Amiga.org
Amiga computer related discussion => General chat about Amiga topics => Topic started by: asian1 on March 18, 2005, 06:16:59 AM
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Hi
I am confused by statement from Mr Bolton Peck about Amiga Inc debts to him (old court case). He claimed that Amiga Inc had not pay him.
The court had ordered Amiga Inc to pay Mr Peck's salary.
When KMOS take over Amiga Inc, they should bring fresh money / capital.
Why don't KMOS use the fresh money to pay the Amiga Inc's debt to Mr Peck and Mr Fontenot?
It's a "tiny" sum (US$ 117 thousand) for bona fide / good investors.
When investing in an existing company, the investors should know the assets and the debts of the company. All debts should be settled to get a good fresh start.
If KMOS refused to do this, what will happen to new employees of Amiga Inc?
Do they have to sue KMOS / Amiga Inc to get their salary?
Is it possible that someone else (3rd party) hold the money and did not give it to Mr Peck?
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Okay, what brought this up now?
Yes, the court ordered Amiga, Inc. to pay Mr. Peck's past due wages. They just need sufficient revenue and capital to do so.
KMOS are the owners of Amiga, Inc. Only the investors can bring in fresh money/capital. Transfer of money from one company to another, especially if one owns the other is not quite simple. At least in the US. It's one of the reasons Microsoft is a large monolithic company and will try to avoid being forcefully broken up. US law does not allow companies to shuffle money around to subsidiaries/child companies at will. Each unit/subsidiary/child company has to float or sink on their own. Companies are not allowed to filter money in to a company they own to keep it afloat when it is experiencing losses.
Though assumably the same investors are behind both Amiga, Inc. and KMOS. What their motivations are, beyond profit and recouping their investment, I have not clue.
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>US law does not allow companies to shuffle money around to subsidiaries/child companies at will. Each unit/subsidiary/child company has to float or sink on their own. Companies are not allowed to filter money in to a company they own to keep it afloat when it is experiencing losses
Hi
AFAIK If I am the existing owner / personal investor in the old Amiga Inc, I can create a new holding company XYZ and invest my own money (fresh money) for new shares in Amiga Inc.
Amiga Inc can use this money to pay the debts.
If Garry Hare choose to ignore the Court orders, imagine his reputation:
1. To new / future investors:
What happen if the investor ask for part of the profit and annual report?
Will Mr Garry Hare give the report and the money, if the investor win a lawsuit against Amiga Inc?
2. To suppliers / bank:
What happen if the supplier / bank ask for payment?
Will Mr Garry Hare give the money, if the supplier / bank win a lawsuit against Amiga Inc?
3. To new /future employees / programmers:
What happen if I ask for salary? Will they pay me?
Will Mr Garry Hare pay the salary, if the employee win a lawsuit against Amiga Inc?
Because this matter is related to official court order, sooner or later the investor, supplier, banks, and excellent programmers will find information about this serious problem.
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@asian1
You have posted this on quite a few sites.
Man on a mission?
How do you know this matter was not settled?
Besides it is a matter for the courts not you.
All you seem to be interested is in posting this FUD on as many sites as possible.
kgrach
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Before you post something like this or anything related to red vs. blue or anything financial..ask yourself..
"does anyone really care"
If you say yes to your own question...then try..
10 Print "Does anyone REALLY care???"
20 GOTO 10
EDIT by me..
if it gets out of hand this thread gets deleted.
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Argo wrote:
KMOS are the owners of Amiga, Inc. Only the investors can bring in fresh money/capital. Transfer of money from one company to another, especially if one owns the other is not quite simple. At least in the US. It's one of the reasons Microsoft is a large monolithic company and will try to avoid being forcefully broken up. US law does not allow companies to shuffle money around to subsidiaries/child companies at will. Each unit/subsidiary/child company has to float or sink on their own. Companies are not allowed to filter money in to a company they own to keep it afloat when it is experiencing losses.
Argo, you are pretty confused on this situation. Nothing in US law prevents the transfer of money of a company to its subsidiary, especially when neither are publically traded. Once we get into publically traded entities we potentially could have issues, but this isnt the case here. In addition, this has absolutely nothing to do with Microsoft, in which the case is exactly the opposite of what you are talking about (only 2 of 5 divisions actually make money).
-Tig
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kgrach wrote:
How do you know this matter was not settled?
Besides it is a matter for the courts not you.
First of all we know it has not been settled because Bolten hasnt been paid (Matt hasnt either). Its not a matter for the courts unless you believe every bill is a matter for the courts. The courts decided that Amiga Inc was wrong and owed money to Bolten, Matt and others, now its a bill that is owed by Amiga Inc, and needs to be paid, selling themselves though two companies and then renaming themselves doesnt make the debt go away.
-Tig
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Well, the though is irrelivant now KMOS megerd Amiga, Inc. into itself and was renamed Amiga, Inc. Since Amiga, Inc. was never disolved, nothing has changed. The judgements still stand. What's being done about them, haven't a clue.
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kgrach wrote:
All you seem to be interested is in posting this FUD on as many sites as possible.
No thats not FUD (maybe you should reread the definition of what "FUD" actually stands for), it isn't even trolling.
It is the most important question regarding KMOS-AInc:
Are they gonna be a respectable company, or is it just the old sh## in a new bag ?
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@kronos
For people like you they will not be respectable... ever. So why whondering? You and the others will continue to slandering Amiga Inc whatever they say.
@asin1
Pathetic. Why you don't ask to Amiga themeselves, new emails are on www.amiga.com
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>Pathetic - send e-mail
Hi
I had sent e-mail to Amiga Inc about Linux LiveCD, CeBIT and other matter but no one send any reply.
I do not know if the Mr Peck is spreading FUD or not.
There are several possible scenarios:
1. Mr Bolton Peck had received the payment, but he is a liar and try to deceive Amiga community about the matter. The whole issue is just a defamation attempt.
2. Dr Garry Hare / Amiga Inc had sent the payment, but someone hold it / keep it illegally. Or Dr Garry Hare had sent the payment to the wrong address / account.
3. Dr Garry Hare is not aware of the court order and Amiga Inc debts to its former employees. Perhaps there is a document mixed up at Amiga Inc.
4. Dr Garry Hare try to send the money, but he is unable to contact Mr Bolton Peck and Mr Fontenot.
5. Dr Garry Hare is ignoring the court order.
Dr Garry Hare have opportunities to clear the matter on IRC chat, because I had send the question to MrBot, but apparently MrBot refused to forward my question to Mr Garry Hare.
At the clarification, I hope Dr Garry Hare will answer the important question, but he did not answer it.
I try to post about this question on "Comment" in Amigaworld.net but it was deleted (twice)
This matter is very important because this will affect Amiga Inc and Dr Garry Hare reputation.
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@asian:
As i have asked before, why is this so important for you? Is it YOU that is awaiting to get paid?
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restore2003 wrote:
@asian:
As i have asked before, why is this so important for you?
Because people like to know these things before they start rooting for and advocating a product. Nobody likes to go out crusading for the acceptance of, and advocating for, a product that someone turns around and taps you on the shoulder to tell you the manufacturers of said product murder babies.
Not that anyone around here is murdering babies, but you know what I mean.
If you want to attract advocates, become transparent to the questions.
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restore2003 wrote:
@asian:
As i have asked before, why is this so important for you? Is it YOU that is awaiting to get paid?
Maybe it's important to him for the same reason I don't buy Microsoft products.
Microsoft are convicted criminals with dubious un-ethical business practices, and have done nothing to make things better.
Amiga Inc have been found guilty in a civil court of withholding money which legally belongs to Bolton and Matt. Until they pay up, many people may find them to dodgy a company to invest in(their products) for personal moral/ethical reasons.
Hardly FUD.
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As i have asked before, why is this so important for you? Is it YOU that is awaiting to get paid?
It clearly shows the integrity of Amiga Inc and that is important for everyone who even thinks about buying a product from them. This has been going on for too many years and shafting their former employees like this is a clear signal not to trust Amiga Inc. Rather pathetic actions of Amiga Inc, don't you think? Shouldn't all public preasure should be brought to bear on Amiga Inc to make a amends? Why are you trying to discourage this from happening and thereby protecting the wrong doer?
Dammy
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Way I see it... AmigaInc has shown repeately that they are not trustworthy company. I'm one of the original "3000 developers" for AmigaDE/Anywhere and I have no intention to do anything Amigainc/de related until they have got their act straight.
They need developers, cause they need products to sell. But they won't get developrs until people are able to trust them.
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Is this April Fools or a mistake on Amiga Inc. website or something else?
From Ann.lu (Mr Bolton Peck):
"This registered letter came back undeliverable-it seems the actual residents of that address are an architecture firm called Cross Architecture. A representative from that firm said they had received several pieces of mail for Amiga, Inc. but there is no Amiga office anywhere in that building."
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asian1 wrote:
Is this April Fools or a mistake on Amiga Inc. website or something else?
From Ann.lu (Mr Bolton Peck):
"This registered letter came back undeliverable-it seems the actual residents of that address are an architecture firm called Cross Architecture. A representative from that firm said they had received several pieces of mail for Amiga, Inc. but there is no Amiga office anywhere in that building."
Jesus Christ! If this is true, the sooner Hyperion can break away from these con merchants and take *THEIR* OS with them, the better. Even if they have to change the name of it to HyperionOS or something.
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Mr Mike Bouma at Amigaworld.net mention that the REAL address of Amiga Inc is in San Fransisco, CA.
If this is true, why Amiga Inc mention a fake UNUSABLE address in their website?
What kind of company use fake address on their website?
Why don't they provide e-mail address only?
I am also worried about Dr Garry Hare reputation, first the fake business card fiasco, now the fake address.
What happen if Mr Garry Hare send fake data on annual financial report to Investors and fake data on tax return to IRS?
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Well, the though is irrelivant now KMOS megerd Amiga, Inc. into itself and was renamed Amiga, Inc. Since Amiga, Inc. was never disolved, nothing has changed. The judgements still stand. What's being done about them, haven't a clue.
Aha! But here's the real question... Do we know that Amiga Inc was not (at least legally) dissolved before it's assets were presumed by KMOS?
Wayne
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I am also worried about Dr Garry Hare reputation, first the fake business card fiasco, now the fake address.
wow! you sure seemed VERY worried for "Dr Garry Hare".
that's really kind of you.
I don't think that "business card fiasco" did anything to dirty the good reputation of Garry Hare. He's not the one that lied about it. He made a card to give to friend's and acquantences. this was taken by someone else and PUBLICLY exploited for their own reasons. Those people are the ones who should be ashamed of themselves.
I have no idea what's going on with this "fake" address. I assume you mean the address that is in NY. Get more info before you start creating all sorts of possibilities. And, yes, it would be good to find out exactly what that NY address is for. even if it's juat a UPS or mail drop off.
I have yet to see Garry Hare make a promise he didn't keep or say something unprofessional. He's always acted respectfully. So, i think his reputation is intact. And please note, that this statement has ABSOLUTLY nothing to do with "amiga, Inc" now or in it's former incarnation. this is NOT a blanket approval of the former ot present "amiga, inc". i don't care about amiga inc. I'm ONLY speaking about Garry Hare.
Yes, I would like to see everyone who is owed money get what they need. however, i can guarantee that the people given rubber checks by CERTAIN PERSONS (who shall not be named here) will never see dime one.
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by cecilia on 2005/4/2 12:20:30
He made a card to give to friend's and acquantences.
Why would he make up fake business cards to show to friends and family? Does he have that low self esteem he has to lie to his own family and his friends? Instead of bashing on the message barer, you need to question why Hare would do something like this in the first place. Shoot the messenger doesn't work anymore, buttheads like me will start asking questions about the facts in the message.
Dammy
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Why would he make up fake business cards to show to friends and family
I realize this may seem like an odd thing to do.
see, i spent some years out in Los Angeles - and some time working in what is generally refered to as "The Business" (or Hollywood as you folks might call it)
You may recall Hare work at Disney for a bit.
anyway, you'll have to trust me on this, Business Cards over in that "culture" are considered as common and ubiquitous as, well, cellphones, fax machines, etc.
I'm not kidding when I say that people regularly invent business cards when they want to try out a new company. people regularly have a different set of cards depending on who they are meeting with and who they intend to MAYBE do business with in the future.
Even I had more than one type of business card. (Altho, i never went too crasy with it. sometimes it was only because a friend said, "hey, let me make you a nice card").
I am sure Garry was just trying out this card on his friends just for the hell of it.
No one in LA is fooled by any of this. Business cards are like toilet paper. you get it, you use it, you put it away. You don't waste time thinking about it. it's just a convenient place to store someone's phone number. (or email)
it's YOU fellas that made a huge deal out of something that meant ABSOLUTLY nothing.
I was busy working when this whole business card thing went down. and I found out about it (i'm guessing about a year later) when I read garry's first interview. I couldn't understand what the big fuss was about!
I swear, it looks retarded.
I think you kids need to get out more and learn about the world before you start judging people on things you don't understand.
and i'm not suggesting this thing they have in LA is rational or makes alot of sense - i've ranted about LA for years. I think they are nuts out there. But at least I understand WHY they are nuts! (and i'm not suggesting that garry is Nuts. but i am sure he is savy enough to know how to deal with the nutters out there. it does take some skill. and for that, he deserves a bit of respect!)
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@cecilia
That sounds very reasonable, in a way.
BUT
Why the hell didn't anyone come clean about the card back then? It was claimed that it was fake (photoshopped or whatever), when it clearly was not. Some people were trashed over this badly, while they were 100% correct about it all along. The card was real, it did exist, and it was given out by Garry.
Also, some unnamed official fanzine even had a competition to create fake business card.
Anyway, cecilia, are you speaking for Garry here, or just for yourself?
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Anyway, cecilia, are you speaking for Garry here, or just for yourself?
i'm talking about the way things work in LA. If Garry had come from Saturn, i wouldn't have any idea about the card as I don't know how things work on Saturn.
Also, if you read garry's own words you should be able to discern that the man is savy. and knows about business. I'm simply figuring he's resonable. he knows how business cards are used in LA and uses them that way, period.
as for the "...claimed that it was fake (photoshopped or whatever)..." and the ensuing nonsense, the fact is that Garry has often said he doesn't go online and look at all these sites and I'm sure he was all unaware of the crasyness - which was created by others, not him. that's just very obvious and needs no crystal ball. In other words: he just didn't know what nonsense you (the general "you", not you personally) were up to!
Also, some unnamed official fanzine even had a competition to create fake business card.
SEE? case in point: this is the FIRST i've heard of this!
why? because while all this crap was going on i was working on something important and not paying any attention to this sillyness.
in other words: let's say you suddenly ask me why I didn't DO anything about this competition, and how DARE i just let this go on, etc, etc....
well, because I never knew about! I didn't create it, I knew nothing about it!
See how this scenario can easily seem like a big "f'img" deal when in fact it's totally meaningless in the vastness of the universe!
So how can people hold Garry Hare accountable for the behavior of others? What is he, Omniponent? Come on, he's just a regular guy!
Obviously Mr Hare is living his life and isn't interested in the delusions created by others. why should he be?
and neither am I. the only reason I am here often is because I like some of the people that post here and I enjoy talking to them. (plus, i've had an amiga since 1989, so i have a vested interest, unlike Mr Hare, who has just found out about amigas)
I'm NOT interested in making up stuff. I'm not interested in fights and taking sides and all that crap. boring! I'm just here to have a good time.
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Cecilia, the voice of reason.
Now, can we leave finally let this go ?
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Obviously Mr Hare is living his life and isn't interested in the delusions created by others. why should he be?
Because he handed out these cards?
Being the savvy business man he is, he should be well aware that such insider jokes like this (the LA thing you described), doesn't work well outside of the small circle.
Considering the mess, confusiong and fighting it created, I guess he knows better now.
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seer wrote:
Cecilia, the voice of reason.
Now, can we leave finally let this go ?
:roflmao:
well, i do try!
anyway, hopefully this will help set the record straight or maybe help people see things from Hare's side. which is: a businessman who's basically an outsider and was never involved with any of the nonsense of the past several years.
I'm hoping that as an outsider, Hare will be a stablizing influence on the whole situation so that developers can just get on with their projects. and we can all benefit!
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Wayne wrote:
Aha! But here's the real question... Do we know that Amiga Inc was not (at least legally) dissolved before it's assets were presumed by KMOS?
Wayne
Dunno bout the US, but here (and probraly any other country that wants to have a working economy) this would require some court-paper-work, also known as bancrups or insolvence to make sure no creditors get shafted.
This normally done by auctioning/selling those parts of the company off that are still worth some, just as it happened with C= and later Escom.
@cecilia
I see no reason to trust BBRV, but I also see non to believe Mr Hare either.
The obscure way the IP got transfered, his rather cluless interviews, the t-shirts that were delivered months after he claimed them to be produced and no the obviously faked AInc-address all paint a picture that he is just another member of the "bunch", an honory "Bill" so to speak :-P
Now to that card:
Scenario 1:
GH is choosen as new AInc-CEO by Netventures, he hands out the cards in expectation of what he thinks just as formal details. BBRV somehow finds out about the new CEO and gets his hands on a card. GH/Netventures for some reason decide that the Itec/KMOS-detour needs to be taken.
Scenario 2:
GH hands out these cards just as teaser, BBRV gets trapped and the rest of the red-bunch (fleecy,McBill,HMetal) stay on the sideline putting more fuel into fire instead of clearing things up.
Now somehow scenario 1 sounds more reasonable (which offcourse doesn't mean it's true).
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Being the savvy business man he is, he should be well aware that such insider jokes like this (the LA thing you described), doesn't work well outside of the small circle.
the stupidity of some people here has nothing to do with the real world. trust me!
I doubt anyone could predict what happened.
savvy doesn't mean he can guess what everyone's psychotic reaction is going to be to every little thing he does.
that's just nuts. and i know nuts! :lol:
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I see no reason to trust BBRV, but I also see non to believe Mr Hare either.
i may have more reasons to distrust BBRV, but i never said I "trust" Garry Hare. I just have no emotion about it. He's not selling me anything. So I don't need "trust".
He's not offering me a job, so I don't need to concern myself with his trustworthyness. Although, His behavior in public shows respect and a healthy sense of humor and if he's like that in a business setting, he's probably great to work with. But that's just my guess. It doesn't affect me personally, so i really don't care.
the t-shirts that were delivered months after he claimed them to be produced
I listened to the audio files from his speeches at amigawest and what I heard was this: he was asked about t-shirts. His reaction indicated that this was a new topic to him. He tried to be witty and say they were 'at the printers'. the next sentences indicate that he's thinking on his feet and quickly says he'll work on getting that problem fixed.
I listened carefully and several times to get a sense of what he was saying and what he meant. i don't think I'm wrong here.
I remember that sometime last summer there was a news item here that informed people that they should go to the official site and update their address and other club info. Now, I've never joined that club, never paid to get a t-shirt, i'm not involved with any of that stuff, but even I realized that this news item meant that someone was collecting info to maybe mail SOMETHING out. like maybe a t-shirt. several months pass. presumeably to collect and double check the info and figure out how many shirts have to be printed. at the beginning of this year, people start getting a package.
I see that and it looks to me that Hare made a promise and kept it! good on him!
obviously faked AInc-address
i can't say it's obvious. the facts are not in yet. as i mentioned over at amigaworld, since i am in New York I will happily go into manhatten when i get the chance and take a look.
Making assumtions before facts are in just creates a mess. at least let me get over there first!
his rather cluless interviews
so he's not an amiga user. why does that make him "clueless". as i said before, maybe him being an outsider might be good. it may mean he's objective and interested in running a successful business.
your "Scenarios" for the card are more conspiracy theories. without more info on everything that actually happened i am just uninterested in imagining any possible story. it's just boring.
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Why the hell didn't anyone come clean about the card back then? It was claimed that it was fake (photoshopped or whatever), when it clearly was not. Some people were trashed over this badly, while they were 100% correct about it all along. The card was real, it did exist, and it was given out by Garry.
One of the points made in the interview is not entirely accurate. It's thus quite clear to me the whats said in the interview was a cover story, not false as such, but not entirely true either.
He either was, or was about to become the CEO of Amiga inc. at the time. There was evidently a change of plans at some point and he became CEO through a longer, more convoluted route.
IIRC the statute of limitations is 3 years, if so that'll hit sometime this year and then we'll find out what the corporate manoeuvrings were really all about.
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@cecilia
I was refering to this:
I don't think that "business card fiasco" did anything to dirty the good reputation of Garry Hare. He's not the one that lied about it. He made a card to give to friend's and acquantences.
Where it seems that you believe that GH was completly honest and upfront on the issue. My scenario 2 is just finishing that line of thought.
Scenario 1 is just an alternative that does with fit with all "hard facts" we know about AND makes much more sense than No. 2.
Bout the address:
AInc did put up a address and now they can't be reached by it, even worse the company actually at that address claims to to have never heard of them and that they have allready received several letters this way.
Now that is what I call obvious, and any other explanation would be no less than bizzare. But I must admit that "bizzare" is just righ on spot far to often in anything Amiga.
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by cecilia on 2005/4/2 14:20:06
I'm not kidding when I say that people regularly invent business cards when they want to try out a new company. people regularly have a different set of cards depending on who they are meeting with and who they intend to MAYBE do business with in the future.
Even I had more than one type of business card. (Altho, i never went too crasy with it. sometimes it was only because a friend said, "hey, let me make you a nice card").
I am sure Garry was just trying out this card on his friends just for the hell of it.
I could possibly see it with a new company that has not been formally created to see what bites on it. The rest of your possiblities are too weak to even consider anything but sheer deception or fraud. But none of your theories on this covers an existing company that he is working for and not as CEO. That's deception, pure and simple. And where did these cards come to be, at a electronics show or between acouple of drinking budies at their favorite hole-in-the-wall for yucks? It's also possible it was a pod Garry who gave out those business cards, but it's sure as hell not probable.
Dammy
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Come on people, give the card a rest..
All the people involved didn't tell us the whole story
All the people involved aren't going to tell us
All the people involved don't even care (anymore) about it..
Why should we ?
Point is nobody here knows all the details, what Hare was thinking back then, what BBRV was thinking and why nobody told us what really happened. Hare told his version, BBRV theirs.
As for the address, does anybody know it's really Bolton that is posting it ? Did he really sent that letter ? If he is, and if he did, then it's bad business as usual, if not, just another troll.. I'll wait on what Cecilia finds..
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Is it just me, or is the fact that Mike Bouma *knows* the real address of Amiga Inc a bit weird? Why doesn't he just give the address to Bolton Peck, so Bolton can try to get his money?
Maybe he has.
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All the people involved didn't tell us the whole story
All the people involved aren't going to tell us
All the people involved don't even care (anymore) about it..
Why should we ?
Because Microsoft is full of lying swindlers. Long live the good business practices and technical honesty of Amiga Inc. :-)
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Waccoon wrote:
All the people involved didn't tell us the whole story
All the people involved aren't going to tell us
All the people involved don't even care (anymore) about it..
Why should we ?
Because Microsoft is full of lying swindlers. Long live the good business practices and technical honesty of Amiga Inc. :-)
Who said Americans didn't do sarcasm? ;-)
(oh... probably me! :-D)
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Because Microsoft is full of lying swindlers.
Yeah.... and look where that got them..
At least their users got a fully supported OS and no blue and red trolls bickering over things that really don't matter... I doubt any Windows users is giving any thought about the lies spread by MS management tho..
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I doubt any Windows users is giving any thought about the lies spread by MS management tho..
Plenty of EX-users are though. Me for one.
Think about it. MS can afford to lose thousands of customers, Amiga can't afford to lose ten.
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I doubt any Windows users is giving any thought about the lies spread by MS management tho..
They aren't lies, they're features!
Dammy
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@mdma
MS can afford to lose thousands of customers, Amiga can't afford to lose ten.
I know! That's why I'm cloning as fast as I can.
:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:
Plaz
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@asian1
Now I know something is fishy about your story.
Fact one of the Amigaones Ordered and paid for by KMOS was ordered for and delivered to the New York office this year.
That puts paid to what I siad earlier about you.
What new fairy tale do you and kronos have now.
Kgrach
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I think Asian1 raises legit questions. In 2002 my girlfriend ordered AmigaOS 3.9 for me (Xmas gift) from the Amiga.com AmigaMall. I never showed up. Emails to them about the matter went unanswered. As long as Fleecy and Bill are involved with "the Amiga" I'm uneasy.
LA ethics or not, the business card incident looked bad. I think Hare's explanation was plausible, but it still didn't look good. It could be interpreted as a lack of judgement thing.
I think it's cool that Cecelia will check that address for us. BTW we really don't have any proof that anybody at the address said several bits of Amiga mail had gone there. It's an unattributed non-quote.
Anyway I'd like to know more about that article I read that said a German court ruled that Gateway never actually got ownership of the Amiga's OS. And so that would affect everybody on down the line.
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>Fairy tale
Hi
I have NO fairytales.
The Ann.Lu post is from Mr Bolton Peck.
I do not know if the post is a fairytales from Mr Peck or not.
There is a possibility that the fake address is just an April Fools joke from Mr Bolton Peck, but he post it on April 2, 2005.
Where is the proof that Eyetech had sold AmigaOne to KMOS office in NY?
What is the exact address?
Is it possible that KMOS had closed its office in NY, or they use other name or address?
Is it possible that Amiga Inc will occupy the new NY office starting April 4, 2005?
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kgrach wrote:
Fact one of the Amigaones Ordered and paid for by KMOS was ordered for and delivered to the New York office this year.
In the IRC session, didn't Garry Hare say something about how long it took for the AmigaOnes to be delivered after being ordered? I wonder if this address confusion had something to do with that.
I don't think Bolton Peck would lie about another company, "Cross Architecture", being at that address (and suite number), not when it could be easily checked either on-line or by a New Yorker in person. He said that company had gotten Amiga mail before, and they actually checked the rest of the building and found no sign of Amiga, Inc.
It could be that Amiga, Inc. has somebody in that building that is receiving mail for them, maybe in an office of an investor, etc. that doesn't have an Amiga, Inc. name on it. But this doesn't account for the suite number listed on the AI web site apparently being occupied by a company with no connection. The address should be correct on the web site. I hope somebody at AI is paying attention and making the correction, if it's needed. If Amiga, Inc. stands by that address as the correct one, then it really would be great if somebody would verify it in person.
-- gary_c
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@JoannaK
I have no intention to do anything Amigainc/de related until they have got their act straight.
If you want to work on something more concrete, work for AmigaOS4. :-)
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In the IRC session, didn't Garry Hare say something about how long it took for the AmigaOnes to be delivered after being ordered? I wonder if this address confusion had something to do with that.
there you go talking out your {Ashcroft} again.
The reason for the delay in delivery had nothing to do with amiga inc or garry hare. it was all on the other end and I'm not going into details because I don't want to hurt anyone's feelings.
You love to speculate and throw mud at anyone. it's so easy to do when you are sitting in japan and are completely clueless.
I'm willing to go to the manhatten address and actually get facts. and when I come back with pictures i'll post them with the exact time I took them.
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I know the brainless dealer who sold the Amigaone systems to KMOS.
He shipped the systems out sometime in late February. The delay was the result of incompetence on the dealers part not address malfunction.
So if they moved USPS mail forwarding would still be in effect.
Even if they didn't forward the mail because it was registered there would still be a sticker on it from the post office with the NEW address.
Also in New York State you don't send legal letters or notices to the company directly. All legal correspondence gets sent to the New York Department of State . They will deliver the notices for you to the legal representative of the company. Failure to keep a valid contact address and phone number on file with the DOS will result in an automatic judgment against the company.
Sounds like somebody who does not live in the US because they would know that.
Like I said I don't think the person on ANN.LU is who he says's he is.
So I stick with my original post of this thread is FUD
Kgrach
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Sounds like somebody who does not live in the US because they would know that.
If someone from say Arkansas had laws in their state that were different, how would they automatically know NY wasn't the same?
I live in England, I haven't got a clue about half the weird laws they have up in Scotland. Most laws are the same, many aren't.
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cecilia wrote:
there you go talking out your {Ashcroft} again.
I wonder why you always have an insult ready for me, cecilia. I try to be as civil as I can when I post. As I hope you noticed, I phrased my thought as a question, not as some theory I was trying to push at all costs. If there was some other reason for the delay, fine. That answers my question. Really, no need for the rudeness.
You love to speculate and throw mud at anyone.
Not at all. I do speculate, yes, because it's rare that all the information about one thing or another is laid out for us to see in its entirety, and speculation is a way of trying to put the pieces together. Speculation in itself is not a bad thing, as any scientist, investigator or journalist will affirm.
But I don't "love to throw mud at anyone". That's ridiculous, and if you feel this way, then I have to think that maybe you don't read my posts very carefully, or you read them with your opinion about me already set. I say what's on my mind, but I try to make it a point to respond to arguments and ideas, not to insult or belittle people. I guess I got on your bad side by being on the other side in some issues regarding a certain company and some individuals. But I realize your mind is firmly made up about me, so I won't waste your time trying to convince you of how I really am.
I'm willing to go to the manhatten address and actually get facts. and when I come back with pictures i'll post them with the exact time I took them.
That's terrific. As a guy who travels in and around around Tokyo every day, I know it can be a real expedition sometimes to get somewhere in a big city. I appreciate your effort, as I know a lot of others do.
-- gary_c
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The delay was the result of incompetence on the dealers part not address malfunction. So if they moved USPS mail forwarding would still be in effect.
OK, I was just wondering, since Garry Hare didn't say specifically why there was a delay. Of course the forwarding would only work in a situation where Amiga, Inc. had been at that location and then moved, leaving a forwarding address.
Even if they didn't forward the mail because it was registered there would still be a sticker on it from the post office with the NEW address.
Assuming the post address had a new address for them. And if Amiga, Inc. notified the post office of a new address, why wouldn't they update the address on their own web site as well?
Sounds like somebody who does not live in the US because they would know that.
As mentioned, most people in the US would not know that. I'm from Oregon and lived and ran a business in Hawaii for a long time and never had reason to send "legal letters" to anyone in New York, so this is news to me. Bolton Peck is in Washington state, so unless he had some earlier experience doing something similar, I doubt if he'd be aware of it, either.
Like I said I don't think the person on ANN.LU is who he says's he is.
Whether you want to believe it or not, he is in fact who he says he is (post explaining his situation (http://amigaworld.net/modules/newbb/viewtopic.php?mode=viewtopic&topic_id=11472&forum=16&start=40&viewmode=flat&order=0#154118)). But let's wait for Cecilia to see if there's any sign of Amiga, Inc. at that address.
-- gary_c
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@kgrach
I don't live in New York, but I thought the Attorney General could only be served process for certain types of businesses--foreign entities doing business in New York, limited liability corporations (like your own), etc. The other types are supposed to have a process address on file.
Oh. And a totally off-topic plug for Kurt's business. I just installed my RAKA1200. Awesome litte piece of hardware. But I think I would have added a horizontally mounted header for the connector instead of soldering the cable directly to the board; otherwise, it totally kicks ass. :-)
Trev
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by kgrach on 2005/4/3 18:58:08
Sounds like somebody who does not live in the US because they would know that.
Thanks for demonstrating why most folks do not like NYers, sheer arrogance and elitist attitudes. Just because NY does something rather oddball does not mean the rest of the great unwashed states follow in NY's foot steps and keep up on NY's odd ball rules and regulations. Second, I kinda doubt NYDOS would give a rat's ass since this happened and judgement against Amiga Inc happened prior to KMOS purchasing Amiga Inc and at the time Amiga Inc was not a NY corp.
Dammy
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I seems that KMOS bought amiga inc busines, not a company.
So because KMOS have changed it name to amiga, it seems that "old amiga inc" doesnt exist anymore?
This is how I've undestand situation, because GH said about party pack and t-shirts that they don't have leagal reasons to do anything to those things, but they have moral reason to fullfill "old amiga inc" promises
simly I have two point here
1 buy a company, buyer get whole thing depts, products,, etc
2 buy a busines, buyer get busines products etc but not depts, personels, etc
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kgrach wrote:
So I stick with my original post of this thread is FUD
I think it's Exciting to discover all these new and unique definitions of "FUD", and the Amigoid community seems to be particularly creative.
You're still beaten by a post I saw on ANN the other day, when someone called a potentially positive announcement from one company about that company's own products "FUD". :)
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Well, here you go (from New York Department of State, updated weekly):
Selected Entity Name: KMOS, INC.
Current Entity Name: KMOS, INC.
Initial DOS Filing Date: OCTOBER 10, 2003
County: NEW YORK
Jurisdiction: DELAWARE
Entity Type: FOREIGN BUSINESS CORPORATION
Current Entity Status: ACTIVE
DOS Process (Address to which DOS will mail process if accepted on behalf of the entity)
KMOS, INC.
17 DEER TRACK LANE
GOLDENS BRIDGE, NEW YORK 10526
Registered Agent
JONATHAN WARNER
WARNER & SCHEURMAN
6 WEST 18TH ST. 10TH FLR.
NEW YORK, NEW YORK 10011
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Hi guys,
I've sat here pretty much for two weeks watching this, and I must say that it's turned out much more adult than I expected. I'd like to bring up one point, in that it's all moot.
Amiga/KMOS/whatever they are this week, obviously do not feel the need to operate in any fashion with regards to us, the Amiga community. We are not their market, nor their demographic. Nothing we say, nor any conspiracy theories we add will make any difference whatsoever and nothing we do will change their minds. They obviously do not feel they owe any of the employees they screwed a dime. I know all about how that works, so trust me. Neither Matt nor Bolton are ever going to see a dime, just like I won't see any of the $10,000+ that is legally owed to me.
Amiga Inc, just like Genesi, has proven themselves to be masters of the shell game, whether that involves hiding their money or their address is irrelevant. What makes me wonder is why anyone feels either of these two companies is relevant any more?
If you want an Amiga, you're stuck with the Eyetech/Hyperion solution. Amiga Inc is not involved. The fact that they were incorporated in New York as a "Foreign company" makes me wonder if that's not just another way of confirming that they're not in control anyway.
IMNSHO, the AA (DE) idea is now stillborn and the PPC platform is a dead-end. Make your choice. I'll be over at whyzzat.com if you need me, having fun talking politics without all the Amiga drama interfering.
Wayne
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I think I'd just like to see m68k Amiga OS opened up, if not in source (and not GNU, if it did happen), then at least with publicly available hardware and software information (or what's left of it, anyway). It's where all the fun is, in my opnion.
But Wayne has a point. KMOS/Amiga will most likely maintain their relationship with Hyperion and Eyetech for as long as it's legally necessary. After that, they'll go on trying to compete with Java and .NET, and yes, they'll probably fail.
And Wayne, dude, way to plug that forum. ;-)
Trev
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boing wrote:
I think it's cool that Cecelia will check that address for us.
you're welcome.
Pic for outside (http://www.amiga.org/gallery/index.php?n=964) is there and the info on the third floor (http://www.amiga.org/gallery/index.php?n=965) showing what or who is in Room 301.
I wrote down under each picture what happened. I think I just left out that when I used the name "John Gizymala" (which I believe is the name connected for the web site, not sure here), it was recognized. However, the other woman who was also making a delivery had a whole stack of names. And I can't ssay I recognized any of them. (and I didn't memorize them because my name is NOT James Bond).:-P
Anyway, all you sluths can now look up "Bandwidth Technology" to see if and how they are related to Amiga Inc/ formerly KMOS.
Just so you have an idea of the layout, room 301 seems to have 2 doors. One door has the number on it, the other door (at a 90 degree angle) has nothing but a mail slot. No info on either doors except the number.
Trev wrote:
And Wayne, dude, way to plug that forum. ;-)
:roflmao:
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So they use a standard Madison Avenue Remailer. A lot of companies do this. If they are a startup or have offices in rundown parts of town. Sometimes they run business out of their homes. Other times they just want the prestige having a Madison Avenue office gives them.
I dealt once with a very reputable venture capitalist, he was a certified millionare and used a remailer like this. As he explained it he had a couple houses and by using a remailer he would have his mail and packages forwarded to where he was. This allowed him to have one address yet be flaky about where he was at any given time. Registered letters that have signature verification would need to be signed by the recipient who wouldn't be there at a remailer. Suite 302 is an architecture firm. The remailer probably lets them use 301 too since all they really need is the address.
It isn't any big deal. It just means they don't have a huge corporate office (did anyone think they did?).
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Wayne wrote:
Neither Matt nor Bolton are ever going to see a dime, just like I won't see any of the $10,000+ that is legally owed to me.
Wayne
$10,000 for what? :-?
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Darth_X wrote:
Wayne wrote:
Neither Matt nor Bolton are ever going to see a dime, just like I won't see any of the $10,000+ that is legally owed to me.
Wayne
$10,000 for what? :-?
Sorry if this is incorrect...
He had invested some money i think
I think it was about 10k i beleive.
Too bad he will probably never see a dime ):
:-)
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and the PPC platform is a dead-end
Absolutely wrong.
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He had invested some money i think
No that's not it. I suggest we let it rest and if Wayne wants to bring it up he will. It's been discussed to much allready.
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ikir wrote:
and the PPC platform is a dead-end
Absolutely wrong.
Prove it then. I mean REALLY prove it with hard evidence, not just wishful thinking.
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mdma wrote:
ikir wrote:
and the PPC platform is a dead-end
Absolutely wrong.
Prove it then. I mean REALLY prove it with hard evidence, not just wishful thinking.
do you want proves??!!!
xbox2 will be based on powerpc, also new gamecube.PS3 will have cell that is an evolution of powerpc (cell is respalded by IBM,sony and Samsung).More and more servers are ppc based.Apple uses PPC, So the PPC have a bright future
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Thumb UP Cecilia!!! . . . your better than Mata Hari :-)
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Hi guys,
This topic has veered far enough off the path to quantify being locked.
Please feel free to discuss the various threads that have resulted in new topics, but understand that the whole KMOS/Amiga Inc money issue has already been discussed long enough that it's pretty well dead. AI/KMOS is going to do whatever they please and it really has nothing to do with us.
Wayne