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Amiga News and Community Announcements => Amiga News and Community Announcements => Amiga Software News => Topic started by: Peggus on July 28, 2002, 07:59:33 AM
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For those of you with slow connections who can't download the large audio MP3 file, here's a synopsis of the Thomas Frieden interview.
I just listen to the amiwest interview with Thomas Frieden.
Here are some of the more significant things that were said during the intervoew...
The ExecSG is practically completed.
There's still heavy work being done on Intuition
The TCP/IP stack is practially finnished, it is one of the fatsest TCP/IP stacks ever implemented on the Amiga.
Developing is done on classic systems.
The hardware abstraction layer is still in flux, once it's nailed down getting OS 4 running on the A-one hardware will take a week or two.
The reason why a lot of the OS4.2 features are being implemented in OS4.0 is because the resposiveness of the system would have suffered if these features where to be run under 68k emulation.
They are aiming for a skinnable os eventually but OS4 will just be configurable similar to visualprefs birdie magic menu. etc.
The bootscreen and bootmenu will remain in OS4
Virtual memory is being implemented from scratch by Thomas. They're not using existing solutions due to responsiveness.
Thomas is fairly sure OS4 will be released before the end of the year.
Now don't take my word on any of the above, it's what I remember of the interview. I may have missunderstood some points or confused some things..
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homas is fairly sure OS4 will be released before the end of the year.
I think I have said it before....
Next year....
Hey come on... you guys at amiga/Hyperion could do better...
We won't see an A1 or SharkPPC before AOS4 is released... But how long do we have to wait...
And.. what about all those ppl who bougth an "I am amiga" club membership.. do they have to wait until next year...
I know this is just my own speculation... But I am very tired of waiting.. Things get pushed further and further in to the future...
Any way, personally I think that Mos and Pegasos is the way to go... If that is ever finished...
Maybe the way is X86 Amithlon ??? Or Linux...
Or is it just me ???
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It's just you
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Thank you... And I really mean it...
If it is just me, then everything is going well...
Which I really hope....
I would like to buy an A1 + AOS4 in august or very soon...
Cross my fingers... :-D :-D
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I don't give a Flying F**K how long I have to wait!
I will buy Amithlon 2.0 (when it is out) and use it until AmigaOS4/A1 is finished and available.
Loki :-D
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@Loki: You're not alone; Amithlon seems as the life saver I need while waiting for the A1.
@yssing: There's nothing wrong with the Pegasos (heck, it seems as the only thing that separate the two is the modem/IrDA and the absense/presense of a CPU socket). The real problem as I see it is MorphOS which is a wild card in the equation; will it be overall the better choice, or not. I respect the choice, but you can't convince me that you take a lesser risc; MorphOS may have a better chance being more mature at it's release, but then what? Atleast AInc have the aim of merging with the AmigaDE (which I seriusly doubt the MorphOS will be able to compete with due to the borrowed Tao technology). But then again, MorphOS have been on the move for a long time and that may prove to be the advantage it needs.
Those are just my opinions and the argument that both OS's are vapourware can be considered true; because they are. We will just have to wait and see if and when the releases come and what they really are like. Don't let my opinions start a flame war; they are just opinions based on things I've seen so far and is subject to constant changes and/or modifications depending on the newsflow.
Is there any info about the plans for MorphOS (feature list, future, etc)?
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Is there any info about the plans for MorphOS (feature list, future, etc)?
There is a JVM in development (by Thendic), and that is something
I would prefer to the ability of playing PlanetZed on a desktop :-P
R.S. and his team have said several times that they wouldn't announce
anything before it is ready (atleast as long as MorphOS1.0 isn't released)
and the Radeon-driver is a good example.
You should also keep in mind that it will quite a while before DE/divx/flash/??
are really finished and intregrated in OS4 (just look at the time AInc and
Hyperion needed to get where they are right now).
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The ExecSG is practically completed.
More or less the same than said 3/4/5 months ago ....
The TCP/IP stack is practially finnished
And has been since last year ;-)
The hardware abstraction layer is still in flux,
Wasn't that one of the 1st things that should have been done ?
once it's nailed down getting OS 4 running on the A-one hardware will take a week or two.
Either their definition of a HAL( or what can be called OS4) is quite
different from mine (which would mean more work) or they are simple
unrealistic.
Thomas is fairly sure OS4 will be released before the end of the year.
See you next year :-P
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Either their definition of a HAL( or what can be called OS4) is quite
Then tell us, what is your definition of a HAL?
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@Peggus
A HAL is the layer between the OS and it's API and the actual device-
drivers.
Take CGX/P96 for example:
On the one side you have the gfx/layers-replacement libs, and on the
other side you have the divers for the actual cards. The definition
of how these two interact with each other is the HAL.
The OS4-HAL would define one generic PCI/IDE-driver, but the
actual low-level-drivers for the A1 or the A1200/4000 are not really
a part of it.
So either they mean that they will need two weeks after they finished
the HAL(including A1-drivers), which would allready be quite optimistic,
or they think they could write the low.level-drivers in two weeks, which
is an outright joke.
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>Either their definition of a HAL( or what can be
>called OS4) is quite different from mine (which
>would mean more work) or they are simple
>unrealistic.
He didn't say that OS4 will only need 2 weeks to be
ported to the AmigaOne, but that they only need 2
weeks for porting a first version of the HAL/ExecSG
to the AmigaOne.
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Never before, in the last 10 years, has this community been so close to Decent hardware and a decent OS upgrade. It would be stupid to get out of the community based on the fact things are taking a while.
This is a major upgrade, you cant complete an OS upgrade of this scale in several months with the resources Hyperion or Amiga Inc has.
Wait till the end of the year, possibly thurther because this is an Awsome upgrade and its going to take a while.
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The way to go is AROS ;).
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The way to go is AROS ;).
Yeah or Amithlon with Native X86 programs...
I think that Amithlon might be the way..
See you next year Hyperion....
It seems to me that more and more things are beeing implemted in to OS4, which results in things never being done.
I just remeber some things I learned in "computer school (Datamatikker for danskere)" don't do more than what was ordered, or you won't keep your time schedule, and the end product will most likely not be as good as it could be...
And you will lose customers
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Keep in mind that if there will be an OS4 released before the end of this year it will be the one for the PPC add-on cards. And as for Amithlon 2, well if you saw one of the topics here on org you see that Amithlon 2 is farrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr from being released.
Coder
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Thomas is fairly sure OS4 will be released before the end of the year.
This not the answere I am looking for. Fairly sure? I stated this also to some other people but might it not be a good idea to get some more people onto OS4?
Coder
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It seems to me that more and more things are beeing implemted in to OS4, which results in things never being done.
Ben Hermans said some time ago that the feature set was locked down. Thomas said today that the only reason things have changed since last year, is to not have things running in emulation, which was the original plan......or you won't keep your time schedule
Schedules are never kept by computer companies.
Basic rule of thumb: Sofware released on time is unfinished software.
-john
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Any way, finish it NOW...
and fix the rest in Boing bags...
So we could all have our A1/SharkPPC or what ever and OS4..
Fix the rest later..... I don't care if I have to reboot my system a few times... heck I use windows for crying out loud...
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Schedules are never kept by computer companies.
Very true indeed! Does anyone here have an interest in pc games? Well, almost all the games, even the very big budget ones with big teams behind it, have at least one delay, sometimes more. And these are delays for months too. Games like Mafia, Duke nukem, Unreal 2, ...
So it is not a strange situation at all. This is the biggest and hardest step ever to be taken on OS.
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So either they mean that they will need two weeks after they finished
the HAL(including A1-drivers), which would allready be quite optimistic,
or they think they could write the low.level-drivers in two weeks, which
is an outright joke.
I'm glad to see you know what you're talking about. It's a rare event on many forums.
Being a hardwareengineer myself I have to agree with you, it does seem overly optimistic to move the entire HAL from phase5 hardware to A1 in just 2 weeks.
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it does seem overly optimistic to move the entire HAL from phase5 hardware to A1 in just 2 weeks.
Amiga Inc / Eyetech and Hyperion work on the "Anti-Scotty principle". To explain, they always miss their release date estimates by a factor of four :-P
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'Before the end of the year'... Oh man :oops:
I wasn't expecting miracles, but I should have known that the June promise was pure BS. I believe I've been insanely patient during the last decade or so, but I guess I'm really done now. I'll come back and take a look around next year, but my Classic hardware will be long gone since then.
Too bad... I really wanted my old Miggy to be pushed to the limit one more time.
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They should put more resources on OS4. Then they might be able to come up with a decent release time.
Coder
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Coder
Who should pay for the increased use of resources?
There are no money in the Amiga market (yet). We need the OS to be released first, apps coming, then people will be more than willing to spend...
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@coder:
you have to be realistic about this. The amiga market has become very small indeed (in fact, it is a miracle that we are still here imo). Putting more resources into OS4.0 would ofcourse be a good thing but who is going to pay all those people? I don't think you would be too happy working on something and not getting paid for it (if it's your day job).
In my opinion, it is already quite a miracle that a company dared to take on the challenge and such a big risk. It even is a surprise that they are still working on it. Very big companies like escom and gateway didn't manage to come up with anything.
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@Troels_E Date/z5
Offcourse you are right. More resources cost more money. But it shows that at this moment the resources working on OS4 are very little. But let's hope they make it for sure this year.
Coder
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@coder:
Don't know if 30 people is so little. This is just the most difficult step. If they can make this step, then i think there is a future. It's a bit like building a house. The outside of the house (the structure in the ground, the bricks,...) is the hardest part and the most difficult part. Because if the structure in the ground isn't good, then the rest will be a nightmare. But if it is, then the fun start when decorating and stuff...
I hope they make it but my life doesn't depend on it. After the numurous fallbacks in the past 8 or so years, i've learned to be relaxed about it. I believe in the team working on OS4 (which has nothing to do with Amiga Inc) and i hope they make it. Nothing more and nothing less. Try to be relaxed about it.
I'm sure that the hyperion team have encoutered major stumbling blocks which they never thought of before starting the project. But isn't this so in every major project. 8-)
We will see at the end of the year. In the meantime, i still enjoy my A1200 like i always did. I use pc too but i keep coming back to my Amiga because i like it and i always have.
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What I fail to understand is, why A Inc. seem to put so many (??) resources into DE and not AOS4.. it seems to me that AOS4 is more likely to earn them some "quick" cash....
So i have to agree with coder...
Anyway, as for me, I will stick to what ever comes first... MOS/Pegasos, AOS/A1 or Amithlon....
If it is the latter, then that is just fine.. We could then start by doing some native x86 coding..
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Being a hardwareengineer myself I have to agree with you, it does seem overly optimistic to move the entire HAL from phase5 hardware to A1 in just 2 weeks.
Being a softwareengineer myself I have to say to you, that it depends on the way the HAL is written. A well written C++/ASM code needs few hours (the C++ part) and few days (by rewriting the ASM parts), if they are not so silly to put too much ASM code inside ( the times of C2P algorithms which were better from others only by CPU cycles are gone forever , yes, and the one from 'Kalms' was the best ;) ). And I doubt, that it is written in ASM, because one of the goals of the HAL is to be portable, so you will have to rethink it ten times ,what you will write in ASM, and what not, if you are a designer.
re
Treke