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Amiga computer related discussion => General chat about Amiga topics => Topic started by: irishmike on August 03, 2009, 02:12:53 PM
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Greetings All:
I have been away for about 2 years (it would be in October according to when I last visited the forums). I have not been active in the forums here, but considerably active in my vintage computing hobby in general.
Since I have a "beer budget", my Amiga buying has been on hold (and mostly still is). I sold my A4000 that I built up over time and it brought a little prosperity to my household. I have decided to buy another Amiga, however I am going lower end this time.
What sparked my wanting a new "miggie" is that I ended up making a purchase on eBay for GFA BASIC 3.5 (for my Atari ST) -- turns out that I had my "duh cap" on that day and failed to notice that quite prominently, the version is for Amiga. Ok, I now have a new, never used copy of GFA BASIC for Amiga and it is not in any way the seller's fault that I was dunce enough not to notice the listing said "Amiga" (so I did not even mention the foulup to the seller over in England nor do I harbor any ill will towards him, the transaction went very well). This alone didn't spark my wanting a new machine.
I have been steadily acquiring software and parts for an Atari 1040ST that I bought from eBay and wanted to get "Shadow of the Beast" for it. A friend here in the Kansas City Metro Area suggested that the Amiga version looked much better. Just last night (August 2, 2009), I purchased a copy off of eBay and it should be here later this week. Hence the fire is lit under my butt to get a new Amiga machine.
COMPLETE ASIDE: IF anyone has a copy of the Shadow of the Beast manual they would scan and make a PDF, I could use it!!!!
So I am now looking for an Amiga 2000, I think I can find the base machine here in Kansas City -- but I will need to find a flicker fixer/scan doubler for it and I understand that the one that software hut used to manufacture is no longer in production currently as they had a parts supplier dry up. (That was the Toastscan). So I am needing either a Picasso II (I believe that that is a VGA card -- please correct me if I am wrong) or to find one of those type flicker fixers. Help is welcome for me to acquire that as well. Otherwise I think I know where to find OS 3.9, ROM 3.1 versions and such for the unit. Normally Amigakit in case anyone wondered!
I am also looking for the compiler for GFA BASIC 3.5 since I bought the interpreter.
Anyhow, I am not sure how well I will like the A2000 because I loved the A4000 and my A1200 before it. I would definitely buy another A1200, but the price is way out of my budget for right now. I have to build the whole Amiga system for under $200 USD... that is going to be hard. That, of course, is not including OS 3.9 and the 3.1 ROMs. After those the price will be closer to $300 USD I think.
Yes, doing retro computing is sometimes a challenge!
Anyhow, hope some of you can help with some of the things I mentioned above. By all means -- suggest, advise, and comment. Look forward to being involved in the community again.
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Hopefully the 2000 you get has an accelerator if you want to run 3.9, I believe it won't run on the stock 68000.
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@tone007: Are there good accelerators for A2000? Could use some examples (names) and of course availability. Thanks for the advice, didn't think of needing one... the 68000 is of course the same processor in my Atari ST :-)
I would love a 030.
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There are a few decent accelerators. The C= 2630 is probably the best priced one (sub $100 if you're lucky,) but it can only handle 4mb of RAM onboard. GVPs are around as well for a bit more money, but they have the drawback of requiring special GVP SIMMs, so it's best to get one of those already populated with RAM. Here's a list of A2000 accelerators: http://amiga.resource.cx/exp/a2000proc
As for scandoublers/flickerfixers, if you're not in a hurry Individual Computers is supposed to be coming out with an A2000 (and a500, a600) compatible internal one that'd be price-competitive with legacy scandoublers, and probably function better. Either way, those are generally in the $100+ range as well.
edit: if you're up for using composite/s-video, http://www.amigamaniac.com has just developed a very affordable Amiga RGB to s-video/composite solution that seems to work very well.
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@tone007: thanks for the information. It is very helpful.
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Also, just in case this wasn't an issue the last time you were shopping for Amigas, you definitely want to look out for leaky batteries on the motherboard. (2000, 3000, 4000.) The acid does some pretty nasty things to the boards, and getting stuck with a half eaten board is no fun.
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Welcome!
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@tone007: Yes, I remember about the batteries, that is one thing I always look at before I make a purchase decision! There is a guy here in Kansas City who can repair damage on some of the boards and did some kind of fix where the battery would not be so suspectable to leaking as well. He is the fellow who repaired my original A4000 board that was non-functioning. He has always done a good job on any electronic repair I have sent his way.
@amigakit: thanks.
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@irishmike
I use a Microway FlickerFixer AGA 2000 in my A2000HD. It is a very old board but has been very reliable for many years. I don't know if any are available on ebay or similar.
Please note that this board has nothing to do with the Amiga AGA chipset. It was manufactured long before the term AGA was used by Commodore for the advanced graphics AGA chipset
Some details about this flickefixer are available here
http://amiga.resource.cx/exp/aga2000
and Big Book of Amiga Hardware.
http://www.amiga-hardware.com/
under Flickerfixers & Scandoublers
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redfox
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@fedfox: Looks like a cool board. I am kind of holding out for a Picaso II or a newer model board though.
@all: found myself a A2000, be picking it up Friday (Aug 7, 2009). I will naturally need to get the 3.1 ROMs for it (from Amigakit :-D) soon too. It will have a GVP accelerator in it!
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Amiga ownership on a beer budget seems to be getting harder every year... It has now become a "collectible" and no longer "old junk". I know it was never "junk", but you know that old computer sitting up in the closet.
I'd suggest keeping an eye on local ads (local papers, craigslists), garage sales, etc. Try to find someone clearing out an attic or something. I bought a huge lot of amiga hardware this way (A1200, A500, software, two monitors, mice, joysticks, etc.). I kept most, and sold a couple high $ items on eBay. Made back most of the money I put out on the initial lot.
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@irishmike
Picaso II :D ... always wanted one of those for my machine.
Not sure if it will run with the stock 68000 processor, but should work just fine with a GVP accelerator
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redfox
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@brianb: Yeah, the beer budget is not just my Amiga Gear! I have just acquired an Atari 1040ST system and a lot of software and hardware for it. It is vintage computing in general that is getting more expensive -- especially when non-collectors get wind that the old "piece of junk" in their closet is worth something now. I think eBay does serve to partially drive the price up on the hardware though. It is true that it is becoming more scarce and therefore has more value -- but my latest purchase from eBay is a shining example of the obsurdity of some of the pricing.
The story (and this is the reader's digest version) is that when I bought "Shadow of the Beast for the Amiga -- I was watching two listings. One was buy it now for $25.00 USD and the other was at $22.00 and auction style. The $22 one had the whole box, manual and a T-Shirt ta-boot. I decided to watch it until it got closer to the ending which was at 6:45 ish CDT last night (Aug 2, 2009). At 5 hours to go, the price was already at $81 USD and I stopped watching it after executing the buy it now for just the disks. The game was less than $50 USD new for crying out loud and the seller of the boxed edition made no claim that the disks were even any good. So some poor soul bought an $81.00 (at least) T-Shirt and manual basically. I am for paying for what vintage software is actually worth, but I don't think I can ever justify more than $50. That is even hard to swallow for me. But some of it is very hard to find and therefore the value is greater for a collector.
I am kind of the odd one out because I view my collection as old, but I also know the value of the stuff and that is always a dangerous combination because you could easily prey upon someone who has no idea of the value and while it is a deal for you, it is in some ways taking advantage of those not in the know. I try to be fair in all my dealings!
Anyhow, didn't mean to publish a novel here. I think the watching CL and eBay idea is a good one and I already do. For Amiga gear, I do have an excellent resource right in my back yard and therefore count myself lucky.
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@redfox: As I stated, the A2000 I am buying comes with the GVP 030 accelerator :-) I think that it will be a great little machine!
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@irishmike
I agree ... great little machine!
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redfox
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@irishmike
Picaso II :D ... always wanted one of those for my machine.
Not sure if it will run with the stock 68000 processor, but should work just fine with a GVP accelerator
It will - but just using the original Picasso software. Picasso96 needs 020+.
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@zipper: Thanks for the info. The GVP is going to be the 030 version.
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Welcome back! Hows Rogue working for you? Yeah, I don't know why some software goes for so much money. I have a sealed copy of Conquest for the Longbow on my shelf for PC and I watched one go for almost 100 dollars on Ebay. What's worse would be if you had a sealed Quest for Glory game. Those go for regularly over 100 dollars. But we also have to remember that the software only goes for what we, the collectors will pay for it. Also, I found my sealed copy of space quest 1. It's the first release, without the game graphics picture on the front. If there was any other software you wanted to try let me know. I was testing a bunch of it and most of it seems to work, even if the internal floppy drive doesn't.
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@new2amga: Just actually got the Atari today (finally). So I won't know how the Rogue works just yet. Have to have time to go through the new machine and check ram and ROM versions :-) Good to see you on here!
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...So I am needing either a Picasso II (I believe that that is a VGA card -- please correct me if I am wrong) or to find one of those type flicker fixers....
Just to be clear, the Picasso II is an RTG graphics card, but not a scan doubler/flicker fixer. The Picasso IV, however, has a module for the video slot that can scan double the native modes for disply on 31KHz monitors.
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@graffias79: That is why I asked :-D The Picasso series was a video card and I thought a VGA card, but I would rather (I think) do a toastscan or something like that. Unless there is another option. According to an earlier post, someone is working on one perhaps.
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I do like the Picasso II. I have one in an A4000 that I am thinking of selling soon. The only drawback is that it is Zorro II speed. It would be perfect for an A2000 with 3.1 ROMs and an accelerator. A SD/FF card would likely work well with a Picasso II since they don't compete for slots (or even for space) and the Picasso will automatically switch between RTG mode and native passthrough (VGA in).
I hope that made sense, I am very tired!
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This may be a little out of your price range, but it's the bee's knees of Amiga accelerators, and you can buy them new from Software Hut.
http://www.softhut.com/cgi-bin/test/Web_store/web_store.cgi?page=catalog/hardware/accelerators/gvp_tekmagic.html&cart_id=8858880_5193
060/50 with SCSI-2, accepts 128MB RAM :)
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@ irishmike
Good to hear from you again. I wondered what happened to you. I too, am about to get an A2000 with GVP 030, 3.1 ROMs, and i have OS 3.5 here.
My current pet project is nice A1000, that I just found a 1Mb Insider RAM card for! Am about to see if ROM KS will work with all this too.
Right now I am about void of hardware - but still have a sh*tload of software. If you need any help, just hollar ;)
The 030 accelerator is by far the best choice, if you ever plan on any games being played! 060's are great for graphics, sound, rendering, etc., but stink for most games!
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Hey Motrucker! Long Time no "see" or hear. Glad you are still around. I am definitely glad with my decision to buy the A2000 with 030. I am looking for some games true, but I basically have only one on the platform right now and it is very newly acquired (as I posted). I will have to get Lemmings again. I hope I still have EasyADF around someplace, it was a great way to get those images back into real floppies!
The A2000 and my Atari 1040ST are now the bulk of my vintage computer collection though I do have a Tandy COCO 3 I just acquired and I know it works too, but it will need some pieces parts as well and those can be as hard to find as some of our Amiga gear is.
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I still find some Amiga stuff (mostly software) locally at yard sales and flea markets. If I can run across Lemmings again, I'll let you know.
I should have my "new" A2000 in about two weeks. I miss having a "modern" Amiga.
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The 030 accelerator is by far the best choice, if you ever plan on any games being played! 060's are great for graphics, sound, rendering, etc., but stink for most games!
i used to think that as well about 060's and game incompatibility, but since getting an 68060 for my A1200 and whdload I've yet to find a game that didn't run on it. If you can afford it, get it would be my advice
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coming back like an alcholic that cant stay sober....
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@a1260: Well we all have our vices :-)
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Keep your eye out for an A1200 with 3.1 roms and OS 3.9. You might just find one for that.
AmigaKit has PAL refurbished ones left for $146USD - add some for OS, mouse, etc. and you'd need a US power Supply or build one from an ATX power supply like I did. (That's an easy solder job.)
It's PAL unless you want to do some hardware hacking and ground one of the pins on the Alice chip to make it default to NTSC on boot.
Watch around, you might just find one.
-Nyle
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@nlandas: I appreciate that, I actually already looked into that and they even do have a PS already for the US market available as well. It will would come down to shipping and I already found a great A2000 I have agreed to buy right here in my area. That is going to be around $150 USD and then maybe $100 USD more for the OS and the 3.1 ROM. I am actually excited about acquiring this unit!
@everyone: I am also looking forward to Jens Schönfeld's upcoming release of the indivision VGA adapter for the A2000, he thinks around October it should be available.. so if I don't find a solution before then... I will definitely pick one up as soon as it is made available.
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You'd be best off waiting for Jens' Indivision product. The Microway's floating around are rather weak performers. Faint lines on the screen, RF interference, no PAL support (all my observations when I've owned them), plus they're old and still kinda expensive.
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@save2600: I will likely wait for the indvision to come out... just would be nice to see my new game go now instead of 3 months from now ;-) I am not obtaining a C= monitor for the machine so it will be "dormant" until I get a VGA adapter for her.
Expense is definitely an issue too though.
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The Commodore 2320 is around as well and works much better than the Microway, for one it supports both PAL and NTSC.
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@tone007: I will keep that in mind. I must also point out that you were the original person to tell me to look into the upcoming Indivision product and so I contacted Jens to see what his timeframe was on the A2000 model and he responded in kind with his timeframe and what issues he is working on getting the controller working -- he said he wants to release it in October, but didn't want to be held to that because things could still be delayed with the issues he is facing. I think the guy is great! He is definitely an asset to the larger Amiga community.
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The Indivision AGA is a great device, I have one in my 1200. The OCS/ECS version should be very nice as well, though it might not be quite as flexible due to those machines not having AGA (1024x768 256-color workbench is a big selling point on the AGA Indivision.)
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The Indivision AGA is a great device, I have one in my 1200. The OCS/ECS version should be very nice as well, though it might not be quite as flexible due to those machines not having AGA (1024x768 256-color workbench is a big selling point on the AGA Indivision.)
How usable is 1024x768 8 bit?
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If you would like to borrow a C= Monitor from me until you get your SD/FF, let me know. I am more than willing to let you borrow the monitor on my A600 for the interim. I too hope to purchase at least 3 of those ECS SD/FF when they come out. Give me a ring and let me know.
Nathan
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How usable is 1024x768 8 bit?
On my A1200 030/50 it's unusable. I run my Workbench in 1024x768 in 16 colours and it's very responsive, but any increase over that and there's very noticable lag to everything. Waiting for windows to slowly draw themselves on screen takes the fun away from using Workbench.
On another note, although the Indivision is great, it's not the only way to get a flicker-free display from an Amiga these days. I have my A600 plugged into an LCD TV using the new S-Video adapter from AmigaManiac.com, which gives me a rock solid display in resolutions up to 1364x536 widescreen. Here's a photo of Workbench playing some music - http://home.exetel.com.au/amiga/PICT4033.JPG
Something like this might also do the job until the Indivision ECS arrives. If Jens is aiming for an October release, it'd be great to see them being sold at AmiWest.
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How usable is 1024x768 8 bit?
Like Cammy said, it's not the snappiest, even with an '060 things get a little sluggish, not to mention it doesn't work right with FBlit. Still nice to be able to do it occasionally though, since I'm pretty sure I won't be coming across a BVision setup anytime soon and it's fun to squeeze the most out of the desktop 1200.
I generally stick with 32 colors and get decent performance and FBlit compatibility.
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I would stick to the idea of getting the A2000 first. These are great machines, and it is easy (and usually inexpensive) to upgrade.
You might want to consider a graphics card with built in SC/FF. I used to use a Spectrum from GVP with very good results.
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Hey guys, thanks for all the support -- man I am feeling the love here!
I did get my A2000 this morning with the 030 accelerator and it has a 4GB Hard Drive and 8 mb Ram 4 chip and 4 fast (4 on the accelerator naturally). It seems to be in real good shape and now it is just a matter of the pesky VGA situation and maybe a second floppy drive in it.
Those that PM'd me, thanks, I have written you back. I will have to see how the budget looks in a bit on some of that. I REALLY appreciate the support though!
@new2amga: We'll talk soon I am sure ;-)
Anyhow, the new A2k seems to be a very nice one indeed, it has like one scratch on the case, but otherwise has little to NO yellowing and is every bit as pretty as beige can be :-D
Soon she will be up to 3.1 ROMs and at least OS 3.1 to go with. I am thinking of buying the OS 3.1 and 3.9 from Amigakit when I do the roms.
@amigakit: A while back you included a copy of easyADF for me with a purchase, I can not seem to find the disk... would you be willing to throw another copy in when I buy the stuff? PM me if this is okay.
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@motrucker: Will probably pick up a spectrum for the interim. I assume (forgive my ignorance here) that it will do VGA?
Sounds like a decent card.
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Spectrum is fun for RTG stuff (correct, VGA output,) but it doesn't scandouble unfortunately so native Amiga screenmodes as in games would still require a 15khz monitor.
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so the question becomes: What is the best solution for now to get scan double, flicker fixer and VGA output for my A2000? I really would also like to spend less money right this moment :-D Wouldn't we all though. But having purchased the A2k and last month the Atari ST, my vintage computer hobby budget analyst says to "cool it" for now (aka my wife). So I know that I am into next month before I can buy the 3.1 ROMs and the Amiga OS media that I wish to purchase for this machine ;-)
Between the "vintage computing hobby" and my vinyl LP collecting, I am sure that I could spend many dollars per month were my wife not "grounding me" in reality sometimes. Hey, that is one thing wives are good for though!
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Has anybody tried this?
http://cgi.ebay.com/Arcade-RGBS-CGA-EGA-YUV-TO-2-VGA-CONVERTER-NEW_W0QQitemZ310159942806QQcmdZViewItemQQptZLH_DefaultDomain_0?hash=item4836f92496&_trksid=p4634.c0.m14.l1262
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Spectrum is fun for RTG stuff (correct, VGA output,) but it doesn't scandouble unfortunately so native Amiga screenmodes as in games would still require a 15khz monitor.
Or a multisync. I see 1942 monitors pop up on eBay every now & then. Even saw one at a yard sale - but I wasn't fast enough :(
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@motrucker: yeah, I really hate that when I find a part or something and then for whatever reason, I am not able to snatch it up -- when it comes to miggie parts, you almost have to act the second you find an item.
Right now I have a fellow here in Lawrence who has an extensive collection of vintage computers who is looking to dispatch the whole lot. His items are mostly Atari ST, Tandy TRS-80 and some odds and ends, but one is a A500 new in a box (I think he said A500, maybe an A600 too, can't recall right now the exact one because the conversation was over a week ago now). But to acquire 100 computers and software and odds and ends -- he is asking $2000 in total. He would sell the Amiga for $50 he told me by itself, but he really wants to sell the whole collection. And if you think about it, he is asking $20 per computer -- and one of the TRS-80 Model 1's are worth over $500 to some. The Tandy computer collectors are almost as passionate about those machines as we are!
The offer was tempting, but two things held me back from buying this whole collection: 1) $2k USD is a lot of money for me, especially right now and 2) I would have to find a place to store all this gear and storage space is indeed at a premium in our home. But I do feel he was being very reasonable. Some folks are definitely needing or wanting to get out of the hobby -- and sometimes I understand the feeling. It can be on the order of an addiction sometimes :-D