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Amiga computer related discussion => Amiga Software Issues and Discussion => Topic started by: Gilloo on May 11, 2007, 01:08:09 PM

Title: Anaiis - Highway USB Stack for old classic Amigas
Post by: Gilloo on May 11, 2007, 01:08:09 PM
ANAIIS, acronym for Another Native Amiga IO Interface Stack, is a quick
and dirty software solution that brings the possibilities of the Universal
Serial Bus (USB) to the basic Amiga 2000, with 68000 at 7.14Mhz, and the
ZorroII card Highway from E3B.
Yes you have read it: 68000, not 68020 or higher, with at minimum Kickstart 1.3
or higher.
On better configuration, it may works, but you should prefer Poseidon.
In this case you must shut down Poseidon and try ANAIIS at you own risk.

ANAIIS, Another acronym with hidden parts:
Native because it was all written in C.
Amiga because this computer worth this kind of program.
Input because it works for mice and keyboards.
Interface because Intuition.
Stack because this kind of program is called like that.

ANAIIS controls:
- hub (not all hubs)
- mice
- keyboard
- printer

A little interface is given to control the stack. You can also control it
via CLI commands:
usbstart, usbreset, usbstop.

You can send files to printer with usbprint command.

You must keep original mice and keyboard, ANAIIS is not yet resident and
doesn't survive at boot time.
A lot of games will certainly not work.

Tested with success with Brilliance, Deluxe Paint, Ced, and perhaps all applications under Intuition.

anaiis.lha (http://aminet.net/package/hard/drivr/anaiis) (AmigaOS 1.3 and higher) [86 ko]

Enjoy USB on old classic Amiga.
Only Amiga makes it possible!
Title: Re: Anaiis - Highway USB Stack for old classic Amigas
Post by: Gilloo on November 20, 2007, 11:43:39 AM
6 months later, same player, shoot again...

ANAIIS version 0.92
http://aminet.net/package/driver/other/anaiis

Corrections concerning:
- hubs (now most hubs will work)
- mouse wheel.
- qualifiers on repeating key, pointer moves with keyboard, reset.
- direct printing using fake parallel printer.

The subway version is in the starting blocks...
Title: Re: Anaiis - Highway USB Stack for old classic Amigas
Post by: Oli_hd on November 20, 2007, 02:08:55 PM
Nice to see you are still working on this.
Those lucky lucky Highway owners!

If only it supported the Tylacine I could have a play but its basic for a reason.
Nice to see basic printer support!
Title: Re: Anaiis - Highway USB Stack for old classic Amigas
Post by: persia on November 20, 2007, 02:23:18 PM
Would this work with Minimig?
Title: Re: Anaiis - Highway USB Stack for old classic Amigas
Post by: leirbag28 on November 20, 2007, 06:28:56 PM
@Gilloo


PLEASE PLEASEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE   do finish the Subway version!  this would mean USB for almost all plain ECS 68000 Amigas!

You would be a SUper Hero!   Wow!  that would mean I could buy a Subway for my A600!  no need for an Apollo 630  woohoo!

Simply amazing!   What would really be cool is if it could be integrated into the ROM with BLizkick or something so that USB mice and keyboards would work from early bootup menu. And perhaps even booting off a USB THumbdrive!


You are the Man of the Hour!
Title: Re: Anaiis - Highway USB Stack for old classic Amigas
Post by: motorollin on November 20, 2007, 06:31:17 PM
Quote
Gilloo wrote:
On better configuration, it may works, but you should prefer Poseidon.

*cough*

--
moto
Title: Re: Anaiis - Highway USB Stack for old classic Amigas
Post by: HenryCase on November 20, 2007, 08:53:45 PM
Quote
persia wrote:
Would this work with Minimig?


I was going to ask the same thing!
Anyone got an idea on how complicated it would be to implement?
Title: Re: Anaiis - Highway USB Stack for old classic Amigas
Post by: Gilloo on November 20, 2007, 09:28:47 PM
@leirbag28
Same dream : to boot My workbench from a key... :lol:
modify some text files, and retreive all my work on a decent PC or Mac... what a dream!!

There will be not enough subway in the world to use with all old fashioned amigas then? huhuhu
Remember that most games doen't work with ANAIIS...
I don't know if it's the same with other usb stacks. (let me know !!!)

@motorollin
Against cough, you should take some syrup, winter is coming, the bears and groundhogs are in point to hibernate, and me... coding for fun.

@all, concerning minimig
I doubt it works without the uhc124 die... :-D
The Minimig conceptor should implement a *true* clockport and then, if you plug a subway, maybe one day...

Tell me if you have ideas on how an usb stack must look on our funny computer (gui, install, ... whatever)

see you, be back soon (next 6 months, for spring I hope :-P)
Title: Re: Anaiis - Highway USB Stack for old classic Amigas
Post by: HenryCase on November 20, 2007, 10:16:06 PM
Quote
Gilloo wrote:
@all, concerning minimig
I doubt it works without the uhc124 die... :-D
The Minimig conceptor should implement a *true* clockport and then, if you plug a subway, maybe one day...


According to this website (found by amiga.org member little), the UHC124 chip can be purchased for around 4.80USD:Click here (http://www.semiconductorstore.com/pages/asp/item.asp?ItemNumber=TDUHC124-0F0C)
Looks promising.  :-D

Great work Gilloo. :-)
Title: Re: Anaiis - Highway USB Stack for old classic Amigas
Post by: alexh on November 21, 2007, 09:08:47 AM
Ah, UHC124, that brings back memories. I cant believe we still make it, let alone sell it ;-) If the Amiga community needed some UHC124 chips I could arrange to get them at cost.

I've said it before, I'll say it again. USB is a f#@£ing stupid idea for MiniMig. The CPU power and RAM required for the USB stack combined with the incompatibility native Amiga USB has with Apps such as games makes it a terrible idea.

You can plug in modern keyboards and mice via MiniMig's PS2 connectors using $1 USB adapters and have 100% compatibility and no CPU/RAM overhead. It is a no brainer as far as I am concerned.
Title: Re: Anaiis - Highway USB Stack for old classic Amigas
Post by: Gilloo on November 21, 2007, 10:20:35 AM
Quote

alexh wrote:
I've said it before, I'll say it again. USB is a f#@£ing stupid idea for MiniMig. The CPU power and RAM required for the USB stack combined with the incompatibility native Amiga USB has with Apps such as games makes it a terrible idea.

Why not ? Games should use lowlevel.library, and not kill system.
If Amiga was designed only for games, it would be dead in 1994, and unknown today. I use it for computing, texts, drawings... not for games.

Quote

alexh wrote:
You can plug in modern keyboards and mice via MiniMig's PS2 connectors using $1 USB adapters and have 100% compatibility and no CPU/RAM overhead. It is a no brainer as far as I am concerned.

And where I plug the printer? in the PS2 connector? :lol:

ANAIIS doesn't use a lot of CPU to manage keyboard and mouse.
Use the original gameport mouse and an usb mouse under deluxepaint and try to draw cirles by hand. You will see the *difference*.
I agree with 100% compatibility but not on the CPU/RAM overhead.
Title: Re: Anaiis - Highway USB Stack for old classic Amigas
Post by: persia on November 21, 2007, 12:00:22 PM
If you can do USB with little or no overhead, as Anaiis promises, you'd be f#@£ing stupid not to.  It's f#@£ing stupid to trade legacy Amiga ports for legacy PC ports if you don't have to, the argument has always been that USB uses too many resources, Anaiis make that argument look f#@£ing stupid.
Title: Re: Anaiis - Highway USB Stack for old classic Amigas
Post by: leirbag28 on November 21, 2007, 12:56:03 PM
@alexh

Quote:
I've said it before, I'll say it again. USB is a f#@£ing stupid idea for MiniMig. The CPU power and RAM required for the USB stack combined with the incompatibility native Amiga USB has with Apps such as games makes it a terrible idea.
-------------------------------------------------------------



 Even if that were the case, I would still say its better to have it..........the power usage issue or whatever can be easily resolved with the inclusion of an AC adaptor port right on the MiniMig so that you can plug it into the wall if you need to use alot of consitent power.

This is standard to have an AC adaptor. Now that would be a tragedy if the MiniMig doesnt have one....it closes alot of doors.
Title: Re: Anaiis - Highway USB Stack for old classic Amigas
Post by: alexh on November 21, 2007, 03:03:37 PM
Quote
Gilloo wrote:
Games should use lowlevel.library, and not kill system.

They don't though. Most games (ADF images) don't even run from workbench, or are even DOS disks. They must be booted separately.

Quote
Gilloo wrote:
If Amiga was designed only for games, it would be dead in 1994, and unknown today. I use it for computing, texts, drawings... not for games.

A 1.5Mbyte A500 (MiniMig spec) was effectively dead _before_ 1994.

Quote
Gilloo wrote:
And where I plug the printer? in the PS2 connector? :lol:

Into your PC/MAC?

Seriously, you are not going to want a 7MHz, 1.5Mbyte MiniMig as your main computer and so you're not going to need to print from it. Have you tried printing on an A500 Amiga recently, not fun.

Quote
persia wrote:
It's f#@£ing stupid to trade legacy Amiga ports for legacy PC ports if you don't have to

Hardly a true legacy port. It's on the latest Intel x38 motherboards! The majority of keyboards and mice will continue to support PS/2 with a passive ($1) adapter for a long time to come (if not forever) as they all use the same ultra cheap USB HID device chips.

Quote
leirbag28 wrote:
the power usage issue or whatever can be easily resolved with the inclusion of an AC adaptor port right on the MiniMig

CPU power, not electrical power :-)

I am not an opponent to the Anaiis USB stack, I congratulate it's author(s) for all their hard work.
Title: Re: Anaiis - Highway USB Stack for old classic Amigas
Post by: Gilloo on December 16, 2007, 11:00:09 PM
Hi all

Zero Point Nine Cube version comes!
Now ALL Amiga are able to use USB, even twenty years old A1000 :-o



Merry Christmas and best wiches for the next year!
Title: Re: Anaiis - Highway USB Stack for old classic Amigas
Post by: Reflex on December 31, 2007, 11:38:41 AM
well why don't make it work with a mediator too?
I mean the great problem about mediator is that only spiderII can work with that board and it's too expensive.
Moreover poseidon isn't avaible anymore and didn't support mediator, anais would be the perfect solution!
Title: Re: Anaiis - Highway USB Stack for old classic Amigas
Post by: rkauer on December 31, 2007, 08:24:03 PM
Quote

Reflex wrote:
well why don't make it work with a mediator too?
I mean the great problem about mediator is that only spiderII can work with that board and it's too expensive.
Moreover poseidon isn't avaible anymore and didn't support mediator, anais would be the perfect solution!


 I think the very same thing: contact Elbox to bring Anaiis to Spyder!
Title: Re: Anaiis - Highway USB Stack for old classic Amigas
Post by: B00tDisk on December 31, 2007, 11:14:15 PM
Quote

rkauer wrote:
 I think the very same thing: contact Elbox to bring Anaiis to Spyder!


Hmm!  Interesting idea.  Giloo, can you code anaiis to erase an RDB?

 :-x
Title: Re: Anaiis - Highway USB Stack for old classic Amigas
Post by: LoadWB on January 01, 2008, 01:01:11 AM
Quote
A 1.5Mbyte A500 (MiniMig spec) was effectively dead _before_ 1994.


Sheesh, the negativity here...

Throw 8MB and SCSI on that MiniMig and you have what I was using exclusively until around 1997.  What I'd like to see is an A500-compatible expansion port on the MiniMig :-)
Title: Re: Anaiis - Highway USB Stack for old classic Amigas
Post by: Gilloo on January 02, 2008, 01:20:35 PM
wow, this thread is not dead!

@Reflex and rkauer
Don't dream, PCI is not a solution for classic Amiga architecture: Zorro still better.

ANAIIS is built in old style Amiga coding, only for uhc124 die, used by Highway and Subway. It's not easy to be generic and keep the minimum of cpu usage. It can't use interrupts as PCI needs to manage usb...
Now you can use Subway on non-accelerated A500, A600, A1000, A1200, and it's better than nothing.

@B00tDisk
 :lol: no way to erase anything, hot unplug and massstorage are not supported (and certainly never)(lack of documentation, time, motivation...)
Title: Re: Anaiis - Highway USB Stack for old classic Amigas
Post by: LoadWB on January 02, 2008, 02:01:22 PM
What kind of support in the USB stack would it take to support an APC UPS (or other) under something like apcupsd?

I'm using apcupsd on Solaris machines using SNMP.  I would love to be able to use an APC UPS via USB on my Amiga.  Would be pretty neat, and I'd even take some time to port apcupsd over to Amiga (would take a while as my time is limited, and this would be a first programming project.)

Yeah, I'm desperate to find something worth-while to get back into programming, and just into programming on the Amiga.
Title: Re: Anaiis - Highway USB Stack for old classic Amigas
Post by: Gilloo on March 27, 2008, 10:21:10 AM
Quote

LoadWB wrote:
What kind of support in the USB stack would it take to support an APC UPS (or other) under something like apcupsd?

I'm using apcupsd on Solaris machines using SNMP.  I would love to be able to use an APC UPS via USB on my Amiga.  Would be pretty neat, and I'd even take some time to port apcupsd over to Amiga (would take a while as my time is limited, and this would be a first programming project.)

Yeah, I'm desperate to find something worth-while to get back into programming, and just into programming on the Amiga.


Sorry to update this old thread, but ANAIIS 0.97 is about to be a "public device", like OS4 usbsys.device (Sirion)
Now it can read/write data endpoints via USBIOReq requests :-D
Title: Re: Anaiis - Highway USB Stack for old classic Amigas
Post by: rwo on March 27, 2008, 11:16:05 AM
Thumbs up dude!!

PS: I was wondering if youre HCD(s) support all transfer types? (Control/Bulk/Interrupt/Isochonous)

RWO
Title: Re: Anaiis - Highway USB Stack for old classic Amigas
Post by: mboehmer_e3b on March 27, 2008, 12:01:43 PM
Quote

 :lol: no way to erase anything, hot unplug and massstorage are not supported (and certainly never)(lack of documentation, time, motivation...)


Hm, just take the old code sniplet from the decyphered spider.device and kill the system boot HD RDB :-)

(But beware, this code is (c) Elbox  :-D )

Michael
Title: Re: Anaiis - Highway USB Stack for old classic Amigas
Post by: Gilloo on April 09, 2008, 11:21:05 AM
Quote

RWO wrote:
Thumbs up dude!!

PS: I was wondering if youre HCD(s) support all transfer types? (Control/Bulk/Interrupt/Isochonous)

RWO


Hi Rene (sorry for the loooong response delay... :-))
Control: yes (setup, data in, out) (setup, data out, in)
Bulk: yes (in) (out)
Interrupt: yes (in)
Isochronous yes! (in) This last transfer can't be done via sirion API, but by registering endpoint in the funny polling loop of ANAIIS.
This endpoint has 2 buffers and one interrupt (classic software interrupt).
Each transaction reserves one time slot each millisecond for isochrononous and the interrupt says at caller when the buffer1 is full (of data), and continue to fill buffer2...
This kind of transfer is not very stable on 68000, and maybe I will not release this part, and there is no public API for that... :-(

Other thing concerning usbsys.device: the SeeClaimed tag is used to see all interfaces or function even these in use. But how to see if an interface is used... :pissed:
 
Title: Re: Anaiis - Highway USB Stack for old classic Amigas
Post by: Gilloo on September 18, 2008, 02:33:47 PM
Hi Folks!

anaiis 0.97 is finally there
http://aminet.net/package/driver/other/anaiis

before installing it, keep 0.96 version... maybe it contains strange bugs (too fast, too slow, too I don't know...)

What's new:
pandora: usbsys.device (or anaiis.device) sirion like interface.
localization: to see texts in french.

Now you're able to code your own usb-coffe-machine driver on a genuine 68000.
Title: Re: Anaiis - Highway USB Stack for old classic Amigas
Post by: Gilloo on December 01, 2008, 10:07:51 AM
ANAIIS 0.97 30-nov-2008
http://aminet.net/package/driver/other/anaiis

Keyboard leds are now working: Capslock, Numlock and ScrollLock (Numlock and ScrollLock leds are just there to be nice) Scrolllock is used to simulate amiga "help" key.

Title: Re: Anaiis - Highway USB Stack for old classic Amigas
Post by: Thomas on December 01, 2008, 10:42:43 AM

Quote
Scrolllock is used to simulate amiga "help" key.


Please don't do this, or make it configurable.

Most KVM switches use Scroll-Lock to switch between computers. And it's really annoying if a help window opens everytime you switch to another computer.

This was already a problem with the AmigaOne and OS4.

Also some keyboards (mostly Logitech) don't have a Scroll-Lock key any more.

Bye,
Thomas
Title: Re: Anaiis - Highway USB Stack for old classic Amigas
Post by: Gilloo on December 01, 2008, 01:52:22 PM
Quote

Thomas wrote:

Quote
Scrolllock is used to simulate amiga "help" key.


Please don't do this, or make it configurable.

Most KVM switches use Scroll-Lock to switch between computers. And it's really annoying if a help window opens everytime you switch to another computer.

This was already a problem with the AmigaOne and OS4.

Also some keyboards (mostly Logitech) don't have a Scroll-Lock key any more.

Bye,
Thomas

Hu, sorry but this is the common key mapping used for the Amiga. Sure, PC keys don't match Amiga keys, but you can use setmap with a modified keymap.
For "help" key, should I use "F12" instead? :idea:
So CapsLock and led are working.
NumLock do nothing but set/unset led.
ScrollLock simulates "Help" and set/unset led.

If someone dislike this, he can disable internal drivers with the adequate option and create a HID driver to do the job as he wants.  :lol:
Title: Re: Anaiis - Highway USB Stack for old classic Amigas
Post by: Gilloo on February 23, 2009, 09:45:27 AM
0.98 version is here.
http://aminet.net/package/driver/other/anaiis

Now hot plug and unplug are working, and notification of these events too.
Title: Re: Anaiis - Highway USB Stack for old classic Amigas
Post by: Reflex on June 02, 2009, 12:20:34 PM
MEDIATOR - MEDIATOR -MEDIATOR

Anaiis seems to be much more complex now, it seems to be OK to use with more recent hardware!

Think again about it!
Title: Re: Anaiis - Highway USB Stack for old classic Amigas
Post by: Gilloo on June 10, 2009, 11:48:37 AM
yes, youth bugs go away little by little... still in progress
Title: Re: Anaiis - Highway USB Stack for old classic Amigas
Post by: rkauer on September 12, 2009, 06:54:19 AM
Now it can be used with only chip RAM on a plain A600 and a Subway+clockport adaptor? WOW!!!

 You, sir, are an Amiga hero!
Title: Re: Anaiis - Highway USB Stack for old classic Amigas
Post by: recidivist on September 12, 2009, 02:25:30 PM
Three cheers for Gilloo!

Hip,hip HOORAY!

Now I have to buy MORE stuff for old Amigas as if Catweasel,Picasso,and Xsurf weren't enough...
Title: Re: Anaiis - Highway USB Stack for old classic Amigas
Post by: Cammy on September 13, 2009, 02:17:30 AM
I love using a USB mouse and numeric keypad on my A600! Having a mouse plugged into the side, where my mouse pad is, was annoying and got in the way of my hand. Now my USB mouse is plugged in behind the A600.

Oh, and playing DOOM on the A1200 with a USB control pad really beats using the keyboard, with those shoulder buttons to strafe and all the fire buttons and Start button supported.

ANAIIS ROCKS!
Title: Re: Anaiis - Highway USB Stack for old classic Amigas
Post by: Gilloo on March 25, 2010, 10:25:24 AM
0.99 version is here.
http://aminet.net/package/driver/other/anaiis

- external .usbhcd can be used (but not full Sirion compabible due to the lack of docs)
- GUI works with wb1.2 and higher (wb1.1 don't crash but is ugly)
- a lot of things in the GUI have been improved (see statistics menu)

still in progress!
Title: Re: Anaiis - Highway USB Stack for old classic Amigas
Post by: Gulliver on March 25, 2010, 10:30:38 AM
Great! It is really good to see Anaiis maturing. Well done!

PS: Someone said it before, but I am just going to repeat his words: What about support for mediator? Could you do it?
Title: Re: Anaiis - Highway USB Stack for old classic Amigas
Post by: cv643d on March 25, 2010, 12:46:23 PM
This should be added in Workbench 3.95 :)

Great work! :)
Title: Re: Anaiis - Highway USB Stack for old classic Amigas
Post by: Gilloo on March 25, 2010, 01:12:14 PM
Quote from: Gulliver;549616
What about support for mediator? Could you do it?

None and no.

ANAIIS has an open door now: a .usbhcd for ANAIIS is a simple device with a BeginIO vector able to manage RESET, READ, WRITE io requests. READ/WRITE io are classic USBIOReqHCD Sirion compatible. If someone is able to make a lowlevel driver for Mediator, Thylacyne or a openuhci, he (she) 's welcome. But not me, no time and no hardware for that.
Title: Re: Anaiis - Highway USB Stack for old classic Amigas
Post by: Gulliver on March 25, 2010, 03:00:13 PM
Thank you for leaving the door opened!
Title: Re: Anaiis - Highway USB Stack for old classic Amigas
Post by: Gilloo on February 09, 2011, 10:37:16 AM
bump !!!
0.99 got massive inside now.
You can use usb sticks (but not all of them)
Enjoy file copy with usb, on vintage Amiga 8D
Title: Re: Anaiis - Highway USB Stack for old classic Amigas
Post by: ognix on February 09, 2011, 01:25:56 PM
Quote from: Gilloo;614339
bump !!!
0.99 got massive inside now.
You can use usb sticks (but not all of them)
Enjoy file copy with usb, on vintage Amiga 8D


Great news, and significant!
Give us more details about.

BY!
Title: Re: Anaiis - Highway USB Stack for old classic Amigas
Post by: magnetic on March 23, 2011, 10:42:57 PM
Anyone have this working on an Amiga 1000?

I have a 512k a1000 with version 1.2 kickstart. My goal is to be able to use a usb stick as a hard drive or something. Not to boot from but maybe to hold samples/ images??

any comments on this?

also where can I get a better kickstart disk? i only have 1.2.. also how do i upgrade  the rom?
Title: Re: Anaiis - Highway USB Stack for old classic Amigas
Post by: TheGoose on March 25, 2011, 05:09:34 PM
Curious, has anyone around here, with a 68000 machine ever try / use one of these?

http://www.vesalia.de/e_a500clockport.htm