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Amiga News and Community Announcements => Amiga News and Community Announcements => Topic started by: tft666 on August 09, 2010, 02:58:21 PM

Title: Amiga OCS Demo Won at Assembly 2010 Demoparty
Post by: tft666 on August 09, 2010, 02:58:21 PM
Winner in the "Oldskool Democompo" at Assembly 2010 Demoparty was an Amiga demo.

DEKADENCE & ACCESSION - "GRIND"

Requirements: OCS, 020, 8MB Fast
Competed with (amongst others) a 486DX demo.

Download it and thumb it at http://pouet.net/prod.php?which=55576

(http://pouet.net/screenshots/55576.png)
Title: Re: Amiga OCS Demo Won at Assembly 2010 Demoparty
Post by: LoadWB on August 10, 2010, 07:35:33 AM
Another Amiga demoscene win.  Keep piling 'em up, guys!
Title: Re: Amiga OCS Demo Won at Assembly 2010 Demoparty
Post by: cv643d on August 10, 2010, 08:11:36 AM
Worked fine on my A1200/A1260/16MB/3.1

I like colors in demos though :)
Title: Re: Amiga OCS Demo Won at Assembly 2010 Demoparty
Post by: Vegas on August 10, 2010, 04:19:16 PM
Awesome!! Great Sound, this is my new favourite.
Title: Re: Amiga OCS Demo Won at Assembly 2010 Demoparty
Post by: koaftder on August 12, 2010, 06:52:33 PM
Hell yea, this was a good one.
Title: Re: Amiga OCS Demo Won at Assembly 2010 Demoparty
Post by: countzero on August 12, 2010, 07:51:00 PM
Drools :crazy::eek::insane::knuddel:

awesome awesome demo for metal freaks like me, worked great on me unexpanded (just an x-surf) A3000. Great stuff for OCS ! :afro:
Title: Re: Amiga OCS Demo Won at Assembly 2010 Demoparty
Post by: Karlos on August 12, 2010, 09:05:14 PM
That's awesome. For those that aren't able to view it properly, there's a youtube vid:

[youtube]hu5wQxgPZEg[/youtube]
Title: Re: Amiga OCS Demo Won at Assembly 2010 Demoparty
Post by: Thorham on August 12, 2010, 09:31:08 PM
Cool :) Imagine what kind of an impact this would've had back when the first accelerators with extra ram were available, they probably would've been blown away :lol:
Title: Re: Amiga OCS Demo Won at Assembly 2010 Demoparty
Post by: Jope on August 13, 2010, 01:09:18 PM
Quote from: countzero;574498
worked great on me unexpanded (just an x-surf) A3000. Great stuff for OCS ! :afro:


It was optimized to run acceptably on an A3000/30 at 25MHz, which is basically the best Amiga that fits in the Assembly Oldskool rules.

Unsurprisingly, that's the machine it was shown on in the compo.
Title: Re: Amiga OCS Demo Won at Assembly 2010 Demoparty
Post by: halvliter'n on August 13, 2010, 08:25:04 PM
Great, give me more.::) AMIGAAAAAAAA RULES!

Good music and realy good GFX in Amiga OCS sense.
Title: Re: Amiga OCS Demo Won at Assembly 2010 Demoparty
Post by: halvliter'n on August 13, 2010, 10:02:56 PM
Is it just the CPU that matters now?
Title: Re: Amiga OCS Demo Won at Assembly 2010 Demoparty
Post by: countzero on August 13, 2010, 10:05:45 PM
what do you mean ?
Title: Re: Amiga OCS Demo Won at Assembly 2010 Demoparty
Post by: halvliter'n on August 13, 2010, 10:11:49 PM
Quote from: countzero;574688
what do you mean ?

Of course not just the CPU, the entire computer! :)  More Copper and stuff!
Title: Re: Amiga OCS Demo Won at Assembly 2010 Demoparty
Post by: bbond007 on August 14, 2010, 12:55:05 AM
Quote from: tft666;574048
Winner in the "Oldskool Democompo" at Assembly 2010 Demoparty was an Amiga demo.

DEKADENCE & ACCESSION - "GRIND"

Requirements: OCS, 020, 8MB Fast
Competed with (amongst others) a 486DX demo.

Download it and thumb it at http://pouet.net/prod.php?which=55576

(http://pouet.net/screenshots/55576.png)


It runs great on my a1200. 030/40/32MB
Title: Re: Amiga OCS Demo Won at Assembly 2010 Demoparty
Post by: Karlos on August 14, 2010, 06:00:25 AM
As good as the demo is, the competition rules are pretty skewed if 486 machines can enter and an 040 and/or AGA based amiga can't, IMHO.
Title: Amiga OCS Demo Won at Assembly 2010 Demoparty
Post by: stefcep2 on August 14, 2010, 06:33:31 AM
Quote from: Karlos;574721
As good as the demo is, the competition rules are pretty skewed if 486 machines can enter and an 040 and/or AGA based amiga can't, IMHO.


No I think they have got it abour right...
Title: Re: Amiga OCS Demo Won at Assembly 2010 Demoparty
Post by: Karlos on August 14, 2010, 06:46:05 AM
Quote from: stefcep2;574723
No I think they have got it abour right...


What, 1992 era technology not oldskool enough? It's 2010. If my A1200 were a person, it would be old enough to vote (at least in the UK) by now :)
Title: Re: Amiga OCS Demo Won at Assembly 2010 Demoparty
Post by: pVC on August 14, 2010, 07:51:24 AM
Quote from: Karlos;574724
What, 1992 era technology not oldskool enough? It's 2010. If my A1200 were a person, it would be old enough to vote (at least in the UK) by now :)


But if the hw was too ahead of its time? ;) Starstruck (http://www.pouet.net/prod.php?which=25778) won the main compo few years ago.. with A1200/060/AGA against the beefy mainstream PCs :)

But yes, as the AGA has been the main platform for Amiga demos long time there should be a proper compo to fit it. It just isn't fair to keep it in same category with modern HW... even though it might not be fair for 8-bit computers to have it on same compo with them :) Maybe it would be time for midschool compos too.
Title: Re: Amiga OCS Demo Won at Assembly 2010 Demoparty
Post by: Jope on August 14, 2010, 01:26:06 PM
Quote from: Karlos;574721
As good as the demo is, the competition rules are pretty skewed if 486 machines can enter and an 040 and/or AGA based amiga can't, IMHO.

It's a problematic compo. It sucks also because a Sinclair Spectrum competes in the same compo against the 486.

The end of 1991 rule was set in the early 2000s, when the AGA/060 was still sort of able to fight modern PC demos in the realtime compo.

What can you do? It's not like we're flooded with oldskool entries at Assembly, hence it's not possible to split the compo into more categories.

Basically this is the best we can do at the moment, the rules have been tampered with way too much already and the competitors try and bend them more all the time.

IMO, I'd much rather kick that 486 out and downgrade the Amiga to an A500 with 1MB chip than allow A4000/060 in.. But that wouldn't bring any more entries to my compo, Assembly is a gamer party in the eyes of the C-64 and Amiga crowds.

Hence no-one will make productions for Asm, the quality releases are always saved for parties with a higher percentage of sceners attending.

Nevertheless, the scene compos will be there at Assembly Summer for as long as possible. Just keep those quality entries coming, preferably for the Oldskool/Extreme compos so I have something to show on the screen. :-)
Title: Re: Amiga OCS Demo Won at Assembly 2010 Demoparty
Post by: Karlos on August 14, 2010, 03:00:56 PM
I dunno, I mean it's totally out of order that the speccy is expected to compete with 32-bit machines, IMO :)

The "midskool" idea is probably fairest, I reckon. Perhaps:

386 - 586 (< 100MHz), up to VGA
030 - 060 (< 100MHz), up to AGA

"oldskool" could then be something like this:

086 - 286 (< 20MHz), up to VGA
000 - 020 (< 20MHz), up to AGA

"proper oldskool" would then be everything sub 16-bit era :)
Title: Re: Amiga OCS Demo Won at Assembly 2010 Demoparty
Post by: Jope on August 15, 2010, 09:32:47 AM
That is the general consensus for the definition of oldskool and midskool, but as I said, we don't get enough entries to warrant splitting them.

If anything, Amiga AGA + 486 should be bumped to real wild to compete with handheld consoles etc and oldskool should be pushed back to 8-bitters only.

However your radical opinions have already occurred to others, this same discussion with the same conclusion has been had at length on pouet and the assembly mailing lists. If we change something, one vocal group will be satisfied and another group will became vocal with their dissatisfaction. :-)

There is no golden solution to this for the time being due to lack of entries, and time has actually shown that the most technically impressive demo has often prevailed at the compo instead of the most powerful platform automatically winning.
Title: Re: Amiga OCS Demo Won at Assembly 2010 Demoparty
Post by: pVC on August 17, 2010, 01:31:35 PM
It's clear that you don't get 060/AGA and other midskool entries with these rules at least. But who knows if you could get enough if you'd have own compo for them. I think it could even be possible to retrieve that part of the scene at Assembly in the future as there isn't many parties left for them at all... Breakpoint was the only good party fot them, but what happens now.. remaining amiga scene might be looking a new place to go and why not more competition from other midskool platforms too :) Assembly is big, has history and is stable, so there might be a chance.

In any case, the most of the amiga sceners aren't even thinking to release demo at the Assembly because of the compo categories. I'd be interested to make demo there too, but with current categories I'll rather release it elsewhere.
Title: Re: Amiga OCS Demo Won at Assembly 2010 Demoparty
Post by: buzz on August 17, 2010, 04:21:00 PM
Quote from: Karlos;574745
I dunno, I mean it's totally out of order that the speccy is expected to compete with 32-bit machines, IMO :)


Yeh i agree. those 32bit machines don't have a chance! :-)
Title: Re: Amiga OCS Demo Won at Assembly 2010 Demoparty
Post by: buzz on August 17, 2010, 04:24:05 PM
This thread needs more spectrum!

[youtube]x1o_Tr8jq3I[/youtube]
Title: Re: Amiga OCS Demo Won at Assembly 2010 Demoparty
Post by: LoadWB on August 17, 2010, 06:24:25 PM
Quote from: buzz;575125
This thread needs more spectrum!


Pretty neat stuff, that Sinclair.
Title: Re: Amiga OCS Demo Won at Assembly 2010 Demoparty
Post by: Britelite on August 17, 2010, 07:37:46 PM
Quote from: buzz;575125
This thread needs more spectrum!


Although, on the real hardware that speccydemo is a flickering mess ;)
Title: Re: Amiga OCS Demo Won at Assembly 2010 Demoparty
Post by: halvliter'n on August 17, 2010, 09:20:40 PM
Quote from: Britelite;575147
Although, on the real hardware that speccydemo is a flickering mess ;)

Fully agree. You have done a lot for the Amiga. Amiga Rules!!!!!  Cheers Britelite, you are the king now. KONGE!!!
Title: Re: Amiga OCS Demo Won at Assembly 2010 Demoparty
Post by: warpdesign on August 17, 2010, 10:29:01 PM
I wasn't impressed by the demo... And still the same 2x (160x120, doubled) pixels in most scenes we have seen for years... This is ugly...
Title: Re: Amiga OCS Demo Won at Assembly 2010 Demoparty
Post by: Karlos on August 17, 2010, 10:37:07 PM
Quote from: warpdesign;575178
I wasn't impressed by the demo... And still the same 2x (160x120, doubled) pixels in most scenes we have seen for years... This is ugly...

Meh. What do you want from a 25MHz 030 ECS machine? Regular lo-res would quadruple the number of pixels to calculate in what looked like a fundamentally 3D demo.
Title: Re: Amiga OCS Demo Won at Assembly 2010 Demoparty
Post by: Britelite on August 17, 2010, 11:00:34 PM
Quote from: Karlos;575185
Meh. What do you want from a 25MHz 030 ECS machine? Regular lo-res would quadruple the number of pixels to calculate in what looked like a fundamentally 3D demo.


To be honest, some parts could probably have used a better resolution. But as I didn't have a A3000 to test it on myself (only an AGA-machine with faster memory and 030/50MHz), I didn't want to take the risk of the framerate dropping too much. The 4bpl c2p-routines could probably be made faster, so maybe next time I'll try to do something in a higher resolution :)
Title: Re: Amiga OCS Demo Won at Assembly 2010 Demoparty
Post by: Karlos on August 17, 2010, 11:09:15 PM
Quote from: Britelite;575187
To be honest, some parts could probably have used a better resolution. But as I didn't have a A3000 to test it on myself (only an AGA-machine with faster memory and 030/50MHz), I didn't want to take the risk of the framerate dropping too much. The 4bpl c2p-routines could probably be made faster, so maybe next time I'll try to do something in a higher resolution :)


I actually thought it looked fine, despite the 160x120 resolution. Human eyes are more concerned with motion than they are high detail, so fluidity is better than sharpness if you have to choose.

What is copyspeed on the A3000 chip RAM anyway? There comes a point when your C2P is no longer the limiting factor, though I usually found that was into 68040 territory for AGA.
Title: Re: Amiga OCS Demo Won at Assembly 2010 Demoparty
Post by: buzz on August 18, 2010, 01:16:30 PM
Quote from: Britelite;575147
Although, on the real hardware that speccydemo is a flickering mess ;)


oh.. timing (made for spectrum clone). or a cheat (made for emulator?)

Nice work on your demo btw (as usual) :-) Cheers!
Title: Re: Amiga OCS Demo Won at Assembly 2010 Demoparty
Post by: Britelite on August 18, 2010, 02:56:06 PM
Quote from: buzz;575250
oh.. timing (made for spectrum clone). or a cheat (made for emulator?)


It's all interlaced to get more colors, the video is recorded from an emulator with a filter that blends two frames. Some parts look decent on the real hardware, but some have really shitty colorcombos (like flickering white and black to get a grey shade). The effects would've been a lot cooler with less colors and no flickering ;)
Title: Re: Amiga OCS Demo Won at Assembly 2010 Demoparty
Post by: pVC on August 18, 2010, 04:40:37 PM
Quote from: warpdesign;575178
I wasn't impressed by the demo... And still the same 2x (160x120, doubled) pixels in most scenes we have seen for years... This is ugly...


Yes, seen for years on AGA and 030/50+, but can you say you've seen anything similar on OCS before?