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Amiga computer related discussion => Amiga Hardware Issues and discussion => Topic started by: vortexau on May 27, 2003, 06:49:09 PM

Title: 1991 - when an A2000 could be the FASTEST!
Post by: vortexau on May 27, 2003, 06:49:09 PM
(from the June 1991 issue of AMIGA WORLD)

 "If, as Motorola claims, its 25-MHz 68040 processor is faster than Intel's 25-MHz 80486 processor, and if, as GVP claims, its 50-MHz 68030 board for the A2000 runs faster than a 25-MHz 68040, then an Amiga equipped with the 50-MHz 030 is faster not only than the fastest IBM PC or PC clone (which use the 25-MHz 486), but also than the fastest Macintosh (which uses a 42-MHz 68030)! Zowie!"

 . . . . . . . . .

We've lost a lot of, lot of ground! :-(
Title: Re: 1991 - when an A2000 could be the FASTEST!
Post by: Lo on May 27, 2003, 07:04:35 PM
A2K'GVP_030@50 was my computer of choice then!
Much fun to razzle-dazzle PC & MAC geeks.

Boy, that GVP 3001 combo card was EXPENSIVE!
(Around $2000 USD)
Title: Re: 1991 - when an A2000 could be the FASTEST!
Post by: vortexau on May 27, 2003, 07:33:50 PM
I bought the GVP G-Force 030/40/4 Combo, the 40MHz variant, with its 4Mb of ram. That cost me about $1600AUD. The HD mounting bracket was extra.

I later added a second 4Mb when I fitted my (still in use) PicassoII display card.

My present Blizzard 2060 only cost about $1100AUD in 1997.
Title: Re: 1991 - when an A2000 could be the FASTEST!
Post by: PMC on May 27, 2003, 09:25:58 PM
I think I actually have that copy of AF somewhere!

Doesn't the article actually question the need for that much computing power?

When you think that you can buy the same CPU for around £90 today....  Makes you think!
Title: Re: 1991 - when an A2000 could be the FASTEST!
Post by: Minion on May 27, 2003, 10:18:39 PM
Yes but you can buy a CPU 100's of times faster than that for £90 - its called an Athlon XP 2600+
Title: Re: 1991 - when an A2000 could be the FASTEST!
Post by: PMC on May 27, 2003, 07:37:33 PM
You're right there.....  But the Althlon won't fit in my A1200!

 :-D
Title: Re: 1991 - when an A2000 could be the FASTEST!
Post by: pixie on May 28, 2003, 02:43:25 PM
One 040 @ 25Mhz runs way faster then a 030 @ 50Mhz
Title: Re: 1991 - when an A2000 could be the FASTEST!
Post by: Cluke on May 28, 2003, 02:51:17 PM
@pixie:

Just what I was going to say. I upgraded from a blizzard 030/50 to 040/25 and the 040 was definitely faster. Looks like there was a bit of marketing spin going on back then (the 030 is probably faster for 'certain operations')
Title: Re: 1991 - when an A2000 could be the FASTEST!
Post by: elendil on May 28, 2003, 03:14:08 PM
Wow...I remember those times. That¨'s elleven years ago? Incredible how much the pc has evolved since them. Really quite amazing.

A bit sad that we got lapped quite a few times after cbm messed up.

Sincerely,

-Kenneth Straarup.
Title: Re: 1991 - when an A2000 could be the FASTEST!
Post by: bloodline on May 28, 2003, 04:55:37 PM
Quote

elendil wrote:
Wow...I remember those times. That¨'s elleven years ago? Incredible how much the pc has evolved since them. Really quite amazing.

A bit sad that we got lapped quite a few times after cbm messed up.

Sincerely,

-Kenneth Straarup.


Lapped!! lapped? lapped... I think we lost the race... concidering that we don't use the Amiga hardware anymore...  
Title: Re: 1991 - when an A2000 could be the FASTEST!
Post by: Jupp3 on May 28, 2003, 05:09:45 PM
Quote

the 040 was definitely faster. Looks like there was a bit of marketing spin going on back then


Talking about "marketing spins", didn't Macintosh sell Macs with 25MHz 040's as 50MHz ones? Based on that, they run internally at double MHz

Quote

(the 030 is probably faster for 'certain operations')
Reply


50MHz 030 runs A1200's internal IDE definitely faster than 25MHz 040...
Title: Re: 1991 - when an A2000 could be the FASTEST!
Post by: bloodline on May 28, 2003, 05:19:07 PM
Quote
50MHz 030 runs A1200's internal IDE definitely faster than 25MHz 040...


Yes, but the Royal Mail are faster than the A1200's internal IDE :-D
Title: Re: 1991 - when an A2000 could be the FASTEST!
Post by: patrik on May 28, 2003, 05:51:22 PM
Comparing a 030 with a 040 is like comparing a VW Golf with a Porsche. The 040 has a much more advanced architecture and is able to be several times faster than the 030 on a clock per clock comparision basis. Ofcourse if you give the 040 a very bad memory/bus-interface as with the well known A3640-Card, it wont perform anywhere near its full potential. This is a bad simile, but it makes its point: If the 040 is a Porsche it would in the case with the A3640-Card be a Porsche fitted with bike-tires.


/Patrik
Title: Re: 1991 - when an A2000 could be the FASTEST!
Post by: vortexau on May 28, 2003, 08:23:59 PM
I never said that the magazine (AMIGA WORLD) was accurate - I just quoted a box-out in the front section!

In 1991 Unix was shown on A3000s:
At Dallas's Uniforum Show (Jan 22-24), with over 20,000 attendees and almost 400 exhibitors . . . . .
' Several networked Amigas ran Unix with X-Windows and Sun Microsystems' Open Look interface.
 Two Amigas were fitted with the Universaty of Lowell graphics board-- recently dubbed the Commodore A2410 card -- which works with either AmigaDOS or Unix. Because it must go through MMU under Unix, the card is said to run 14 times faster on AmigaDOS, which uses DMA.
 The lower-priced A3000UX model ($4999), with its 1MB of chip memory, 4MB of fast memory, and 100MB hard disk, requires the A2410 card for color. It is intended for educational or home use. The professional model ($6999) comes with 1MB of chip RAM, 8MB of fast RAM, a 200MB hard disk, and an Ethernet networking card. Both also promise strong support. Purchasers will be able to call Commodore Toll-free, reaching a trained technician who will try to work out any problems ... failing that, an engineer will take the case .... if not successful, Commodore will dispatch a technician to make on-site repairs. '

(( ALL that EXPENSIVE SUPPORT? Must be the reason that Unix was dropped?? ))

Amiga Unix Ticking at Tech
' BLACKSBERG, VIRGINIA-
Students wishing to enter Virginia Polytechnic Institute and State University notonly need to be bright, they also need to buy a computer. For many disciplines, an IBM or a Mac is the "in" machine. But for computer-science aces, an Amiga 3000 is required. The school is pioneering not just with Amigas, but also with AT&T's Unix version V.4 an operating system so new it isn't even finished.
 
 Virginia Tech made the startling leap from Macintosh (which had been the computer-science mainstay since 1985) after a rigorous assesment process. A task force contacted 17 computer vendors and pressed them to meet a longlist of specifications. Among other requirements, the system softwae had to run at a minimum speed of one MIPS (Million Instructions Per Second), leave 1MB of RAM available after loading the system software, be expandable to 4MB, and have a bitmap resolution of 640x480. Desirable options included a floating-point coprocessor, expandability to 8MB of RAM, a SCSI port, sound generation, a mouse, and greater than one MIPS performance. The main software requirement was the ability to run a standard version of Unix. Finally, it had to be affordable.

 Many vendors fell short on some of those points. Commodore, however, met or exceeded all criteria, beating out Sun, Digital, NeXT, and Apple. '

(( SO - I wonder if Commodore ACTUALLY did deliver on that back then? ))

 
Title: Re: 1991 - when an A2000 could be the FASTEST!
Post by: jeffimix on May 28, 2003, 09:08:27 PM
Hehehe, all that expensive. I bought my A2000 for lets see, 25USD plus shipping and handling, I have been offered a 1084s monitor for another 1USD plus shipping and handling. Now thats a 2Mb SupraRam board, GVP I/O extender, GVP SCSI controller with who knows how much space on the Harddrive (I think 88MB, its the original hard drive) and a 1084s. Comes to 26 dollars plus shipping and handling (which will add 40 + ??? USD to the total cost, but anyone getting stuff from as far away  as I do would have to pay S+H). Now I'm looking for Cheapest ROM chips/WB disks I can find (3.1 ofc) I'm thinking those will cost 0-50$.
Title: Re: 1991 - when an A2000 could be the FASTEST!
Post by: PMC on May 28, 2003, 10:19:14 PM
Even back then the Amiga was pricey.  I can now see why those A3000UX systems are so rare these days.....

It is a real shame that the Amiga wasn't more of a success, as having a competitive alternative to Intel/AMD/Windows today would be a great thing.  Thinking about it, it's amazing how many people expect you to be MS compatible....

Still, I quite like the idea of being able to plug in standard PCI cards to my trusty old A1200, to take advantage of all the low-cost PC hardware out there.  
Title: Re: 1991 - when an A2000 could be the FASTEST!
Post by: on May 28, 2003, 11:37:50 PM
Some clarifications:

The 030-50 is running at 50 MHz  bus/ 50 MHz core clock.
The 040-25 is running a 25 MHz bus/ 50 MHz core clock speed.
So it's faster, but not several times, you must not compare the 040-025 to the 030-25 but with 030-50.

What kind of GOLF and Porsche are you talking about? The GOLF R32 is for shure not less advanced than the Porsche Boxter. GOLF is even more because it has exhaust gas temperature regulation, 4 Motion and the newly developped double clutch 6 shift automatic gear box. But the Porsche is a sportscar, the GOLF is a general purpose allround car.
And the Cayenne/Touareg are even developped cooperatively by VW and Porsche as are the Corrado, 924, 914 and all the old VWs.
Title: Re: 1991 - when an A2000 could be the FASTEST!
Post by: patrik on May 29, 2003, 10:16:02 AM
I recommend reading the book "Computer Organization & Design - The Hardware/Software Interface" by David A. Patterson and John L. Hennessy.


/Patrik