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Amiga computer related discussion => Amiga Hardware Issues and discussion => Topic started by: neofree on January 04, 2005, 06:07:19 PM
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Hello,
I got the following recently:
Amiga 1200 in Power Tower with 3.1 ROMs.
BlizzardPPC (040/25, PPC/200) with 32megs of RAM and SCSI
SCSI HD and CD
When I got it, something was banging around in the box... I opened it up and the BlizzardPPC was loose banging around...
I just powered it up last night using 1084 monitor and it booted up to workbench. The display was flickery so I went to change the screenmode and it locked up when I double clicked the screenmode icon. Before this, there are green garbled lines here and there whenever I double click on any icon and bring up a window.
So I grabbed my OS3.9 CD, but it wont recognize it or boot to it. I checked that CD0: was loaded and even tried other CD's and none were recongized.
This is a Rev 0 BlizzardPPC and the previous owner was trying to get a G-Rex to work with it but he couldn't make it work. He claimed he tested the BlizzardPPC successfully without G-Rex installed...
I don't have ANY Amiga floppies (No WB, etc.)... So where do I go from here? Does it sound like damaged hardware? Or does it sound like bad software loaded or problems because of G-Rex firmware?
Besides ordering WB disks off of eBay, is there anything else I can try (software wise) that might revive the CD so I can format?
Thanks,
Neofree
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neofree wrote:
I just powered it up last night using 1084 monitor and it booted up to workbench. The display was flickery so I went to change the screenmode and it locked up when I double clicked the screenmode icon. Before this, there are green garbled lines here and there whenever I double click on any icon and bring up a window.
I have never seen "green garbled lines", but BlizzardPPC problems are mostly caused by heat or insufficient power supply.
Check that the fan on the PPC still works. Remove the metal shielding from the PPC and remove any dirt that accumulated below it.
How do you power the whole setup? What kind of PSU, where do you feed power to the A1200 and/or the BlizzardPPC? I'd recommend to feed power to both the original power connector and the power connector that usually feeds the internal floppy disk drive (in the original desktop case).
Did the previous owner use the very same motherboard you are using now? Some motherboards won't work with the BlizzardPPC (or any other accellerator with a 68040 or 68060 CPU) unless they get the famous "timing fixes" applied.
This is a Rev 0 BlizzardPPC and the previous owner was trying to get a G-Rex to work with it but he couldn't make it work.
A Rev 0 BlizzardPPC will not work with a G-Rex busboard, it needs a hardware upgrade (nobody performs these upgrades anymore, AFAIK).
I don't have ANY Amiga floppies (No WB, etc.)... So where do I go from here? Does it sound like damaged hardware? Or does it sound like bad software loaded or problems because of G-Rex firmware?
Huh? So you *are* using a G-Rex? This is not listed above. Remove it, your system will not work with a G-Rex installed.
Besides ordering WB disks off of eBay, is there anything else I can try (software wise) that might revive the CD so I can format?
Boot without startup-sequence, and run HDToolBox from CLI (this only works if OS 3.1/3.0 is installed, OS 3.9's HDToolbox requires a lot of stuff to be set up before it can be used). Does it list your CD drive?
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Firstly, I'm not using G-Rex. But I've heard you can reflash your BlizzardPPC with a G-Rex firmware. Also, I was told this PPC works in this Amiga fine with the G-Rex out prior to shipment.
I'm using an Amiga 1200 in Power Tower, whatever the original power supply is in a Power Tower, would have to check more about power issues when I get home. Yes, the small cpu fan is spinning. Also, this happened within minutes of first use, barely any time for the unit to heat much.
I'll try nuking the startup sequence... CD0 was found in the boot menu when I tried to boot from cd, but it said not bootable. Does that mean the drive is not bootable or the CD was not bootable? Is it even possible to boot OS3.9 from CD?
Thanks,
Neofree
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neofree wrote:
Firstly, I'm not using G-Rex. But I've heard you can reflash your BlizzardPPC with a G-Rex firmware.
Not the Rev 0 boards. You actually *need* to reflash all (most) BlizzardPPC boards to use them with a G-Rex, but that won't make a Rev 0 BPPC work with a G-Rex.
I'm using an Amiga 1200 in Power Tower, whatever the original power supply is in a Power Tower,
That should be sufficient.
would have to check more about power issues when I get home.
Do that. The setup described above is the absolute minimum to make my BlizzardPPC (same as yours) work reliably.
Yes, the small cpu fan is spinning.
That's good, but also check for dirt when you get back home. The fan simply moves air through a very thin channel below the big flat PPC heatsink. That channel gets easily blocked by dust.
Also, this happened within minutes of first use, barely any time for the unit to heat much.
Without a CPU fan, my BlizzardPPC/BVision combo survives about three minutes.
CD0 was found in the boot menu when
Okay, so your CD drive is probably installed correctly (cables, termination...).
Could you post the whole contents of your "CD0" file? It's just a textfile, perhaps something is set up incorrectly.
Is it even possible to boot OS3.9 from CD?
No. You have to create an "Emergency Disk" which is bootable and will 'boot' the CD afterwards.
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About G-Rex.. What I mean is that the previous owner may have flashed the Rev 0 board thinking he might make it work... How do I check which version I have and if I should flash?
About 3 minutes until it locks... I can say it's definately not a time issue. The lockups occur at precisely the same actions. Like if I double click Screenmode icon, and others. Other icons work fine though for indefinate amount of time without lockup. This made me think it's a HD failure but the CD doesnt work either.
Thanks,
Neofree
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@ Neofree
If you're in Europe maybe you should get the 3.1 disks from HopperJF's auction:
here (http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=8159127156&ssPageName=STRK:MESE:IT)
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nope, in USA.. looks like a good collection of software though
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Well, I found the problem... but it isn't good news...
Inspected the BPPC board itself. Found two pins of a large square chip (not CPU's) smashed together. Probably smashed together when the BPPC was banging around in shipping since it wasnt secured.
I carefully tried to seperate them, but one of them quickly just fell off completely. It was loose at the very base of the chip.
Now.. The unit doesnt come on at all with BPPC in. I took SCSI cable out to see if it it would just mean SCSI is bad, but it still doesnt work at all any longer...
:( :( :(
Seeing as the BVision I have coming requires one of these boards, I don't know what to do now...
Thanks,
Neofree
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@neofree:
What's printed on the chip? Even better, can you take a picture of the mess and post a link to it?
/Patrik
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if you are REALY! handy with soldering iron, you can make a very fine solder and perhaps use some conductive pen to make the connection relieable, however due to the delicate circuitry I would recommend getting a computer repair centre to do the job.
Did the board sustain any further damage? Like ruined PCB tracks? And it must have banged against something so how does the main board look like?
I’m really sorry to hear about your troubles but it is repairable!
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Im sorry to ask here, but it seems i have similar problems like you...
I have almost exactly setup (1200 towered in Power Tower), OS 3.9 with PPC 040, Mediator with ethernet and sound blaster cards and BVision.
My system hangs up just 1 or 2 minutes after finishing loading wb.
I get an annoying noise coming from the disk drive, like if it was expecting some disk to be inserted. I mean, nasty cliking noise all time, and in my screen i get a "nodos" icon...that sound makes me really nervous!!
Besides i cant seem to get the Bvision working properly.
I have fed the original floppy drive power connector, but i dont know what else to do.
I read somewhere that i have to give more power to the Bvision , i just dont know how!!!
Any guides please!!!
Regards!
Sebastian
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maybe this could help:
I'm using an A4k with CSMKII 060 and a C64/3D. To make a very long story very short: When ever i would double click an icon my Amiga would crash. I got rid of the CGX-drivers and installed the Picasso96 driver after that it worked perfectly!
It sounds a bit like the problem you have (btw: I was using OS3.9)
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@NeoFree
Dude, sad to say it, but forget running a BVision in Rev0 ppc stable, or ruuning it at all. : (
@Gavilan
Nice to see you. Why you just dont try to get CGX reinstalled up in the machine and see what happens?
AFAIK there is not P96 monitor for Bvision, but i could be mistaken.
It seems its a timming problem in your setup
Best Regards anyone out there, and happy new year
-DeQ
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I'd go round to the original seller and stick the Bliz in his rectum. How friggin hard is it to package stuff properly! :-x
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@ DeQuevedo: hola! feliz año para ti tambien!!
;)
I tried installing CGX version 3, since my version 4 got broken and cant get it anywhere
Just the same: i keep seeing the light of the disk drive on all time, and the clicking noise coming from the disk drive very fast, all time , and this nasty requester saying "nodos" disk icon in my desktop... You think this is a timing problem??
Are there some kind of compatibilities between mediator and bvision??
I would like if you can pm and we can keep this in spanish please!!! ;)) Since i have a lot more questions to do concerning bvision and ppc...
For example, how shall i give more power to the bvision??
Regards
Sebastian
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I'll try to take some pictures tonight. I *might* be able to do it if I only had some flux... And could find my 15 watt solder iron. But I fear I will make it worse. I did do SMT soldering for HP, but nothing this small.
Man.. The whole thing has me very frustrated... Might sell the BPPC and BVision both and get a Mediator. Are there any accel boards though that are PCI that work with mediator?
Thanks,
Neofree
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What do people think of these?
http://elbox.com/news_04_12_17.html
Looks like maybe you could slap in a SharkPPC after OS4 comes out. (Per site the reason why SharkPPC isn't out yet is they are waiting for OS4 to be released.)
Thanks,
Neofree
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Heard from person who sold me it...
He said he'd pay for repairs or give me the G-Rex and Voodoo card he tried to get to work on this thing, so I could sell it for repairs/replacement..
Any thoughts? What are G-Rex's worth?
Thanks,
Neofree
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ask to a technician, to rework the broken IC legs.
Its a 10 minutes job for a tech.
For the future, if you wanna know wich FlashRom version you installed, type in a shell:
version blizzppc.device full
If it is a 45.35 version, its the latest
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The GRex DOES work with a rev0 BlizzardPPC. I have one running here! You just need to know what the trick is and it's a very simple one.
Don't use the latest flash and don't use the latest CyberGraphx drivers and it will work! Works for me.
If I remember correctly ALL the 4.3 CyberGraphx drivers are wrong. If I remember correctly The latest 4.2 release is beta 11. You need that one.
Go to grex.amigaworld.de and get the correct flash. It's not the latest but the one before that.
Also if you have a BlizzardPPC + BVisionPPC and you have the latest BIOS flashed in you NEED the Cybergraphx 4.3 drivers and the otherway round. I have a second system with a BVisionPPC and the 4.3 drivers which lockedup when using MagicMenu or 3D stuff. Flashed in the latest BIOS and voila. Stable.
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While we're at it, I might as well post my problems as well:
* My A1200T (Eyetech tower) with BlizzardPPC and ZIV board rarely boots up on first try. If I power it down and power it on again a few seconds later it boots fine, though. I guess it's a power problem. I seem to remember reading that you could feed power to the mobo through the original floppy power connector. However, I don't want to try this before I asked someone, because sending power the 'wrong' direction seems a bit risky to me. So, is it a good idea to do so?
* I entered 'version blizzppc.device full' as Framiga recommended and it seems I have v44.31. Should I re-flash to 45.35 and where do I find it?
* I can't enter the BlizzardPPC menu by depressing ESC at boot. Doesn't my EZKey-EX support that? Would a Lyra be better?
Thanks,
Martin
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Hi AdMartin
your version seems good for me (~99-2000).
About the BlizzardPPC menu, if you can see the Amiga Early SS (both mouse button pushed at boot) you should see even the BPPC one but only with a monitor plugged to the Amiga RGB port.
EDIT- just noticed:
o ECS/AA 31khz support
the Bootmenu now ALWAYS pops up in 31khz mode, so
people with 15khz monitors have to use to
switch the resolution to 15khz INTERLACE.
The resolution is saved too in the flash so the next
time it uses the resolution you set.
The resolution switch is disabled if there`s a permedia
card found.
and
o BootMenu which can be invoked by holding
the Key key during the system boot.
(It may not work for weird tower pc-keyboard hacks)
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First of all, you CAN use the G-Rex flash with a BVPPC. You just need to have the LATEST G-Rex CGX version and use the Permedia2 driver. If this doesn't work, I urge you to flash with an older firmware. About the damage in the IC pins, this should be very easy to repair, my board had far worse damage.
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Well I told him I'd take the G-Rex.
Assuming I got the G-Rex to work without frying my BPPC, doesn't it run hot? I also was planning on running this machine 24/7 for a BBS after I installed lots of cooling. :)
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Framiga wrote:
your version seems good for me (~99-2000).
So nothing significant is gained by flashing to a newer version?
o BootMenu which can be invoked by holding
the Key key during the system boot.
(It may not work for weird tower pc-keyboard hacks)
Yeah, I have another A1200 setup with an Elbox tower (and Elbox keyb adapter). If I plug the BlizzardPPC into that I can reach the bootmenu. I bought the EZKey because I read that it worked even with several keys depressed simultaneously, but if it doesn't work at boot I don't want it. That's £30 down the drain. I'll probably get a Lyra instead.
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All menus, screens and stuff should be visible on the BVPPC up to the execution of the CyberGraphX driver. The firmware forwards the display.
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Yeah, I would see the menu if I could enter it... :/
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Alright you thread hijackers ;) JK
Anyone have any comments about running G-Rex 24/7?
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Well, I have a rev.2 board and while my Amiga was in use, up to last year, it was working 24/7 without any problems.
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OK, here are the pics:
www.wattservices.com/1.JPG
This is a pic of the entire chip. It appears to be the SCSI chip. However, with the SCSI cable unplugged the unit still does not boot. I'm using a 1084 btw, maybe it's giving SCSI info for the BVision, I don't know I havent gotten my BVision yet.
www.wattservices.com/2.JPG
This is the best pic of the damage. If you can tell, the trace is lifted and up against the chip (look next to the 5th pin in from the right). This happened when I soldered a small copper wire thread to the trace and to the side of the chip tonight. But when I pulled away even very slowly the trace was lifted and you can see it is still there but up against the chip. I was never able to get anything to stick. It'd feel like it was stuck, but as soon as I moved my hand (ouch) or needle nose pliers away, it'd bust off.
www.wattservices.com/3.JPG
Another slightly different view. The purplish glare shows where the pin was on the chip, but so little is there to solder to. I tried using a small metal pin to scrape away some of the chip insulation to have more to solder to, but never got enough.
Any ideas? I can't seem to get anywhere with this...
Thanks,
Neofree
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@neofree:
To the right of the chip on picture 2 and 3 it looks like a component is supposed to be soldered there, but has loosened. When comparing with this (http://www.amiga-hardware.com/download_photos/blizzppc040_front_big.jpg) picture it seems like it is a tantylum capacitor.
Tricky situation with the lifted trace. This (http://www.amiga-hardware.com/download_photos/blizzppc_3_big.jpg) picture suggests that the trace doesnt run very far and connects to a via. Might it be possible to connect to that via on the opposite side of the card?
/Patrik
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Thanks!
I looked around... Didn't find the missing component. :( Anyone got schematics or just know what I need to put here?
Well.. That helps with the trace. Also explains to me what the board looks like without SCSI option. Which means that this board should be OK once I put that part back on and I just might not be able to use SCSI. The problem I'm worried about more then the trace is that the chip doesnt have anything sticking out to solder to.
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OK, my last post sucked. Here some more and better info:
Yes, I have GRex with a BlizzardPPC rev 0. I have a Voodoo 3 in and 10 MBit network card. I don't have soundcard because I thought that only works when you have the latest firmware flashed in with the OpenPCI.device. The whole rig is stable. I can play Quake, Quake 2, and Shogo.
You must absolutely NOT use the latest firmware. This firmware supports the OpenPCI.device which is the cause of all the problems. You need the firmware before that which doesn't use OpenPCI. So you can't use any of the OpenPCI drivers.
The CyberGraphx 4.3 drivers seem not to be able to recognize correctly that no OpenPCI.device is supported and start to give all kinds of negative side effects. I needed the 4.2 beta 11 drivers to get everything working stable.
To summarise a few simple rulez:
- If you have a rev0 BlizzardPPC and you want to use a VooDoo 3 with a GRex then you can't use the firmware with OpenPCI support. You need the one before that.
- If you use the previous firmware you can't use the 4.3 CyberGraphx drivers. These drivers seem not be able differentiate properly between the firmware with OpenPCI and without OpenPCI. You need the 4.2 release. The beta 11 was the latest.
- If you have a BVisionPPC and you want to use the 4.3 CyberGraphx drivers you need the latest firmware with OpenPCI support. I had my BlizzardPPC upgraded in France from a 040 to a 060 and it didn't work properly when it got back. MagicMenu would lockup the system when I wanted to see the menu and so did 3D games. I flashed to the latest BIOS and it worked.
To be honestly; Frank Mariak and Ralph Schmidt and everyone else involved with Cybergraphx and the firmware {bleep}edup the latest releases of both their products. Don't ask for support because neither is interrested in fixing this problem. This rev2 crap was the biggest mistake they ever made.
On a side note; I have a Voodoo 3500 TV which wouldn't work in my modern AGP 4 supported AthlonXP motherboard. I found a BIOS on the internet that changed the timings of the card. I flashed it in the Voodoo 3500 and it has worked ever since. Maybe there is a BIOS outthere for PCI voodoo cards that change the timings. If I remember correctly the rev0 problem was a timing problem and only with the Voodoo-3. I might buy another PCI Voodoo card and start testing some of that stuff if I am able to find such a BIOS.
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The capacitor that's missing there next to the SCSI chip is the same one as the 5 that are in a row next to the 5V fan connector. These are standard components.
I have had a damaged BlizzardPPC also in which that component was missing. Took it out of a dead mobile phone.
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So the damaged IC is a normal NCR SCSI controller. You should be able to rip one off an old PC SCSI card. Maybe that way you can restore the card in its full glory?
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A little update on the driver to use for your Voodoo 3.
Go to the page [color=FF0000]grex.amigaworld.de[/color] (http://grex.amigaworld.de/software_driver.php)
You can only use stuff from 19-sept-01.
As you can see, all the stuff above it is openPCI crap so unusable for a rev 0 firmware.