Amiga.org
Amiga computer related discussion => General chat about Amiga topics => Topic started by: Amigaz on February 11, 2005, 04:40:39 PM
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About 5 weeks ago I ordered a CD32 controller for my recently aquired CD32 console which came with a defective and very beat up controller.
Tested the controller on my CD32 upon arrival but neither up or directinal control workec on the pad so I emailed Vesalia and they replied with that they're going to send me a new one.
I waited about a month without recieving anything so I sent them an email asking if they had sent the controller but after 6-7 days no reply and i've heard of other peoples experience with their poor support service and answering emails etc so I told them I demanded a reply or I would tell about my experience and poor service on the various amiga forums...and would to you know! they answered rather quickly!
They told me the controller was sent (probably the same day the sent the reply to my last email) and telling me that this is the end of our
business relationship.
So they expect their customers to wait weeks for email replys and you have to send threats to get a quick reply.
This proves they can't handle customers which return defective goods...they are treated like 2nd class customers or something like that.
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I must say I have a similar experience. It has already been discussed at the forums. It was about a scandoubler being out of stock. Took ages for a decent reply but in the end I got my goods. All ended well.
I'm not sure if I will do business with them again. I really hate it when people don't reply emails. Especially businesses. However they seem to have a reputation when it comes to emails. But they have kept their word so far (at least in my case). In the end you usually get what you wanted. Give em a chance.
BTW; did you receive that controller yet? I would be surprised if they would let you down.
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unfortunately this is one of they bad habit :-(
Its a pity that a good and reliable Amiga reseller (like Vesalia is), has a so poor "post-sell" customer care service!
Anyway the important is to know that, before purchase something.
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Vesalia is really silent with the e-mails, but I guess this is because of not enough manpower. I mean it was the biggest Amiga reseller, but last I heard that it's currently consisting only of 1 person. But I had about 10 orders during the last 6 years and I always received the goods. So no problem with them.
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and telling me that this is the end of our buisness ...
You were told that by a company? Sheesh!
Thats such bad customer service. I wouldnt bother with those again.
Good on you for putting your foot down on what sounds like a shoddy run company. IMHO, no matter what the state of the company is, or how much / little you spend your entitled to at least an email back explaining the delay. Leaving people in the dark isnt acceptable.
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I've had nothing but possitive dealings with Vesalia. I know their emails can be slow at time, but they do follow through. Perhaps the tone in your message is what turned them off?
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@adolescent:
Off-topic: Do you check your PM messages? I suspect you are pulling a Vesalia on me in regards to the A3000 Floppy Slot cover. :-?
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About a year ago I emailed Vesalia about a CSPPC they had, I just wanted to know if they really had it in stock(this because the rumors that they didn't have it) and I wanted to know if they would ship it to Sweden. No answer in about a month so I emailed them again(the exact same email) still no answer after another month and still today I haven't got any answer. Too bad because I had the money.
Anyway, telling that they won't make any business with you is just stupid to say. They are starting to dig there own grave if they have that attitude in a small community like Amiga.
@X56h34 "Pulling a Vesalia" a new word for situations like this perhaps. :-D
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About a year ago I emailed Vesalia about a CSPPC they had, I just wanted to know if they really had it in stock(this because the rumors that they didn't have it) and I wanted to know if they would ship it to Sweden. No answer in about a month so I emailed them again(the exact same email) still no answer after another month and still today I haven't got any answer. Too bad because I had the money.
eh, eh . . . nice :-)
I've done exactly the same question (4-5 mails) me too (during those long thread about CSPPC sent to DCE).
Never got an answer.
The only difference was the question; i've asked them if they test the card before shipping.
Bye :-)
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As far as buying a PPC card from Vesalia, please check this thread (http://www.amiga.org/forums/showthread.php?t=12355) for more information on the quality of their service. :-(
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I might have been a bit hard in my email but I have a right to have an angry tone when I'm ignored as a customer who just want to know what has happened to my replacement part.
I think Vesalia has no right to be angry in this case since they are treating me like I was made up of air and now I'm just trouble to them.
This company will slowly go down if they treat other people like this.
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@x56h34 I see what you mean. It occurs that when it's small things then they do their job but when it comes to bigger things like CSPPC then they mess it up.
EDIT: @AMIGAZ, GGSData has a CD32 controller. Just a tip. :-)
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Don't worry about the strong language you directed to them. I too have used phrases in the sense of 'I demand....'.
Their english is not so good either. Perhaps with 'ending business' they just ment they would not send you another controller. They might have run out :lol:
Anyway I think it is no excuse for a one man internet shop since an 060 accelerator still costs over 200 euro. This may be cheap for a 060 card but it is still alot of money. If things go wrong you just can't treat customers like they do. It is just too much money for that.
'Pulling a Vesalia' I like it. But still; They solved the problem I had with them with style. They went wong, tried to solve it. But went wong again, but kept on trying and all was sorted in the end. I send them emails which were not responded by another email, but they were (eventually) responded by action. I would think twice however, before I'll go buying something expensive from them again.
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I have had several talks on the phone with Mr. Does after those I guess I can say you have a completely wrong impression of them.
At first you have to know that Vesalia is run only by one man from his home (he has to clear and close his storage as the income won`t make up for the rent anymore) He is an older man so he isn`t that good at the e-mail thingy especially when it is not in german. If you want to know something from them call them, as mails have a rather slim chance of being read in a reasonable timeframe.
He has to see after his mother as she isn`t very well at all, so he sometimes has no time to see after the business.
Regarding the controller: Of course it is annoying to get defective goods, but you have to see that they actually did a negative balance after sending you another controller for the postage alone. You can imagine that you can get ticked off if you already do negative business an the person on the other side is using harsh words. The alternative would be not to ship any order below lets say 100 EUR abrought, you don`t really want that, do you ?
Maybe it helps to see Vesalia more like a complete private person that just happens to have a pretty list of his good to offer and not to comapre them with Amazon or the like with all is well, all is happy customer care.
Though Mr. Does really goes out of it`s way to help it`s customers. He actually drove to Thomas Dellert in person to see that the G-Rex A4000T that I ordered got the needed fix before it could be delivered at all. When I ordered my MicroA he called me on second X-mas (!) day that he was just about to set up the system and it will be delivered in the next few days.
I agree that the situation is not ideal, but what would be the alternative ? If Mr. Does would decide to close down Vesalia, where would you go to buy all the stuff no one else has ?
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Right, I'd have to agree with Lemmink... While I have not met the man in person, I have spoken to him on the phone and he is a very decent character who goes out of his way to help his customers. I have indeed noticed the problems with email correspondence. I've bought nearly all my major gear from Vesalia, but any technical questions I had before buying were never answered, even after repeated emails. So, after finding out the details elsewhere I'd go to the website and place an order. As soon as the order goes through to the payment stage, I then get an email from Vesalia confirming the order and payment details, and get whatever questions answered then.
So, it seems he/they prioritise their limited email responses to those people who are buying stuff from them. I don't think this is unreasonable at all for someone like this with quite limited resources, although it doesn't excuse the sloppy after-sales service. Thankfully I haven't had any problems with anything I've bought, and would probably buy from them again...
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@Lemmink:
All I know is that I am down over 700EUR for the card and that Vesalia offered no help whatsoever on the subject.
I've had to beg a friend in Germany to personally visit DCE on his own time and see if they even received the card from Vesalia for repair, that's how bad it was. It's not like I've threatened Mr. Does or something and he decided to ignore me. I politely asked what the status of my card's repair was and he never answered. If I ask about a different product, he may answer, but if I again ask about the PPC card...silence. I cannot speak German so calling him doesn't help. I tried to a few times, however this lead to nowhere as once he hung up after a few words, and the other time I was greated in German with perhaps a few English words too, followed by another hang up.
How can I not be pissed off? :-( I didn't even come to a point where I asked for my money back. I simply did not get ONE SINGLE REPLY on the topic of my faulty PPC card.
Regardless of his personal agenda and problems, I think that he really should not treat me like this.
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x56h34 wrote:
All I know is that I am down over 700EUR for the card and that Vesalia offered no help whatsoever on the subject.
:-o Now that is just too much money. It is exactly what I was talking about. One-man operation or not. You just can't do that to people.
I have called him too once. He even speaks a bit of dutch. And as I stated before; my problems were solved. But this story is unacceptable and makes vesalia smell like a fraud.
I hope it has been an incident.
If there are more of these cases you can safly say Vesalia offers no warranty on expensive products since they/he is unable to take the damage.
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@AMIGAZ
You're probably right about Vesalia being a one-man operation. Or better: a man, his wife and a technician. Suchs an operation does not provide for much time to answer e-mails elaborately. It is a bit of a hectic time currently. But margins are not that high that it allows for expansion of workforce. Bear this in mind. And it is not only Vesalia suffering from this, I think that many, maybe most or even all resellers face a similar situation. The market is not THAT big and very diverse. Which computermarket provides for aftersales of products 15 years out of production? Certainly not Windows-related. You'll be the laughing stock of the shop's crowd when you want a replacement for a specific PC-part some 5 or 6 years old.
Be very glad that some companies STILL provide for spares of your old relic, however much you cherish it!
I got a scandoubler for my A1200 from them some 2 years ago and on the shortest day of the northern half in 2004 I got my MicroA1 from them: drove up the entire 170 odd miles, collected what I wanted and some more, got a cup of coffee from the missus, paid the bill, said goodbye, turned the car, drove back home, installed the gear and continued enjoying life.
Be patient, moderate your tone, you are dealing with people that STILL show interest in a very awkward market! Be glad that they are still around and are able and willing to serve you with your beloved but heavily antiquated gear!
My handfull of small-coin.
Jettah
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Having lived in Germany for six years I can tell you across the board Germans lack the remotest concept of customer service; it is alien to them. There are small pockets in this economy that have grasped the concept to a small degree with full credit coming from the arrival of Wal-Mart stores.
Competition is a wonderful concept for business however, Vesalia operates a niche market without competition where Guido's customers need him more than he needs them, hence the usual German lack of customer service. This is the culture here. It does not matter if you are bank rolled to purchase a Porsche 911, if you think the dealer will kiss your ass all through the sale like dealers selling Hondas in the USA do you are fooling yourself. German retailers feel they are doing the customer a favor and that favor is a pain in their asses. If shipping takes three months from Frankfurt to London you better bite your tongue and praise the fact you received your product. If you received the wrong product then using an apologetic tone may yield you some results as long as you avoid blame on the vendor. Complaining will only bring you contempt. Once you understand this you will have a much better shopping experience.
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Err.. isn´t it better that the German shops learn what service is? I mean everybody else in the world knows what that is and it isn't hard. :roll:
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I think that KD7HTH put it really nicely as to why things suck nowadays, and not only with Vesalia, but with the entire Amiga dealer community.
I was impressed at how dedicated and honest AmigaKit turned out to be, compared to other dealers. Two thumbs up for their service.
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Hmmm....funny. We have a joke at work, that goes something like this:
"Do you know the proper German answer to any question?"
"Nein!"
Having worked partly in Germany for the last 5 years, I have too know the people more. They have a very special way of treating strangers and foreigners, but when you finally get to know them they are the friendliest people existing. I do speak German, and that's a great advantage though.
I would get someone that speaks German fluidly to call up Vesalia and check things out. Remember the time zones though, don't call him in the middle of the night ;-)
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I always regarded the Germans as very correct and courteous in their dealings with customers. Was I that wrong then?
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@odin:
I have nothing bad to say about German business as a whole. I've dealt successfully with many people from Germany and they were mostly friendly and very professional. My misfortune with Vesalia should not be categorized as an example of how all german businesses work. Vesalia is only one bad seed, in my opinion.