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Amiga computer related discussion => Amiga Hardware Issues and discussion => Topic started by: elpiloto on February 20, 2008, 12:04:06 AM

Title: a3000 vga port
Post by: elpiloto on February 20, 2008, 12:04:06 AM
hi,
i found a cheap a3000 that is in a very good shape, the psu was bad so im using a pc one, the a3000 works ok, but i pluged my lcd monitor into the vga connector of the a3000 and i cant see anything .... is there any jumper that must be moved to use the vga port?
with my old 1084s works perfectly

cheers
Hernan
Title: Re: a3000 vga port
Post by: alexh on February 20, 2008, 12:06:08 AM
There is the VGA out Enable/Disable switch on the back of the case (in between the VGA and Audio), but I'm sure you tried that already?

If it is a PAL A3000 you may need to switch to 60Hz (NTSC).

Many LCD's cannot handle the 50Hz output of a PAL A3000 VGA output.
Title: Re: a3000 vga port
Post by: adolescent on February 20, 2008, 12:10:45 AM
There is an enable/disable switch right next to the VGA port.  
Title: Re: a3000 vga port
Post by: elpiloto on February 20, 2008, 12:40:14 AM
yhea i tried that switch and the a3000 is on ntsc now, but still nothing  
 :madashell:  :crazy:
Title: Re: a3000 vga port
Post by: adolescent on February 20, 2008, 01:10:57 AM
Any battery damage?  Do you have another VGA CRT that you can try to make sure it isn't just a problem with the LCD?
Title: Re: a3000 vga port
Post by: amigadave on February 20, 2008, 01:23:46 AM
Quote

alexh wrote:
There is the VGA out Enable/Disable switch on the back of the case (in between the VGA and Audio), but I'm sure you tried that already?

If it is a PAL A3000 you may need to switch to 60Hz (NTSC).

Many LCD's cannot handle the 50Hz output of a PAL A3000 VGA output.


As alexh pointed out above, you may have to open up the case and change the jumper from a PAL display frequency to a NTSC display frequency as many LCD monitors can't cope with the 50hz refresh rate of the PAL frequency.  Also I hope you are not flipping the switch at the back while the Amiga is on.  I don't know if that can cause damage, but would not take the chance.

Good luck, A3000's are one of my favorite Amigas.
Title: Re: a3000 vga port
Post by: AMC258 on February 20, 2008, 01:30:40 AM
You can and should flip the switch with the power on.  For this reason:  It's upside down from what you'd expect.  Enable is down, Disable is up.  So, try it both ways to make sure.  When I got my A3000UX, it had a blown fuse which was disabling the scandoubler.  Look for that.  Sorry, don't have the schematic handy.
Title: Re: a3000 vga port
Post by: elpiloto on February 20, 2008, 03:19:19 AM
hi all,
Thanks for the replys!!
As i sayed, i moved the jumper to NTSC mode, the psu of the a3000 is not the original from commodore, its a PC one (i dont know if the TIC signal have something to do with the vga port), i allready tryed with a crt monitor and i moved the switch that eneables the vga mode too and ..... nope, nothing on the screen.


oh by the way i have the original kickstart 2 disk, but i dont have the 1.3 for the A3000, is there any way to find it?
cheers
Hernan
Title: Re: a3000 vga port
Post by: rkauer on February 20, 2008, 03:42:13 AM
Quote

elpiloto wrote:
hi all,
Thanks for the replys!!
As i sayed, i moved the jumper to NTSC mode, the psu of the a3000 is not the original from commodore, its a PC one (i dont know if the TIC signal have something to do with the vga port), i allready tryed with a crt monitor and i moved the switch that eneables the vga mode too and ..... nope, nothing on the screen.

oh by the way i have the original kickstart 2 disk, but i dont have the 1.3 for the A3000, is there any way to find it?


 The tick signal have "almost" nothing to do with VGA signal (it is generated from the video frequency: Agnus PAL or NTSC).

 Check if the monitors you have can handle 50Hz of vertical frequency.

 Check your ROM (OK, not YOUR ROM, the A3000 one!) to see the version.

 1.4 ROM inside the A3000 means you need a super-kickstart disk or an HD with the rom image on devs: (more information about it over the net).

 1.3 ROM simply never exist in an A3000!
Title: Re: a3000 vga port
Post by: elpiloto on February 20, 2008, 04:08:36 AM
Quote

rkauer wrote:
Quote

elpiloto wrote:
hi all,
Thanks for the replys!!
As i sayed, i moved the jumper to NTSC mode, the psu of the a3000 is not the original from commodore, its a PC one (i dont know if the TIC signal have something to do with the vga port), i allready tryed with a crt monitor and i moved the switch that eneables the vga mode too and ..... nope, nothing on the screen.

oh by the way i have the original kickstart 2 disk, but i dont have the 1.3 for the A3000, is there any way to find it?


 The tick signal have "almost" nothing to do with VGA signal (it is generated from the video frequency: Agnus PAL or NTSC).

 Check if the monitors you have can handle 50Hz of vertical frequency.

 Check your ROM (OK, not YOUR ROM, the A3000 one!) to see the version.

 1.4 ROM inside the A3000 means you need a super-kickstart disk or an HD with the rom image on devs: (more information about it over the net).

 1.3 ROM simply never exist in an A3000!


but.......my a3000 when starts apear a kickstart menu, that says kisckstart 2.x hard disk or floppy and kickstart 1.3 hard drive and floppy, so i thin must be there some version of kickstart 1.3 for the a3000 ......
Title: Re: a3000 vga port
Post by: rkauer on February 20, 2008, 05:37:50 AM
Quote

elpiloto wrote:

but.......my a3000 when starts apear a kickstart menu, that says kisckstart 2.x hard disk or floppy and kickstart 1.3 hard drive and floppy, so I think must be there some version of kickstart 1.3 for the a3000 ......


 Maybe the last owner managed to use a kickstart switch in your A3000, but it never, ever had ROM 1.3 as standard.

 Anyway, using ROM 1.3 (35.xxx) don't gives access to the HD, so it is used for gaming purposes in floppy-based games and apps.

 More information over A3000 can be reached here (http://amigahardware.mariomisic.de/cgi-bin/showhardware_en.cgi?HARDID=22).

 More about kickstarts here (http://amigahardware.mariomisic.de/cgi-bin/showhardware_en.cgi?HARDID=1459).
Title: Re: a3000 vga port
Post by: rkauer on February 20, 2008, 05:57:26 AM
 BTW quoting Amiga Hardware Database: (http://amiga.resource.cx)

 Early A3000s have Kickstart 1.4 soft-boot ROM. It loads a ROM image (revision 2.04 or 3.1) from a bootable drive, reallocates memory with the 030's MMU and turns 512 kB Fast RAM into ROM. Kickstart 1.4 does not work with 040 or 060 processors because their MMU is different.

 Most A3000s shipped with Kickstart 2.04 ROM. Both versions can be replaced with a 3.0 or 3.1 one. The ROM timing circuit provides four different speed settings for output enable (90-345ns) and access timing (160-437ns).

 All A3000s shipped with DMAC 01 or 02, Ramsey 04 and Fat Buster 05, 06 or 07. Upgrading to DMAC 04 and Ramsey 07 solves many problems with some 040 processor cards, especially the A3640. Upgrading to Super Buster 11 enables Zorro III DMA which is required by some expansion cards, for example the A4091.
Title: Re: a3000 vga port
Post by: elpiloto on February 20, 2008, 06:06:35 AM
ok so i need the 1.4 image, any way to find it?
Title: Re: a3000 vga port
Post by: Zac67 on February 20, 2008, 07:32:25 AM
There was no 1.4 ever released, it was only used as boot ROM for the Superkickstart machines (like yours). You'll need to put a Kick2.x or 3.x image where the boot ROM expects it; the A3k floppy set has some tool to read it from a Superkick disk, but you can use any image - A3k version needed.

I'm a bit in a hurry (going to work), hope that puts you on the right trail.  ;-)
Title: Re: a3000 vga port
Post by: alexh on February 20, 2008, 07:57:14 AM
Quote

elpiloto wrote:
As i sayed, i moved the jumper to NTSC mode

I am not sure that is enough, I think you must also change to NTSC in screen prefs?

Quote
but.......my a3000 when starts apear a kickstart menu, that says kisckstart 2.x hard disk or floppy and kickstart 1.3 hard drive and floppy, so i thin must be there some version of kickstart 1.3 for the a3000 ......

You DEFINITELY have kickstart 1.4 ROM chips inside your A3000.

This ROM allows you to load KS1.3 or KS2+ (including KS3.1) from hard drive or floppy drive.

There are official SuperKickstart (floppy) disks for KS1.3, KS2.04 and unofficial ones for KS3.1.

Do you have a hard drive? If you do then can forget about using floppy disks.

1)Rename your hard drive partition DEVICE NAME to WB_2.x (This must be done at the lowest level, not just change Icon name)

2)Copy the Superkickstart ROM image to your hard drive in the location DEVS:/kickstart

Where do I get a SuperKickstart 3.1 ROM image?

See your PM ;-)

For more information about making SuperKickstart floppy disks, and all thinks related to KS1.4 take a look here

http://aminet.net/package/util/misc/MakeSuperDisk
Title: Re: a3000 vga port
Post by: Jope on February 20, 2008, 08:46:07 AM
Quote

rkauer wrote:
Anyway, using ROM 1.3 (35.xxx) don't gives access to the HD, so it is used for gaming purposes in floppy-based games and apps.

Oh, but it does give you HD access. There's a 1.3 compatible scsi.device on the superkickstart disk, that gets appended to the 1.3 image to make a superkickstart file in WB1.3:devs/kickstart.

When the A3000 was first released, it usually came with KS/WB 2.01 or 2.03.. Commodore told everyone that 2.x wasn't fit for production use and basically instructed people to use 1.3 for production work.

That's why it had superkickstart functionality.. If it really had been what they wanted, the A4000 would have shipped with it too, I guess. :-)
Title: Re: a3000 vga port
Post by: AMC258 on February 21, 2008, 12:18:25 AM
This belongs in a new thread.  But, here it is.

Early A3000's shipped with Kickstart ROM v1.4.  Yes, it is a Kickstart.  It DOES have an incomplete v1.4 of the OS on it, I have personally witnessed it on my A3000UX.  You CAN get a CLI going in 1.4, but I don't remember the trick to it.  It's worth seeing, the graphics are screwey.  Most of the vector graphics (gadgets and things) do not exist, and you can clearly see the transition from 1.3 to 2.0 as a work in progress.
One thing the ROM does different than other Kickstart ROMs though is allow you to select a Kickstart image to use instead of the 1.4 Kickstart.  You are never supposed to see the 1.4 Kickstart.

The standard installation was this:
Three hard drive partitions.  One with the OS1.3 system, including the 1.3 SuperKickstart.  One with the OS2.0 system, including the 2.0 SuperKickstart.  One called WORK: (YES!  This is where it all started with this name!) where you put everything non-OS specific.

The OS1.3 that comes with the A3000 works with hard drives, just like OS1.3 for A1000/500/2000.  I could be remembering wrong, but the way I remember is that OS1.2 worked with hard drives also, it would NOT boot directly from a hard drive though.  1.3 introduced 'Autobooting'.
 
One of these days I'm going to dig up my 1.4 ROM, and see if I can run OS4 with it installed.

BTW, C= NEVER made a SuperKickstart for OS3.1!
Title: Re: a3000 vga port
Post by: Zac67 on February 21, 2008, 07:29:15 AM
Just press both mouse buttons on startup to get the boot selection screen. There you hit the invisible close button on the top left corner and you've got 1.4. For what it's worth... ;-)
Title: Re: a3000 vga port
Post by: alexh on February 21, 2008, 09:56:28 AM
Quote

AMC258 wrote:
BTW, C= NEVER made a SuperKickstart for OS3.1!

BTW, C= NEVER made any KS3.1, Super or regular!

They went bankrupt before launch and it was VillageTronic who eventually released it :-P

Anyhow (as I said early) there _IS_ an unofficial  SuperKickstart3.1 (An A3000 KS3.1 ROM with Bonus Code)
Title: Re: a3000 vga port
Post by: Jope on February 21, 2008, 03:06:29 PM
Quote

alexh wrote:
Anyhow (as I said early) there _IS_ an unofficial  SuperKickstart3.1 (An A3000 KS3.1 ROM with Bonus Code)

And as we determined elsewhere, the bonus code hasn't actually changed since 2.04.. It seems to work fine for all kickstarts that came after that. I'm talking about $VER: bonus20 37.14 (5.5.91)

Now you can easily make your own 3.1 superkickstart disk from a 2.04 superkickdisk + 3.1 A3000 ROM.. Just a case of writing the 3000 ROM's contents over the 2.04 ROM image on the superkickdisk with your favourite monitor or disk editor.

I once made a 3.9 superkickstart file, and that also works.

Make a backup copy of your 2.04 superkick disk and work on that, please.

Oh and if you already have a 2.04 superkick file, you can just take the bonus out of that and tack it on to an A3000 3.1 image you read from the original A3000 3.1 ROM chips you have in your possession. ;-)
Title: Re: a3000 vga port
Post by: AMC258 on February 22, 2008, 01:03:40 AM
Okay, call me schtuupit, but, what the heck is the 'bonus code'?

And, where the heck can I get my hands on this unofficial SuperKickstart 3.1 ??  Or should I just try and find one of the MANY SuperKickstarts I have and modify it?
I have every version of 2.x that was ever released on SuperKickstart!
Title: Re: a3000 vga port
Post by: Jope on February 22, 2008, 06:28:26 AM
The normal kickstart is exactly 512kB no more, no less.

The A3000 kickstart is 512kB + bonus code. Look at the end of your superkickstart file in devs:kickstart, there you will find the bonus. It is very clear where it starts and where the kickstart ends.

Like I said before, just get your hands on a 512kB A3000 3.1 and you can make a superkickstart 3.1 by tacking the bonus into the end of it..

Just out of curiosity, what 2.0x superkickstarts do you have?

At least 36.143 and 36.202 I guess, but more?
Title: Re: a3000 vga port
Post by: AMC258 on February 23, 2008, 01:55:56 AM
Quote
The A3000 kickstart is 512kB + bonus code.


Great.  But, what is the bonus code?

Quote
Look at the end of your superkickstart file in devs:kickstart


I don't have a DEVS:Kickstart anymore, now I have a SYS:Kickstart (OS4).  I don't know where my 1.4 ROMs are.

Quote
Just out of curiosity, what 2.0x superkickstarts do you have?


I'll have to let you know when I dig them up next time.

Quote
At least 36.143 and 36.202 I guess, but more?


IIRC, there were between 5 and 7 of them.  I got the idea that the original owner of my A3000UX was involved in some sort of upgrade program from C=.  Interestingly, the first set of SuperKickstart disks consists of a single SuperKickstart disk (1.3) and a piece of paper promising that future SuperKickstarts would include the all new Release 2 which wasn't quite available yet.
Title: Re: a3000 vga port
Post by: Zac67 on February 23, 2008, 11:50:04 AM
The bonus code contains the scsi.device driver and onboard fast RAM setup. Without it, you lose these features.
Title: Re: a3000 vga port
Post by: alexh on February 23, 2008, 12:07:21 PM
Quote

Zac67 wrote:
The bonus code contains the scsi.device driver and onboard fast RAM setup. Without it, you lose these features.

Hmm, maybe for 1.3. KS2+ contains all that.
Title: Re: a3000 vga port
Post by: AMC258 on February 23, 2008, 03:41:35 PM
Right.  I don't know about the fastmem, but I have managed to extract the scsi.device from the 3.1 Kickstart (512k).
Title: Re: a3000 vga port
Post by: taunusand on February 23, 2008, 11:27:42 PM
Tell me if this is a stupid question.. But how can you extract scsi.device (or any) from kickstart?  :-?