Amiga.org
Amiga computer related discussion => General chat about Amiga topics => Topic started by: AndyFC on November 12, 2009, 01:14:07 PM
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Hi all, just a word of advice to ship international items via a method that has a tracking method which Ebay/Paypal recognise.
Just had an email today to say that Paypal has found on the side of a buyer (Theshomustgo0n in Portugal) as I was unable to provide evidence of receipt/tracking for an A1200 keyboard.
Annoyingly they don't take into consideration any suspicious activity such as the non-delivery complaint and escalation only taking place 2 working days after the item was posted, and the fact that the ebay acokitty was closed just after I posted, but before I marked item as dispatched. I'm just putting this one down to experience and also to warn others.
At least I now have Royal Mail's insurance to try and fall back on.
Thanks.
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Your experience and a lot of others are well documented here on the site. Some problematic countries like Spain, Italy, France and Portugal have been repeatedly mentioned. To complain 2 days after you posted it? What a crock. Sounds like a total scammer to me. On other video game and computer group sites we have a known 'GOOD' and known 'BAD' sellers & buyers lists. Maybe one could be started here?
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I only ever had one problem on ebay. Sadly it was over an Elbox tower from Germany. The seller told me he was having problems getting it posted to me as it was an "oversized" parcel. After nearly a year of being quite resonable and patient with him I threatened legal proceedings (and yes, I meant it).
Got the tower within a week after that.
I've sold loads on ebay myself and have 100% positive feedback. Other members of this forum (eg. Phantom) have had dealings with me and I'd be glad to see a good/bad buyer/seller list as save2600 has mentioned. I know the side of the list I would be on.
PS. I'm 258graham on ebay, just so ya'know.
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A good idea with the list. Not that I'm a verified good seller...yet :)
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Ebay based on my many years of experience.....
Ebay 1999 = Very cool
Ebay 2009 = Den of theives, shop/sell at your own risk
Your milage may vary.
Plaz
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That's the trouble with PayPal. You the seller have to prove you shipped something, otherise PayPal will always find in the buyers favour and you will lose the funds. It's also in PayPal (eBay's) interest for the dispute resolution process to take as long as possible because during that time they keep your money and make interest out if it!
I had to chase the buyer who made a complaint about me for non-delivery and beg them to remove the complaint (after they had got the goods).
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That's the trouble with PayPal. You the seller have to prove you shipped something, otherise PayPal will always find in the buyers favour and you will lose the funds. It's also in PayPal (eBay's) interest for the dispute resolution process to take as long as possible because during that time they keep your money and make interest out if it!
I had to chase the buyer who made a complaint about me for non-delivery and beg them to remove the complaint (after they had got the goods).
That's the whole problem with Ebay and Paypal. They're not designed for the buyer. Only for the seller. Ebay charges the seller to sell and item. Paypal charges the seller for the price of the item sold. They make money off the seller, not really the buyer. Hence, they're always going to side with the seller first and foremost.
It's the same problem with the unemployment system in America. Companies pay into the Unemployment system, as insurance. The employee doesn't pay into it. So, when an employee is unlawfully fired, it's next to impossible to win, 'cos the state will almost always side with the Company. You could have evidence supporting your case and they'll still find a way to side with the person they collect the money from.
Capitalism at its finest.
Ebay and Paypal will never change, until people stop using their services. End of story.
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Ebay based on my many years of experience.....
Ebay 1999 = Very cool
Ebay 2009 = Den of theives, shop/sell at your own risk
Your milage may vary.
Plaz
Exactly Plaz. Good call. Important to consider why this is. 1999: more savvy computing people with integrity had internet access, developed rapports and traded online. 2009: everybody and their grandmother now owns a 'puter. Lowest common denominator is winning the war against common sense and decency. ePay as a whole disgusts me today. So does most of society. I think I'm going to puke now. lol
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Your experience and a lot of others are well documented here on the site. Some problematic countries like Spain, Italy, France and Portugal have been repeatedly mentioned.
Yup Spain, Italy and France are problems here. Never had a problem from Russia or Czechoslovakia, go figure.:lol:
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eBay's really no different than most brick and mortar businesses in the US. I recently purchased a CD boxed set from a local retailer. The set had a bad disc, and the retailer wouldn't exchange it, forcing me on the publisher. Yes, warranties blah blah blah, but my sales contract was with the retailer, not the publisher. No one stands behind the products they sell, from the smallest mom and pop shop to the largest big box store. (The exception is Fry's Electronics, which lets you return just about anything. Luckily, they put little "This item has been royally !@#%ed by our inexperienced customer service staff." stickers on all their returned and restocked items.)
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That's the whole problem with Ebay and Paypal. They're not designed for the buyer. Only for the seller. Ebay charges the seller to sell and item. Paypal charges the seller for the price of the item sold. They make money off the seller, not really the buyer. Hence, they're always going to side with the seller first and foremost.
I found this week that eBay has changed drastically to the buyers advantage, I had long know about seller not able to give negative feedback. But this week I listed some CB gear that belonged to my brother who died last year. When I built the listing I was told of an automatic payment hold on these items where if you list in certain "problem" categories electronics and computers where amongst some listed, paypal automatically holds the money until the buyer submits positive feedback or 21 days passes without the buyer raising a dispute! To my mind this is a classic example of guilty until proven innocent.
Today eBay decided to pull the listing with no real explanation, I consulted the prohibited item section regarding radio equipment and it said nothing about frequency of the equipment or licensing conditions in there. yes these rigs are strictly speaking illegal to use for CB in the UK but are legal for amateurs to use and it is perfectly legal to buy and sell them within the UK. So I'm now waiting for a reply to my strongly worded email to eBay support asking for the reason my listing were removed as i did not list prohibited items according to their own list and when I can expect a refund of my listing fees.
IMHO eBay as gone from been all about the sellers as it was in the nighties and early millennium to been all about the buyers.
Gaz
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You would think ebay would be seller oriented because sellers pay the listing fees, pay a portion of the final price, and pay the ebay fees.
But, eBay also knows that buyers pay, for access to the huge audience of sellers it has. which is why it seems to be buyer oriented in disputes even though buyers arent the ones paying the fees, directly.
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@gazgod
First off, I am sorry to hear about your brother :-(
Unfortunately, you will simply get a boiler-plate automated response. If you respond to that, you will likely get a secondary boiler-plate automated response. If you respond to the 2nd being very clear you demand to hear from a human being, you may get a response but it is unlikely they will bend.
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@ gazgod, I could make some smart a$$ remark about "sellers in nighties" but will refrain.
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For those of you that run real businesses, how does eBay compare to merchant accounts, credit card processing fees, rent, insurance, taxes, etc? Despite the buyer-friendly policies (gee whiz, consumer protection, imagine that), it's still less spendy than a "real" business. I suspect their dispute process isn't that different from a credit card charge back process.
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I've been selling on eBay for about two and half years, with 100% pos. feedback. So far I have had a couple of disputes that were decided in my favor (knock on wood).
These days I will not ship to Spain, Italy, or Portugal unless it's EMSI - That may kill a few sales, but several Italian customers prefer it - with its tracking, insurance, and delivery in a few days (depending on their customs).
A list of good vs bad sellers will prove a huge task I think. And, if you check a sellers feedback list (all feedback) on eBay, you can tell if they are safe to deal with.
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And by the way, always place a restriction so that no one with 5 positives or less can bid, otherwise you will get scammed. Fake PayPal emails and everything. What a nightmare
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Yep,
Spain, Italy, France, Portugal and Germany...I think all European countries are "problematic" but not "systematic" very much happily for us all. :-)
These are only sometimes numerous and punctual problems, but you cannot generalize.
Your experience and a lot of others are well documented here on the site. Some problematic countries like Spain, Italy, France and Portugal have been repeatedly mentioned. To complain 2 days after you posted it? What a crock. Sounds like a total scammer to me. On other video game and computer group sites we have a known 'GOOD' and known 'BAD' sellers & buyers lists. Maybe one could be started here?
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A list of good vs bad sellers will prove a huge task I think. And, if you check a sellers feedback list (all feedback) on eBay, you can tell if they are safe to deal with.
Not at all. You create a new forum called 'User Feedback' in the Marketplace and for each user name (ePay, here, elsewhere), you'd start a new topic. When you want to add a positive or negative comment you simply check to see if their user name is already on the list. If it is, click on the link and 'reply' to it with your $.02. If not, start a new one and flame on or report positively!
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Not at all. You create a new forum called 'User Feedback' in the Marketplace and for each user name (ePay, here, elsewhere), you'd start a new topic. When you want to add a positive or negative comment you simply check to see if their user name is already on the list. If it is, click on the link and 'reply' to it with your $.02. If not, start a new one and flame on or report positively!
I guess you're right. But I still think the eBay feedback profile will prove very telling about a sellers habits, and it's already there.
I would encourage any/every potential buyer to check my eBay profile.
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Well here in the UK the stupid government saw no problem with ebay UK taking over the superior Yahoo Auctions UK around the turn of the century.
And surprise surprise Yahoo auctions was shut down for good within weeks and there is no competition ever since.
There are also some loopholes in the VERO program that mean other people who have no legal claim to do so can have your account banned for good, all because
1. ebay are too dumb.
2. ebay are too chicken to challenge something serious.
As for sending stuff abroad, well I won't post anything worth double figures outside my own country any more.
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@gazgod
First off, I am sorry to hear about your brother :-(
Unfortunately, you will simply get a boiler-plate automated response. If you respond to that, you will likely get a secondary boiler-plate automated response. If you respond to the 2nd being very clear you demand to hear from a human being, you may get a response but it is unlikely they will bend.
Thanks Red, it was over a year ago but its difficult to handle when someone dies with no warning at 41.
I expected an automated response, but actually received an email saying the listing were removed in error and I'm free to relist, They have also contacted all bidders to state it was there error and that the item will be relisted!!
I must say that better than I expected.
Gaz
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Well here in the UK the stupid government saw no problem with ebay UK taking over the superior Yahoo Auctions UK around the turn of the century.
And surprise surprise Yahoo auctions was shut down for good within weeks and there is no competition ever since.
uk.ebid.net
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Just want to let you know about a happy ending to this - I got a cheque from Royal Mail yesterday for the full amount I lost after I put in a claim. May be worth you doing the local equivalent if ever anything is ever reported lost in transit.