Amiga.org
Amiga computer related discussion => General chat about Amiga topics => Topic started by: bloodmoney on July 31, 2007, 09:33:35 AM
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Linky
http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/html/localnews/2003813881_kentarena31m.html (http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/html/localnews/2003813881_kentarena31m.html)
:lol: :-o
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Already discussed in another thread (http://www.amiga.org/forums/showthread.php?t=30606), too.
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Oops, so I see.
Oh well, needed its own thread anyway.
:oops:
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(http://www.fotosearch.com/comp/ARP/ARP116/Grovel.jpg)
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Geeeeeeeeeeeeeeeez! I HATE Liars! :madashell:
(http://www.yadamnfool.com/pics/amiga/amigaloses.jpg)
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Very sad indeed. I wish Amiga.Inc would actually do something FOR the Amiga. They really make it hard to believe.
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Construction on the 6,025-seat arena began Monday after the Kent City Council last week gave the final go-ahead to build the venue
Seems to be a pretty small arena. Probably not worth the effort for Amiga Inc. How about the Pond in Anaheim, Ca. Now that has a seating capacity of 17,000. Maybe that will suit them. Plus its but a short walk to Fantasy Land. :lol:
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LOL @ AI and Bill McNugget
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The headline and article is wrong. Here is what it should say, short and sweet.
The Amiga Circus Has Left Town.
The circus, otherwise known as Amiga Inc has left town. Unlike your typical circus there were no lions, no jugglers, trapeze artists etc. The only thing the Amiga Inc circus brought was a single clown, named Bozo McBill.
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LOL, yeah, I told you so. Next item up for discussion. Where are those new Amigas?
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drewz21 wrote:
I wish Amiga.Inc would actually do something FOR the Amiga.
I wish Amiga Inc. actually existed. Purchasing the name of a dead company doesn't make you that company (regardless of what the law says)... just a parasite. I'm glad this deal fell through. Clearly this impostor company has no intention of doing anything for Amiga users and its just some idiots exploiting the name to try and get rich. The only post-Commodore owners of the Amiga who actually continued the business, supported the products, and employed some of the staff was Escom. All the subsequent owners have just been pirates and should burn in hell.
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... and yet you guys wonder why Amiga Inc never really went out of their way to support the Amiga community ...
If I were them, even if everything were "on schedule and rockin", I'd stay as far away from you guys as possible.
Wayne
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thats just it.. it never was "on schedule and rockin'". they get what they had coming to them..people just realized all that the trolling really wasnt trolling about AI, it was the truth.
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As much as this is crap, if whatshisface from Invisible Hand felt that Kent wasn't going to give them rights to party like Broadcom (http://business.guardian.co.uk/story/0,,2129816,00.html), perhaps they decided not to pony up even if someone could've coughed up the funds.
The whole idea was as half-baked as they get, but if the only purpose would be to show off arena-bling to look big to "partners," and the city wanted to keep it realistic, rather than some sort of third-rate Google campus knockoff (maybe they were going to serve Coke, not AmiCola?)... :lol:
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Well it was really silly to invest in an Arena for AI, they need to start acting like a company with valid products first, THEN try to get sponsorship! Not the other way around!
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Yeah AINC should be more concerned with actually producing something rather than trying to pony up monopoly money to name an arena. I mean what good is it to have your name on a building when there isn't anything that company sells. Oh well maybe in the next ten years we'll have a $1000.00 386 25 mhz based machine using ISA slots and a CD-ROM.
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@redrumloa
:lol:
they always had plenty of smoke and mirrors. ;-)
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redfox
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Oh my... these Amiga Inc. people are utter idiots... Even making "reruns" of old Amigas would have sufficed and would certainly have cost less than $2.5 million!
I bet Amiga Inc. would fare better even in the hands of DoomMaster!!! :roflmao:
(even though all that Doomy's Amiga Inc. would produce, would be Mil. Spec. A2000s :-D)
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Wayne wrote:
... and yet you guys wonder why Amiga Inc never really went out of their way to support the Amiga community ...
If I were them, even if everything were "on schedule and rockin", I'd stay as far away from you guys as possible.
You have got to be pulling my leg :-?
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I'm not sure what to think.
If they got, the deal they would have royalties on any advertising in the stadium and much more for a broadcasted match...
But they will have a long time to get their money back.
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redrumloa wrote:
The headline and article is wrong. Here is what it should say, short and sweet.
The Amiga Circus Has Left Town.
The circus, otherwise known as Amiga Inc has left town. Unlike your typical circus there were no lions, no jugglers, trapeze artists etc. The only thing the Amiga Inc circus brought was a single clown, named Bozo McBill.
Come on now, dont be like that.. They have a dog and pony show too, right? :lol:
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Re-read that seattle times article.
Kent needed a sponsor to promise money in order for construciton to be approved. Once construction was approved, the city could vote to continue construction EVEN IF the sponsor backed out. That means that Kent just needed ANY promise to get the construciton going.
It's very likely that Kent knew this would be the outcome all along and witheld the truth a bit to get construction under way. The article even says that the city council knew more about Amiga than was let on and that they voted a week ago to proceed with construction even if Amiga backed out.
Kent used Amiga to force construction of a building that would not have been approved without a backer.
So to ask the most relevant question:
Did Amiga get anything from this deal?
It may sound farfetched, but the only really good organized crime in Washington State is in the construction business. It's not unheard of for this sort of crime to use a city council as a o between.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Colacurcio_crime_family (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Colacurcio_crime_family)
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Terse wrote:
So to ask the most relevant question:
Did Amiga get anything from this deal?
Interesting take Terse. I didn't see it like that, but then again I don't know about these things.
No matter, to me the most relevant question is:
Did AmigaNS get anything from this deal?
Answer is simply: we got nothing but empty dreams, just like in the past from Amiga Inc.
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redrumloa wrote:
You have got to be pulling my leg :-?
Hey, I'm not defending them in any way here. It's really none of my business. I just don't understand why people adopt such a... what's the word... hostile maybe, attitude about all of this, then expect Amiga Inc to be their biggest supporters and buddies.
So, AI messes up again. No real surprise there, but does it really need 5 different threads with everyone adapting a "b*tchbunny" attitude to discuss it? In my viewpoint, I really don't care, but I ponder whether anyone on the planet was actually surprised, or whether everyone is just using this as "yet another excuse to beat the dead horse"?
I'm sure there's more to the story. There's always AI's side we haven't heard, though honestly I'm not sure I'd believe it at this point either.
All I'm saying is it would be nice for a change to have both sides of an issue before rolling out the ancient head chopping machine, unless all this bashing is just a matter of fodder for the entertainment mill, in which case, fire away..
Wayne
edit : strictly guessing and playing devil's advocate here, I would say that Amiga Inc and the city of Kent had an agreement and/or maybe even a contract which specified how much and when was to be paid.
Then, when the initial story broke and Kent officials were slammed with dozens of armchair lawyer types from {bleep}bunny to include our favorite Amiga stalkers and the 10,000 pages of "evidence", they (kent officials) probably got nervous, did a little investigating, and wanted to change the terms of the deal to include more cash up front.
Since that wasn't part of the original deal, Amiga Inc walked. Again, I haven't heard from or talked to anyone, but if I were to guess as to what AI's side of the story might be....
Wayne
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@Wayne
I got to admit, this is a very good point and I commend you for it. Everyone is so trigger happy with AI these days, without even knowing the whole story. But then again you can't be surprised, Amiga users are known for being a strange breed right? LOL
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Wayne wrote:
strictly guessing and playing devil's advocate here, I would say that Amiga Inc and the city of Kent had an agreement and/or maybe even a contract which specified how much and when was to be paid.
Then, when the initial story broke and Kent officials were slammed with dozens of armchair lawyer types from {bleep}bunny to include our favorite Amiga stalkers and the 10,000 pages of "evidence", they (kent officials) probably got nervous, did a little investigating, and wanted to change the terms of the deal to include more cash up front.
Since that wasn't part of the original deal, Amiga Inc walked. Again, I haven't heard from or talked to anyone, but if I were to guess as to what AI's side of the story might be....
Wayne
Way off Wayne unfortunately.
The original letter of intent was for $5 million USD upfront. Then Amiga negotiated down to $2.5 million upfront for the actual deal between all three parties (Kent, the Thunderbirds, and Amiga). Then according to Kent they tried to negotiate it down further, even though an agreement had been completed and even though Kent stuck by keeping the deal open for months despite bad press.
http://tinyurl.com/3d99aq
http://tinyurl.com/2g5zds
Amiga has little reason for excuse that we can see, Kent's only demand after the bad press, to pay early, Amiga resisted. And when Amiga resisted Kent gave in and let them have until the originally agreed groundbreaking date. And Amiga let the date come and go without paying, which voided the deal.
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LOL, could not disagree more Wayne.... What ever agreement they had with the city of Kent is pure ballony as there was never a chance that they would deliver, whether we point out the truth of not. I believe we did the city of Kent a favor by asking them to take a better look at AI. (the true spirit of the amiga community it to help each other)
AI is a disgrace to the Amiga, the sooner we loose them the better for the Amiga community.
Why don't they just change there name? Then they don't have to put up with the community. Fact is they just want to rape the Amiga name without supporting it. Truth is with out the Amiga name there worthlessness is obvious.
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We ourselves should stop using the name Amiga and change it into SAMiga (http://www.sam440.com/eng/) :idea: :lol:
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Hey, I'm not defending them in any way here. It's really none of my business. I just don't understand why people adopt such a... what's the word... hostile maybe, attitude about all of this, then expect Amiga Inc to be their biggest supporters and buddies.
Look back a few years, and you will discover that it was the exact opposite. Amiga INC and McEwen was pretty much treated like some religious icon.
Why are people hostile now? Maybe it has something to do with the broken promises, scamming peoples money, lies, lawsuits, ruining the amiga brand so much that it is now worthless and so on...
If they actually did something good, then i am sure all the negativity would dissapear as well. +
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@guru-666
You're certainly entitled to that opinion, but I wonder why you are so vehemently wanting to shout it from the mountain top? They might have screwed you for $50, but I just can't help feeling that your reaction is rather "over-reaction".
After all, if AI doesn't matter, why get so pissy about it? It isn't as though they came into your house, took a sledge to your Amiga, and raped your dog or anything.
I can't disagree (due to lack of factual basis) that this community would be better off without Amiga Inc. Personally I think the last "shot" we had was with Gateway but even that is purely speculative and ended almost 10 years ago now.
Where I truly believe Amiga Inc is screwing up is in lording over all the people in the community who're at least trying to develop for the classic platform, telling them they can't do whatever because "it isn't licensed".
I think if AI truly has little real interest in the classic community (and it's obvious that they do not), they ought to just leave it the hell alone and let people enjoy their hobby, even if it means letting people develop new stuff for the old platform without worrying about having to pay "30% of the total price" to Amiga for the privilege.
Wayne
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I think if AI truly has little real interest in the classic community (and it's obvious that they do not), they ought to just leave it the hell alone and let people enjoy their hobby, even if it means letting people develop new stuff for the old platform without worrying about having to pay "30% of the total price" to Amiga for the privilege.
Exactly! I think this is the main cause for the hostility we see against Amiga INC today.
Sending lawyers on a community member for posting a video of a amiga using a modified 3.9 kickstart, is just sad..
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Hmm i can perfectly understand why people want to throw mud at AI when you consider how slimey they are. The british public at least love a good session of 'lynch the lying {bleep}s', its probably good for your mental state in some cases. :lol:
I personally am taking great joy in seeing Amiga Inc die on its ass. Its almost like divine retribution, it is a shame that the Amiga brand has been linked with these dodgy fellows.
Continue the Lynching session...
nadoom
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ffastback wrote:
As I said, I was strictly guessing as to what Amiga's side of the story might have been.
The real point of the story is that I don't see any real point in beating the dead horse here.
Wayne
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Wayne wrote:
ffastback wrote:
As I said, I was strictly guessing as to what Amiga's side of the story might have been.
The real point of the story is that I don't see any real point in beating the dead horse here.
Wayne
As webmaster of this site your conjecture can hold some weight with some was my thought there, I just wanted to make sure the straight story, as told by the media in interviews with Bill M. and Kent city officials and thru papers obtained by Rich Woods that your conjecture was way off the mark.
Whether this is a pertinant thread to discuss on this board in general, thats of course your call. :)
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ffastback wrote:
Whether this is a pertinant thread to discuss on this board in general, thats of course your call. :)
I do appreciate the input, though the actions and vendetta of some out there is truly scary.
Honestly, I don't see the point in these discussions on this site, but I'm not here to tell people what to think or how to act. Amiga Inc dug their own hole with the community (with a lot of help from factions in the Amiga community sworn to support other thieves) but I just guess I don't care enough about the situation either way any more to hold any strong opinions either for, or against Amiga Inc.
I'm here to support the Classic platform and as far as I'm concerned, any rights for anyone to presume to be the "parent company" died in 1994/95 with Commodore. What we are forced to accept now (by threat of lawsuit in most cases) is the evil "stepfather" to took the name to coerce us into supporting them instead of worrying about our own platform.
Wayne
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The company may be a b*tch. The community may be a b*tch also. Sometimes one may even wonder what the hell are we still doin' here. Everything is in ruins, even the best efforts have little hope to prevail - add to that the constant lies, the hype, the broken promises and disappointment.
But hey, it's our world. Maybe it's not perfect. But are we in a hurry to get somewhere? Will we lose something, if neither the next, nor those after that will get somewhere, if some of the few alternatives we have will get somewhere on a distant day? (and given the hardships we did achieve amazing things - AROS, MOS, OS4, Classic all alike)
The beauty of the situation is that we can keep on dreaming and hoping without giving up on anything else. Being an Amiga user is not restrictive. Most of us uses more than just an Amiga. Heck, then what? No company can ruin our childish hopes :-)
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Everyone is so trigger happy with AI these days, without even knowing the whole story.
Now that is hilarious! :lol:
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Colin_Camper wrote:
Everyone is so trigger happy with AI these days, without even knowing the whole story.
Now that is hilarious! :lol:
Why is it funny? It's very true. Everyone is lined up to beat the dead horse here, some of you obviously have some pent up aggression. If I were to offer my opinion, even caring that much any more is the sad yet funny part.
Wayne
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How hard can it really be to make a small PPC board with extras?
FFS.
disgrace.
we need about 2ghz and upto 2gb ram and pci-e usb2.0 and sata/ide etc
maybe onboard gpu instead.
I like the idea of MINIMIG but we need more of a 1200 setup with ECS and maybe AGA aswell must be able to connect to 1200 /600 or 500 keyboards etc would be nice to have onboard 32mb ram and 030 40/50mhz on it too.
Regards.
Regards.
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Amiga Inc is not going to get us anywhere reasonable with any kind of hardware. No one is going to listen to them either, since they have fostered so much distrust of anything they say or do.
There are factions in the community that are out for nothing more than supporting pirates of the Amiga legacy and their own sense of purpose and beatring down anyone who disagrees.
In short, everything has helped kill the Amiga. Not just Amiga Inc, although I agree they are a culprit.
What would help at this point? I am not certain if there is an answer.
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Wayne wrote:
Everyone is lined up to beat the dead horse here, some of you obviously have some pent up aggression. If I were to offer my opinion, even caring that much any more is the sad yet funny part.
Quickly looking though the threads.. and most of the posts tbh I can't see anything objectionably and worryingly "holding phone, ready to dial 999" aggressive with the comments.
In my opinion it really is just a bunch of people who have loved and lost a platform taking any excuse to have a good 'ol bi*ch about a company that pretty much killed any last hope of it coming back.
What's so wrong about that? We all need a good bi*chin session now and then; keeps us sane me thinks. Though if it isn't really the kind of discussion that warrants using public forum, then that it entirely up to you as the Webmaster, Wayne.
But if you're not bothered about that then I wouldn't worry about some of our attitudes. You've said it yourself you understand the bitterness.
If you don't mind an observation I'd say you've just got so used to being let down by them Wayne that you don't even get angry anymore. Or it could be that you're just a better man than most of us.
@ nadoom
"The british public at least love a good session of 'lynch the lying {bleep}s', its probably good for your mental state in some cases."
Yes it is quite sad that we're like that isn't it?
It's unfortunate but I guess we just can't help ourselves. Everyone gets those feelings of judgment though even if they don't admit it.
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@wayne
Not shouting from the mountain, just confused why anybody would have any sympathy for anything AI does. And it does sound like you are telling us we should cut AI some slack... why?
no aggression, I'm on vacation in the south of France, just embarrassed by AI....
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(http://koft.net/pix/dh.gif)
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@Koafter
Makes me laugh every time. It shouldn't, but it does.
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Everyone is lined up to beat the dead horse here, some of you obviously have some pent up aggression.
You sound like the guy with the wheelbarrow full of money on his way to buy a loaf of bread in Harare expressing surprise that people are {bleep}ing about Bob Mugabe. :-)
This isn't aggression! This is people enjoying free entertainment and common culture! :-)
Check your stats - before the latest Scamiga Inc shenanigans and then after.
Enjoy! :-D
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Wayne wrote:
Why is it funny? It's very true. Everyone is lined up to beat the dead horse here, some of you obviously have some pent up aggression. If I were to offer my opinion, even caring that much any more is the sad yet funny part.
Wayne
Hello Wayne,
This thread was born out of a fresh news article at the time from a major newspaper outlet. Amiga Inc. has been in the news a lot lately in at least three newspapers. And this time people in the "real world" got screwed on a deal it seems. It may be a familiar repeat in your mind to previous experiences you have seen with Amiga but that dosen't mean talking about this new occurance is beating a dead horse. Nor is it certain that all of us have been so close to Amiga news over the years as you may have been. I wasn't around for the $50 coupon thing or the t-shirts or the birth of MorphOS or the Thendic case if that helps with perspective. Yes I have read about these things but I have to suspect its nothing like living through them when I read posts from other people. So I would not be as quick to judge.
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@Wayne
Why not have then 10-20 questions session with
Bill now ? I suppose he has a lot to say.
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@Manu
He already said it.
On another note, we have had a very strange request about sales that
occurred from 1996 through 2000 regarding Amiga computers. Now I understand based on the documentation that we have here that the machines were purchased primarily from Petro at Amiga International.
What I need to know is how many of you would still have copies of invoices or other documentation that shows you purchasing this hardware and any all possible advertisements or promotional materials that you may have received at this time. We seem to have an issue with regard to the actual facts that machines were purchased during those years, and we are limited in the materials that we have here for those years. If you have any information or documents that meet this criteria then please let me know as soon as possible.
Of course, in hindsight, we can see how weasely and disingenuous these words were, sometime before the court case starts and Scamiga go back to their usual 'silent' mode.
Ie: The are contemptuous of us and ignore us - until we can do something for them.
Forgive us for gloating for we know not what we do! :lol:
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If he's got anything to say, why can't he just come out and bloody well say it?
He had no problems before with his 'executive updates' etc.
Funny how his last 'offer' to do another 20Q's was just before the lawsuits started up.
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Manu wrote:
@Wayne
Why not have then 10-20 questions session with
Bill now ? I suppose he has a lot to say.
What like this one where nothing happened?
http://www.amigaweb.net/index.php?function=view_news&id=612
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Wayne wrote:
(with a lot of help from factions in the Amiga community sworn to support other thieves) but I just guess I don't care enough about the situation either way any more to hold any strong opinions either for, or against Amiga Inc.
That may be so, but please bare in mind that, like yourself, there have been some of us who have been dicked out of a lot of hard work (and money), although by Amiga rather than Genesi.
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I hoped that AInc has to pay for their lies...