Amiga.org
Amiga computer related discussion => General chat about Amiga topics => Topic started by: koaftder on April 30, 2007, 09:57:19 PM
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I sure am. An I'm not picking sides either. I hope Hyperion and Amiga Inc both loose their shirts. The judge will probably be an Atari hold out.
Lets face it, there hasn't been any thing all that interesting in the Amiga community in the past year and all of a sudden Amiga Inc releases specs for some god awful slow as dirt under spec system and launches a lawsuit. I've completely drained my reserve LOLs today. I'll have to goto bed early tonight so I can go back and hit the forums tomorrow for another round chest hurting laughter.
I hope they both go out of business in a giant red and white checker ball of fiery death. AmiDrama at it's best.
In time, the empty offices of Amiga Inc and Hyperion will be used exclusively by the Aros kitty as her personal catbox.
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Yes, Hyperion deserve every single thing what comes to them and i personally thank Bill for pulling the rug from under them.
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the most important question is who kin cares anymore
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LOL,
@glitterbug
so it's that easy... and you know all the facts.... right!
I think Bill is going to save the amiga, this guy an AMAZING businesman and knows computers. This is going to be FANTASIC. Willout Bill the amiga would NEVER have been as pupolar as it is now.
you realize that without hyperion there would have been no amiga OS4, 3.5 or 3.9? And amiga-inc had ZERO to do with OS3.1. So I personly wish amiga-inc would jsut go get lost as they have done nothing for anybody.
You realize that $25000 is chump change when it comes to writing an OS.
I'm a glad there is a law suite, not realy but its got a lot of entertainment value.. in the end no of this matter, the amiga irrelent anyway you slice it.
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Regarding the thread subject, hell yes! For the discovery phase of the court proceedings, if nothing else.
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I'm not. I stopped caring about OS4 long time ago, but I think it's a shame that this happened.
You may not like Amiga Inc. or Hyperion, but what about the poor developers who have put in time and effort to work on the OS they love, just to have it yanked away from them by this dispute? There are a number of good people who put in a lot of work that are totally outside the politics of this.
None of the teams AmigaOS, MorphOS or AROS deserve to be dicked about like this.
It's sad that some people are jumping on this to rekindle the old blue vs. red thing and generally behaving like children. Shows that even after having 4 years to grow up, there are those who are unable to act their age.
I'm sorry for the AmigaOS4 users, shame things had to go this way. I hope something comes up for you guys in the future.
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@guru-666
Hyperion agreed to Amiga Incs terms then went back on them (according to the court doc), no Hyperion fan can turn a blind eye and blindly praise them anymore, they have been exposed and now we will see them (hopefully) crash and burn.
If Amiga Inc wins, we might actually see OS4 released instead of still being held hostage by Hyperion.
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@glittering
You don't know that, if it where that simple they would not be in court. So far you have only heard form amiga inc, that is there case.... that does not make it so.... If there case did not sound *resonable* they would be tossed out of court.
Now lets wait and see what ACTAULY happend.
No matter who is right, I would perfer hyperion to win as they have produced products that I use.
if a-inc wins will only see very $$$ OS4 with sub par hardware bundels that I would NOT EVER buy
(now that it's clear that amigaanywhere won't produce cash (hint fire Mr. Moss!)...they want to extract money from the remains of the amiga community, which they where NEVER part of anyway... scammers!)
if hyperon wins then we will get OS4 for any ppc hardware....
don't jsut jump to concusions, hyperion is the company that is not only making OS4 but also selling it for differnt boears, cool in my book! A0inc jsut want a cut and to mess things up with sub par hardware.
Right now amiga inc does not even have the source code for OS4, as the agreement between a-inc and hyperon has expired before os4 was released....if they do have it, they stole it via some developer.
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Glittering,
Maybe the source was stolen or sold to a company in India.
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No, as usual potentially good news immediately becomes astonishingly bad.
Now if only Dennis would reply with stuff about the MiniMig I could be all happy again.
Andy
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Did Hyperion make 3.5 and 3.9? I have always thought it was Hage and Partners who made them.
As far as I can remember Hyerion made a port of Descent when those OS'es where released.
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good point, I'm not sure!
Eitherway sounds like we can get OS4 form hyperon, it also sounds like they would be willing to jsut sell the OS without the sub par hardware so we can run it on what ever ppc platfor we choose... now that sounds decent..compared to tha amiga-inc plan
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Glittering: Strange as you seem to know so much, but have just joined?
I smell troll.
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AJCopland wrote:
No, as usual potentially good news immediately becomes astonishingly bad.
Now if only Dennis would reply with stuff about the MiniMig I could be all happy again.
Andy
I'll drink to that! :pint: :pint: :pint: :pint:
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hmmm...no.
Last week I was hopeful for some kind of opportunity to try OS4.
I should find a different hobby.
Fester
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@krize
Call me a troll all you want, i do not care because the cancer in the Amiga community (Hyperion) has been exposed as being the w@nkers responsible for holding OS4 hostage and stopping OS4 from being released.
Who would have thought out of all of the riff raff in Amigaland, Hyperion would have turned out to be the baddies in the end.
Just for you Hyperion, the last dancing banana you cowboys will ever get..
(http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/thumb/3/31/Dancing_Banana.gif/120px-Dancing_Banana.gif)
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Im not sad that this happened. God knows they all deserved it.
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I'm not happy, but you have to face facts... this is one of the funniest things I've heard for long time...
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Glittering wrote:
@Glittering, do you not think 562,000 bytes of banana is a little greedy on other people's bandwidth?
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Ok, image resized :-)
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@meega
Uhm dude the trial is not over.... we just don't know the facts. Infact the trial has not even started, so maybe a-inc is fibing.. maybe hyperion realy did screw up and write the whoel shebang for $25000... that would be sad and stupid... but what did we learn form this? We could have as a community come up with $25000 for a brand new OS! Next time I suggest we just commision the OS and foget about amiga-inc and hyperion!
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Glittering wrote:
Ok, image resized :-)
Thanks.
Edit: Many thanks.
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Oh well here we go again.Overpriced slow and low spec hardware seems to be the popular view.Personally looks like I'm going to have lots of time to revive/upgrade my Classic Amigas for months to come.Might even get them all working properly again!LOL.As to the new Amigas I cannot justify their expense even if I can get better spec PC's from charity shops for under a £100.
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guru-666 wrote:
@meega
Uhm dude the trial is not over.... we just don't know the facts. Infact the trial has not even started, so maybe a-inc is fibing.. maybe hyperion realy did screw up and write the whoel shebang for $25000... that would be sad and stupid... but what did we learn form this? We could have as a community come up with $25000 for a brand new OS! Next time I suggest we just commision the OS and foget about amiga-inc and hyperion!
I'm sorry guru-666, why are you addressing this at me, and are you sure that it has been posted in the right thread?
/confused
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@meega
err sorry I belive that was for our new pal glitter.
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Glittering isn't new, just hasn't posted much.
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Why hate the people who actually did something? What has A-Inc done for the amiga in the last 10 years? Hyperion actually sat down and used some imagination and creativity to CREATE something. A-inc seems to be in business lately just to sit on their hands.
I don't own an AmigaOne or use AmigaOS 4 but I certainly appreciate the effort the Friedens put into OS 4.
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avanham wrote:
I don't own an AmigaOne or use AmigaOS 4 but I certainly appreciate the effort the Friedens put into OS 4.
I'm not actually sure what it is you appreciate... the Friedens didn't work on OS4 for you... they did it to make money... that's what Amiga Inc. want to do too. I have no problem with a company that wants to make money, but don't confuse what they are doing with altruism... you would have to look to an open source project for that.
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bloodline wrote:
I'm not actually sure what it is you appreciate... the Friedens didn't work on OS4 for you... they did it to make money...
Do you honestly believe that they made an OS from SCRATCH which has no hardware to run on for MONEY ?
that's not the easiest way to bang the bucks in my book !
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countzero wrote:
bloodline wrote:
I'm not actually sure what it is you appreciate... the Friedens didn't work on OS4 for you... they did it to make money...
Do you honestly believe that they made an OS from SCRATCH which has no hardware to run on for MONEY ?
that's not the easiest way to bang the bucks in my book !
Ok then, why don't they give it away?
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IMHO this lawsuit should have been initiated years ago.. It's been about 4 years since AmigaInc did pay Hyperion for OS4, and since then they have been waiting for Hyperion to deliver. I am not saying that AmigaInc has been innocent during these years, they have definitely done their best of confusing things up and driving people away.. But this OS4 issue is between those companies and Hyperion ain't been keeping their end of bargain.
Let's face it. Hyperion did jump into this OS4 making quite willingly. They accepted their payment and announced their own timetable. If they can't make OS in the time *they* agreed, it's their fault. And if they have agreed to give it to AmigaInc on measily 25K usd then it's their agreement and they should honor it. And yes, it's Hyperion's fault if they can't keep their subcontractors on shedule and operate according their agreement with AmigaInc.
So.. as it seems to be that Hyperion ain't able(or willing) to do their part voluntarely (and paid) it's quite obvious this kind of action was eventually needed. I don't feel mush sympathy on either side, they have made their own beds and chosen their business partners so they are definitely reaping what they sow.
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Exactly. Hyperion has made their bed and no one forced them to act unprofessional and no one certainly wanted them to hold OS4 hostage, Amiga Inc have their faults but in this case Hyperion is 100% to blame and it amazes me, that they still have loyal fans to defend and make silly excuses for them.
So the world may know.
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@glittering
So you work at hyperion and know these facts?
It amazes me that with so little inforamtion you are so sure of your self... alot like those popele that where so sure they would find WMD... interesting... beacsue I don't think you know any mroe than I.
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it's funny to see b.mc even trolling the forums in his spare time ...
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Its so blindly obvious, all you have to do is look at Hyperions dirty track record regarding OS4 to see the bigger picture. I know people view Hyperion as "Amiga crusaders" and "heroes" but when you take off the boing ball glasses it becomes clear than those "heroes" you think so highly of have been taking the piss out off Amiga users for years.
You guys want to see the good in Hyperion, which is fine but being blind to the people that are hurting the platform is just downright stupid and ignorant.
Amiga Inc are {bleep}s without a doubt but the enemy within (Hyperion) are even lower.
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From the documents, it appears that Amiga Inc made a payment and then some to Hyperion. If Hyperion actually cashed that check and took the money and really didn't provide the code as per their agreement, then thats really, really messed up.
From reading the agreement, it looks like Amiga had a lot of room to yank them around.
From what it looks like to me, I see one company thats untrustworthy and greedy ( Amiga Inc ) and another company that bit off more than they could chew and didn't play by the rules they agreed to ( Hyperion ).
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Well i find it kinda entertaining actually. Look at the bright side with the lawsuits at least the Amiga community can finally say that A-Inc has produced something (even if it isn't HW or SW) lol. Besides they have nothing better to do anyways, lord knows they dont know crap about software development nor hardware development so what else is there. Hyperion needs to honor a release date or change thier name to Microsoft :)
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I agree 100%, you saved me a lot of typing JoannaK!!!
IMHO this lawsuit should have been initiated years ago.. It's been about 4 years since AmigaInc did pay Hyperion for OS4, and since then they have been waiting for Hyperion to deliver. I am not saying that AmigaInc has been innocent during these years, they have definitely done their best of confusing things up and driving people away.. But this OS4 issue is between those companies and Hyperion ain't been keeping their end of bargain.
Let's face it. Hyperion did jump into this OS4 making quite willingly. They accepted their payment and announced their own timetable. If they can't make OS in the time *they* agreed, it's their fault. And if they have agreed to give it to AmigaInc on measily 25K usd then it's their agreement and they should honor it. And yes, it's Hyperion's fault if they can't keep their subcontractors on shedule and operate according their agreement with AmigaInc.
So.. as it seems to be that Hyperion ain't able(or willing) to do their part voluntarely (and paid) it's quite obvious this kind of action was eventually needed. I don't feel mush sympathy on either side, they have made their own beds and chosen their business partners so they are definitely reaping what they sow.
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yea... and you want 20 questions with Amiga Incompetent. I'd ignore them and tell them to piss off..
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The Amiga market hasn't been a big money-maker for a long, long time. I seriously doubt the Friedens ever expected to make a lot of money off OS4. Nobody would take the risk developing software for such a weak market for monetary reasons alone. There are a lot greener pastures for good programmers than the amiga.
If A-inc really cared about the amiga, they would have made sure there was hardware to run OS4 on. They have left Hyperion in an unrecoverable position in which they can't sell their work because there is no hardware, and they can't rewrite it for any other platform that does have hardware.
Personally, I think the saviours of the amiga market will turn out to be Dennis' minimig project and the AROS team. Since they are doing it for free and releasing all of the code, they can't be sued or caught up in legal battles.
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Oh, I'm sure AInc will find grounds to sue them too and every single Amiga-user too probably. I almost think it's the dwarf twin brother of SCO.
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avanham wrote:
Why hate the people who actually did something? What has A-Inc done for the amiga in the last 10 years? Hyperion actually sat down and used some imagination and creativity to CREATE something. A-inc seems to be in business lately just to sit on their hands.
Actually Amiga Inc is the one who really did something. Amiga Inc hired a contractor to write an update to an OS. A year after it was supposed to be delivered, they decided that Hyperion was never going to finish it and they paid them the money promised them, plus an additional fee, but still didnt receive what they were promised (source and executables for the OS). Four years after paying for it, Hyperion apparently decided that they owned the OS and signed a distributer for an OS based on AI IP whose modifications were paid for by AI to the amount required by the contract.
-Tig
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The Amiga market hasn't been a big money-maker for a long, long time. I seriously doubt the Friedens ever expected to make a lot of money off OS4.
If so, then it looks like they got their wish.
If A-inc really cared about the amiga, they would have made sure there was hardware to run OS4 on. They have left Hyperion in an unrecoverable position in which they can't sell their work because there is no hardware, and they can't rewrite it for any other platform that does have hardware.
Actually from the court documents presented so far, it looks like Hyperion is more than a little responsible for their current situation.
Personally, I think the saviours of the amiga market will turn out to be Dennis' minimig project and the AROS team. Since they are doing it for free and releasing all of the code, they can't be sued or caught up in legal battles.
Spot on! But, they *can* be sued - anybody can be sued for anything, at least here in the US, though admittedly there aren't any real grounds for a suit against them.
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Tigger wrote:
Four years after paying for it, Hyperion apparently decided that they owned the OS and signed a distributer for an OS based on AI IP whose modifications were paid for by AI to the amount required by the contract.
-Tig
methinks you're too jumpy. Have you seen the original contract of Hyperion ? No ? Don't you think it's a little bit strange that it was not submitted to the court ? Did you know all AInc's claims were based on a 2004 contract which was NOT signed by either parties ? (Arctic software development agreement)
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countzero wrote:
Tigger wrote:
Four years after paying for it, Hyperion apparently decided that they owned the OS and signed a distributer for an OS based on AI IP whose modifications were paid for by AI to the amount required by the contract.
-Tig
methinks you're too jumpy. Have you seen the original contract of Hyperion ? No ? Don't you think it's a little bit strange that it was not submitted to the court ? Did you know all AInc's claims were based on a 2004 contract which was NOT signed by either parties ? (Arctic software development agreement)
I think I have actually read the documents and you have not at this point, so no I dont think I am being jumpy. Have I seen the original contract with Hyperion? Yes, I have and if you'd read Fleecy's deposition, you would have read it too, its Exhibit A. Its identical to the unsigned one thats been floating around btw, but it has Alan, Benji and Barry's (fleecy) signature on it, and initials on every page. Now how about you go read the document and then come back with your questions. In addition, we see that in April 24, 2003 that Ben Hermans and Kouri signed an agreement for $25K for Hyperion to deliver the OS4 code and executables (Thats Exhibit F of the Bill McEwen Deposition). Its 4 years later and they havent delivered the code or executables yet.
-Tig
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Hmmm .... Glittering == Paul Gadd ?
Just food for thought :lol:
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What, Paul gadd, my old nemisis, that I had to kick up such a fuss to get his child molesting avatar changed ( Paul Gadd = gary gliter).
He does seem to have the same unique trolling abilities, and glittering.
Good work Kronos, hadnt thought about thaat idiot in ages, he really was a complete retarded moron
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cv643d wrote:
Did Hyperion make 3.5 and 3.9? I have always thought it was Hage and Partners who made them.
Hyperion has nothing to do with 3.5 or 3.9. The Frieden brothers were only involved with the WarpUP support.
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I do not see why anyone in it's right mind could possibly be on AInc's side ?? Unless you absolutely hate OS4 and want it to vanish from the surface of the earth.
AInc. does not have the plan to develop and sell OS4 once they have got complete hold of it. Bill McEwen stated years before that he doesn't give a sh!t about the amiga community (though he was clever enough to say it in a little more diplomatic way).
Even AInc. can not be stupid enough to think they could sell more then few hundred maybe thousand copies of OS4, so for them OS4 is practically worthless.
Somehow they are up to a new money making scheme and the existance of OS4 as it is is in their way, so they want to have it buried in the deep sea. That's the only reason why they want it back.
Before taking side cosider the following:
OS4 in the hands of AInc. means there will be no OS4 for anyone.
So if you do not care about OS4 be free to cheer for AInc.
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Lemmink wrote:
I do not see why anyone in it's right mind could possibly be on AInc's side ?? Unless you absolutely hate OS4 and want it to vanish from the surface of the earth.
...or you might have had a run in with Ben Hermans and hate him and his company.
It just seems somewhat fitting that A.Inc turned on thier one ally, just as everyone not blinded by Amiga lust imagined they would.
AOS4 is not part of that. :-)
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>Did Hyperion make 3.5 and 3.9? I have always thought it was Hage and Partners who made them.
Yes... and Hage & Partner got the same treatment once finished all the work...
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"but what did we learn form this? We could have as a community come up with $25000 for a brand new OS!"
Well I don't know, $10,000 has not gotten us a workable browser. :idea:
http://www.discreetfx.com/AmiZilla.html
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@countzero
Have you seen the original contract of Hyperion ? No ? Don't you think it's a little bit strange that it was not submitted to the court ?
What's this then (page 12) (http://www.merlancia.us/amiga-hyperion/decmossshow_case_doc.pdf)?
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I haven't read the moss' document when I wrote that message.
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A lot of people seem to be passing comment without having seen any documentation. I think it would be better if people would either:
a> read the documents that are available, if they can access them (links to some documents have been provided)
or
b> wait for those documents to become available in a form that they can access (due to possible hardware/software issues, e.g. browser capabilities, internet access speed, etc.)
or
c> keep quiet, unless they have first hand knowledge or information (and then please provide that information to the rest of us)
Amiga.org might be held responsible or accountable for libellous statements made by individuals, which would obviously be countered by moderators having to edit posts or take other actions, which I am sure that they would rather not have to do.
Please, people, less speculative spume. It is not pleasant to read.
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let's be happy or sad at the results of the lawsuit when it's over instead.
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Kaminari wrote:
cv643d wrote:
Did Hyperion make 3.5 and 3.9? I have always thought it was Hage and Partners who made them.
Hyperion has nothing to do with 3.5 or 3.9. The Frieden brothers were only involved with the WarpUP support.
Nope, try again ..... :-P
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Is anybody happy about the lawsuit?
Yup,the lawyers! :rtfm: :destroy:
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Sing it, Chicago! "Does anybody really know what time it is? ... Does anybody really care?"
I'm hoping:
- someone buys up the AmigaAnywhere platform and intellectual property and uses it to develop/distribute on license a line of games for portable and casual gamers, under the "Amiga" brand (a la Atari). The name will live on, and the only "real" technology Amiga, Inc. has developed will continue in another form.
- everything OS4/New Amiga/Classic Amiga is liquidated to the highest bidder and forgotten about as a personal computer. Put it to use in some embedded application. Put it in toys or ATMs or toasters.
Amiga has been the Terri Schiavo of personal computing sine 1993, nothing more than the source of warm nostalgia at industry {bleep}tail parties! Enough is enough!
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@Glittering
Don't forget, mate, those are only assertions to be 'proven' either way by the court.
we know nothing, anything (unless you have hard evidence) is just hearsay, conjecture, and in your case personal opinion.
Paul Hogan said 'opinions are like farts. only your own smells nice'
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And I, for one, used my classic Amiga for "productivity" applications, and only a very few games - and even those were not the usual varieties.
To whit: Word Processing (excellent typewriter), Spreadsheet, Graphic Editing, fiddling about in AmigaDOS, learning/reading about coding/compiling, and general background music/mod playing.
If the best that is on offer is something to play shoot-em-ups - then I'm not interested.
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What exactly did Hyperion have to do with OS 3.5 and OS 3.9?
They were written by Haage & Partner, as I recall. And they ripped of Amiga IP as well.
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Haranguer wrote:
What exactly did Hyperion have to do with OS 3.5 and OS 3.9?
They were written by Haage & Partner, as I recall. And they ripped of Amiga IP as well.
And welcome to A.org. Nice of you to introduce yourself.
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Haranguer wrote:
What exactly did Hyperion have to do with OS 3.5 and OS 3.9?
They were written by Haage & Partner, as I recall. And they ripped of Amiga IP as well.
good to see your first post was a totally non-trolling post...
on another note, i still have absolutely no idea as to what the lawsuit is about, but tbh, it doesn't really matter...os4 is dead, new amiga specific hardware is dead, lets all rejoice in the existence of uae
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Is anybody happy about the lawsuit?
Does it matter if we are or not?
What can we do about it............... nothing.