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Amiga News and Community Announcements => Amiga News and Community Announcements => Amiga Hardware News => Topic started by: anarchic_teapot on December 03, 2002, 09:38:45 AM
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Terrasoft (http://www.terrasoftsolutions.com/products/boxer/teron_cx.shtml) have just announced they'll be selling the G3 Teron CX board with YDL.
Pricing similar to the AmigaOne, but graphics support in Linux limited to AGP 128 Rage Pro.
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Yeah, I agree that graphics support is alittle weak! It's great to see another PPC motherboard on the market though!
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Of course it's great to see another PowerPC platform. Actually as a developer I really like this processor.
But this makes me think that the AmigaOne (or the Pegasos) is just like this new PPC platform : nothing original. Just take a PC and replace the x86 compatible and some electronic chips and you get it.
When Amiga came out in the 80's the hardware was so interesting. I'd like to see a computer with some kind of terrific hardware again. At present we only get interesting hardware in game consoles. But they remain consoles !
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But this makes me think that the AmigaOne (or the Pegasos) is just like this new PPC platform : nothing original. Just take a PC and replace the x86 compatible and some electronic chips and you get it.
Yeah true, but I am glad to see more and more support for PPC where desktop computing is concerned... maybe this will open the doors of opportunity once again for PowerPC (beyond all things Mac).
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Yeah true, but I am glad to see more and more support for PPC where desktop computing is concerned... maybe this will open the doors of opportunity once again for PowerPC (beyond all things Mac).
Same here. It would be more than it is now if Steve Jobs had not killed the Mac compatables just when they were starting to really take off. The competition was really heating up then. I hope to see that same type of explosion with Amiga compatables this time around. There were at least 10 or so companies that were producing official Mac clones. If we got half that many then it would be great.
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I hope to see that same type of explosion with Amiga compatables this time around. There were at least 10 or so companies that were producing official Mac clones. If we got half that many then it would be great.
Well I guess as long as Amiga Inc. is willing to play, then these companies building PowerPC solutions for the desktop can take advantage of the Amiga market, being AOS and/or MOS!
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Pricing similar to the AmigaOne, but graphics support in Linux limited to AGP 128 Rage Pro.
How about pricing is NOT similar to AmigaOne, but is in fact much better. $499 for TeronCX from Terrasoft, $599 for AmigaOne from Softhut, I think it $575 from compu-quick....is there a cheaper dealer somewhere? Where do you get similar pricing, I see a $100 premium for an AmigaOne. Oh well, different perspectives...
YDL supports rage 128....it doesn't limit someone to the rage 128. I don't like the wording, cause it almost implies that the AOne hardware supports more graphics cards than the TeronCX, which of course, is not true....but it is an accurate thing to say, that since YDL is an operating system, until they officially support more cards, then they don't support a lot of cards...smiles.
Just like unreleased OS's don't really support any cards.
:-D
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I see a $100 premium for an AmigaOne.
different perspectives indeed. I see you paying $100 for AmigaOS 4 :-)
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How about pricing is NOT similar to AmigaOne, but is in fact much better.
Go and buy one then.
I see a $100 premium for an AmigaOne.
So? :-?
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It almost sounds as if some people think the Teron CX's sold via different distributors (like Eyetech and Terrasoft) are different. "Amiga compatibles"? "Another PPC motherboard"? It's the same motherboard.
And what's this supposed to mean: "Pricing similar to the AmigaOne, but graphics support in Linux limited to AGP 128 Rage Pro"? Whatever drivers exist in Linux naturally run under Linux regardless of whom you buy a motherboard from!
Included in the $500 is of course Yellow Dog Linux, which otherwise costs $60 when bought directly from Terrasoft, including 2 months installation support ($30 with "normal" support).
Unless the distribution policies for AmigaOS are changed, it's all moot anyway, AmigaOS users are not allowed to choose their hardware vendors freely. Like I've said, the market for one piece of hardware has been turned into two separate markets - "hardware allowed to be bought by AmigaOS users" and "hardware for everyone else".
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How about pricing is NOT similar to AmigaOne, but is in fact much better. $499 for TeronCX from Terrasoft, $599 for AmigaOne from Softhut, I think it $575 from compu-quick....
How about, the TeronCX as sold by Terrasoft in the US (remember, Eyetech are the Teron distributors for Europe) has a VIA686A (UDMA66) southbridge, whereas the AmigaOne has the faster VIA686B.
Eyetech has just stated on the Amigaone mailing list that the Linux-only mobos will be sold slightly cheaper than the AmigaOne G3SE. Which goes to show that Amiga-compatibility is worth something, after all. ;-)
Me, for the difference I'd take an AmigaOne every time.
Oh, but I have, haven't I? :-D
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How about, the TeronCX as sold by Terrasoft in the US (remember, Eyetech are the Teron distributors for Europe) has a VIA686A (UDMA66) southbridge, whereas the AmigaOne has the faster VIA686B.
No. Both Terrasoft and Eyetech are distributors of the "consumer revision" Teron CX, which is equipped with the 686B.
Eyetech has just stated on the Amigaone mailing list that the Linux-only mobos will be sold slightly cheaper than the AmigaOne G3SE. Which goes to show that Amiga-compatibility is worth something, after all.
I'd hope it's because the bundled AmigaOS is worth something... ;)
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No. Both Terrasoft and Eyetech are distributors of the "consumer revision" Teron CX, which is equipped with the 686B.
Wrong.
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How about, the TeronCX as sold by Terrasoft in the US (remember, Eyetech are the Teron distributors for Europe) has a VIA686A (UDMA66) southbridge, whereas the AmigaOne has the faster VIA686B.
Well, actually, the Terrasoft site says it has ATA100 onboard, so that would be the same southbridge as the A1.
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Sorry, double post. :-P
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Good to see another PPC based white box.
Realistically, with employment of Linux as the OS, they may have to compete with the rest of Linux (X86) based solutions.
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But this makes me think that the AmigaOne (or the Pegasos) is just like this new PPC platform : nothing original.
Nothing wrong with multiple HW platform distributions.
Just take a PC and replace the x86 compatible and some electronic chips and you get it.
It worked with X86 world. Why not fight clones with clones?
When Amiga came out in the 80's the hardware was so interesting. I'd like to see a computer with some kind of terrific hardware again.
Well, during middle 80s you don’t have nVidia style companies…
At present we only get interesting hardware in game consoles. But they remain consoles !
They not remain consoles for most part.
I recall X-Box's GPU (NV2A) was a variant of Geforce3(NV20). Nvidia’s nForce1/2 chipset is a variant of X-BOX’s chipset, which also designed by nVidia.
Nintendo Game Cube’s VPU is being supplied by ATI (ArtX based chip, comparable to DirectX 7 class).
ATI’s Radon series (DirectX 8/9 class) would considered superior compared to ATI/ArtX’s VPU chip.
Most of today’s leading edge console graphics technologies are being powered by the giant desktop graphics providers (mostly from X86 world e.g. ATI and nVidia).
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AmigaOS users are not allowed to choose their hardware vendors freely.
Technically, AmigaOS users are allowed to choose their _licensed_ hardware vendors freely.
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But this makes me think that the AmigaOne (or the Pegasos) is just like this new PPC platform : nothing original. Just take a PC and replace the x86 compatible and some electronic chips and you get it.
You mean just like apple? Just a mobo with PC cards and a PPC cpu instead an x86... I guess It`s not Mac anymore eh? Or it is because of the fancy case and the new Amigas wont be Amigas cause will have just another ordinary grey case (just like most A1200 tower systems)?
Is it an Amiga for you an A1200 on a PC tower with PC slots like PCI which have a PC gfx card, a PC sound card and a PC ethernet card? Oh and if it has also a BlizzardPPC instead of only a 68k? I guess not...
The new Amiga just another PPC platform... was A1000 just another 68k platform?
(Ah but we had custom chips!! Do you have a company with the know-how and the capital to make new custom chips that will be better that the nVidia and ATI GPUs? And even if Amiga had all these things.. in 6 months would be crap their custom chips) (BTW I haven`t seen an AGA screen for years since I don`t have a scan doubler. Doh! so that means I haven`t used an Amiga all these years!) (You`d say I should use the dblpal screenmode and drop my GFX card lol)
The important thing for me would be if that mobo could run AmigaOS (competition=lower prices, more choices)
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> The new Amiga just another PPC platform... was A1000 just another 68k platform?
Yes, the new Amiga is just another PPC platform.
No, the A1000 was not "just another" 68k platform.
The AmigaOne is based on standard parts and a licensed motherboard that was designed to do something entirely else (than to be an "Amiga") originally.
The A1000 was a custom-designed motherboard and machine with the entire design, including motherboard layout and machine casing, designed for just the A1000. But more importantly, and this separates it from being "just another" 68k platform, it had custom chips designed for it and only for it.
And please, spare me the "doing new custom chips would be impossibly expensive"... I know, and I agree - at least for the most part, meaning stuff like 3D chips etc (perhaps there could be one or two special custom chips for something in particular, but that's another story). That has got nothing to do with defining what the new Amiga is.
No matter what the reason, there is nothing, hardware-wise, separating "the new Amiga" from being just another PPC platform. It is nothing special. All parts are standard, licensed from elsewhere, as is the entire design. Unlike Apple, it doesn't even have a case design of its own. The only thing that makes a difference is the software.
The hardware is clearly just another PPC platform. And, I guess if we forget the artifical limitation of the dongle codes, that makes AmigaOS just another PPC operating system instead of being an operating system for "Amigas".
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All parts are standard, licensed from elsewhere, as is the entire design. Unlike Apple, it doesn't even have a case design of its own. The only thing that makes a difference is the software.
What's wrong with that? Aren't standards a good thing? So, Apple Mac's have a nice case. Looks may be important to some computer buyers but not me.
As a user would I want another custom Amiga audio/ video chipset? No, thanks. The SB Live and AGP ATI video cards are fine for me.
Would I want a custom keyboard, mouse, floppy drive controller? No, thanks.
The fact that the AmigaOS is moving to a standards based motherboard that can be fitted with common parts IMO is a good thing.
Should the AmigaONE design be similar to the Amiga classics that used proprietary system boards, cases, power supplies, chipsets, floppy drives, expansion slots, keyboards, mice, monitors, memory, etc...?
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>What's wrong with that? Aren't standards a good thing? So, Apple Mac's have a nice case. Looks may be important to some computer buyers but not me.
Please re-read what I wrote. I dedicated an entire chapter after that one rebutting this particular claim.
This was not about right and wrong. There is nothing, per se, wrong with AmigaOne using standard parts.
All I claimed is that that makes it "just another" PPC platform.
"Amiga" used to be a hardware platform of its own. Now it (or more precisely AmigaOne) is not.
AmigaOne is not a hardware platform of its own, but a standard, licensed PPC motherboard.
Again, not about right and wrong, or saying whether this is good or bad...
Just saying it like it is.
Just another PPC platform.
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My apologies,
I misunderstood the point you were trying to make.
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>I misunderstood the point your were trying to make.
No problem. :) I'm glad we are in agreement.
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The point was that in order to be an Amiga doesn`t need to have custom chips. AmigaOne/Pegasos are Amigas exactly the same way as a MacG4 is an Apple.
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no worries.
Katalaba... eimai ligo argostrofos :-)
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OT: ! Megalwses h` metanasteuses sthn Australia?! :-)
Eimaste pantou telika :-D
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A custom chipset does not have to be built by the same company who designs the computer. For example the X-Box uses a nVidia chip or the Game Cube an ATI.
But what's exciting with this is that the hardware is fixed and it's powerfull hardware. Moreover on the X-Box you get shared memory which allows so many optimization tricks (just benchmark a main memory to video memory copy on PC and cry as it is so slooow).
When a company sells a game for a console, they do not label on the package with stuff like "this game needs this or that hardware". They just label it "X-Box game" or "Game Cube game". No wrong hardware, no wrong driver... You put it in your box, and it works.
That was really a nice thing with the Amiga. You just had to put "Amiga software" on the package and you were about 100% sure it would work on your Amiga.
I've been programming many years now on PC, and I don't count the times I had to correct "compatibility" problems in my softwares, or deal with users why the software could have troubles on their PC :
"Oh yes, for running this software featuring high quality real time 3D you NEED a 3D card"
"No, it won't work with your old 2 Mb 3D card"
"Oh, well, I code with an nVidia card, I don't really support ATI cards but it will work, it's just the program won't be as fast as on an nVidia one"
"Your sound card doesn't support hardware channel mixing so you will have to install DirectSound on your computer to make it work"
"Oh, well, it seems that the high resolution timer interface on your PC is not working properly. It might be a problem with your motherboard. First time I see this..."
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I'm afraid it will be the same with the new Amiga. One of the great advantage of the old Amigas : "the plug and use concept" will be lost. With consoles if a piece of software works on the developer platform, let's say a Game Cube, it will work on ALL other Game Cube of the world. Something quite impossible on PC. Something lost for the Amiga :-(
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Yes but Amiga was never a game console (only in the eyes of its enemies) It is a computer, and from A3000 and beyond it didn`t have a standard hardware. It used graphics cards, soundcards etc, it had a variety of 68k cpus and speeds etc.
The only difference now is that those cards aren`t made for Amiga computers only but for a variety of computers by very specialized companies in this or that sector.
This way your computer is modular and you don`t have to throw it if you want to update lets say its graphic chip after 6 months.