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Amiga computer related discussion => Amiga Hardware Issues and discussion => Topic started by: webmany on December 12, 2007, 04:36:32 AM

Title: Cyberstorm and A4000 problem
Post by: webmany on December 12, 2007, 04:36:32 AM
I have a Cyberstorm MKIII.  I had it installed in a A3000 and it worked fine (except do not have int_2 done), but when I installed it into my new A4000, I get noting but a black screen.  The A4K currently has a 040 board in it.  Is there a jumper that needs changed, or should I send it away for repair?
Title: Re: Cyberstorm and A4000 problem
Post by: Jeff on December 12, 2007, 04:45:45 AM
Well if it works fine in the 3000 and not in the 4000 I would look closely at a configuration issue with the 4000 first before sending the card away. I had mine running fine in my A4000D for a long time before moving it to the tower but I don't remember the jumper settings I used. I'm sure you can look it up somewhere though. If not, I'll find them for you.

Jeff
Title: Re: Cyberstorm and A4000 problem
Post by: webmany on December 12, 2007, 04:54:45 AM
The only settings I found (from the manual for the Cyserstorm) was 2 jumpers on the motherboard, but they are already set to ext for the 040.
Title: Re: Cyberstorm and A4000 problem
Post by: alexh on December 12, 2007, 09:50:36 AM
A CS MKIII has different jumper settings to an A3640 if that is the 040 card you have.
Title: Re: Cyberstorm and A4000 problem
Post by: amiga92570 on December 12, 2007, 01:21:43 PM
the jumpers for the Cyberstorm MKIII should be set to EXT. Remember you also need to install drivers before installing card or it will not boot. Also, make sure the board has proper spacers and is sitting level on the 4000 board.
Title: Re: Cyberstorm and A4000 problem
Post by: webmany on December 12, 2007, 02:43:37 PM
The 2 jumpers on the motherboard are set to EXT.  What other changes are needed when going from a 040 to 060?

What drivers need to be installed?  I have installed the 68060 files in WB3.9, but it does not even get that far.  If I hold down the mouse button, I never get the diag screen.

The SCSI is not connected to anything.  Just using the IDE drive.

Title: Re: Cyberstorm and A4000 problem
Post by: pan1k on December 12, 2007, 04:01:51 PM
I'd suggest also that you make sure you have the correct plastic standoffs, and make *sure* that the cyberstorm is firmly seated! Also make sure the ram modules are properly seated.
Title: Re: Cyberstorm and A4000 problem
Post by: doctorq on December 12, 2007, 04:08:46 PM
Quote

Remember you also need to install drivers before installing card or it will not boot.


Sorry, but this isn't true and seems to be a general misunderstanding. The computer WILL boot without correct libs, but that doesn't mean that the computer won't crash as soon as it runs SetPatch though.
Title: Re: Cyberstorm and A4000 problem
Post by: webmany on December 12, 2007, 04:24:06 PM
The card was firmly on the standoffs, and the ram reseated.  No joy.

Title: Re: Cyberstorm and A4000 problem
Post by: alexh on December 12, 2007, 04:38:46 PM
Try unplugging the hard drives and any non essential cards, in case it's a PSU problem.

If that gets you further, then at least you know.
Title: Re: Cyberstorm and A4000 problem
Post by: Miloo on December 12, 2007, 04:46:55 PM
Id try it back in the A3000 to be sure.

I had the same problem with my CSPPC, tried a new psu, took every card out of the machine, reseated ram but nothing. When I put my A3640 in, the machine booted first time.

The CSPPC has now gone for a holiday in France  :roll:
Title: Re: Cyberstorm and A4000 problem
Post by: amiga92570 on December 12, 2007, 04:51:36 PM
Quote

doctorq wrote:
Quote

Remember you also need to install drivers before installing card or it will not boot.


Sorry, but this isn't true and seems to be a general misunderstanding. The computer WILL boot without correct libs, but that doesn't mean that the computer won't crash as soon as it runs SetPatch though.


At times it may boot and crash, most times it will not boot. I have used 100's of Cyberstorms MKI, MKII, MKIII, PPC. depend's on firmware update, and version of 060. 040's seem to be ok.
Title: Re: Cyberstorm and A4000 problem
Post by: amiga92570 on December 12, 2007, 05:10:20 PM
One other thing, try holding down esc while powering on computer and see if cyberstorm menu screen comes up. If it does not, there may be a problem with the card or the cpu socket. If you are using keyboard interface such as lyra you will need to keep hitting the ESC key continuosly.
Title: Re: Cyberstorm and A4000 problem
Post by: amigadave on December 12, 2007, 05:40:06 PM
Quote

amiga92570 wrote:
the jumpers for the Cyberstorm MKIII should be set to EXT. Remember you also need to install drivers before installing card or it will not boot. Also, make sure the board has proper spacers and is sitting level on the 4000 board.


I think the answer is above.  If you did not install the 060 libraries and drivers BEFORE you removed the 040 and installed the 060, it won't boot.  I am not sure how far along the boot process it will go before it hangs, but I know you will not see any part of the Workbench and I suspect you won't be able to get to the early startup screen either.

Good luck, hope you get it running soon.  I am in process of shuffling accelerators, video cards, ethernet cards, and other Zorro cards between a couple Amiga A3000Ds, one A3000T, two A4000Ds and one A4000T, to get the best combinations and have run into the 060 install problem before.
Title: Re: Cyberstorm and A4000 problem
Post by: Amigaz on December 12, 2007, 05:46:14 PM
Quote

amigadave wrote:
Quote

amiga92570 wrote:
the jumpers for the Cyberstorm MKIII should be set to EXT. Remember you also need to install drivers before installing card or it will not boot. Also, make sure the board has proper spacers and is sitting level on the 4000 board.


I think the answer is above.  If you did not install the 060 libraries and drivers BEFORE you removed the 040 and installed the 060, it won't boot.  I am not sure how far along the boot process it will go before it hangs, but I know you will not see any part of the Workbench and I suspect you won't be able to get to the early startup screen either.

Good luck, hope you get it running soon.  I am in process of shuffling accelerators, video cards, ethernet cards, and other Zorro cards between a couple Amiga A3000Ds, one A3000T, two A4000Ds and one A4000T, to get the best combinations and have run into the 060 install problem before.


Like DocQ says it's untrue that it won't boot without the '060 libs, it will most certainly boot if the accelerator is healthy but will probably crash on the setpatch line in startup-sequence and you'll get an angry red SOFTWARE FAILURE message on screen

Both me and DoctorQ have "been there, done that" when it comes to these things

 ;-)
Title: Re: Cyberstorm and A4000 problem
Post by: doctorq on December 12, 2007, 05:47:50 PM
Quote

At times it may boot and crash, most times it will not boot. I have used 100's of Cyberstorms MKI, MKII, MKIII, PPC. depend's on firmware update, and version of 060. 040's seem to be ok.


There is a difference between working stable and booting. The computer will ALWAYS boot ok regardless if the correct libraries has been installed or not. The problem comes when actually loading any software, for instance Setpatch that might crash the computer and put it into a reboot cyclus.

It may crash without correct libraries installed, that is correct, but it will ALWAYS boot even with no libraries installed (since the libraries most times are loaded from disk anyway).
Title: Re: Cyberstorm and A4000 problem
Post by: rkauer on December 12, 2007, 08:31:13 PM
 Looks more a connection problem to me.

 Try held the middle of the accelerator slot's back (on the Amiga) with a rubber (that you use to erase pencil) when inserting the card.
Title: Re: Cyberstorm and A4000 problem
Post by: webmany on December 12, 2007, 08:48:46 PM
I have tried removing the HD and floppy, here get the insert disk screen.

Will try holding the middle down, holding the esc key and moving card back to the 3000 tonight.
Title: Re: Cyberstorm and A4000 problem
Post by: motorollin on December 12, 2007, 09:14:25 PM
Quote
webmany wrote:
I have tried removing the HD and floppy, here get the insert disk screen.

Then the problem is software, not hardware. The machine is probably booting but hanging half way through because the 060 drivers are not installed.

Quote
webmany wrote:
Will try holding the middle down, holding the esc key and moving card back to the 3000 tonight.

Don't bother - you already know the card works since you get the Kickstart screen with no HDD attached.

--
moto
Title: Re: Cyberstorm and A4000 problem
Post by: A4000_Mad on December 13, 2007, 01:03:11 AM
@ webmany

Can you just confirm that you have now seen the insert disk screen at some point?

I ask because I have *never* been able to get the insert disk screen on an A4000 unless a healthy and correctly fitted CPU card is present. Has anybody??

If you have seen the screen then that is good news. If not, I would suggest doing your tests with only the CSMK3, PSU and 2MB RAM connected to the motherboard until you get the insert disk screen. Then when you get the screen add on the floppy and the HDD. After which it will be a case of sorting out your software as stated.
Title: Re: Cyberstorm and A4000 problem
Post by: amiga92570 on December 13, 2007, 01:24:50 AM
Quote

doctorq wrote:
Quote

At times it may boot and crash, most times it will not boot. I have used 100's of Cyberstorms MKI, MKII, MKIII, PPC. depend's on firmware update, and version of 060. 040's seem to be ok.


There is a difference between working stable and booting. The computer will ALWAYS boot ok regardless if the correct libraries has been installed or not. The problem comes when actually loading any software, for instance Setpatch that might crash the computer and put it into a reboot cyclus.

It may crash without correct libraries installed, that is correct, but it will ALWAYS boot even with no libraries installed (since the libraries most times are loaded from disk anyway).


Exactly, Booting means it is in the process of loading OS, too boot means it finishes the booting process. I have never had a cyberstorm (and I have owned plenty and still own 25 different boards) finish the booting process without the proper 060 libs, and most often it will hang with black screen or continue to reboot. Never experienced AmigaZ software failure message. I guess you learn something new every day.
Title: Re: Cyberstorm and A4000 problem
Post by: webmany on December 13, 2007, 01:49:52 AM
I had a typo, I do NOT get the insert disk screen with the HD and floppy removed and the cyberstorm installed.
Title: Re: Cyberstorm and A4000 problem
Post by: A4000_Mad on December 13, 2007, 01:52:54 AM
Yeah I guessed it was a typo mate. What's new?
Title: Re: Cyberstorm and A4000 problem
Post by: webmany on December 13, 2007, 02:59:42 AM
And the winner is...

If I hold th board down in the middle, then everything works.  So how do I fix that?
Title: Re: Cyberstorm and A4000 problem
Post by: rkauer on December 13, 2007, 03:24:04 AM
 Just make as I say before: when inserting the card, held the middle of CPU slot with an eraser rubber.

 That way you force the middle to connect like the outmost parts of the card's connector.
Title: Re: Cyberstorm and A4000 problem
Post by: amiga92570 on December 13, 2007, 03:29:48 AM
Kind of hard to type with one hand while pushing the card with the other though.  :lol:
Title: Re: Cyberstorm and A4000 problem
Post by: alexh on December 13, 2007, 07:35:15 AM
Sounds like the board has warped (deformed) over time, heat, humidity etc. can do that.

The A3k probably warped at the same rate.

Or it's the A4k motherboard which is warped.

How are you going to decide which is which and get it back without risk?? Hmmm..
Title: Re: Cyberstorm and A4000 problem
Post by: webmany on December 16, 2007, 12:07:05 AM
Managed to get it working by folding some paper and placing it under the connector approx  in the middle.  Works great now.

Thanks for all the help.