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Amiga News and Community Announcements => Amiga News and Community Announcements => Announcements and Press Releases => Topic started by: System on October 24, 2003, 05:20:01 PM
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Alan Redhouse and Total Amiga Magazine are working along with Amigaworld.net to provide the Amiga community with AmigaOne Updates every quarter. The first two updates from TAM issue 15 & 16 can be read here (http://amigaworld.net/modules/features/index.php?op=c&cat_id=7&rev_id&sort_by). Also an interview / user Q&A is planned (http://amigaworld.net/modules/newbb/viewtopic.php?topic_id=1799&forum=4) with Alan Redhouse of Eyetech.
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Hmmm, very interesting indeed. Thanks Alan and all who are involved in making this possible! :-D
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now have huge facial omelettes to try to remove
The pretty much insulting tone won't make my doubts entirely disappear: if the VIA issues were so widely known (and repeatedly hinted as fixed ages ago), what are the "some Linux driver - and VIA south bridge initialisation issues"?
Sorry for bringing the topic up again, but I feel the tone pretty provocating. Self contradicting statements from Ben Hermans in just a few days matter of time (by the time of the ominous checksum error screenshots) didn't help the case.
Their "rivals" had a tough time with stability as well - 2 revisions of a hardware fix, then switching the entire northbridge and building a brand new machine was a heavy financial blow.
It seems to me that those questioning the stability of either system were pretty right on spot back then. W/O omolettes to remove.
My 2 eurocents
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@ Warface
The AmigaOne-XE has gone through professional testing (http://amigaworld.net/modules/features/index.php?op=r&cat_id=2&rev_id=35&sort_by) and the various claims have been proven to be FUD.
There will always remain smaller issues to enhance and fix, just like is the case for your Peg or probably even future Peg2. There isn't such a thing as perfect hardware or software.
The VIA Southbridge (used in millions of PCs and also Peg) issues have been well documented, but as Alan pointed out earlier it was difficult to get documentation and support from VIA in the past. Regardless any significant hardware bugs have been proven to fixable through software drivers.
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ah Mike is at it again ......
The VIA Southbridge (used in millions of PCs and also Peg) issues have been well documented,
a) the SB used in the Peg does NOT share "the" VIA-bug, but still it had the
same probs as the A1, till those were fixed with April.
b) "the" VIA-bug is well documented, and easy to fix, but still it took >1 year
to do so.
Looking at all available info I came to this conclusion
(most positive version for the red side):
All VIA-SBs out of that era act a bit out of spec. An issue that never made
problems with x86-NBs.
But is a prob for the Articia.
What does this mean ? The articia IS buggy !
Why ?
Because it was MAI who choosed to build a chip that would rely on older
VIA-chips, while VIA sees those chips as end-of-life and won't even bother
for such small numbers as used in PPC-projects.
It was MAI's responsibilty to make sure their chip work with the line of
SBs they have choosen to support, and the ArticiaS has been available
since late 2000 (atleast) (in engineering samples).
Makes you wonder how long they'll take till they get the ArticiaP really ready,
since even the samples are allready > 1year late (and counting).
"proffesional testing"
Some guy running something undisclosed and stating that it was fast
isn't really worth anything ....
Send a board to c't or similar, and you will get real results (assuming they
would have any interest in such a test that is).
Alan should better keep the eggs to himself, as he had his own share in the
FUD and "look how stupid I am comments" department
:-P
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@ Kronos
For years I have read your Fear, Uncertainty and Doubts with regard to the Amiga projects and most of your doubts have along the way been proven to be unfounded.
I never understood why one should FUD a rival platform when in fact they are so very much alike. Mai Logic deserves alot of credit for making both Pegasos and AmigaOne platforms a reality. This is a most excellent and professional company the various companies could learn alot from.
Both the Pegasos1 and the AmigaOne boards are already nice Linux platforms. The articia has been proven to be of excellent quality, the VIA bugs were hard to find and fix without more support from VIA, but they have done it due to the great teamwork of Eyetech, Mai Logic and AmigaOne betatesters.
The writer of that AmigaOne-XE review is an industry professional with professional equipment to his disposal.
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The AmigaOne-XE has gone through professional testing and the various claims have been proven to be FUD.
Professional testing... And you are pointing me towards an user review? You must be joking.
I dare anyone to crash an April 1 Pegasos running linux DMA enabled out of hardware problems.
Yet there are issues with the April 1 fix (which I have), but require an expert.
There are some problems which don't show up in Linux, but can show up in MorphOS purely because MorphOS is more demanding (Linux hardly uses the Radeon blitter to the same extent as morphos in case of solid window moving, resulting in sound distortion caused by the Articia AGP lock issues with Radeon). And there are those which are randomly or rarely occuring, and only in special cases.
Yet, believe me: there are serious differences between an April 1 and April 2 Pegasos.
Sorry, neither me, nor you, nor Dave P are hardware experts.
EDIT - references corrected
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You don't need to be a hardware expert to test a platform running Linux (software). To know if a system is good or not it's more valuable to be a software testing (and development) expert.
There can be endless reasons why your Peg does not work like the AmigaOne does. Yes, the AmigaOne comes with the latest revision Articia chips and the Peg1 does not, but I don't know if that is the reason. But overall the Peg1 seems to be a nice Linux platform.
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MikeB: Please.. Don't try that anymore. You have been proven wrong so
many times and still you don't seem to understand that you simply no
more have any credibility left.
I could comment AlanR:s technical knowledge and experience.. but it's
quite enough to just read his year old comments .. How sure he was
then that they have perfect product.. :-)
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:flame:
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@ JoannaK
You are free to back up your claims. I could list many of your past claims and doubts though. ;-)
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I'd like to know why people insist in mud throwing...
Articias were never used in a desktop computer and after some time problems arised, I don't know why people are so sure that Discovery chipsets is free of bugs...
on the other hand Pegasos IDE lock ups seem to be VIA related due to interrupt problems, the Frieden said a few months ago that some of the problems the One had were interrupt related due to lack of documentation and incorrect inizialization.
I'm sure that Hyperion got more information about ArticiaS than bPlan/Genesi... that would cause that AmigaOne accept more DIMM types and can run the bus at full 133Mhz.
The relationship with VIA seems to be quite good too.
This is boring.
BTW I own a Peggy but I don't like the attitude of BAFs and BMFs
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The AmigaOne-XE has gone through professional testing
LOL you call THAT professional testing?, I dont but what could I expect you to offer up as proof of your claims?, I think before you or anyone claims that the AmigaOne is all rock solid and whatnot, a board should be sent to a non-biased third party and be tested by them under extreme conditions, and see how it fairs because I for one dont believe it verbatim, and to go around saying 'its solid blah blah blah' and have no proof is very counter productive, if you want to be productive? ask anandtech or another technical review site with some merit to test your board, publicly display the results...and then we can all laugh (or) listen to the 'I told ya so's'
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Articias were never used in a desktop computer and after some time problems arised, I don't know why people are so sure that Discovery chipsets is free of bugs...
AFAIK no one stated that it is free of bugs. The discovery chip's abilities are still subject to determination. But it is OT
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@ meerschaum
Well it's the writer's profession to test software and he did his testing in professional settings, thus I consider this to be a review done by a professional tester instead of by just some ethusiast.
BTW, DaveP has done some interesting additional performance testing (http://amigaworld.net/modules/newbb/viewtopic.php?topic_id=1691&forum=4#19687) for anyone who is genuinely interested. 8-)
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:lol: :lol:
... and now he comes up with that cmpletly f*** uped mem-test ......
Nice way of prooving, that you have no clue :-D
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Same stuff and a lot of other numbers have been on Ann.lu long time
ago, so there is no need to buff that particular website in every
corner. :-)
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Great! Let's take items of information published months ago and turn them into a "news" item by regurgitation.
A waste of space.
:-(
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@ Kronos and JoannaK
IMO you both should take a deep breath now. Why should you get all personal within this thread anyhow? It's only a computer after all.
Why not instead ask the people you support to come up with data which would prove them to be right with regard to their claims? I believe in the past they have even stated that they would do so, but yet they haven't. Yet you decide to attack those who do try to provide you with real life data.
Similar things happened in reply to earlier real life AmigaOne / Pegasos benchmark comparisons, provided by various Peg/AmigaOne owners.
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The AmigaOne-XE has gone through professional testing
know if that is the reason. But overall the Peg1 seems to be a nice Linux platform.
:roflmao:
Well they are both slow/expensive solutions for
linux...only problem is A1 is *only* a linux platform
ATM...maybe this will change next year though?!
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@ -D-
But overall the Peg1 seems to be a nice Linux platform.
:roflmao:
OK, so I gather you don't agree. ;-)
Wow 400 postings, I did it! ;-) See ya.
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LOL :-P
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At least an average user, such as myself, can *buy* an A1. :-P
Flame on... :flame:
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Always the ultraspammers like Kronos and Joanna speak..... Let other serius users give their opinions.
Since AO starst Kronos you have attacked every amiga project.....
MikeB credibility? Much more better than yours, Johanna and Kronos... and all knows. Don't attack him, post serious comment or don't post at all.
Remaining ontopic: great articles, thanks.
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@MikeB
Slightly surprised Pegasos owners can run Linux DMA enabled when A1
owners can't... Maybe someone should check if Linux on Pegasos does
something better :-D
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>Similar things happened in reply to earlier real life
>AmigaOne / Pegasos benchmark comparisons,
Right. We're still waiting for olegil's speed results of
his A1 SE....
PS: Do you have an AmigaOne?
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@ MikeB
Mai Logic deserves alot of credit for making both Pegasos and AmigaOne platforms a reality.
And Genesi deserves a lot of credit for making the MAI Articia S Northbridge working decently.
However, "decent working" is not at all the same thing as "excellent working". So moving along now. Been there, done that, so to say. I look forward to the Marvell based Pegasos boards ...
Linux is one thing, but it will be interesting to see how various things will be "fixed through software drivers" in OS4 as that OS comes closer and closer to the hardware, and how these software fixes will affect overall performance. Especially on the "A1 SE".
My guess is that Genesi has lost a lot of money (and time!!) in the process of making the Articia S work in a decent way, but at least they have been open about the problems. Without doubt, it has cost them a lot of time and money to develop the April 1, the April 2, and then these six months or so of "void", and the Pegasos 2. I guess that we can "credit MAI for this" too, MikeB ...?
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Itix: you're a toy..
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Mai Logic deserves alot of credit for making both Pegasos and AmigaOne platforms a reality. This is a most excellent and professional company the various companies could learn alot from.
Mai Logics part has a problem according to several engineers who have alot more experience then you or Dave on board layout. The Teron Boards were abandoned by the Yellow Dog Linux folks for it, and the Barbie was abandoned as well due to issues with the part. You in reality dont know anything about the company Mike, you are parroting what Fleecy or maybe Ben told you. You dont have the education, experience or technical knowledge to know whether the part performs correctly or not.
Both the Pegasos1 and the AmigaOne boards are already nice Linux platforms. The articia has been proven to be of excellent quality, the VIA bugs were hard to find and fix without more support from VIA, but they have done it due to the great teamwork of Eyetech, Mai Logic and AmigaOne betatesters.
Which non engineer told you that Mike?? Fleecy or Ben???
The writer of that AmigaOne-XE review is an industry professional with professional equipment to his disposal.
What exactly is Dave's job that makes him an industry professional capable of answering questions about DMA bugs?? I'm sorry, but much like your self proclaimed super amiga knowledge, I find it wanting. Is the DMA bug in Articia?? Don't know, haven't personally tested it, though it may be an interesting experiment. But if you think what you so strongly classify as "professional testing" proves it doesn't occur, you are sadly mistaken.
-Tig