Amiga.org
Amiga News and Community Announcements => Amiga News and Community Announcements => Miscellaneous => Topic started by: GadgetMaster on August 06, 2002, 09:01:14 PM
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There is a short interview with Amiga Inc. (http://home.powertech.no/micbergs/Interviews/AmigaINC&MorphOS.html) on Amitopia regarding MorphOS.
Please note that some questions predate the Amiwest 2002 announcements.
Source: Amitopia (http://www.amitopia.tk/)
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What kind of compatiblilty does MorphOS provide in regards to AmigaOS?
As far as I know it provides 68k emu. and Warp and Power Up, as well as Native MOS apps.
Can it also provide Native AOS4 app. compatiblity?
Cheers
D@n
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MorphOS will not run apps that make use of AmigaOS4 features.
If Amiga successfully sue the MorphOS team, MorphOS won't run any Amiga software.
I think we should all just sit tight and see what happens.
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Cool. They disassembled MorphOS PPC code and
then showed that it is the same code as 68k
assembler?
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O.k. only one comment:
instead of wanting to commander someone else's market,
It's OUR (the users) market, and NOT AInc, Eyetechs, Hyperion or
bPlan's market !! They all can deliever products to OUR market,
but the don't own us, and we can decide ourself what we buy.
He better made sure that he really has a "waterproof" case or this
will ne the end of AInc.
@zacman
The just passed their 68k-stuff through the 68_2_PPC-assmebler ;-)
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@Kronos
What is RS' reaction to this? :-?
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@Red
Why do you ask me ? Am I his babysitter or what ?
Just send an email to laire@t-online.de or ask on the MorphOS-IRC
and you may find out.
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@Red
Why do you ask me ?
You're one of our resident MOS fans who seems to follow it pretty closely. On top of that you speak German and IIRC you frequent the boards he posts to.
Am I his babysitter or what ?
LOL, no your sister did date him once though right? :-P
Just send an email to laire@t-online.de
Oh heavens no!
or ask on the MorphOS-IRC
You trying to get me killed? :-P
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This MOS/OS4 battle will go on for a long time.
Coder
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@Red
Mmmmh you don't wanne email, and you don't like to chat ....
Have you allready tried asking your wife ?
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your a naive little man... :)
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@red
Didn't notice earlier;
"Defender of the faith" and then a pic of Clinton below the text.
LOL! :-D :-D :-D
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Mmmmh you don't wanne email, and you don't like to chat ....
Naw the only time I tried talking to him he accused me of having an agenda. So me in a MorphOS forum would be like a lynching:-P
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"Defender of the faith" and then a pic of Clinton below the text.
Actually that's pretty bad now that you mention it :-x
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"Defender of the faith" and then a pic of Clinton below the text.
and
from: Monica Lewinsky's house
Hmm.....
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Eatin aint cheatin
:-P
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(http://www16.brinkster.com/whabang/faith.jpg)
Teehee!
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hehehe....yeeeeeesh.. Maybe I should add a inflamatory pic of clintler to my sig... Otherwise new users may really think I am a Clinton supporter..scary stuff :-o
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Defender of the Faith
Judas Priest Album ?!
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That wouldn't be in the spirit of things. You're meant to look like a Clinton supporter as pennance for your sins.
:-)
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@Red
Maybe I should add a inflamatory pic of clintler to my sig... Otherwise new users may really think I am a Clinton supporter..scary stuff
I dont think it would really work because your is only displayed on forum posts not on news comments
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Kronos wibbled:
It's OUR (the users) market
Wrong. A user (buyer) may be in the market, but that market does not belong to him. Any more than the shop you go into to buy sweeties belongs to you.
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Have you ever imagined the creation of MorphOS?
I have :idea:
(http://gnaf.hjem.orangenet.dk/creation_morphos.gif)
:-D :-D :-D :-D :-D
PS: Coder do you recognizethat hand?
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I hardly think so..
The MorphOS team got until September 1st to either sign a deal with Amiga Inc. or have a cease-and-desist order from Amiga.
MOS wants to go to a trial? it's their right, although I hardly see MOS wins, due to the simple reason - Amiga owns the code, and any patents are owned by Gateway - so if Amiga looses, Gateway will sue..
Hetz (HeUnique)
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There are problems on both sides of this if it goes to court.
1. The disassembly of MorphOS won't match the disassembly of the AmigaOS68k.
2. Changing a program by 25% makes it eligible for a new copywrite... that doesn't refer to an individual subroutine but the work as a whole.
3. If (for example) you have a task of stepping through a linked list to find something the algorythm is likely to be the same or very similar no matter who implements it. It's just the way it's done and is an obvious implementation and arguing they stole the code because their's is similar doesn't mean a lot.
4. Reverse engineering a product to make a compatible one IS legal to some extent.
5. All of the above is subject to interpretation and the argument can go either way depending on how a judge sees it.
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Many judges aren't that technically minded. They rely on others to explain how all this stuff works.
A wrong interpretaion could lead to a wrong decision.
I have first hand knowledge of this as the company that I worked for was taken to court (UK Small claims Court) over an alleged faulty CD Writer.
I was a witness on behalf of our company and the other side was using an independant technician.
Before any decision was made the independant techie and I were trying our best to explain to the Judge how a CD writer worked. No easy task when the judge hadn't even used a computer before.
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Bah, there are people MUCH closer to MorphOS than
Kronos.
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I can guess it. Let them prove that in court.
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@HeUnique
The MorphOS team got until September 1st to either sign a deal with Amiga Inc. or have a cease-and-desist order from Amiga.
I am afraid that the stuff that Amiga wanted them to sue about is taken care of by the MOS team. Maybe there is still some left that is illegal or is sueable but I am afraid this will be a case that drags on forever in court. And that will do no good.
Coder
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"I am afraid that the stuff that Amiga wanted them to sue about is taken care of by the MOS team. Maybe there is still some left that is illegal or is sueable but I am afraid this will be a case that drags on forever in court. And that will do no good."
well i dont give a damn the fact if they did take stuff out to stay legal that means they are untrust worthy in the first place with all the crap with it was all coded safe from the start claims.
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Hey guys! No amount of conjecture and arguing here will make the slightest bit of difference to the outcome. Drink a beer, relax, sit tight and wait.
Theres nothing you can do!
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@Alkemyst
well i dont give a damn the fact if they did take stuff out to stay legal that means they are untrust worthy in the first place with all the crap with it was all coded safe from the start claims.
I feel the same. But I am a bit sad about the fact that it has to come to a lawsuit. All this legal crap. I mean look at Amithlon 2, delayed because of legall stuff. GRRRRRRRRRRR!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Coder
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I feel the same. But I am a bit sad about the fact that it has to come to a lawsuit. All this legal crap. I mean look at Amithlon 2, delayed because of legall stuff. GRRRRRRRRRRR!!!!!!!!!!!!!
yeah that was unexpected :(.
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I don’t think MorphOS camp has the financial muscle to match Gateway Inc...
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@Michal
But you should stop doing this.. Why cant Amiga go for the future, show that you are strong?
I know this is a marked strategy to somewhat push MorphOS out. Its like Lindows for the PC marked. Its a competitor to Windows, but also RUN's Windows programs.
Win32 cloners wouldn’t worry being sue by MS, IF they clean code’s their OS.
Win32 cloners would be in trouble, IF they copied any MS code.
“Lindows” naming battle is a different issue.
You should start to think like an Amiga user Bill.
?
This would be subjective assumption regarding to being an “Amiga user".
Amiga INC. writes:
We are not afraid of it. Our only issue is that it is has been created using illegally derived material that belongs to Amiga. If they had clean room developed it, there would be no issue.
If you notice the earlier statements, Amiga Inc has no problems with "clean room developed" code.
If you have full believe in your work, then drop the case and go further.
Is that a good excuse for committing illegal acts (POV of Amiga Inc)?
We all know you should have the right to use Amiga, but MorphOS aint using Amigas name. I want both products on the marked, it will be a colourfull marked
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A market that will result in Beta vs VHS like war will not help the consumer in the long term.
Two path
1. AmigaOS 4.x path for long term view.
VS
2. MorphOS path for long term view.
Note that SUN doesn’t let any one deviate from their Java standard. MS has paid a the price for thier recalcitrant actions.
and thats what we want, not another Commodore
I don't think Commodore's deployment model equals MS's style deployment model
i.e.
1. With CBM, 1 OS Company(i.e. CBM) = 1 hardware vendor(i.e. CBM). Apple also uses this deployment model.
2. With Amiga Inc,1 OS Company(i.e. AInc) = multiple hardware vendor, due Alnc's multi-licensing regime.
keeping all secret and kinda forget what the userbase want.
This would be subjective assumption in regards to what user base wants.
All companies has their trade secrets and know how. Companies invest in R&D to develop trade secrets and know how.
Being labelled a monopoly by Justice Department invokes a different sets of laws.
I wouldn’t be surprise if stupid US Justice Department and (the nine anti-MS US states) destroys their own US company’s dominance in the world market due to their narrow scope and pays the price for it.
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It's OUR (the users) market, and NOT AInc, Eyetechs, Hyperion or bPlan's market !! They all can deliever products to OUR market, but the don't own us, and we can decide ourself what we buy.
Don’t you realise if there are two identical products that do same thing yet with enough differences, the market may end up like OS/2Warp** vs Win95** (or Beta Max VS VHS) wars?
**The battle of succession for Win16 standard. Both has their own different 32bit API path.
The consumer will lose in the long run (for OS/2Warp users in that case).
Personally, I Iike SUN’s model in regards to controling thier standard and sharing their standard with others.
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Gateway doesn't give a #### about Amiga. They won't defend the name. It's Thendic/bPlan vs
Amiga Inc.
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4. Reverse engineering a product to make a compatible one IS legal to some extent.
Where does it state this?
2. Changing a program by 25% makes it eligible for a new copywrite... that doesn't refer to an individual subroutine but the work as a whole.
Depending on work's copyright conditions, “derive works” may be considered illegal by the copyright holder.
Just look in your Quake's license and copyright text file.
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Gateway doesn't give a #### about Amiga.
Do we know their intent?
They won't defend the name.
Do we know their intent?
Re-read my post carefully, I have not anything in regards to "defending".
Any inference made is due to your thinking...
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Wrong. A user (buyer) may be in the market, but that market does not belong to him. Any more than the shop you go into to buy sweeties belongs to you.
I disagree with that analogy as well as Kronos' statement. The users don't own the market, they are the market. No one owns the market. Not the users, not the developers, not the IP and trademark owners, no one.
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I disagree with that analogy as well as Kronos' statement. The users don't own the market, they are the market.
O.k. your english is better than mine ;-)
The point is that WE decide, what we buy, and that is what
defines a market. If AInc or Thendic want to be a part of
that market they just have to deliever what WE want.
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Gateway doesn't give a #### about Amiga.
No, but if they c an earn a few bucks from sueing BPlan, then?
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Poster: whabang Date: 2002/8/7 14:18:47
Quote:
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Gateway doesn't give a #### about Amiga.
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No, but if they c an earn a few bucks from sueing BPlan, then?
It's not even that. If it involves Gateways patents, you better believe they will certainly defend it regardless the name. Patents are not shoved aside because of the name involved.
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Patents ?
AFAIK is "right-mouse-pop-up-menu" the only AmigaOS-patent and that won't
be used in MOS_1.0 (don't ask me how menus will work).
Even if SW-patents don't count in europe (atleast a bit of common sense).
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The point is that WE decide, what we buy, and that is what
What you want may not reflect what the market wants.
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AFAIK is "right-mouse-pop-up-menu" the only AmigaOS-patent and that won't
I don’t think that would be the issue.
Note that MS's WinXP uses the right button for their "context sensitive" popup menu.