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Amiga computer related discussion => Amiga Hardware Issues and discussion => Topic started by: Sandman on February 10, 2009, 05:12:14 PM

Title: Any advantages to Indivision 4000 over a Picasso IV?
Post by: Sandman on February 10, 2009, 05:12:14 PM

Hi,

I was lucky enough to snag a Picasso IV for my 4000 which works fine but I was wondering if there are any advantages to the new Indivision 4000 I have seen posts about.

Thanks for the input.
Tim

Title: Re: Any advantages to Indivision 4000 over a Picasso IV?
Post by: zipper on February 10, 2009, 06:41:51 PM

Dont know exactly, PicassoIV FliFi goes upto about 150 Hz.

Title: Re: Any advantages to Indivision 4000 over a Picasso IV?
Post by: krize on February 10, 2009, 07:56:32 PM

Indivision is not a gfx card, its a scandoubler so you can use normal AGA screenmodes on a standard vga/lcd screen...

Title: Re: Any advantages to Indivision 4000 over a Picasso IV?
Post by: DoogUK on February 10, 2009, 08:23:31 PM

Indivision is an extremely nice bit of kit...but the picasso is the winner there.

Title: Re: Any advantages to Indivision 4000 over a Picasso IV?
Post by: alexh on February 10, 2009, 10:14:31 PM

The scan doubler & Flicker Fixer in the PIV is not perfect though. It shows some artifacts when scan doubling high speed interlaced images.

If MASTATABS ever decides to release the source code for it I'd give it a go at fixing it (if technically feasible).

Title: Re: Any advantages to Indivision 4000 over a Picasso IV?
Post by: Ratte on February 10, 2009, 10:53:49 PM

The PIV FlickerFixer supports PAL / NTSC-Modes only.
Indy supports ALL modes (except A2024).
PAL, NTSC, DblPAL, DblNTSC, Euro36, Euro72, Multiscan, Super72, HighGFX, HD720 ... in 24Bit Colordepth and all with 60Hz or more.

Title: Re: Any advantages to Indivision 4000 over a Picasso IV?
Post by: Jose on February 10, 2009, 10:56:56 PM

@alexh
"The scan doubler & Flicker Fixer in the PIV is not perfect though. It shows some artifacts when scan doubling high speed interlaced images.

If MASTATABS ever decides to release the source code for it I'd give it a go at fixing it (if technically feasible)."

I think the problem there is that the PicassoIV's normall output is progressive, so when it mixes both fields into one frame you see interlaced artifacts. Since the FliFi feeds the GPU you'd have to program a deinterlacer for it:) Maybe it's possible, at least for a basic deinterlacing algorithm...

Other thing I remember is messing with the frequencies, for example, would it be possible to output a 100Hz interlaced screen instead of a 50Hz progressive one ?
One of these days I'm gonna try it, right now my 4000T with PicassoIV hasn't been turned on for more than an year :-o There's a good explanation though, I only have a 3640 on it...

Title: Re: Any advantages to Indivision 4000 over a Picasso IV?
Post by: Sir_Lucas on February 10, 2009, 10:58:53 PM

The biggest advantage for me is that Indivision SD/FF is brand new, while PIV SD is almost if not more than 10 years old.

Title: Re: Any advantages to Indivision 4000 over a Picasso IV?
Post by: raketa on February 10, 2009, 11:26:13 PM

PIV is the winner for me, because I already own one. It's not only sd/ff, but gfx, sound and TV card with my Concierto and Paloma installed. Plus I like automatic monitor switcher.

Title: Re: Any advantages to Indivision 4000 over a Picasso IV?
Post by: Damion on February 10, 2009, 11:30:12 PM

Biggest PIV problem I've experienced is that the default setup on some cards has a real ridiculous bug, that isn't easily fixed with the config tool. (Deinterlacing artifacts, (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Deinterlace#Deinterlacing_methods) on the other hand, are probably unavoidable.) The Indivision is probably better than the PIV scandoubler, but it seems silly to put one in a machine with a PIV - PIV scandoubler is already pretty good, and you'd lose the automatic video switcher. Indi makes more sense with other video cards or no video card.

Title: Re: Any advantages to Indivision 4000 over a Picasso IV?
Post by: alexh on February 10, 2009, 11:47:11 PM

Quote

Ratte wrote:
The PIV FlickerFixer supports PAL / NTSC-Modes only.

If you say so, I've no idea.

Quote

Ratte wrote:
Indy supports ALL modes (except A2024).
PAL, NTSC, DblPAL, DblNTSC, Euro36, Euro72, Multiscan, Super72, HighGFX, HD720

Nice sell ;-)

But of course non of these modes would ever be used when you've got a Zorro III, programmable pixel rate RTG gfx card like the PIV. You would need an application that specifically required one of those extra modes for the Indivision to have the edge over a PIV with respect to features.

Quote

Ratte wrote:
... in 24Bit Colordepth and all with 60Hz or more.

The PIV scandoubler is 24-bit and has programmable scan rate conversion too.

How good the scan rate conversion is on the PIV is debatable. I've never used it.

Quality is where the Indivision may have the edge over a PIV.

Title: Re: Any advantages to Indivision 4000 over a Picasso IV?
Post by: Sandman on February 11, 2009, 12:10:20 AM

Not to take this thread in too different a direction, but...


I've only used my PIV with what it defaults too and never really dug too much into the TNG settings or whatever.  Anyone know of any good info online about this.  A tutorial of some sort perhaps?

The manual seems pretty lean and I'm self-proclaimed novice on amiga video, etc. but would really like to learn about it.

Thanks,
Tim