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Amiga News and Community Announcements => Amiga News and Community Announcements => Miscellaneous => Topic started by: Kent on May 22, 2002, 02:52:37 AM
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A quick Q&A session (http://www.amiga.pl/os4/devfaq.html) has been posted online at the eXec magazine (http://www.amiga.pl) going over some of the details in the AmigaOS4 development. If you have something you want add or if you have further questions send it to os4faq@amiga.pl (http://mailto:os4faq@amiga.pl)
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Hmm...looking forward to Java support...it's the only language I've managed to code anything of significance in so far (almost working monopoly game, and server program for multiplayer adventure game). I keep wanting to improve my C skills, so I can spend some spare time coding for the Amiga. Unfortunately I just never have the time. Maybe I should go for C++ instead, to utilize my OO-experience. Does anybody here have any experience with C++? How does it compare to C and Java?
Kay
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>>Will dos.library's maximum file length limit be removed?
>No. This is not possible due to internal data structures.
Huh? Stil 28 char file names? I hope that I read this wrong!!!
:-(
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As a Non Linear Video Editor Im hoping that there wont be any maximum file size limit as was the case With Wndows until Win2k was released.
I am REALLY hoping to move my nle stuff over to A1.
(Absolutely pig sick of WinTel)
So if any scouts from Matrox are surfing through here, put in a good word for us and get your RT2500 coded for A1 ... Pretty please... ;-)
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I think the DOS limit may be a bit longer than the WB limit. I
remember Ben Hermans posting on ANN backalong that 128ch was the
longest possible name length. Hopefully this is the DOS limit he's
talking about.
Don't quote me on this though...
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I think you will find "file length" limit refers to exactly that, the file length. Anyone that uses SFS knows that 100 character file names are not a problem (except with my old (commercial) copy of Dopus 4). IIRC the SFS docs say that they limited the filenames to 100 chars because of dos.library;
SFS docs:
- Fast reading of directories.
- Fast seeking, even in extremely large files.
- Blocksizes of 512 bytes up to 32768 bytes (32 kB) are supported.
- Supports large partitions. The limit is about 2000 GB, but it can be more depending on the blocksize.
Support for partitions larger than 4 GB or partitions located (partially) beyond the 4 GB barrier on your drive. There is support for New Style Devices (NSD) which support 64 bit access, the 64-bit trackdisk commands and SCSI direct.
- The length of file and directory names is internally limited only by blocksize. Limitations in the dos.library however will reduce the effective length of file and directory names to about 100 characters.
- The size of a file in bytes is limited to slightly less than 4 GB. Because of limitations in dos.library we will however probably not allow files larger than 2 GB, to avoid potential problems.
So... a new FFS system should be able to match/exceed these specs, since they ARE playing with actual Amiga source code ;)
Cheers,
- Paul
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>>Will dos.library's maximum file length limit be removed?
>No. This is not possible due to internal data structures.
Huh? Stil 28 char file names? I hope that I read this wrong!!!
You are wrong. DOS limits filenames to 107 charactors, its FFS that is limited to 31. Presumably OS4 FFS will support full-length names, like some third-party filesystems do.
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Hmm...looking forward to Java support...it's the only language I've managed to code anything of significance in so far (almost working monopoly game, and server program for multiplayer adventure game). I keep wanting to improve my C skills, so I can spend some spare time coding for the Amiga. Unfortunately I just never have the time. Maybe I should go for C++ instead, to utilize my OO-experience. Does anybody here have any experience with C++? How does it compare to C and Java?
For most application development C++ is better than Java, first of all, it performs way better, second of all, it's more consequent (imo). When it comes to comparing to C, well, if you code in good manners you get code that is way more structured than in C (OO kinda does that for you), and it's typesafe (if you behave) etc. You might want to look at this page that my apartment-mate did: learn why java isn't a great language (http://www.acc.umu.se/~arvid/java.html)
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For most application development C++ is better than Java
Before you go off hooping and hollaring at how much better C++ is over Java I'm going to have to contest your arguments for application development.
While C++ is very robust and the perfect language for a lot of things, that does not arbitrarily make C++ better than Java. Instead it gives C++ a great advantage over Java in many respects. Now then, if you take C++ and compare it to Java where Java all out rules in, there's absolutely no comparison. Java web application development is damn powerful and you can build enterprise level applications in a matter of hours where C++ would take quite a few more bits and bobs to pull off. While I agree that Java is not the perfect language in comparison, but when I'm looking to write applications that are 100% cross platform compliant without the need for a complete rewrite or heavy abstract object layers, Java is my tool of choice.
I wrote a good Notepad replacement that allows for configurable hot keys and supports text styling... works on the Mac, works on Windows, and even works on the AmigaDE. The design is very small and has a tiny footprint, it accepts file arguements and will open up multiple files if needed. I built a find and replace as well as toggle case and simple macro recording. I was able to write that in about one weeks time for my needs. To do the same in C++ would take quite a bit of time to support Mac, Windows, AmigaDE, Linux, and a myraid of other platforms would be a headache and a half. A notepad isn't something that requires hellified CPU time but to make arguments a bit on light side, perhaps C would be a better choice over C++ in comparison for games development.
Before you start thinking that Java isn't a great language, you really should find out what the strengths are so that you can exploit them. A good Coder (http://amiga.org/userinfo.php?uid=69) knows when to use one language over the other rather than all out shunning specific languages for their strengths.
:pint:
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Hi Kent,
Are you really active with AmigaDE?
Coder
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> For most application development C++ is better than Java, first of
> all, it performs way better, second of all, it's more consequent
> (imo). When it comes to comparing to C, well, if you code in good
> manners you get code that is way more structured than in C (OO kinda
> does that for you), and it's typesafe (if you behave) etc. You might
> want to look at this page that my apartment-mate did: learn why java
> isn't a great language
Well, yes, I figure that C++ has advantages when it comes to application
development. Java is no speed demon. The advantage of it, though, is that
it is really easy to use once you get the hang of it, and that there is a
whole heap of built-in functionality, like loading and displaying gifs,
jpegs and even html documents. I had a look at your mates page, and he raises
many good points, although I just have to point out: Taking a parameter by
value can be done more elegantly than he does:
object.myMethod(p.clone());
<...>
public myMethod(MyClass p){
}
And it's really quite natural to do, once you get the hang of Java and know
what you're doing.
Still, I guess I'll be looking into C++ this summer. Does anybody know of any
good books on the subject?
Kay
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Are you really active with AmigaDE?
I wouldn't say that I'm hard core, it's more my hobby than anything else. I dabble in VP and C but my largest effort is in Java and playing around with the native layer bytecode. Eventually I hope to finish and release a small Java program I've been developing that is similar in design to NetInfo. Thanks to Java's inherent nature to the web, a NetInfo type program is best written in Java so there's no extreme overhead. Most of my knowledge is in web application development through the J2EE Module-2 design (not applets), so I'm really pressing for full Servlet2.3 and JSP1.2 APIs or better in the AmigaDE Java layer. I've been working on one project for a number of years now and I'm getting ready to relaunch it. Part of my efforts on Amiga compliant JavaScripts and html design are a part of it.
You?
:pint:
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Still, I guess I'll be looking into C++ this summer. Does anybody know of any good books on the subject?
What's your experience in computer programming? I picked up C++ in about two weeks transition time from Java using one of the "teach yourself C++ in yadda yadda time". I can write some pretty looking GCC stuff without the use of an IDE.
SYNTAXX ERROR:>
:pint:
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Hi kent,
Not really serious in developing for the DE. I just installed the latest update and it looks nice. I might develop something for DE in the future. At the moment I am busy wit programming something for the currentOS/OS4. But playing around with DE is fun.
Coder
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At the moment I am busy wit programming something for the currentOS/OS4. But playing around with DE is fun.
Cool. That's one area I never really got into (developing for the AmigaOS) that I really tried but gave up due to frustration in the documentation and the massive clutter of an SDK in the DevCD2.1. I'm hoping there will be better implementations of the ExecSG so that I can look into that area of programming again. I have SAS/C 6.55 but may look into StormC when the A1 is finally released. Personally I can't wait until OS4.2 with the AmigaDE sandbox... at that point I'll really have a blast with my bedroom coder tactics!
Code tight, code small, code clean... that's my moto.
:pint:
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>What's your experience in computer programming?
Tricky question, any metrics I could use? Guess not...I did get an A in basic
Java programming at the university, and I have progressed a bit since then.
That doesn't make me a good programmer in real-life, though, but at least it
indicates that I have a half-decent decent understanding of the semantics.
Other than that I've coded a little bit in E and before that (many, many years
ago), in Dragon Basic. My C experience is limited to making a few tiny progs
with StormC.
Kay
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I'd recommend two books if that's your current state. One of them would be focusing heavily on the fundamentals with the second one focusing on programming tactics in C++. There are things you can do in C++ that are a nightmare to do in Java but at the same time there are some small differences that may help you learn one programming language over another quite fast. Stick with the command line for a while until you get a good solid working of the basics and understand the creation and destruction of pointers well enough to get into GUI development, then start looking outside the box.
My rough experience: numerous years of Commadore64 Basic (wrote my own yatzee game even), 5+ years of ARexx as well as RexxC, a year of Pascal, 2 years of Java, and 2 years of C/C++ (off and on). There are others but that's the important ones in a nutshell (VisualBasic isn't important in my book). What has come of my programming experience... nothing I'd want to release, hopefully that will change in due time.
:pint:
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> I'd recommend two books if that's your current state. (snip)
All right, thanks for the advice, I'll follow up on that one. I'll go looking for books as soon as I finish my last exam. My miggy and me will be separated for the duration of the summer, but I'll keep myself busy reading and laying out architectures for future projects. I might grab myself a book on general programming patterns while I'm at it. Time to get serious! :-)
Kay