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Amiga News and Community Announcements => Amiga News and Community Announcements => Announcements and Press Releases => Topic started by: bhoggett on September 09, 2002, 02:36:11 AM
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As posted by Skal Loret on the TAML:
--begin vote results announcement--
In a surprising show of common accuracy between the three vote keepers, I can now announce that the vote regarding the transfer of the name "Team AMIGA" DID NOT pass. In fact, it did not even come close to the supermajority necessary for passage.
The vote was 28-18 against.
Thanks to all that participated, and thanks for voting your conscience.
--end of vote results--
In effect this means Amiga Inc will have find another winner to replace the [color=CC0000]I Am Amiga[/color] name for the club.
Source: teamamiga@owlnet.net (Team AMIGA mailing list)
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I, for one, salute the members of Team Amiga for voting that way. Not that it will keep Amiga from simply taking the name, as they have with a few others, but it's at least a proper show of respect to say politely that you disagree.
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Judging from what Gary Peake said on the mailing list before the result was known Amiga Inc will respect the wishes of the members of Team AMIGA. It would actually be disastrous PR at this time for them to go back on that pledge, and I don't think they've got the stomach for that sort of confrontation.
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Nah. It just shows that Team Amiga aren't really team players. ;-) :-D
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Pity the name was already taken. I respect the way they handled it. Thats true democracy. Good stuff.
How about they call the "I am Amiga" club "The Amiga Organisation" or amiga.org for short. Can't see that causing any ownership probs eh? :-D
Just an idea. I like Club Amiga. The logo could be like the neon sign for Club Flamingo in Police Squad.
:hammer:
I guess this means I won't be getting my t-shirt anytime soon.
One final idea. I've seen t-shirts with a velcro strip and stick on letters. Why don't they just put a strip over the winning logo, supply some cut-out letters, and let people make up there own club name?
-zudo
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Very well, I voted for Club Amiga anyway...:-)
I guess Amiga Inc, owning the "Amiga" part of "Team Amiga", could
have taken the name by force, but it is right of them to respect
the original users of the name. As far as I've understood, Team Amiga
has done a lot of good work for the platform.
So, all is well. :-)
Kay
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Obviously Mohamed and I are disappointed after suggesting the new name -- which was completely coincidental. I'm equally surprised that there was any concern, given the fact that the group seems to be virtually dormant. One would have to guess that the commercial connection with Amiga may have seemed inappropriate.
In any case, a few lessons to be learned from this process:
1. anyone can lay claim to a title or design - we may run into this again and again with any number of suggestions, including 'Club Amiga' - registering a trademark makes all the difference
2. internet-based voting that is unauthenticated is asking for trouble in any community, but especially this one
Mark
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They had 46 votes! That is so pathetic, they aren't relevant anymore.
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Amiga Inc will have find another winner to replace the I Am Amiga name for the club
The winning logo design should still be ok its just the club name that has to be changed.
SimoAmi & co did createa few alternative names to go with the logo so why not just use one of those instead of TeamAmiga?
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The winning logo design should still be ok its just the club name that has to be changed.
I agree, why not just use the next suggested name? I am sure that Si will not mind changing a bit of text!
(BTW Why not go with my suggestion for a name, Club Amiga World Wide. Doubt anyone has taken that combination! ;-))
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Funny, as the whole Team Amiga thing started as a joke....
pity...
How does one join this Team Amiga?
I've tried looking for the mailing list, but only find old references.
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Nah. It just shows that Team Amiga aren't really team players.
Ah thnx... :-x ;-)
I was one of the first Team Amiga members when Rick Lembree (Rick, you're still missed, but I'm glad you don't have to see what has become of us ;)) started the "movement" as an countermove to the Team OS/2 movement that was trying to promote, eh OS/2...
When Rick passed away and Gary Peake took over and tried to setup a mailing list or 2, I found myself with bad Fido acces and Internet access so I never really was able to follow Team Amiga after Rick died..
I must say I'm surpised that so few Team Amiga members voted or thast so few are left.. Hmm I wonder if Miss Fido; moderator of the Amiga Fido group is still using her Amy.. Anybody here know Asha Develder ?
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@seer
Asha is still contributing to the Team AMIGA mailing list, which is where all the activity seems to be these days.
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Asha is still contributing to the Team AMIGA mailing list, which is where all the activity seems to be these days.
Ah thnx.. I should consider reaplying then...
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How does one join this Team Amiga?
Have you tried here (http://www.owlnet.net/mail.html)?
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I have tried several times, but it didn't work :-?
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Sorry for my ignorance.... but what`s that thing "Team Amiga"? Could someone please explain me? :-)
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Well a few years back on usenet of fidonet, some OS/2 supporters stuck "Team OS/2" in their sig to promote OS/2.
Ofcourse us Amigans couldn't be left behind so Team Amiga was started =).
And what it did? AFAIK absolutely nothing, besides sticking 'Team Amiga' in the members signatures.
Actually I should still be a 'member' of Team AMIGA :-b. Perhaps I should put the phrase back in my sig :-D.
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I have tried several times, but it didn't work
Send the "subscribe teamamiga" to majordomo@owlnet.net not to Majordomo@thule.no (Like the other way around then the webpage sais..
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You do a misservice to Team OS/2, which imho, which has achieved legendary status, and was so feared by Microsoft as MS formed their own countermovement 'Club Win'
And now we see the top 2 choices for this club, Team Amiga and Club Amiga, patterned after that...
Team Amiga, really has no excuse for having less than 50 votes, when Amiga could still form a club with a 1,000 member and all of them had to pay $50 bucks each to join.
I was never part of this club, but its obvious the leadership there wasn't much....Team OS/2 had web sites and conferences and official support from IBM (not any more), they did a lot more than append signatures to their profiles.
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I was never part of this club, but its obvious the leadership there wasn't much
Team Amiga was never meant to be the same as Team OS/2, Team Amiga was a "joke" to get back at "annoying" OS/2 users who plagued Amiga newsgroups back then.. Rick Lembree started it, made a loose list of people who started using "Team Amiga" in their sig, and Gary peak "took over" when Rick died..
Team AMIGA was in the spirit of Amiga, a "free grass roots" movement it was called back then, no fees, no "you must do" other then promote the Amiga whenever you can club...
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I, for one, salute the members of Team Amiga for voting that way.
Hmm. The name "Team Amiga" was preferred to other options by more active members of the Amiga community than are, apparently, active members of the current Team Amiga. That doesn't say much, but it says something.
I didn't personally care for the name "Team Amiga", and I think Bill McEwen's new proposal ("Amiga Team") is much better, so I'm pretty pleased with the result.
It just strikes me as peculiarly anti-community that Team Amiga voted the way they did.
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I voted for "Team Amiga", but "Club Amiga" will do just as well for me. :-D
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@MikeB
You just won my vote for best Avatar ! ;-)
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I can't help wondering what's with so much criticism over the decision, both here and on ANN? I mean, why does the "community" feel Team AMIGA owe them something?
Surely the people who have been using that name for years now have more right to it than a bunch of people who until last week couldn't give a toss? What exactly gives anyone the right to call them "anti-community"?
Come on people, act like adults. They had a decision to make, they put it to the vote and got a result. It might have gone the other way but it didn't, so why can't everyone just accept it and move on?
:-?
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I agree with simplex here: "Amiga Team" is a good suggestion from
AInc's side. Sounds very action-like. Kind of like "Alpha Team". :-)
I think we just traded up.
Kay
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yes, and it has always told me that there is no Team Amiga list at Thule....
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I can't help wondering what's with so much criticism over the decision, both here and on ANN?
Can't speak for ANN, or anyone else. I personally was peeved by Wayne's comment, and was replying only to that. Wayne came across as "yeah stick it to Amiga Inc" and implied that Amiga, Inc. would just take the name outright. So, I saw the announcement in that light.
Wayne, if that's not at all what you meant, I'm sorry; that's just how it came across, and continues to come across, each time I read it.
...why does the "community" feel Team AMIGA owe them something?
I don't feel Team AMIGA owes the community anything. I have no idea what they do, but if they want to keep the name for themselves, hey let them. That doesn't change my impression that it is a peculiar thing to do, to deny permission to an apparently larger Amiga community, who apparently were ignorant of the real Team AMIGA, and liked the name from a logo design.
I'm obviously not a member of Team AMIGA, & am not privy to whatever debate there was. All the same, I am curious to know why Team AMIGA voted the way they did. So far, no reasons have been given. They don't owe the community an explanation, but neither did the community owe them the flattery of asking them for the name, eh?
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That's so Ficking obvious why don't they just change the page.
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Sorry Argo, the info on the page is still wrong (I remember having the same problem). You need to send the request to owlnet.net, not thule.no.
(A bit of playing around sending requests to the majordomo lists would show you that, but the info should be fixed anyway.)
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People shouldn't have to waste there time playing around sending request to servers to find something just because someone can't be bothered to correct the information on the page. No wonder Team Amiga is so small....
I say we all join...
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Can't speak for ANN, or anyone else. I personally was peeved by Wayne's comment, and was replying only to that. Wayne came across as "yeah stick it to Amiga Inc"
I don't think that's what Wayne meant. I read it as saying that he respected their fortidude and integrity in making their own decision and not being swayed by outside pressure to conform. I have to say I agree.
That doesn't change my impression that it is a peculiar thing to do, to deny permission to an apparently larger Amiga community, who apparently were ignorant of the real Team AMIGA, and liked the name from a logo design.
Look it doesn't matter if there were only two people in Team AMIGA, they still have more right to the name than the rest of the "community" who've only just decided they'd like to have something that doesn't belong to them. Nothing strange about that at all, except that the name should never have been entered as a candidate in the first place.
They don't owe the community an explanation, but neither did the community owe them the flattery of asking them for the name, eh?
ROTFL!
Flattery??
Isn't the "community" getting a little carried away with its sense of self-importance here? I don't see why a team whose name has been entered without their consent should feel flattered when they are asked to give it up as a consequence.
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@bhoggett:
What, there was outside pressure on Team AMIGA? The designer of the T-shirt knew there was an active Team AMIGA and chose that name anyway? I haven't read about this, and I'd really like to.
I would gladly take back what I've said, given new in formation. I mean, before this vote, I didn't know there was a Team AMIGA organization of any sort, active or otherwise. It was a complete shock to me, and apparently to a lot of amiga.org members, from what I read here.
If there wasn't outside pressure, or if the designer didn't know... then I'm sorry, I just can't see your point at all.
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The designer of the T-shirt knew there was an active Team AMIGA and chose that name anyway? I haven't read about this, and I'd really like to.
The designer of the T-shirt apparently wasn't aware of an existing Team Amiga. When he posted here about the design, I replied that there was already a Team Amiga and maybe he'd have to check with Gary Peake about using the name. He said he appreciated the info and would check into it.
Team Amiga isn't very visible, existing only as a mailing list, and I haven't seen the sig much except maybe for Skal Loret's. They had a plan to do a web site, which I was involved with in the early stages, but nothing came of it. If and when the desktop OS starts looking interesting again, maybe they'll go for it, but my impression from the ML is that it's mostly an old boys' (and a few girls') club more interesting in making small talk than putting together advocacy web sites. No offense meant, of course. A nice little community ML is good in itself, and among those people there's a long-standing strong attachment to the Team Amiga name.
-- gary_c
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Wayne, if that's not at all what you meant, I'm sorry; that's just how it came across, and continues to come across, each time I read it.
That's not what I meant at all, and your reaction is a very status quo part of the big reason I am seriously considering finding something better to do with my time and money these days.
What I meant was that I salute Team Amiga (regardless of their size or whatnot) for approaching things in this manner. Let's face it, the way they took a vote, then announced that they would rather Amiga Inc not take the name is a damned site better than what we've seen from the likes of other groups and "companies" lately.
I find it rather refreshing actually and I wish more entities around the Amiga would take such a civil and elegant approach to their activities.
Besides, you (other responses) mock Team Amiga for their "46 votes" but think about one thing. It only takes one person with a loud voice to make life uncomfortable on a Web site forum. Team Amiga's entire purpose in life was to be vocal. Steal their name and Team Amiga members would crawl out of the woodwork with baseball bats in hand.
Team Amiga may be "a joke" (or at least started that way) but they are DOING SOMETHING. Remove that and Amiga Inc run the risk of making enemies of some of the most vocal Amiga supporters left in this fractured little community.
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I was one of the first Team Amiga members when Rick Lembree (Rick, you're still missed, but I'm glad you don't have to see what has become of us ;)) started the "movement" as an countermove to the Team OS/2 movement that was trying to promote, eh OS/2...
/me raises hand.... I was there.
When Rick passed away and Gary Peake took over and tried to setup a mailing list or 2, I found myself with bad Fido acces and Internet access so I never really was able to follow Team Amiga after Rick died..
a message to majordomo@owlnet.net with a subject of "subscribe teamamiga" will get you there. (IIRC)
I must say I'm surpised that so few Team Amiga members voted or thast so few are left.. Hmm I wonder if Miss Fido; moderator of the Amiga Fido group is still using her Amy.. Anybody here know Asha Develder ?
TBH, I dropped the ML a long time ago. (Got fed up with the gun debate) But I took over moderating the echo when Asha offered. I passed that job back to Z1 and Todd Sullivan over a year ago. Last I heard of Asha she was u
sing AmigaForever on a laptop and still on the TA ML.
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They voted and chose not to give up the name - thats fine. But why is that any better than if they had chosen to do so? (No offense, Im just wondering.)
edit:
"... are doing something ..." Well, what are they doing now? Havent heard of Team Amiga in a long while.
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Suggestion: Throw away the name - i never liked it that much anyway, sounded too ... old? Anyway, the logo is good, simple and easy to pyt on anything and it should scale well (nice and round).
So keep the Logo, but maybe we should come up with a name now?
Of course, that all depends on what the majority of people actualy voted for. The "look" the "sound" or both. Maybe we should just go to the second placer? They had a greate design, and was leading only a week before the competition finished!
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I never even knew that a vote was going on. If I would have known, I would have voted. When was it announced and when was it going ?? (Probably while I was out of town on multiple business trips.)
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That's not what I meant at all, and your reaction is a very status quo part of the big reason I am seriously considering finding something better to do with my time and money these days.
Okay, "vote that way" as in voting by that method, not as in acquiring that result. I read it completely wrong. I'm sorry.
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I agree, but what other names have they *taken* Wayne?
Considering who runs the ML I dont think its a shock that
Amiga Inc knew that there was a name clash way upfront.
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I agree, but what other names have they *taken* Wayne?
The Amiga Developer Network for one. The ADN was used by Amiga.org in 1997 to 2000 for our developer effort. It is what became of the ICOA. I was never asked whether they could take it, but then again, by the time they did, I couldn't care less.
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Cool. Now I know what you were talking about.
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IMO a name like "Amiga Developer Network" should be used for official AmigaOS or AmigaDE developers.
It would be very strange if QSSL couldn't or shouldn't call their official Developer Network "the QNX Developers' Network" just because a community website decided to use a similar name as well.
IMO the name "Team Amiga" is very different as it simply relates to a club which could bear just about any Amiga related name.
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Agreed, its not nice to lose a name one "imagined".
Otoh its only natural that the official Amiga developer network is named "Amiga Developer Network".
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i like "I Am Amiga" :-)
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Team Amiga not really appeared as a joke, but more as a rallying call against the loose direction that the Amiga was taking under the dumb rule of previous greedy owners. Now, Team Amiga has been dead for ages. I should know, I've been 'part' of it.
The fact that the current surviving 'team' refuses Gary the opportunity to finally make good use of his former organization tells how awfully awry they have gone today.
Glad I'm out of this mess (and I feel sorry and compassionate for the fellow 18 members who voted in favor of the name transfer).
Let's go for Amiga Team. (And what's the matter with that 'club' frenziness?)
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Sure, Amiga Inc could just TAKE the Team AMIGA name for themselves. It would only cost them thier soul.
As noted above, at one point the founder died and Gary Peake took over administration of the team. It put him right where he needed to be to affect positive change in the Amiga community. I sincerely doubt he would have been in the right place at the right time to have become part of the formation of Amiga Inc. otherwise.
The Team AMIGA mailing list is now quite lively though only with a few members, mostly (IMO) due to the bellicose nature of a few select inDUHviduals.
This does not mean that just because Amiga Inc is bigger than they are that they can just waltz in and take whatever they want. It's bad enough that big companies are more or less doing that already -- witness the numerous domain name land grabs out there. As far as that goes, what is left of the Amiga community really does NOT need that kind of thing to become commonplace, because the entire Amiga community, all rolled into one, would amount to a bug on the windshield of any of those corporate juggernauts out there.
If anything, I was amazed that the Team AMIGA suggestion didn't get jerked out of contention immediately. I can only assume Gary wasn't involved with the poll so didn't actually know that the name had come up as a possibility. Otherwise, I would EXPECT him to have done that out of respect for his past.
If he was aware, and did nothing ... I don't know what to say. Highly disrepespectful.
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Grimmtooth, I completely fail to see your point, note that Amiga Inc did NOT just take the name! :-?
Also note that almost any normal suggestion was accepted by Amiga Inc, no censorship at all (even non-member suggestions and votes were accepted) , even such a trolling logo as created by Seehund (Emanuel, non-member Mair) was accepted. (I would love to see him wear a t-shirt with his own logo in public! ;-))
If Team Amiga had no problem with the *suggested* Amiga club name, then what would be the problem?