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Amiga computer related discussion => Amiga Hardware Issues and discussion => Topic started by: SHADES on August 30, 2004, 11:15:41 PM
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Hey everyone.
Does anyone know of a new standard sized A1 ATX board that is going to be produced in the near future? None of this Mini ATX /ITX stuff, I want a full compliment of PCI slots or express. I can't live with only 1 or 2 PCI slots! Oh, and does it have on board Giganet? I have upgraded recently and wish to use this new standard.
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There are a handful of XE's going to be produced again with G4s on 'em. The new MiniATX (3x PCI, 1x AGP) boards arn't scheduled in yet. Nobody has mentionned Gigibit ethernet either way on it.
The MiniITX ones are released at the start of October, hopefully coinciding with the release of OS4. They include most things needed by home users, what do you need PCI slots for exactly? (What you want might not be supported by OS4!)
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>> what do you need PCI slots for exactly?
Oh you know, the usual TV Cards, Dual nics, SCSI cards, IDE raid controller, perhaps wireless instead, the list sorta goes on.
OS4 may not support all of them, I know TV cards are supporeted in Winuae etc so I'm sure the 68000 code could be emulated and converted to run under A1. Somone will. The thing is, why Mini ATX/ITX design. I want an expandable big box!
I don't want a mini mainboard. It makes no sense, and as for the specs, 1x AGP?? what's going on there! 4x no worries as there are very few cards that use up the 8x bus width and DDr ram, where's that?
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I think you'll be looking for the up comming CX board. It will not be a full size ATX board, but a mini-ATX. It will use the ArticaP, use DDR RAM, USB (2.0?). It will probably have 2 or 3 PCI slot and an AGP slot. Specifications are abit sketchy at the moment. I think Firewire was mentioned at one point. Not sure on the AGP slot specs. Also, I believe it will have Gigabit, too.
Basically, we know almost nothing about it. Stay tuned.
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Most PC motherboards are MiniATX anyway, if you needed even more I'm sure there is way to sort a riser card in there or something.
As for the AGP speed, it seems it's more difficult than you'd thing to rig a fast AGP port (the Pegasos2 also features simple AGP). When I typed 1xAgp I meant there would be one socket as well as the PCI ones :-D
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Yeah,
that's the word on the street.
The AGP slot (Er, there is none) on the µ-A1-I/µ-A1-C is AGP in PCI mode, on a riser card that will have a max of 3 slots. (one as standard)
i should point out that the Agp standard is being replaced (slowly) by `PCI express` , so it would be nice to have the latest supported interface for the future A1 XC model...
Anyway,
good to see the market moving.
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This is why I don't like mini motherboards!!
They try to pack so much into a small space that features get skimped out on. AGP in PCI mode? what's the point there. And riser cards? that's a realy evil way of doing things. I hope that extra IRQ channels are added for those riser cards.
Althoug I'd be more than happy with just standard PCI/AGP board (as long as it's not 1x speed AGP) I think the previous poster is correct. We should try to develop with the times and PCI express is going to be the replacement solution of the future. Why not use the later technology? sure it's more expensive, but AMIGAs were renowned for being more expensive because they used SCSI and DMA channels etc..etc...
I'd rather a PC built on technology that is going to have a future, not rely on spare parts from the past. Anyone still using VESA at home??
Just wondering ;))
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@argo
Don't think it even makes sense to talk about the CX at this time. Unless you mean the TeronCX offcourse :quickdraw:
MAI claim to have the ArticiaP ready for "engeneering samples" within this quarter, problem is that they have claimed that for the last 2 years.....
Even if they make it this time, they would still need to :
- built an proto-board to test it
- elimnate the worst bugs (and every new chip has plenty of them)
- design a board suitable for end-users
This takes atleast 1 year even in the $$$$ x86-world, so don't expect such a board before 2006 (if at all).
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As for the uA1, it's compact because one of it's main markets needs that size - bear in mind part of this is to replace use of CD32s with SX32 modules ;-)
As for IRQs, thats a given, even on MiniATX you can whack on a riser, they're not the devil's spawn, but a standard PCI compliant item.
Personally I find the idea of having an untra-compact base unit very appealing - I'm tired of hulking great (oversized) PC towers at work!
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I found the problem with PCs at work is their size too, but at home, I want features and expandability. I hate the fact that most mainboards don't have enough IRQs and end up doing PCI steering. The sharing of IRQs on mainboaqrds slow them down, and I find at home, most don't have enough. As an example, I have a time critical 24/96 Sampler unit from STA audio running on an Gigabyite mainboard and Athlon 2600. I have had to turn off, game port, midi, on board sound, USB, IDE raid, serial ports so as not to use sharing on the IRQs. Lots of features not enough lines to the PCI. Most companies use the PCI 2.0 spec of sharing because it's cheaper. I'd like to see them produce a board that's got better performance and charge a little more, but now we are talking about servers which is not needed.
I hate having a mainboard where I have to disable features because they have skimped out in design. Riser cards most of the time only add slots, the IRQs however are hard wired into the PCI controller, and so if they are not there, the controller will share what it has. Much like the prommie does. I think it has 1 or maybe 2 IRQs on it sharing with all slots where as Mediator has 5?? someone who knows the hardware will give the correct number here. Yep, makes it more expensive, but also, it's faster. If my gigabyte board had more IRQs I wouldbe able to use more of the features the board was designed with.
AMIGA always had cutting edge stuff. Sure, people had jst bought EGA, but we were using 4096 colours. 4 channell 8 bit sound, DMA and megs of memory. SCSI interface instead of slow PIO IDE modes etc...... It was expensive to buy as not many people used that hardware at that tim, I would expect the same if PCI Express was chosen, so be it, give AMIGA engineers and developers a chance to get in first and develop some great hardware for express. Newtek??
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AMIGA always had cutting edge stuff. Sure, people had jst bought EGA, but we were using 4096 colours. 4 channell 8 bit sound, DMA and megs of memory. SCSI interface instead of slow PIO IDE modes etc......
Today I have UDMA, accelerated 32 bit gfx with 3D, 16 bit sound @ 48kHz, fast ethernet, fast cdrom... What else is needed?
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hum,
silence?
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I found the problem with PCs at work is their size too, but at home, I want features and expandability. I hate the fact that most mainboards don't have enough IRQs and end up doing PCI steering. The sharing of IRQs on mainboaqrds slow them down, and I find at home, most don't have enough. As an example, I have a time critical 24/96 Sampler unit from STA audio running on an Gigabyite mainboard and Athlon 2600.
What type of motherboard and chipset?
Most companies use the PCI 2.0 spec of sharing because it's cheaper.
The desired compliancy should be PCI 2.3 or PCI 2.2.
I'd like to see them produce a board that's got better performance and charge a little more, but now we are talking about servers which is not needed.
Depands on the type of motherboard, for example
* ASUS A7N8X Dlx, Gigabyte GA-7N400Pro2, GA-K8NNXP LTD ED IRQ numbers can go up to 22 (according to Sandra)(all nForce series).
I have loaded the following motherboards with devices and these are;
1. GA-7N400 Pro2** with Intel ProS Ethernet, VisionDTV(HDTV), SB Audigy SZ 7.1, SiL SATA-150, NV-IDE-133, USB2.0, IEEE 1394,
2. GA-K8NNXP LTD ED with SB Audigy SZ 7.1, VisionDTV(HDTV), SiL SATA-150, NV-IDE-133, USB2.0, IEEE 1394B, NV-NIC(CK8),Intel ProS Ethernet,
Both systems don’t have major issues with DVD-Audio class audio stream.
**I have turned off GigaRAID IT 8212F, Realtek GigaE (8110S-32), Realtek AC97 5.1 Audio since they are redundant devices. Another topic.
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Eyetech are saying a max of 2 PCI +1 for an AGP port (one presumes it would be possible to have a 3rd PCI instead). The controller is the same as the XE motherboard, so I'd guess it has the same available IRQs as that - as to weather they're implemented is another matter (it's made from the TAO reference board, which is made to be compact rather than a powerhouse - so thats a maybe :-D).
I don't think they have a market for the well stuffed big boxes of old (how many filled to capacity A2000s did there used to be?), these small boards should be able to fill the old A500 market (especially if the 'Project Reality' bunch comes together). Remember the OS isn't even finished yet - it's early days ;)
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@Holley
Note that it’s MAI not TAO.