Amiga.org
Amiga computer related discussion => Amiga Gaming => Topic started by: mikrucio on April 22, 2013, 06:18:04 AM
-
Hello all
Just trying to get a figure in my head.
How many active programmers among you?
active meaning Amiga 68k.
RAISE HANDS! thanks
-
I've got a couple different projects in the works, but they've all been back-burnered for a while now. Need to get back on them, sometime...
-
C only for now. Might get interested in Assembler eventually.
-
I'm currently trying to port Descent Rebirth to 68k.
-
Active programmer? yes
Games programming? no
-
When work isn't taking every waking moment, I do play around on my various Amigas; almost always in a programming perspective. I admit though that I get mired down in the semantics of trying to modernized my coding environment on the Amiga more than I do in actually producing any code on it.
My most recent attempts were to get objective-c compiling on the Amiga because I got frustrated with working with C strings again. A two day deep dive over nothing. Would love to work on a game but don't have the time at the moment; too busy making Netflix Original Content on the web an awesome place.
-
When work isn't taking every waking moment, I do play around on my various Amigas; almost always in a programming perspective. I admit though that I get mired down in the semantics of trying to modernized my coding environment on the Amiga more than I do in actually producing any code on it.
My most recent attempts were to get objective-c compiling on the Amiga because I got frustrated with working with C strings again. A two day deep dive over nothing. Would love to work on a game but don't have the time at the moment; too busy making Netflix Original Content on the web an awesome place.
I'm pretty sure C++ compiles on amiga. KArlos would be the guy to ask about that I think.
-
I voted C for Amiga for the simple reason that I'll be switching over to AROS 68k as soon as it is practical to do so. The legal gibberish that is going on with regards to OS 3.x is just insane. Not to mention that AROS is still actively developed and has several features that are lacking in the original AmigaOS series.
That said, the code quality of all the 68k compilers I've ever tried is abysmal. If I had the choice, I'd use AmigaE instead of C but the AROS source codes are written in C.
-
That said, the code quality of all the 68k compilers I've ever tried is abysmal. If I had the choice, I'd use AmigaE instead of C but the AROS source codes are written in C.
How's vbcc? I've heard good things about it.
-
How's vbcc? I've heard good things about it.
I'd love to use it, but its 68020+ only, which I have with no way to display. The only computer I can monitor-ize is the A2000 with a 68010.
-
SAS/C 6.58 generates pretty good code. You can even run it on your Mac or PC using AmiTools if cross-development is a must. It has basic C++ support, but no C99.
VBCC is pretty ok, very simple to use and set up. It has C99 support but no C++. It's not meant for 68020+ only, the source code is available so you can compile it to run on an A1000 if you want, or any other computer and operating system for that matter.
Then there's GCC which is very powerful, but has always been a mess to set up and it eats more RAM and CPU.
-
Great to hear friends!
keep the votes coming!
-
How's vbcc? I've heard good things about it.
The 68k code quality is average overall. Vasm is the best 68k peephole optimizing assembler ever and the inline assembler used for many functions is fast but some of the statically linked vclib code and the backend need some attention. I've seen vbcc make optimizations I didn't think a compiler could do and then the next function will make me cry. It is getting better slowly though and there should be a new version out soon according to Frank Wille. There is major fixes in the vbcc compiler and vasm assembler that help with reliability. The beta is working much better on my 68060 Amiga.
SAS/C 6.58 generates pretty good code. You can even run it on your Mac or PC using AmiTools if cross-development is a must. It has basic C++ support, but no C99.
SAS/C generated 68k is average to above average really. It's about on par with GCC 3 and vbcc depending on the source. The last versions of GCC 2 were probably the best and may have reached good code generation quality, IMO.
VBCC is pretty ok, very simple to use and set up. It has C99 support but no C++. It's not meant for 68020+ only, the source code is available so you can compile it to run on an A1000 if you want, or any other computer and operating system for that matter.
Vbcc would be slow and require a lot of memory on a 68000. SAS/C or DICE may be better options. An fpga 68000 with plenty of memory and storage might be ok for small projects. An older compiler could be used for creation on a low end Amiga and then compiled with vbcc or GCC later if care is taken to avoid compiler specific code.
-
I'm pretty sure C++ compiles on amiga. KArlos would be the guy to ask about that I think.
Yep this was developed in C++ 68k using gcc v3.4, seems to work ok.
ScummVM RTG (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dDuDfD5yPeo)
-
When work isn't taking every waking moment, I do play around on my various Amigas; almost always in a programming perspective. I admit though that I get mired down in the semantics of trying to modernized my coding environment on the Amiga more than I do in actually producing any code on it.
That pretty much sums me up too. I actually have several ideas for games I'd like to implement, but then I get distracted by spending time trying to get the code up "up to spec." Then, some other distraction comes along and... there it sits.
And I didn't vote because I prefer C++. I've always hated C.
-
That pretty much sums me up too. I actually have several ideas for games I'd like to implement, but then I get distracted by spending time trying to get the code up "up to spec." Then, some other distraction comes along and... there it sits.
And I didn't vote because I prefer C++. I've always hated C.
thanks ed, c++ is in the same bucket. please vote!
And what do you mean up to spec?
-
68K all the way :D C is for the peecee :D
But... am I active? Not really :(
-
Well, instead of up to spec I should instead say more modernized. I know that also sounds crazy since I mentioned Objective-C and technically it's quite old itself. I program in a lot of languages across the board. I know that I can use C++ on the Amiga. I have a registered copy of Cubic IDE. I also SAS/C 6.58 or whatever the latest C++ capable version is.
I also am one of the fortunate ones to have a working Amiga 1200/PPC that runs OS4.1. That environment is pretty nice. I keep wanting to get myself a NG Amiga so I can really appreciate it.
Mostly though I've been doing a lot of iOS development (Objective C/C++) and HTML/CSS3/JavaScript programming alongside Node.JS. I keep seeing about getting V8 and Node.JS running on the Amiga and then I realize I need up to date versions of dev tools to compile it.
Then I would start down the path of seeing how far I could get. I'd usually make some progress and then rat hole chasing down broken links for libraries and whispers of solutions or knee deep in trying to compile a bunch of GNU tools to get things moving.
Eventually I'd get so lost in my quest to have a modern tool of some sort as seen on another more modern platform that I'd waste what little free time I had to spare. The worst part is usually I could have written everything I wanted in C in the time I wasted seeking "better" tools. :-)
Story of my recent Amiga life.
-
Well, instead of up to spec I should instead say more modernized. I know that also sounds crazy since I mentioned Objective-C and technically it's quite old itself. I program in a lot of languages across the board. I know that I can use C++ on the Amiga. I have a registered copy of Cubic IDE. I also SAS/C 6.58 or whatever the latest C++ capable version is.
Well, that's pretty much what I mean by "up to spec." :) Except I end up doing this instead:#include <iostream>
#include <proto/dos.h>
#include "GraphicsLibrary.h"
#include "IntuitionLibrary.h"
#include "ScreenBase.h"
struct GfxBase* GfxBase = NULL;
struct IntuitionBase* IntuitionBase = NULL;
struct Library *GadToolsBase = NULL;
ScreenBase screen;
int main(int argc, char* argv[]) {
try {
GfxBase = GraphicsLibrary.GetGfxBase( );
IntuitionBase = IntuitionLibrary.GetIntuitionBase( );
ScreenBase screen = ScreenBase( );
screen.open();
Delay(5 * 50);
screen.close();
std::cout << "\nAnd there was much rejoicing...\n";
}
catch (SystemLibraryException &error) {
std::cout << error.Name << " version: " << error.Version << " failed to open";
}
IntuitionLibrary.close( );
GraphicsLibrary.close( );
GadToolsLibrary.close( );
return 0;
}
Which, to me, is a lot more elegant than the older, clumsier Amiga way of doing things.
Eventually I'd get so lost in my quest to have a modern tool of some sort as seen on another more modern platform that I'd waste what little free time I had to spare. The worst part is usually I could have written everything I wanted in C in the time I wasted seeking "better" tools. :-)
Yep. Me too. Mostly because I lack the knowledge yet of the full Amiga architecture. But then, I'd get pulled away because of work, my (now deceased) father, family, my father's trust or the WWII web site I maintain. So many distractons, so little time.
But this is something I enjoy doing, so I don't consider it time wasted. It's just my way of building appreciation of what was once Amiga. :)
@ mikrucio
OK, you've talked me into it. :)
As to "up to spec" see my response to nyteschade. I just like using the more modern coding paradigms...
-
@EDanaII
What libraries/compilers are you using to use C++ that way with the Amiga?
-
Hmmm well I was using Blitz 2.1 and it was fine for my textured floor Shmup with a few copperlists here and there.
(due to the difficulty finding some big box kit Buck Rogers is shelved for good now, as is Gradius and my 2.5D 'forest game')
-
With regard to modern languages, I find that AmigaE is well suited to the newer object-oriented paradigms for the most part. Once I get my CF adapter into my A1200, I plan on trying to cross-compile code to it using my AROS VM as a PortablE environment.
One thing I am adamant about is that I don't want to support graphics card Amigas exclusively. The chipset was what made the Amiga.
-
Here I was thinking that objective-C was an iOS only thing.
But the try-catch is such a nice feature to have, I use it constantly in php and javascript.
So how do I get to work with objective-c on the amiga?
-
I keep meaning to port a game I released on BlackberryOS last month to Amiga 68k and MorphOS but haven't had enough free time as yet. Sometimes it feels like there aren't enough hours in the day. I mostly coded in 68k asm in the past but I'll be using 'C' for this, as the original code is all in 'C'.
-
I'd love to use it, but its 68020+ only, which I have with no way to display. The only computer I can monitor-ize is the A2000 with a 68010.
SAS/C 6.50 is available from the TOSEC Amiga collection on archive.org and the updates to 6.58 are on aminet.
It should run nicely on your A2000.
Failing that you can also get Aztec C from TOSEC too.
-
@ Nyteschayde
Oops, sorry, Nyteschayde, maybe I wasn't clear. The library is _mine._ It's what I end up doing instead of what I intended to do, driven by my desire to see a slightly more modern coding paradigm on the venerable old Amiga. :)
The compiler, as I pointed out in another thread, is ZeroHero's cross compiler GCC 3.4 (I think). I'm using that as a tool chain in Eclipse.
-
C here, working on something with vbcc...
to me, vbcc seems to generate unaligned reads on 68000, so works fine on 020+ in my testing.
-
cool guys, keep em coming!
I know there is more! keep this thread alive!
-
When my professional game coding career ends (my current job will be my last job), I'd like to create a whole pile of freely available audio tech that runs on many platforms. I'd be targeting everything from GPU to traditional CPUs. Amiga is one platform I would like to include, if anything as a low anchor to keep the code honest. Really I just want to see if I can design architectures that can scale well from the lowest to highest end machines. The reality is most of the stuff I would run in the Amiga would be downright comically slow and neutered, but I'd like to include it anyway.
I've never been one to actually do too much direct game coding, but one thing I would like to try at some point is to create some accurate as possible classic arcade clones that run on say an A500. For me, I'm just curious to try and see if this can be achieved.
But in other words, I'm not active ... always wanted to do more over 20 years ago on the Amiga, still thinking I might have a chance to play with it some day.
-
SAS/C 6.50 is available from the TOSEC Amiga collection on archive.org and the updates to 6.58 are on aminet.
It should run nicely on your A2000.
Failing that you can also get Aztec C from TOSEC too.
It does run just fine :D
Although, I am not too sure what all the widgets do, and it took me a while to figure out how to tell it to compile and link.
-
Sporadically active, here (68k asm). I should be more active really, it's not for lack of time.
-
I am actively programming in ASM. Released Incredible Adventures of Moebius Goatlizard a couple of months back which somehow earned itself a good review and a retro gamer sizzler rating from Retro Gamer magazine.:o