Amiga.org
Amiga computer related discussion => Amiga Software Issues and Discussion => Topic started by: Magic-Merl on February 23, 2005, 04:07:51 PM
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It seems to have been a while since we have heard anything about the actual development and progress of OS4.
Is there an official line.
How close to a complete product are Hyperion ?
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Magic-Merl wrote:
It seems to have been a while since we have heard anything about the actual development and progress of OS4.
Is there an official line.
How close to a complete product are Hyperion ?
2 more weeks?
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@bloodline
No no no, the correct answer is '2 more AMIGA weeks' :-D
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sundown wrote:
@bloodline
No no no, the correct answer is '2 more AMIGA weeks' :-D
Actually... "When it's ready" (tm) ;-)
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sundown wrote:
@bloodline
No no no, the correct answer is '2 more AMIGA weeks' :-D
:-)
http://www.goats.com/archive/020128.html
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OK.
Lets try again
Bloodline:
You say two more weeks.
How realistic is this?
Lets avoid the usual bull***t. Does anyone have any facts in order to answer this question. The community is always in doubt and the previous questions justify the reasons why.
Serious responses only..........please.
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AFAIK it's already past alpha and beta release, though due to what looks like a bit of an unorthodox development process (IMHO from what I've heard from official sources), I guess the labels "alpha" and "beta" are a bit arbitrary.
In short, no idea.
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There are parts of it in beta release already. (As has been the case for some time.) On AW.net Rogue mentioned a new prerelease being prepared for hopefully March.
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i can bet anything , that is not going to be this year .
i am the idiot who got an amiga one
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@All
It must be nearly time.
KMOS/Hyperion/Eyetech/AmigaInc would have to be daft not to coincide the release of their latest products with the 20th Anniversary of the Amiga's release coming up in early April(?). It all looks like its coming together in the next couple of months doesn't it? Not the next couple of weeks.....Surely there's another update on the way very soon. These are exciting times.
Ok. Going back to my happy place now. :spy
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@BigBenAussie
Problem is atleast some of these "companies" (one just can't take them
serious) have allready prooven to be daft beyond believe ...
But to answer the qusetion at hand:
OS4 is clearly released in "aplha", so one could say it's getting
further and further away (since it is a date in the past), wether it
is also in "beta" is a question on how you define beta.
Some say "beta" is something that has all mayor features and only a
relative low number of bugs&quirks to be resolved.
Other will happiely use beta for everything that just works somehow on
a basic list of functionality.
OS4 would tend to be more in the 2nd group.
Even "OS4-final" is something that would very much rely on everybodies
definition, and in my opinion a final version of any (Amiga)OS should
atleast have:
- fast 68k-EMU (JIT) or enough native SW not to use ANY 68k AT ALL
(which is offcourse quite unrealistic with the remaining
developer-base).
- 2D/3D support for current GFX-cards
- USB-support, includeing scanners, kbd/mouse/joypad, masstorage etc.
- a printing system that allows the user to get a quality thats o.k.
for the printer used (3.x drivers need not apply)
And a whole lot of other thinks....
Or in other words, not this year.
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Kronos wrote:
Some say "beta" is something that has all mayor features and only a
relative low number of bugs&quirks to be resolved.
That's the most useful definition, IMO. I believe it's the most common too.
"Everything has to be at least implemented according to planned specs. Done. Now let's kick its tyres a bit."
Regarding beta testing of separate modules/parts, I don't think that is the same as beta testing of the whole product/suite that those parts eventually are supposed to be integrated with some day. It looks like exaggerated straining of definitions. For example, I wouldn't say I'm beta testing "Fedora Core 4" just because I'm using GNOME 2.10-beta with a Fedora Core 3 installation, instead of the FC3 default GNOME 2.8. And I wouldn't say I'm beta testing "GNOME 2.10" if I'm using GNOME 2.8 with a module or app that wasn't included with 2.8.
It's just a bunch of numbers anyway, what matters is what's implemented and when it's implemented and available.
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@Magic-Merl
Bloodline:
You say two more weeks.
How realistic is this?
"Two More Weeks"tm is a time-honored Amiga community unit of time that can be roughly translated as "When H*ll Freezes Over". It extends back to about the time of the Escom collapse. It echos the time estimates given by many persons associated with the various Amiga owners (most notably, those from Gateway).
It is not a serious estimate of when OS4 will be final.
You can find out more at Google Groups (http://groups-beta.google.com/groups?q=amiga+two+more+weeks&qt_s=Search+Groups).
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@Kronos:
- fast 68k-EMU (JIT) or enough native SW not to use ANY 68k AT ALL (which is offcourse quite unrealistic with the remaining developer-base).
CHECK. JIT has been undergoing beta-testing for many months now.
- 2D/3D support for current GFX-cards
CHECK. The first batch of 3D drivers are undergoing beta-testing.
- USB-support, includeing scanners, kbd/mouse/joypad, masstorage etc.
CHECK. Keyboard, mouse and massstorage already released to the current userbase. Scanners and printers in the works.
- a printing system that allows the user to get a quality thats o.k. for the printer used (3.x drivers need not apply)
TBA.
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HyperionMP wrote:
CHECK. JIT has been undergoing beta-testing for many months now.
Indeed! And very nice it is too.
- 2D/3D support for current GFX-cards
CHECK. The first batch of 3D drivers are undergoing beta-testing.
Yep. Warp3D Radeon drivers are on my machine and working fine. Its not Nova, but then that wasn't promised for 4.0.
I wouldn't know about the others since the only USB hardware I have is my digital camera (which works fine), and I don't own a printer.
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@Ben
You know that there is a reason why JIT and 3D haven't made it into the public release....
Undergoing betatesting for several months also means that it may take several months till something is actually released.
Rule 1: If something isn't released, it ain't ready.
Rule 2: If something isn't ready, it doesn't exist.
Hard rules, but also fair rules looking back at the past 12 years :-x
And one could offcourse argue what "current GFX-cards" means, IMO that doesn't include a Radeon7000 (it's 2005 not 2002 afterall).
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Kronos, give it a rest. You're talking to people actually contributing to the Amiga community with a product that actually exists and works pretty well from what I've seen, even though it hasn't been released yet.
It's a shame what has happened to Amiga development since ~1993, but having a go at people actively trying to do something to fix that problem isn't going to help anyone.
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@mikeymike
I'm not talking to anybody contributiong anything positive, I'm talking to Ben H. who has probraly done more harm than all Bills combined.
Also don't forget that Hyperion, apart from being productive, has also set up a pattern of announcing early, releasing late (if at all), a pattern that was true in the years before they started OS4, and hasn't changed eversince.
JIT for example is a thing they talked about since late 2001, and the was "allmost done" since late 2002.
Nobody (probraly not they themselvs) know when the last missing 1% will be done, so it's perfectly o.k. to warn people not to look at what things are promised, but at what is actually there.
Claiming that the stuff I listed won't completed within this year is probraly still on the optimistic side of realism, but who wants realism anyway....
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"I'm not talking to anybody contributiong anything positive, I'm talking to Ben H. who has probraly done more harm than all Bills combined."
shameless statement, don't you?
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Kronos, congratulations on completely ignoring what I said:
Kronos, give it a rest.
Please do not see every thread about HP/OS4 as an opportunity for a slate fest.
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lets just say: It's done, when it's done (3drealms joke)
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2 more weeks?
Neiter myself or anyone at Hyperion ever said "two more weeks".
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Bloodline:
You say two more weeks.
How realistic is this?
He's talking our of his backside.
Lets avoid the usual bull***t.
Too late.
Does anyone have any facts in order to answer this question.
There is a date that we're aiming for, internally. We don't make it public because if we do and miss it then there will be the usual "two more week" postings. As soon as we know we will hit that target, we'll announce it.
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@Kronos
I'm not talking to anybody contributiong anything positive
You listed a few points, Ben made a reply. If you can't read, I'd propose you go back to school.
Claiming that the stuff I listed won't completed within this year is probraly still on the optimistic side of realism, but who wants realism anyway....
Speaking of "positive contribution", I can't remember you doing anything of that sort, either, so I propose you take some of your own medicine.
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@mikeymike
Please do not see every thread about HP/OS4 as an opportunity for a slate fest.
Optimist :-)
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If something isn't ready, it doesn't exist.
I've seen petunia working with my own eyes. it exists. even if you don't want to believe it.
the Ususal Suspects coming out to "play" (or annoy) is just boring. can't you children find something better to do?
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All I can say to this is THREE CHEERS for HYPERION for giving us an update. It's nice to see them here contributing..
To all the naysayers: Okay by now it's 2005, you know what pre release alpha and beta means. It means it's NOT RELEASE quality.. Would you rather have them not saying anything? C'mon folks our dear moderator is right about this stuff.
I am very happy and supportive of their progress..
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I'm still a bit baffled over this. An OS is never really "done," and someone's "beta" is another's "final."
As far as I'm concerned, software is "final" when it is in the hands of people who are not officially signed up as testers, regardless of marketing boloney.
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@Kronos
>"I'm not talking to anybody contributiong anything >positive, I'm talking to Ben H. who has probraly done more >harm than all Bills combined."
Coming from you Kronos, I know Ben will consider this to be high praise indeed.
I know he would be very worried the day that he finds out that you actually approve of something Hyperion does.
It could only mean that Hyperion was about to make a massive mistake.
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;-) I prefer to view the situation with guarded optimism. Most can identify with the optimism, while Kronos at least can identify with the "guarded" part.
It's good to hear that Hyperion are on target with their unannounced release date. (Considering that that's better than them announcing that they're behind their unannounced release date....)
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Prerelease update 2 is already perfectly usable, fast, stable. The best amiga system i've ever used.
Every A1 get the prerelease.
I suggest to visit IntuitionBase and AmigaWorld to be updated to the lastest news on A1 and OS4.
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cecilia wrote:
I've seen petunia working with my own eyes. it exists.
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Yes - in *ß-state* for A1s.
I don't have access to the OS4-ß as there is no OS4-ß for A4k & CSPPC.
So for me it just is irrelevant if there is only a ß-version for A1 - from *MY* point of view I could as well simply say it does not exist (yet)...
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Good answer ! I for one am very happy with my OS4Pre, and with the continual progress that is being made ! Many thanks !
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WID ;-).