Amiga.org
Amiga computer related discussion => General chat about Amiga topics => Topic started by: LaPTuNa on March 25, 2009, 12:17:00 AM
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Hey guys,
I ran across the old GVP-M site the other day and just for giggles, I sent an email to the link asking about 1200 accellerators. I figured it would bounce (I seem to remember it did last time I tried it a few years ago), but it didn't. I got this..........
Re: Is anyone there?
From: gvpmsale (gvpmsale@gvp-m.com)
Sent: Tue 3/24/09 6:26 AM
To: m & m bailey (removed)
Hello.
Thank you for the mail.
Actually we are in the process of getting a small run of Accelerator boards scheduled.
We expect to have the boards ready beginning of may.
Softwarehut will be carrying them and we might be selling a few via online as well.
Regards,
Michael
----- Original Message -----
From: m & m bailey
To: gvpmsale@gvp-m.com
Sent: Sunday, March 22, 2009 9:10 AM
Subject: Is anyone there?
Hi,
I'm just checking the outside possibility of any 030 1200 accellerators left?
thanks,
m. bailey
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Just thought ya'll (can't tell I'm from Texas, can you?) would like to know.
Michial
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Wow - that's great news! Be nice if they'd be willing to do an 060 and/or 060/PPC card too.
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This is great news for classic owners if they manage to do it as the chap says, lets just hope either the new ones will be using standard memory, or that they'll make a run of decent sized GVP simms at a reasonable price :-)
Not much chance of PowerPC, seeing as GVP never made a PPC product as far as I remember.
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More boards is always good news. I wouldn't expect any design changes, though.
I remember reading that Softhut commissioned them to do a run of GVP RAM not too long ago - provides a bit of help on the supply/demand front, but the small production numbers meant the price was still high-ish.
Still, I feel like sending them an email just to thank them for being so awesome.
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So---
Pending a an actual press release.
What types/speeds/ machines would these be for?
IIRC, GVP made accelerators for 1200,2000,3000,4000
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Wow, that's suprising and good news. The last time I went to their site a couple of years ago, my virus shield reported it as a compromised malicious site. I sent a mail to warn them but never heard back.
At the time I was hoping they might fix my fried spectrum video card, but I've long since thrown it away. My mail went unanswered and I couldn't find the replacement chips I needed anywhere.
Plaz
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Am I correct in the 3.9 OS will run on non-ppc but you must have ppc for 4 and 4.1 ?
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recidivist wrote:
Am I correct in the 3.9 OS will run on non-ppc but you must have ppc for 4 and 4.1 ?
Indeed.
3.9 was made to run on 020+ although optimum was 060/ppc
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That is indeed great news...
Now I only wish that some one could do a re-run of amiga 600 acellerators aswell.
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Model specs for this possible re-run?
If they could re-run some 060 boards would be great.
:-D
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I like to have 2x 16 MB GVP Memory SIMMs for my GVP 1230 card.
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There could be a good market for these as they would be ideal for WHDload use.
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Not to burst bubbles, but ISTR getting a similar response from GVP-M several years back when I inquired about GVP RAM. Never saw it.
My memory may play tricks on me at times, but this response sounds all too familiar. I would have to dig WAY back in my emails, but I am sure I still have it.
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by LoadWB on 2009/3/25 9:27:38
Not to burst bubbles, but ISTR getting a similar response from GVP-M several years back when I inquired about GVP RAM. Never saw it.
Sounds like you weren't paying attention: http://www.softhut.com/cgi-bin/test/Web_store/web_store.cgi?page=catalog/hardware/memory/gvp_4MBand16MB.html&cart_id=2228336_65832 (http://www.softhut.com/cgi-bin/test/Web_store/web_store.cgi?page=catalog/hardware/memory/gvp_4MBand16MB.html&cart_id=2228336_65832)
So it took them a while. Bubble burst FAIL.
However, this might shrink some bubbles, if they're only doing 1200 accelerators, sounds like only 1230s as that seems to be all they ever released for the 1200.
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tone007 wrote:
However, this might shrink some bubbles, if they're only doing 1200 accelerators, sounds like only 1230s as that seems to be all they ever released for the 1200.
There should still be a market though as some outlets are still selling NOS A1200s. Couple that with an Indivision, a Subway and one of these GVP cards and it will make a nice machine... for those with some spare cash. :-)
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I had asked about the 1230s a few weeks ago, and got essentially the same reply from Michael:
Hello.
We will have end of april a limited quantity available for sale.
Please confirm your interest so we can contact you once product is available.
As well, please specify what accelerator you are exactly looking for.
Regards,
Michael
I wonder if GVP's switched to using standard SIMMs/DIMMs for these limited runs, and not rolling their own...
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tone007 wrote:
So it took them a while. Bubble burst FAIL.
A while. Almost eight years after my original inquiry. I have recall of the time-frame as I was living in my last student apartment complex when I inquired.
Blah. I hate this train, but I have a nay-sayer ticket after all of the broken promises over the years. There are barely a handful of people actually producing hardware for the Amiga right now. Believe me, even though I lack discretionary funds right now to participate, I am thoroughly pleased by it. The prospect of a fully-operational USB system in my 14 year-old Amiga 4000D with an internal, clip-on SD/FF makes me giddy. If GVP-M can join those ranks, then spectacular.
Bottom line for me is that I am not getting excited over an email like that when I have seen one before in my own Incoming folder, which took more years to materialize than most sane people would wait.
If GVP-M produces new accelerators, that would be awesome. It will not bring them great fame and fortune, but it will certainly make a lot of current and potential Amiga owners happy.
hrmmmm but then, collectors trying to jump on the "Retro-Classic" bandwagon might be willing to pay quite a premium for newly minted accelerators. In better times, I myself would pay a nice penny for another 060 unit for my 2000.
I could probably have summed this all up in a simple statement. Throw your name in for interest, it certainly will not hurt anything. Just do not hold your breath. I have particular misgivings with GVP-M, and I dearly hope that I am wrong.
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i hear they will assemble a number of those a4k 060 accels too. somhow it is strange, either it is old stock, or where they have all that old parts from? connectors, if not the ics?
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@wawrzon
i hear they will assemble a number of those a4k 060 accels too. somhow it is strange, either it is old stock, or where they have all that old parts from? connectors, if not the ics?
Maybe they had some sort of government contract where they have to keep parts available for so many years. Military spec :-)
On a serious note, it's at least encouraging that they've supplied Software Hut with new simms.
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Would be nice to have 16 MB SIMMs... As far as I can see, SoftHut just had 4 MB ones. But prices should be lower than that! :-(
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I sent an email last month inquiring on the availability of an TekMagic 060 board for my A2000 and they sent the same email to me that they would be making a small production run sometime this year.
I would suggest that anyone that is interested should contact GVP Sales and let them know that there is a high degree of interest in their porducts and also to thank them for supporting our small community.
Also lets remember that we should be reasonable in our requests. The only accelerators that we should encourage them to make are 060 boards for the A2000, A1200, A3000 and A4000 based on their current designs. This will help them to keep their production costs down and make it possible for them to do this. Lets be realistic here, yes it would be nice to see a PPC board but it was never one of the products they offered. So that would be an extremely unreasonable request on your part to ask for. Think about what your asking them to do? REMEMBER THE DRAGON!!! (Elbox's Money Pit) Keep in mind we want GVP to make a good deal of money on the items that they sell so as to encourage them to continue to support our aging hardware.
If and when they do make enough money, then we should ask them to PLEASE look at R&D on a newer accelerator card. Maybe a newly designed 060 board with newer features or maybe even a PPC board based on the tried and proven Blizzard boards.
Remember, "Please" and "Thanks" will get you a better response than making Demands.
Thanks,
Rattlehead...... :-)
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rattlehead wrote:
Remember, "Please" and "Thanks" will get you a better response than making Demands.
Thanks,
Rattlehead...... :-)
Good avice, and also try and avoid the words "You must be f****** joking!" when they mention the price. ;-)
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Darrin wrote:
Good avice, and also try and avoid the words "You must be f****** joking!" when they mention the price. ;-)
Indeed. Just how much IS a 68060 these days? I know of a Chinese bloke flogging one for $150.
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Here's my stupid question disclaimer: I know literally nothing about hardware development. I'm a software guy.
Having said that, I was very interested in the talk about some project or other. I can't remember if it was the minimig or something else. Anyway, everyone was talking about emulating a 68000 in one of these new-fangled reprogrammable logic contraptions. (FPGA?) The idea was that they could recreate the 68000, then amp up the clock rate to something serious.
I've also read that the amiga was nice for developing accelerator boards because of it's design. If this is the case, would it really be that difficult for someone to emulate a 68030 (with mmu and fpu) at a higher clock speed? Add in some memory and a buddha from jens, maybe a clock port.
I mean, compared to a buddha, deneb, indivision, mediator, etc, is this really that hard to do? I've heard that recreating the powerpc half would be tough. But I know a lot of people would be interested in a motorola-only accerator board for the 2000/500/600/1200.
brian
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blanning wrote:
If this is the case, would it really be that difficult for someone to emulate a 68030 (with mmu and fpu) at a higher clock speed?
Yes.
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FPGA are no where near fast enough at a reasonable price to be able to emulate an 060
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- I have been watching the pricesw USED,NON-WARRANTED, boards bring on eBay; "you have got to be f--- " is paid often!
There are definitely people still with money and interest;used A4000s have been bringing $315 USD.
ANY and all available boards pulled out of new old stock and finished will be eagerly purchased if the prices are not too high.
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@Rattlehead
GVP-M is a former shadow of itself. They cannot even support their products properly. I won't get into specifics now, but shouldn't their knowledge be higher than average user's?
Few weeks ago I had issues with an accel board. I found help on a.org. Already, supporting A2000, A1200, A3000 and A4000 is unrealistic (production run for 4 products!) and you can expect prices way higher than they are on ebay.
I would recommend A2000/1200 (most common to find, and 1200 NOS still available).
I doubt they have any software developers or engineers in house - so who is going to design newer hardware?
Oh, and don't bring Elbox into the mix. I went to Cracow, Poland, and looked for 3 hours for their office - anyone that was asked had no clue where it was, even though I went to the right street etc. The Dragon must have sucked them in. :lol:
Proven Blizzards? TekMagic boards are also proven.
Anyway the price you pay will be higher than ebay's. Thats for all of you that a dreaming of 060 for $300
:lol:
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JJ wrote:
FPGA are no where near fast enough at a reasonable price to be able to emulate an 060
I don't know, but maybe some less complex processor designs such as the 68030 or 040 are possible. I've always thought this would be the future for classic Amiga expansions. The real processors cost too much, produce too much heat and draw too much power, and I'm sure a board with an FPGA could be made more compact too.
... and seeing the second hand prices of accelerators on eBay makes me pretty sure that a new run of FPGA accelerators could only be cheaper :D.
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Nice! Where you'll find the 030 mask/gerbers?
A plain 68000 is dead easy to emulate, but not the more complicated chips without using a very expensive FPGA. Even NatAmi go to gerber a 060 "clone".
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A plain 68000 is dead easy to emulate, but not the more complicated chips without using a very expensive FPGA. Even NatAmi go to gerber a 060 "clone".
actually they claim to have next to functional 68k softcore replacement already which is being developed parallel as option to 060 cpu-board. but other serious hardware devs deny that such is possible.
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Poses a good question. Which is better, an emulated 060, or a stupid fast emulated 68000 with MMU and FPU?
It would probably be best to emulate an 030, though, since I believe the expansion logic in the Fast Slot is built around the 030. Am I correct?
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even an emulated 68000 would have the limits of an 16bit cpu i take it (adress space and such). would be better to go for 32bit perhaps.
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LoadWB wrote:
Poses a good question. Which is better, an emulated 060, or a stupid fast emulated 68000 with MMU and FPU?
It would probably be best to emulate an 030, though, since I believe the expansion logic in the Fast Slot is built around the 030. Am I correct?
Yes, I think 68030 has the best balance between compatibility and features, so it might be the best emulation choice if you want to speed everything up (and allow access to large amounts of ram) while remaining compatible with all those whdload games ;-)
EDIT: Or maybe just a 68020 and a MMU
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@terminator4
Oh, and don't bring Elbox into the mix. I went to Cracow, Poland, and looked for 3 hours for their office - anyone that was asked had no clue where it was, even though I went to the right street etc.
Didn't you try ringing them?
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Linde wrote:
LoadWB wrote:
Poses a good question. Which is better, an emulated 060, or a stupid fast emulated 68000 with MMU and FPU?
It would probably be best to emulate an 030, though, since I believe the expansion logic in the Fast Slot is built around the 030. Am I correct?
Yes, I think 68030 has the best balance between compatibility and features, so it might be the best emulation choice if you want to speed everything up (and allow access to large amounts of ram) while remaining compatible with all those whdload games ;-)
EDIT: Or maybe just a 68020 and a MMU
A 020 with instruction and data caches + burst plus a MMU is called 030. ;-)
Although it is easier to emulate than a 060, no documentation of the behaviour of such CPU are available. Still a no-go, sadly. :-(
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Why the GVP-m's accelerators can't have more than 128 MB of memory? Is it because of the memory modules (GVP-SIMMs)?
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If their card can't use more than 128 mb ram and is limited to propietary memory modules they should redesign it so that it already includes a chip with 128 mb ram (and maybe use newer/cheaper DDR ram).
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Are these guys really back? Or is this just more vapourware?
Does anyone have any details on what and when and how much?
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There are some prices on their site and they many of the products do say "In Stock" or "New" next to them.
http://www.gvp-m.com/pricejapan.html
It only seems to be '030s for us poor 1200 users
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Pretty sure that prices page has read the same since 2003.
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little wrote:
If their card can't use more than 128 mb ram and is limited to propietary memory modules they should redesign it so that it already includes a chip with 128 mb ram (and maybe use newer/cheaper DDR ram).
Their last A2000 boards were able to use 72 pin SIMM modules as far as I know... Surely it would be much nicer to have SDRAM, but I think it would require a major redesign.
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Copyright 1997-2003 Great Valley Products - M Inc.
This website was last updated 13th October 2003
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jpera wrote:
Why the GVP-m's accelerators can't have more than 128 MB of memory? Is it because of the memory modules (GVP-SIMMs)?
I have never ran out of memory on my 128MB, why the heck would i need more??? :-P
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Back in 2000-2003 their site did not have a phone!
I may try again one day.
Didn't you try ringing them?
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http://www.gvp-m.com/pricejapan.html
It only seems to be '030s for us poor 1200 users
GVP 4.13 latest version of ROM? haha.
actually its 4.15. I guess they did not pay license to Mr Babel?
I'm sure those prices will be "adjusted" for inflation if they get new stock. Small production runs (<1000) don't result in discount prices, as much as we'd all like to see.
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as far i recall from certain threads on a1k.org the adress space of a4k/a3k cpu slot is limited to 128mb. well. i have no technical understanding to fully comprehend what that means, but from what ive read there i assume one could put more ram on an accel but probably some workaround woud be needed. a1200s are another issue since the accel will be connected to another bus so paradoxically you can have 265mb on a blizzard. tough world.
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Check the Software Hut site. They are listing the accelerators (A2000, A4000 & A1200) video card (spectrum) and 4Mb AND 16Mb GVP SIMMs.
Prices aren't bad at all!
Looks like I'll have to buy another A2000....