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Amiga computer related discussion => Amiga Hardware Issues and discussion => Topic started by: Jaruzel on July 03, 2003, 10:26:38 AM
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Guys,
If I was to put a PPC into my A1200D, what improvements would I expect to see?
What software actually uses the PPC, or would most of it still run on the 68k cpu ?
-Jar.
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Well you would get access to some hyperion games and WipeOut and Payback ( smooth and fast ) but beyond that it really is not worth it.
I wish I could give a diferent answer, but unfortunately for most uses you might as well just get an 060 card and wait for AOS4 or MOS to develop a sufficiently good enough catalogue to make the end user experience worth the migration.
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I have to agree with DaveP : BPPC with BVPPC are way too expensive for what they are bringing. I have both and besides the nice WB in 1024x768 and plus a few hyperion games and some comfort with mp3 playback, I would say keep your money for the next gen whether it is A1 or Peg (expect to see the free release of morphos for BPPC this year still).
Lio
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Well.. I got both an BPPC and a B1260 and I belive it's worth it...
IF you can get it relativly cheap, find that the current and uppcoming PPC software is realy the way to go, calculate in the fact that you can have a GFX card in the machine without Zorro/PCI expansion and valuate that, and are willing to face the chance that OS4 might not make it to the BPPC card.
If you can say that 3 or more of the above statements are fullfilled then by all means buy it, else wait. :-D
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Thanks for your replies.
Whats 'relatively cheap' ? This things seem to be SO rare, that it's definately a sellers market.
When I built my A1200D I thought I could live with AGA graphics until the A1 came along, but now honestly, I'm not sure I can.
-Jar.
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Brand new Blizzard hardware is expensive. A simple BVision graphic card for the BlizzPPC costs almost the same amount as the promised PegII+G3 mobo. A 060 Blizzard PPC to that is more expensive than the most expensive AmigaONE available. (One may correct me on these numbers, I refer to the prices when I bought them, but back then there was no Peg/AONE available)
As to is it worth it? If you want to keep your original Amiga, and not interested in either AmigaONE, Pegasos or X86 solutions, it definitely worths the enermous price.
Compared to a stock Amiga, or even to an accelerated one lacking a GFX card the BVPPC060 combo is breathtakingly fast, you can play PPC games, use PPC emulators of many games console, utilize PPC in rendering with Tornado 3D, and some ppc modules exist even for ImageFX, you can listen to MP3s with minimal CPU time, watch movies, even smaller divx anims with acceptable playback speed.
The BVPPC060 combo is the ultimate for the A1200. :-) It makes your system fly compared to an AGA system, and for most CPU intensive tasks there is a PPC alternative, which will leave you with an almost free 060 CPU to do what you like :-)
If you can, try it out somewhere, then you will see the difference yourself :-)
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I just bought a Blizzard PPC (+ lots of other Amiga-stuff) with 060, and WOW, everything runs sooo fast compared to the 040 I was used to.
It's quite expensive to upgrade your A1200D into a IMO "usable" setup, so I don't know if it's worth it, when the OS4/AmigaOne or MorphOS/Pegasos combo just around the corner.
But if you really feel that you need a fast Amiga machine now, try to find some cheap second hand stuff for your machine.
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Well, the one I have in mind is:
http://www.23web.de/amiga_ppc/ (http://www.23web.de/amiga_ppc/)
He wants 400 Euros for it (£277 in old-style UK money).
I'm not poor, but i'm not silly-rich either. I do however prefer to get value-for-money for things. So is the above a fair price or not ?
-Jar.
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No. Spend the money on a Mediator and Voodoo and an 060 card.
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On the privat market here in Sweden a BlizzardPPC 040 goes for around 125$ and add about 40$ for the SCSI model (price is virtually the same whether the PPC is then a 175 or a 210Mhz version). The 060 model is alot more expencive but if you know a person who's good with a solderiron you could add the 060 yourself later for about 110$ + work. :-D
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A BPPC have never been sold with a 040/40 so there have obviously been some work done to the card. The BPPC there seem to have SCSI and together with the BVision, CGFX4 and two 64Mb simms it's not that bad a deal actually but be aware of the fact that this card will most likely not like to sit in a A1200 desctop even if you add feets under it but most likely needs a tower due to the heat of the 040 and BVision.
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Hi there Jaruzel :)
I bougth a blizzard card 060 50mhz + 240 mhz ppc and bvision in 1999, and i am very happy with this "upgrade-combo" - this way i managed to stay amiga-only (i don't own a pc yet) :)
Still, i think you should save your money and buy an amgiaONE instead - i doubt i will use my current computer very much once i get one of the new ppc-amigas in the house :)
all the best
fusko^scenic
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If you have the money, go for it but if you want a long life I sugest you really do something about the cooling because allthough the BlizzardPPC has been built for trapdoor design, it is not suited for it.
You have to direct a fan on the processors of the BlizzardPPC and also on the chip of the BVisionPPC.
This will grant you a long life and there is a French company also doing BlizzardPPC repairs these days so you can get it repaired when it dies.
If you are not going to play games then a Mediator with a 060 card is also a good way to go.
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i love my ppc setup (a1260/66/240mzh)
but then again i only started to love it like 2-3 years ago , before that there wasnt enough ppc soft on amiga really....
if u get a 060 + ppc then u really dont need to think of what if... but then again if u get a 040 and ppc then u might think its too slow and not useable for everything...
cheers
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Expect to pay around a 170 pound from ebay that is what a blizzard ppc 160mhz ppc with a 25mhz 040 with blizzard vision graphics card went for.Even an 060 fetches more than a 130 pound on ebay .most of the time mine uses the 040 only some software uses the ppc .1024x768 workbench with 16 bit resolution is nice and faster than aga graphics and art programs are great on this i would sell mine if i thought an a1 could run my old ppc software but from what i have heard it wont.it is worth it if you can find one try amibench much cheaper i doubt one would be that cheap though .i got acyberstorm 060 +scusi controller and 82 meg of memory for 70 pound including postage for an a4000 .Same thing on ebay went fo 155 pound. :-) :-D
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I kind of/sort of agree with most of the statements here...but I will point out, that while AGA is too slow to be acceptable...that when you get the mediator installed with the graphics card, don't forget it will allow you a high res workbench, but you may discover the overall system is still slow.
It's still goes tick tick tick as it hits the hard drive and you watch the icons draw....and windows move around herky jerky, not like paper sliding under glass...which is what you expect of any modern pc.
It's true that a speed clocked 060, fastATA upgrade, faster hard drive, mediator/voodoo3 kind of/sort of gets you an amiga that thanks to some efficiencies in the os and assembler programming everywhere, is sort of acceptable usable on some taks.....its way expensive, and you may just sit there and go 'ITS STILL SLOW'
if you are willing to go with the 68k only route, then buy a cheapo PC and Amiga Forever, you will have the fastest amiga around.
It's not quite as satisfying as the Mediator 060 setup...but in many ways its better and less costly, and faster and more reliable.
I'm just going to get a pegasos, if I ever get off my duff and do it...(soon)
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I have to ask you Marktime, in your avatar, is the little boy feeding the bear with a dove or something?
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THANK YOU FOR NOTICING....I kept waiting for someone to ask.
Yes, I call it
'Little Boy throws a Dove into the mouth of a bear'
And...originally it looked nice, but then when we lost all our avatars a while back, I did it again, uploaded it again, and somehow I got some monster compression (too much), got some kind of barely 1k thingy that looks bad.
I should change it, but it's too much effort for an avatar. the full size picture looks quite nice, although when you see the whole picture, it almost gives you the impression the boy is just chasing after the dove with the bear just kind of just surveying the whole scene.
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I kind of/sort of agree with most of the statements here...but I will point out, that while AGA is too slow to be acceptable...that when you get the mediator installed with the graphics card, don't forget it will allow you a high res workbench, but you may discover the overall system is still slow.
my ppc + blizzard updates fast even icons updating .and i always used 1024x768 80hz. :-) :-D
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400 EUROs! :-o Don't do it! It's tooooo much!
I bought mine BlizzardPPC+/040 240MHz(now 300Mhz)
for mere 140 Euros 18 months ago. That was good
bargain I think.
My advice is:
Save it for A1 or Pegazoz! :-D
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@Jaruzel:
I bought a BlizzardPPC in 1998 and a BVision in 1999. First recommendation: Forget about buying a PPC card only, always get both a BlizzardPPC and a graphics card.
A BVision (or a Mediator+Vodoo) is expensive, but there's a cheap alternative: Eyetech still seem to have their single slot Zorro adaptor (http://www.eyetech.co.uk/search.php?SearchStr=&SearchCat=ALSO) in stock. These were originally intended to be used with their A1200 rack cases: the graphics card practically "lies" on top of the motherboard. Such a setup might even fit into your Sun desktop case. Any cheap second hand Zorro gfx card should work with this adaptor. Of course, such a card won't have 3D accelleration and it will be slower due to the limited Zorro2 bandwidth - but it's still a vast improvement over AGA.
If I was to put a PPC into my A1200D, what improvements would I expect to see?
The overall speed of your system would still be completely dictated by the power of the 68k CPU. Another recommendation: The SCSI host on Phase5 accellerators is the best (fastest) HD controller for the A1200 (the FastATA device from Elbox is pretty fast too, but it doesn't do DMA - i.e. your CPU will have to manage IDE transfers). Try to get a BlizzPPC with onboard SCSI host, it really makes a difference.
What software actually uses the PPC, or would most of it still run on the 68k cpu ?
There are very good datatypes, movie players, and mp3 players/encoders. Many gfx and audio editing tools support the PPC. Not to forget the games (Doom, Heretic, Heretic 2, Hexen, Quake, Quake2, Descent, Descent Freespace, Shogo, WipeOut etc.).
Is it worth it? Well, getting a graphics card is highly recommended: the high resolutions, true color display, the speed...
Getting a BlizzPPC? Buy one if you're interested in AmigaOS4 and convinced that a BPPC version will be released. Or if you regularly use 2-3 applications that need as much horse power as possible and support the PPC. Or if it is your only option to add a gfx card to your A1200.
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I don't know what you pay for the BlizzVision but I've seen two BlizzVision cards here in Sweden go for 45Euros, and one is in my possesion. :-D
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I don't know what you pay for the BlizzVision but I've seen two BlizzVision cards here in Sweden go for 45Euros, and one is in my possesion. :-D
Gawd... I've been hunting around for years trying to find a BVision card even back here in 2003 and I never found one, let alone at 45 Euros... :(
(still haven't found one here in 2010 either !!!) :( :confused: :crazy:
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I've seen 2 or 3 sell on eBay in the last couple of months between $100 and $200. I was not drunk enough to bid on them myself.
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(expect to see the free release of morphos for BPPC this year still).
This is a definate thing or are you just hoping it will be released? 1.4.5 is very old now.
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This is a definate thing or are you just hoping it will be released? 1.4.5 is very old now.
So is this thread :)
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Holy thread resurrection batman!
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I've seen 2 or 3 sell on eBay in the last couple of months between $100 and $200. I was not drunk enough to bid on them myself.
@tone007
Gawd, I'll need to change my ebay settings to worldwide instead of just the UK. if you spot one for sale again could you please let me know as I'm the kind of numpty who will gladly pay silly money to get hold of one (drunk or sober) :)
(PS:from your new avatar, the advice would be, don't drink and walk or you could end up being hit by your own car and landing on the roof (ouch)...:biglaugh:)
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Gawd, I'll need to change my ebay settings to worldwide instead of just the UK
That's the best advice you could give yourself. One was in Germany, and one or two were in Australia. Shipping cost on such an item would be negligible.
..and that roof was quite comfortable.