Amiga.org
Amiga News and Community Announcements => Amiga News and Community Announcements => Miscellaneous => Topic started by: amigamad on August 11, 2004, 05:13:11 PM
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THE MODERATOR of the RME forum has warned that installing Windows XP SP2 can lead to the bus speed being limited to 100Mbit/s.
Matthias Carstens posted the message on the RME forum yesterday, but says it's not a problem particular to RME products. He said: "It affects any Firewire 800 device. If you have a FW800 PCI card and an FW 800 hard disk, go see the bits come one by one through the Firewire cable".
Full article is here The inquirer (http://www.theinquirer.net/?article=17794)
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Given that Firewire is an Apple invention, I wouldn't be surprised if this was intentional. I don't trust M$ to do anything honestly.
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IEEE-1394 (what apple calls Firewire, and Sony calls i.Link) is actually a TI invention not an Apple invention (much like Apples old bus standard Nubus). And since more Windows XP PCs were sold with firewire last year then Apple sold computers its a pretty big issue for microsoft. However it should be a pretty simple fix.
-Tig
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Hum,
i think your right but you can hack into it...
See... (http://support.microsoft.com/default.aspx?kbid=120642)
Basically the idea behind it, is that they`re trying to stop multiple connections being set up by zombie machines...
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I really wonder what this item is doing in the news section of an amiga site. Can we keep a little bit focused (and I mean not Microsoft bashing)
Next thing is a moderator on some obscure forum that warns that listening to Bush can harm your brain. :-)
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@ Tigger
Er... whoops. My mistake :-)
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M$ is at it again!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Man!! I H@TE this @#iT!!
I wanted to use firewhatever on my A500 later today, and now I hear about this! Next thing M$ will do is make it so the 500 can't even install SP2!!!! Goddangit!!! When wil the madness end?!?!?!?!?!?!!?!??!?
?!?!
PS - Still mad.
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I really wonder what this item is doing in the news section of an amiga site.
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@ Fats
As an Amiga owner, you are required to hate Microsoft. And for some odd reason, to not hateMac or Linix, even though they are not Amiga.
Remember - anything big is evil. Anytihng sucessful is evil. You are also required to hate Michael Jordan's Chicago Bulls, and the New York Yankees, and if you are outside the US, you are most likely required to hate Lance Armstrong.
Basicly, this site is about raising Amiga up by hating MS Windows, and chrotling in glee like a little kid when any thing - no matter how small does not work properly in the Windows OS.
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As the current poll illustrates and our server log supports, most of our users are Windows users, and in fact, quite a few of those Windows-using Amiga.org members use XP. As such, a miscellaneous news item warning them of potential problems seems harmless enough.
The inclusion of a Miscellaneous warning to our users about potential problems they may face isn't Microsoft-bashing, nor is it intended to suggest that Windows isn't a far superior product (it is -- solely on the fact that Windows has had 10 years to grow where the Amiga OS has sat fairly dormant). We simply want to make sure that our user base is well aware of potential problems they may face in the future, regardless of what operating system they are forced to use by either work, personal choice, or even practicality.
(FWIW, IMHO, if Commodore had not died in 1994/5, things might have been a lot different today).
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Basicly, this site is about raising Amiga up by hating MS Windows, and chrotling in glee like a little kid when any thing - no matter how small does not work properly in the Windows OS.
Absolutely incorrect, and the fact that you would think that way is a little sad.
Personally speaking, I -- like most users here -- am a strict Windows user, outside of Amiga Forever. This is NOT because I *want* to be, but because the classic Amiga is a very impractical machine for *my* business use.
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A quick scan reveals an image of Gates in the guise of a Natzi. A news sotry stating: "Bill Gates refused entrance to the White House"
While that can all be passed as humor and satire, please understand that there are those who come to this site who want to talk about Amiga, not Microsoft.
These same folks are actualy smart enough to navigate to "The Inquirer" or "The Vulture" or "Slashdot" on thier own.
Tell you what, I'll go right on saying that Amiga.org users are haters whenever a thread comes up that's basicly a "Look at what we can call out M$ on today" and has no Amiga value.
If you are right, those threads should be very rare indeed.
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The visitor web logs are MS biased because IMHO:
1. Lots of people surf from work/colleges/friends houses/cyber cafes with errr.. PCs, not Amigas.
2. Lots of people have a work laptop to take home.
3. Lots of people havent invested in internet connectivity for their Amigas so use their PC instead
4. No CSS / Flash / Real player enabled browsers on the Amiga yet even though IBrowse is excellent.
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2. Lots of people have a work laptop to take home.
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That's exactly my case. I've used iBrowse and Voyager, but even under fast emulation in UAE, I tend to just use IE.
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Poster: Wayne Posted: 2004/8/11 15:50:47
Personally speaking, I -- like most users here -- am a strict Windows user, outside of Amiga Forever. This is NOT because I *want* to be, but because the classic Amiga is a very impractical machine for *my* business use.
The only real time I will use Windows anymore is either for my favorite game or having to be portable and use it on an old laptop.
For business, the only thing I'll use M$ for is printing of labels end evelopes. However, the more I use Glabels, the less I need M$ Office. OpenOffice and GNUmeric meet most of my needs.
Dammy
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Gee getting back on subject why do Amiga folks need to take pot shots at Microsoft.. I have firewire on my laptop (which is running an sp 2 release candidate at the moment an I don't see there is any truth in what is being said here..
Why must folks here continually post anti-microsoft sentiment and suggest facts that are not in evidence.. I think even you folks that don't like M$ should really try for once to get a grip.. Don't believe everything you read..
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Whats the number of Mac users here on Amiga.org? My firewire is working fine still with the new MacOS X 10.3.5 update! :lol:
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What's the dates on these older stories? If I'm right, I'm guessing rather old. Otherwise, if you'll note, each one of these stories is something we feel that our users might have a casual interest in, or in the case of this story, might affect them directly.
Are you suggesting that to be "more fair" about things, we ought to cover ALL Microsoft stories on Amiga.org?
The fact that various non-Amiga specific stories are occassionally posted is just a different perspective on the issue. besides, there are people here that would simply love it if we stopped posting news items about (in no particular order);
- MorphOS and the Pegasos
- the AmigaOne and AmigaOS (since it's "not a true Amiga" -- quoting some)
- Microsoft or other general interest stories
- news items about (insert villainized company of the week here)
So, who's right, and who's wrong? Shouldn't everything be posted that is of interest to any of our users, or should we just stop carrying news altogether....? Wait, that won't please everyone either...
Wayne
(hint: The fact that I make the rules goes a long way here...) :-)
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Gee getting back on subject why do Amiga folks need to take pot shots at Microsoft..
In reference to FastRobPlus, he's partially right in a manner of speaking. There is a very definite tendency on the part of some zealotous Amiga users to compensate for the shortcomings of the classic Amiga by bashing everything else. "I like system X, so everything else must suck".. That's only natural as a defense mechanism.
The only thing I truly resent about Rob's comment is that he wants to extend that to Amiga.org's staff, which is simply not the case. We're simply trying to serve our userbase, and the general sentiment behind Rob's comments are a little insulting...
Then again, perhaps I'm a bit sensitive considering all the beatings I've taken from various Amiga.org users over the years in exchange for trying to provide a free service.
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By the way, sorry for being off topic, but I don't actually have anything with Firewire, nor am I running SP2, so there's not much I can say about the actual subject.
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So, who's right, and who's wrong? Shouldn't everything be posted that is of interest to any of our users, or should we just stop carrying news altogether....? Wait, that won't please everyone either...
Wayne
(hint: The fact that I make the rules goes a long way here...)
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As webmaster, here's what you should do:
Keep whatever format encourages the type of users you want to see.
Example: If you are okay with these flare-ups that seem to always follow a "news" story that says "Have you heard about the latest rumor about M$' ineptitude?" then keep them coming.
Looking over the stir this news item has caused, I think it's safe to say that at least some users of Amiga.org are uncomfortable with the sheer negative sentiment unleashed in these threads.
I guess what I'm saying is, the worst thing that could happen is you alienate some of us so much that we move on. No big loss if you think about it. After all, since we don't spend cycles hating "M$" or whatever else you are against, what do we have to contribute?
I'm just someone who collects Amiga...
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As the current poll illustrates and our server log supports, most of our users are Windows users, and in fact, quite a few of those Windows-using Amiga.org members use XP. As such, a miscellaneous news item warning them of potential problems seems harmless enough.
I would prefer that is posted in the 'Alternative Systems' forum but I didn't want to cause a controversy either.
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People who type Microsoft as 'Micro$oft' or 'M$' need to grow up.
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Nothing like an article about Microsoft to get eveyone {bleep}ing about everything!
:lol:
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Rob?
I really can't do anything about the fact that you have some type of persecution complex over Microsoft. If you refuse to listen to reason, insisting that things are only done the way you believe, then there's really;
1) No reason to continue this conversation
2) A very high likelyhood that you would be unhappy with ANY Amiga-based site.
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As said earler most users here use there pc to access this site i use mine for web browsing because its quicker and easier . I used my amiga for about two years when i had 56k dialup but now i need modern standards like flash and realplayer plugins and other stuff.
:-)
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Pure jealousy. just because Microsoft are where Commodore should have been.
What have you got? KMOS :lol: says it all.
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Hey! What happened to my avatar?
A little vindictive to remove it, don't you think?
That avatar was a piece of an image that graces Amiga.org's home page from time to time under "random photo"!
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2) A very high likelyhood that you would be unhappy with ANY Amiga-based site.
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Can't be more wrong there, I'm afraid.
Back to the Roots is a great Amiga site. I've even contributed to it by getting Microsoft (I know: boo! hiss!) to write up a release and allow BTTR to offer Leaderboard and Links for download.
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Microsoft's at it again! Bwahahahahahahaha...
Another 128,000 bugs to sort thru...
God, how we love Windows!!
(throws pc out the window)
(crash)
I can't wait until I get my copy of AmigaOS4...
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The avatar was removed because it is a violation of posting guidelines, and you were PM'd on that as well. If you will, point out the original picture and it will be removed as it should not be on the site either.
edit: original image removed, thank you FastRobPlus.
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tnx Wayne...
Anyway did anyone notice my post on how to hack it?
There`s a article here with a fix.
See in the inquirer... (http://theinquirer.net/?article=17819)
Personally i actually take a quite perverse pleasure in seeing windoze users squirm ;)
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I wish they would distinguish between "can cause" and "will cause" problems. I find it hard to believe that SP2 will always result in a slowdown under all conditions with all hardware.
I could write a book on all the things Apple screwed up over the years, such as their FAT driver which regularly destroyed PC floppies for no reason as soon as you popped them in the drive. I find it hard to believe that it's possible to royaly screw up FAT!
Nobody in the Mac world ever made an issue out of that, 'cause no Mac user would be caught dead trying to use Windoze files, right?
Don't think for a second that OS4 will be free of bugs. It'll probably blow up a hell of a lot more than my Win2K system.
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I was gonna stop beating this dead horse, but that last comment jogged a memory.
Back in 1986, the Amiga was released and gave independant computer shops another choice in the emerging 16-bit PC comsumer space.
The franchise I worked for (Softwaire/Software Centre) elected to carry the machine and it's full line of release titles, which were mainly Ageis and EA titles, lots of one offs (Mark of the Unicorn's games come to mind, as does WordPerfect)
Anyway, as some of you know, the Amiga was initialy available with Kickstart and Workbench 1.1. I heard that Commodore made a big deal about letting developers know that 1.1 was not firm, and that you needed to code carefuly and follow the rules, becuse some of the licence you could take in 1.1 would not be allowed in 1.2.
You can kind of see where this story is going... Developers held off on some big titles, waiting for 1.2 to come out. This made consumers antsy as they could see thier desired apps being churned out for such machines as the Atari ST. There was a perception that 1.1 was "not done" and the Amiga was "not ready". Worst of all, when 1.2 came out, many titles that ran on 1.1 were crashing! The headlines were similar to this "XP SP2 breaks Firewire 800!" headine. Minor stuff, ealisy remedied, but big-time fodder for Commodores's enemies. The upshot of all this was the Amiga became known as the world's first Multicrashing computer. An obvious jibe coming from Amiga rivals and enviers. (Reminds me of the guys saying "M$ Windoze" at every opportunity.)
Worse still, developers publicly BLAMED Commodore for breaking their apps!! But Commodore had warned that what to do and what not to do!
Worse still - many, many chains and franchises scaled back or pulled out of Amiga altogether. They either never got back, or got back in sparingly when thay saw that the 500 was more stable and an easier sell. But remember - those first retailers got burned big with unsold inventory labled "Requires Kickstart/Workbench 1.1" on the front. There was no "price protection" or anything for software in those days.
I really think the Amiga was doomed to fail from 1986 onward, as a result of the rough start that let Atari take off running, and gave other manufacturers the needed time to mount a defense (Apple IIGS) against Amiga's superior design.
To tie this all together, I have little doubt that LaCie's firewire needed a BIOS upgrade to work as full speed with WinXP. Whose fault is that? MS? LaCie? Firewire chipset makers? Don't care. But threads like this take me back to Winter 1986, when the boss made the decision to cut Amiga, based on the "Multicrashing" allegations, and the advice of fellow retailers. Back then, I wished I coudld have educated him that C= wasn't really to blame, but were fixing things at light-speed just the same. Problem was, he caved into peer pressure from those who said "Don't bother sticking up for Amiga. It makes you out to be a fanatic!" When people badmouth it, just nod and move on!
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Uh, actually that's wrong. Firewire was an Apple invention and they contributed the technology standard to IEEE, who subsequently relabled it IEEE 1394. Apple gets a royalty from anyone who uses the "firewire" name, although no one is obligated to do so since Apple donated the standard.
Here's the history -
http://www.dvshop.ca/dvcafe/museum/dvmuseum2.html
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To tie this all together, I have little doubt that LaCie's firewire needed a BIOS upgrade to work as full speed with WinXP. Whose fault is that? MS? LaCie? Firewire chipset makers? Don't care.
"Don't care" is definately how the customers see things -- as well as Windoze bashers. My dad's system was plagued by the BSOD almost constantly until he downgraded his nVidia drivers. Is that Microsoft's fault? Well, they'll get the blame since their name is what shows up every time you turn on your computer.
Nice story, BTW. I've heard an awful lot of similar things from all angles. That's especially true since I'm a script programmer, and it disgusts me how people abuse these languages and then {bleep} when their code doesn't work with the new versions. (Some exceptions are PHP and HTML. Those "languages" have too many stupid rules that all get deprecated and rewritten far too often).