and NV25 VIVO should be able to encode MPEG2(with kbit/s rate of 3700) at 640x480 resolution. The application for the video capture was Ulead’s VideoStudio 6 SE (bundled with video card).
Another thing that pisses me off about ATI is they put Macrovision protection on there damn cards so that you CAN NOT back up those old aging VCR tapes, which REALLY makes me mad.
That’s another issue in regards to Macrovision.
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@Hammer
One could make a Pentium VI @3.2 machine preform like a tired old Pentium Classic machine e.g. installing 1995 era Conner hard disk drive. Bloated OSes has a greater dependency on faster drive performance.
You can say that again.
@Waccoon
Well, the less hardware you have to initialize and diagnose on startup, the faster it boots. Nothing boots faster than MS-DOS!
Uh-Uh! C=64 Basic (built-in) lets not go into the 1541 thing. ;-)
I have so many horrible memories of MacOS 8-9, I can't forgive Apple no matter how good OSX is. My dad has XP and I run Win2K, and I simply refuse to upgrade. XP is too damn cluttered and slow.
The Mac OS8-9 thing is a love hate relationship for many a mac fan.
At least MS did something about boottime w/ XP. I agree Win2K is MS' best
The Vaio laptops don't seem very impressive to me. My boss had one and it was a terrible machine to work on (uninstalling registry keys for Comcast tech support took about 20 minutes, about 40 mintues total).
I like Sony VAIO laptops. Quality cases, Beautiful screens... If I didn't want a Powerbook, it would be a Vaio.
I have an XP lic.through my work, but my my wife uses it.
I haven't forgiven MS for the whole Office/DR-DOS thing. I don't like it and I won't buy it.
BeOS was divine, but it went the way of the Amiga.
I just wish I could try out MorphOS. I could I'd put my money where my mouth is and buy if it rocks.
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So Does MorphOS run on IMacs or what? Everyone seems to be avoiding that question. :)
As for ATI, I am threw with there vid capture cards for ever!