Amiga.org
Amiga News and Community Announcements => Amiga News and Community Announcements => Announcements and Press Releases => Topic started by: Kent on November 12, 2002, 05:09:27 AM
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Jim Louderback writes: "With stories about the new Amiga shipping spreading across the web, including here on ExtremeTech (http://www.extremetech.com/article2/0,3973,675450,00.asp), I thought it would be worthwhile to sit down and talk about these, and other developments with Bill McEwen, the CEO and President of Amiga, Inc."
Read More... (http://www.extremetech.com/article2/0,3973,687936,00.asp)
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OK, the ppl who want AmigaOS on Intel should be happy: here we have a public statement by the Guy In Charge (tm) saying that OS5 will support x86. It will take a year and a bit, but IMHO this is better. Odds are much higher this way that we'll have AmigaOS on a 'good' i86 (itanium) rather than the baggage-ridden 80x86.
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Ok, boys and girls straight from the horse's mouth:
"ET: What about Pentium 4?
Bill McEwen: Not with OS4, but it will with our next version, OS5 due out within 12 months from when OS4 ships. We'll merge the code-bases and go cross-platform."
Which, by all accounts is 12 months + 3 weeks from now according to other comments Bill makes. Also expect AmigaDE integration and dual boot capability.
Oh... and it supports the 40,000 programs from the 64k chip as well. Typo there one would hope. Or did those crafty Hyperion guys come up with a C64 emulator too!
All kidding aside, some very pointed and intelligent questions. We'll see about the responses.
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Ummmmm......I just read it and all I can say is.....I'm confused....
ET: And that if you want AmigaOS, "you're not allowed to buy it. You have to buy a new Teron board."
Bill McEwen: That's untrue.
This isnt how I understand it....I thought it was posted that the only way to get a copy of OS4 is to purchase it with a PPC MoBo..."There will be NO shrink wrapped versions of OS4.0"
Also I though that OS4 wouldnt be out until Q1 2003...Why is he saying 3 weeks?
Not to sound bad but I am starting to get the impression that Bill McEwen is answering questions before he knows the correct answers.....Like when he said you could get Bernithalon and you couldnt.
P.S. I guess we see that as far as he is concerned there will be other platforms that the OS will be ported to...Or is he Mixing AmigaDE with Amiga OS?
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I thought OS5 was supposed to be a 64bit operating system. You can not run it on a lousy Pentium4 CPU ... oh well...
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Also I though that OS4 wouldnt be out until Q1 2003...Why is he saying 3 weeks?
Not to sound bad but I am starting to get the impression that Bill McEwen is answering questions before he knows the correct answers.....Like when he said you could get Bernithalon and you couldnt.
;-) I suspect the "three weeks" figure may be due to the traditional time lag involved in the print media. Magazine articles are written months before you and I see them.
Bill may have meant three weeks after he expected the article to be released, instead of three weeks after the interview was conducted.
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Retarded_Fury wrote:
ET: And that if you want AmigaOS, "you're not allowed to buy it. You have to buy a new Teron board."
Bill McEwen: That's untrue.
This isnt how I understand it....I thought it was posted that the only way to get a copy of OS4 is to purchase it with a PPC MoBo..."There will be NO shrink wrapped versions of OS4.0"
Yes. This has been "clarified" so many times by himself, fleecy, Gary Peake, Alan Redhouse and Ben Hermans. I hope that's not a word-for-word quote of McEwen, as what he says is simply "untrue." *)
And what's with this nonsense:
Bill McEwen: EyeTech is one of the larger computer resellers in England, and they licensed the right to take the project over. The Amiga One is our spec, our design, but they built it.
Again, I hope he's been misquoted. Otherwise he's spitting right in the face of Bill Mueller and the other Mai Logic engineers. "No, you didn't design your board, it's our spec, our design."
Things like this...
Bill McEwen: OS4 is the next version of the Amiga OS, it's a total rewrite of the operating system. It's brand new from the ground up, rewritten for the PPC hardware. And it's bloody fast. It's currently in beta testing at 20 external sites, and it's just about ready to go .. in three more weeks. The components are ready, we just have to plug them together and go.
ET: Did you just throw everything out and start over?
Bill McEwen: Well, major portions of the code are still being used. We took those pieces that were hard wired to the custom chipsets, and worked through those issues to make sure we could take advantage of the special capabilities of the Power PC chip. [my emphasis]
...also suggest that he really should abstain from commenting on technical aspects of AmigaOS, and concentrate on trademark licensing.
The rest was the same old, same old. I.e. more marketese.
*) Edit: It could of course be that he was thinking of a special OS version meant for old PPC kludges on Amigas, but forgot to elaborate on that fact. Either way, Amigas with Cyberstorm cards are not very relevant to Extremetech readers, so, AmigaOS will still not be available for sale separately as far as they or anyone else interested in reasonably modern hardware is concerned.
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ksk wrote:
I thought OS5 was supposed to be a 64bit operating system. You can not run it on a lousy Pentium4 CPU ... oh well...
OS5 is whatever the religious nutjobs want it to be, and it'll stay that way until it leaves the vague-outlines-in-an-old-marketing-announcement stage.
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OS5 is whatever the religious nutjobs want it to be, and it'll stay that way until it leaves the vague-outlines-in-an-old-marketing-announcement stage.
Well as long as it keeps the x86 zealot freaks happy, then so be it... maybe this will finally put to rest the never ending debate over x86 vs PPC!
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one word: :crazy:
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Actually, that's a picture, so it's technically 1000 words :-D
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Actually, that's a picture, so it's technically 1000 words
I KNEW someone would say that :-o
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The image is 702 bytes big, so theoretically it's about 100-150 words... :-D ( 70 words more )
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OK, the ppl who want AmigaOS on Intel should be happy: here we have a public statement by the Guy In Charge (tm) saying that OS5 will support x86. It will take a year and a bit, but IMHO this is better. Odds are much higher this way that we'll have AmigaOS on a 'good' i86 (itanium) rather than the baggage-ridden 80x86.
The "baggage-ridden" X86 is for running legacy software investments.
Itanium is not considered as the true X86 successor unlike AMD’s K8 Hammer series CPUs (X86-64).
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Again, I hope he's been misquoted. Otherwise he's spitting right in the face of Bill Mueller and the other Mai Logic engineers. "No, you didn't design your board, it's our spec, our design."
Well, the original Amiga Inc(later CBM) designed the “Amiga” while Motorola designed the main CPU.
I think Bill McEwen was referring to the complete packaged solution, NOT just the components.
MAI’s chipsets alone doesn’t deliver the Amiga™ solution.
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Oh no, what did Bill now say?:-) This will be interesting, trying to figure out what Bill really means?:-) I think he is sharing his ideas. That these are his goals and vision. In that case the timeline is just a goal. I would not expect to see OS 5 by the end of next year. Why work on any OS4.x? I mean I can wait a year if OS5 would be out by then. I am not going to get all worked up by this timeline. I am very grateful that there is a plan for the future and that Bill is thinking about where he wants to take all of this. For me that is the good news, that there is a plan. I am sure some of it will change and that is okay. For me it is great to think that Amiga will still be here for the upcoming years.
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Uhm usually I would defend Amiga, but I think a lot of the things Bill has said are untrue.
Second he doesn't give respect where its due. No mention of Hyperion or Eyetechs labour of love to get OS4 off the ground.
So what's going on with the Amiga One, and who is EyeTech?
Bill McEwen: EyeTech is one of the larger computer resellers in England, and they licensed the right to take the project over. The Amiga One is our spec, our design, but they built it.
Way to belittle Eyetech, who on their own back went out and made sure Amiga One hardware would exist, Maybe Amiga aren't aware of the work they've put in?
OS4 is the next version of the Amiga OS, it's a total rewrite of the operating system. It's brand new from the ground up, rewritten for the PPC hardware.
This statement is immediatey contradicted with the next statement.
ET: Did you just throw everything out and start over?
Bill McEwen: Well, major portions of the code are still being used.
You've got over 40,000 Amiga applications that will run on the machine without any changes
Lie lie lie, Only applications that behave will run and you and I know there are some really dodgy ones out there, I very much doubt 40,000 would run, add to that the availability, if they all did run you'd have to pirate most of them cos they just aren't available.
ET: Wasn't your vision for Amiga that it should be cross platform? Why does the desktop version only run on a custom, modified PowerPC system?
Bill McEwen: The idea is that we can run on any piece of hardware, we architected it that way. First we'll get it running on Power PC, then go from there and expand to other chipsets.
I wish people would make up their minds first its one way and then the other, is it platform agnostic or not.?
ET: What about Pentium 4?
Bill McEwen: Not with OS4, but it will with our next version, OS5 due out within 12 months from when OS4 ships. We'll merge the code-bases and go cross-platform
Again thats a new one on us, we were told no x86 , hyperion said they wouldn't do it, I wonder whose going to make this come true.
ET: What's the status of Amiga OS on other platforms today?
Bill McEwen: We're shipping today on PocketPC and the PocketPC phone edition. You can head right on over to our website and buy an entertainment or software pack that downloads right to those devices.
Uhm this isn't AmigaOS confusing the matter isn't going to help sure from a markettign point of view it reinforces the brand but essentially it will just give customers false expectations.
ET: But those[amiga anywhere content] apps won't run on the desktop version?
Bill McEwen: not until OS5.
Thats funny cos hyperion seem to say the next version of Amiga will have Amiga anywhere running on it, thats 4.2 or 4.5 not version 5, wrong again
ET: After our news story, we had a pretty strong posting on our website. Our member said that Amiga OS "will apply some form of hardware-license mechanism, a dongle to his hardware."
Bill McEwen: That's untrue.
Well essentially in that semantic construction it is untrue AmigaOS does no such thing, the AmigaOne however does have to have a dongle to allow AmigaOS to run on it.
A partial truth but its not one thats going to win you any favours.
I'm sorry but Bill is either clearly ill informed or is lying, I'm more in the loop than him.
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I'm pretty sure 64k does not mean c64, but for instance 64k intros. IE, even tricky demoscene stuff runs on AmigaOS4. And about you all being upset about the "untrue" statements. No, you don't need to buy a AmigaOne to get AmigaOS4, although, atm, it's the only solution. But afaiu, what you HAVE to do is have amiga certified hardware. Not really a big deal, "no, we won't let you use OS4 on stuff we don't know if it works well on" kinda. And about the AmigaOne design, the AmigaOne isn't just the Teron motherboard you know. Read the specs that Amiga have on the AmigaOne, Amiga set up those specs and someone else builds it.
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Whabang: No, 702 bytes is 351 words (one word equals 2 bytes, or 16 bits), or 175.5 long words (32 bits) ;-)
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I'm pretty sure 64k does not mean c64, but for instance 64k intros. IE, even tricky demoscene stuff runs on AmigaOS4.
No, its a typo for "68K", and tricky demoscene stuff won't run without UAE (unless you are using it on a PPC equipped classic, I guess)
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No, 702 bytes is 351 words
:-D :-D :-D
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Don't know about you but I hope no-one outside the Amiga community gets to read that!
What a bad interview.
Why does Bill not know if the AmigaOne is shipping!?
"I guess...."
What is a 64K?
An OS4.0 enabled machine requires some form of hardware license i.e. dongle...
Does he even know what he is talking about?
Really disappointed in this. It has really shaken my faith in AInc.
Allen
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Actualy, i think almost everyone has known that this is the case. Its bloody obvious.
If you didnt know already, Fleecy told me several years ago, and i suppose this still applies... The DE will be integrated in such a way, that the DE will not run as a task/process.
Fleecy didnt go further, but i can only thing of one other way of doing things. The only thing i can think of is, by implimenting the DE as a set of API's. But what is certain is that the DE will be implimented to be ran as a task from 4.2, but by OS5, it'll be completly integrated and wont run as a proecss.
Here's the email again. I keep all my favourite emails :).
Dear Mr McEwen,
sorry to bother you again, as this is my second email on the one topic. In my last email i did make sure you knew that it was not of high importance and that it could wait. But im writing to inform you that there seems to be more confusion than what i first thought.
The matter that i and others are concerned (or puzzled) about is the technical update and a specific phrase. I can hear you getting mad. :). I know that you must have put a lot of work into that article and tried to make it as clear as possible. You did a greate job. However theres just one small thing i and others believe need clarrification in your technical update.
Quote:
Most importantly, AmigaOS4 will see the first introduction of the AmigaDE for existing Amigans, with it running co-operatively on top of the Operating System, and then slowly being integrated until, with the release of AmigaOS5, both will effectively merge to become one.
End Quote.
Many people seem to believe that by AmigaOS 5.0, AmigaOS will have achieved full hardware independance. That is AmigaOS will not require the PPC to operate, and will instead use a range of processors from the zico standard, including arm, x86 and others.
I myself do not beleive this is what you intended to portray. I believe that when you said "both will effectively merge to become one" that you ment that AmigaOS will simply be able to run all AmigaDE applications however the AmigaOS will be dependant on he PPC. As which makes sence to why you would port all existing AmigaOS code from 68k -> PPC code.
So as i am sure this is what you are trying to say, Many other are not so sure, or are sure about something that is not true. I think clarrification is needed on this one point. If (ironicly) you are having trouble understanding me, :) email me right back and ill see if i can put this another way.
Fleecy Wrote:
Dear Rodney 8-)
What this means is that for AmigaOS4 (currently OS4.2), the DE will run
as a separate application on top of the AmigaOS, which itself is
a PPC only OS. When OS5 comes around, it will not run as an
application but be a seamless and invisible part of OS5. However, it will
be a subset of OS5 - it will not decide which processors OS5
runs on.
That information will be released much later on, most likely when we
have OS5 running on them.
Thanks for asking though ;-)
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Bill McEwen got interviewed by E.T.!!!
Call Mulder and Scully!!!
:lol: :roflmao: :crazy: :crazy:
:-D :-D
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No, phone home! :-P
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I don't have an umbrella... :-(
:-D
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My god was this bad. I tried looking at his answers as marketting babble, but it really boiled down to BS. Throw into the mix that YET AGAIN sehund pops up beatting the same old drum, and you have a painful article to read :-x
WTF is Bill doing? He just gave A-Inc haters tons of fuel to throw on the fire :-x
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Hi Al,
> My god was this bad.
Then may I be so bold as to suggest you get a new one?
;-) :lol: ;-)
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One thing to point out is that there are a number of typos, that Bill can't really be held accountable for, and the interview itself was posted not by an Amiga Inc. employee.
Perhaps it's worth pointing out to Amiga Inc. the errors on the interview so they can have them corrected.
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@Crispy_Beef :
Perhaps it's worth pointing out to Amiga Inc.
I e-mailed Fleecy a couple of hours ago, pointing out there 'was trouble at mill'.
Hopefully they'll be able to sort out the erratas.
-john
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Ok.
Excepted you could mistake 68K to be 64K, due to 64 being a common number when dealing with computers. I doubt it is a typo though.
What you can't explain is...
ET: Is it shipping?
Bill McEwen: I guess it is now, but only with Linux on it. It has been shipping in limited quantities...
Why doesn't he know if the product is shipping? I know it is nothing to do with AInc but come on... I am pretty sure M$ft know when Intel ship new chips etc...
Bill McEwen: OS4 is the next version of the Amiga OS, it's a total rewrite of the operating system. It's brand new from the ground up, rewritten for the PPC hardware.
Eh? As said before this is wrong...and directly contradicted by later statement...this is unacceptable.
Also where does he think that there are 7 million of us?
ET: After our news story, we had a pretty strong posting on our website. Our member said that Amiga OS "will apply some form of hardware-license mechanism, a dongle to his hardware."
Bill McEwen: That's untrue
What!?
Very unprofessional.
It is a shame as he does have something cool to talk about...like the way the community is still around and that Hyperion/Eyetech/MAI have worked really hard to get to where we are...
What is done is done though... :(
Allen
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@Allen
While I am not trying to defened all of the obvious mistakes in that interview, there is also some confusion over whether or not they are talking about Classic systems (with PPC), AmigaOnes, or AA/DE
The interview seems to have blurred the lines (which is why it needs clarification/correcting. Hopefully it'll be sorted out soon enough.
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Bill McEwen: OS4 is the next version of the Amiga OS, it's a total rewrite of the operating system. It's brand new from the ground up, rewritten for the PPC hardware.
Eh? As said before this is wrong...and directly contradicted by later statement...this is unacceptable.
Technically it's practically true with exec being totally rewritten (ExecSG) from the ground up to include extra features such as memory protection, virtual mem etc. Plus there really isn't much left of the 68k native code.
Also where does he think that there are 7 million of us?
He's reffering to a potential target market of ex. Amiga users. i.e. those whoe once enjoyed the system and may consider coming back. While I don't believe anywhere near as many as that would consider it, they are the first that should be targetted.
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"ET: And that if you want AmigaOS, "you're not allowed to buy it. You have to buy a new Teron board."
Bill McEwen: That's untrue. "
"This isnt how I understand it....I thought it was posted that the only way to get a copy of OS4 is to purchase it with a PPC MoBo..."There will be NO shrink wrapped versions of OS4.0""
Yes. This has been "clarified" so many times by himself, fleecy, Gary Peake, Alan Redhouse and Ben Hermans. I hope that's not a word-for-word quote of McEwen, as what he says is simply "untrue." *)"
Hardly. Seehund do your research they have
constantly stated that PowerUP boards will
have an exception from the licensing scheme.
This will be the only shrink wrapped version of
AOS4.
Jeez, another thing "conveniently forgotten"?
As for the rest of the interview: No comment.
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Quote:
ET: Is it shipping?
Bill McEwen: I guess it is now, but only with Linux on it. It has been shipping in limited quantities...
Couldn't it be (like someone suggested before) that when the interview was held he wasn't sure if it was shipping now. I.e. he was referring to a future he did not know of, but had an idea of.
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Blade:
See that asterisk that you even quoted? Now look at the bottom of that post, where I address the OS4 for Amigas bit.
Sheesh!
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oh no, how embarrassing!
Amiga OS5 in 12 months on X86 with AmigaDE (whatever that crap is)? And they even haven't got OS4 released? No problem to Mr.Mcewen, 3 more weeks just banging together a couple of modules.
A disgrace to Hyperion, who haven't received ANY help, ANY funding, ANY know how from the GREAT AInc.
Oh well, no surprise there.
All the best and respect to Hyperion though. Ainc doesn't exist anymore in my eyes anyway.
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Seehund
Well things like this will happen if you "Edit" while Im launching a new browser window to copy and paste from. That bit wasnt there I swear it!
Sheesh! ;-)
Blade
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This interview is so ridiculous I'm going to have to paraphrase what I said on another forum.
A) Is this interview a fake?
This interview is either:
1) Real
--a) misquoted
----Does Bill McEwen have Tourette's Syndrome? No. Does
----the interviewer have a hearing problem? I doubt it.
--b) accurately quoted
----Bill McEwen is a liar, a fool, an idiot, and/or a drunk.
2) Fake
--a) intetionally
----This interview is a product of a creative genius who listens
----to Bill McEwen a LOT. If I were to create a fake interview
----I wouldn't have made him lie and dodgle so often,
----especially in cases where it wasn't necessary. I would
----have thought the purpose of a fake interview would me to
----make Bill sound like either a liar, a fool, or an ass, but all
----three? I think not.
--b) unintetionally
----Some nut managed to convince himself that he IS Bill
----McEwen and has copied his mannerisms perfectly. The
----real Bill McEwen should be very worried and change his
----locks, perhaps ask plastic surgeons if anybody has asked
----for the "Bill McEwen" look.
I actually read the interview twice, the second time assuming it was a fake. I found that scenario most improbable. I find the most probable reality is 1b and so I offer my most lucid analysis of the most insane interview I have seen in a technical venue:
B) The Interview?
Going through the list of answers in the order they are answered:
1) lie (largest?)
2) lie (shipping?)
3) lie (total?)
4) dumb (special abilities?)
5) lie (40,000 non-hardware-dependent-apps?) dumb too (64k?)
6) nonsequitur/dodge (what did 7mil have to do with Linux again?)
7) nonsequitur/dodge (so new = image maniulation?)
8) nonsequitur/dodge (US=video, UK=business, NASA=?) lie too (100,000s?!)
9) Amazingly he didn't fook this up by saying he was van Dyle's secret lover. Then again it appears as though the interviewer was mocking McEwen and he didn't notice. Sad.
10) dodge, not to mention a stupid question to begin with considering the licensing scheme.
11) lie
12) Who is 'we' in "we'll"? Meglomaniac.
13) dumb (does he have a clue what he's talking about?)
14) lie
15) nonsequitur/dodge (he said AmigaOS, not AmigaDE)
16) Bill McEwin IS John Madden in answer #16! In web pages near you. Dumb dumb dumb. Also sycophant.
17) nonsequitur/dodge (What does 7mil have to do with the question again? I also love the the division of zero. Much like deviding a carrot into 0 and 1 "pieces")
18) Well this statement either makes Bill or Fleecy a liar.
19) lie
20) lie
21) lie (for further proof look how he answered the question "What's the status of Amiga OS on other platforms today?")
22) lie (how can a liar set things straight? Hrm, an interesting paradox for people who believe Bill McEwen is incapable of lying. Either he's lying now and always has and always will, or he is always telling the truth and is capable of setting things straight. hrmm)
23) nonsequitur/dodge (didn't this guy just say that AmigaDE won't run on AOS4?! Then how the hell are the two related?) and lie (Other side of the coin my ass)
24) fool (wtf? Two years? What happened to 12 months?)
OK, I'm off to laugh at the Amiga apologist posts now. :-D
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@Warrent
am very grateful that there is a plan for the future and that Bill is thinking about where he wants to take all of this. For me that is the good news, that there is a plan. I am sure some of it will change and that is okay. For me it is great to think that Amiga will still be here for the upcoming years
I couldn't agree more. It's always nice to see someone in this community who is not eager to bash Amiga Inc at the first chance they have! ;-)
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@ ruben
"I couldn't agree more. It's always nice to see someone in this community who is not eager to bash Amiga Inc at the first chance they have!:-)"
I do not what Bills' intent was during that interveiw, I do hope that he will follow-up with some comments to put things straight. I think that Bill is a visionary man and was speaking of what he would like to see. Maybe if we try to remember that this may just be who Bill is? A man with a vision, speaking from his heart. Yes, it may be wise for him to have someone else to do the talking about the facts, but I do not hold it against him for having a vision of what he would like. It can be hard to understand why he said the things he did in the interview. Interviews may not be his strength, heck we all have our own weakeness. Will he learn from this? I do not know, but I hope that he will.
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The question is will amigans learn from this! :-?
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Hey, the more people talk about Amiga, for whatever reason, means they would forget that the platform still exists.
oh, yeah, There is no such thing as bad publicity.
hahaha
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@strobe:
(I'm not going to repeat your rather large post here)
As long as we're slagging off people, how about this one:
25) The interviewer has an agenda, and what was posted was a 'trimmed for space' version of what was really said. As in:
Question:
Are you ready to lead an armed revolt against your arch-rivals MorphOS?
Actual answer:
What sort of question is that?
"Edited for size":
sort of
:-D
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I don't think he felt the need or wanted to repond to the "from the forum" questions. I doubt the interviewer even knew the they were about.
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"The question is will amigans learn from this!"
I think so. How long have the amigans been going through this? :-)
If you been with an Amiga, since the 80's then you would know to expect the unexpected!
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Ok,the interview wasn't good,but....
quite a few disbelieve his statement that
OS5 would be readly to go in a year.Why?
Perhaps weve been waiting so long something
like this seem imposible.
We assume a lot,but we know nothing.
But a lot has changed since the summer.
AmigaAnywhere deal has brought a lot of money.
Offices have moved to be "closer to the services
and companies we are working with".
They have split their company into Desktop
and Mobile units.
Is this Desktop unit Hyperion or in house?
Can they now afford a large development team
working in conjuction with Hyperion even at a
basic ground work level for OS5?
Amiga (AFAIK) has not,up unto now,"officialy"
claimed it has or hasn't started work on OS5.
And why should they give the game away.
I'm not claiming this is true,I don't know.
Thing is,neither do any of us.
And if you DO you might not be able to say
because of NDA's.
So stop calling them liars on this issue,
as it hasn't happened yet!
So just chill,there's good stuff comming.
I'm concentrating on A1/OS4 for now.:-)
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This reminds me of Gershwin, Apple's next gen OS which was being developed as a successor to Copland. However as it later turned out it had not been developed past the dry-marker-on-whiteboard stage.
Wake up
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Oh frell! Now I don't know whether to serve up my plate of crow or shove it back in the fridge! :-D On the plus side, this is the first even semi-official statement I've seen from AInc that the dream of having the Amiga OS on my current hardware isn't dead, just awfully delayed. On the minus side are all of the internal conflicts pointed out above and of course that this is yet another bill of goods and not software on the shelf. Still, because of this and in association with all the other news coming out since the WOA, I guess I do have to officially retract my previous statements of doom and gloom about AInc going toes up. I maintain, though, that they were reasonable at the time and within the context of what has happened to in the Amiga world before. But given this information of the projected future for the Amiga OS, I'm glad that I was wrong! Here's to it actually coming to pass. :-)