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Offline XDelusionTopic starter

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Re: Alas, I come to complain about MorphOS
« Reply #14 from previous page: July 18, 2012, 09:46:26 PM »
Quote from: Crumb;700518
I don't think so, Isochronous USB transfers are not planned at all so that rules out most USB soundcards


If that is true then my relationship with MorphOS will not follow much further into the future. This IS going to cost them a loss in future sales and it is going to be a further slap in the face to all the Amiga users who want to use their old software to it's fullest.

LAME LAME LAME!!!!
Earth has a lot of things other folks might want... like the whole planet. And maybe these folks would like a few changes made, like more carbon dioxide in the atmosphere and room for their way of life. - William S. Burroughs
 

Offline XDelusionTopic starter

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Re: Alas, I come to complain about MorphOS
« Reply #15 on: July 18, 2012, 10:26:43 PM »
Quote from: kolla;700576
I was a bit quick there, I dont know about HD-Rec, and I don't know where I would hook in the sampler on the Minimig, I use other devices for sampling.


Can you do midi on the mini mig?
Earth has a lot of things other folks might want... like the whole planet. And maybe these folks would like a few changes made, like more carbon dioxide in the atmosphere and room for their way of life. - William S. Burroughs
 

Offline XDelusionTopic starter

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Re: Alas, I come to complain about MorphOS
« Reply #16 on: July 20, 2012, 08:31:00 PM »
@hooligan & itix:

I agree, there is much ground that needs to be covered, and yes, in part this is Apple's fault for being equally lame, and partially my fault because I like many other humans do not know everything.

You see the thing is that I have NEVER in my entire life encountered a "modern" computer that lacks audio input. Never once!
Naturally never having been exposed to such a thing, I could not anticipate it's existence, especially from a computer company that advertises itself as a computer company with imagination and innovation, a computer company for the artist, for the creative, and not for the suit and tie business guy. Especially from a company that ships audio recording software with it's computers! ;)

On top of that I had just sent back another Mac Mini to an Ebay dealer because he had shipped me an Intel Mac by mistake. Now ironically the Intel Mac had an input jack (not to mention additional USB ports), so naturally I expected them to be on the G4 Mini as well.


Now back to MorphOS.
 
 As I was stating before, one of MorphOS' present claims to fame is the fact that it has backwards compatibility with some classic Amiga software. The downside to this though is that while it seems to support it's fair share, it still has problems running those apps that were the most used within the community.

One example of this would be the legendary OctaMED Sound Studio. You can run this on Amithlon via Paula emulation, or through Maestrix emulation. You can also run this on OS 4 through Maestrix emulation, but no matter what methods you use to try to get it up and running on MorphOS, your system is going to lock up!

I have brought this up on a few occasions, but alas, no one seemed to care enough to look into it, and I can assure you, I am not the only person out there who wants to see this running. In fact I know a few people who are interested in MorphOS, but do not want to jump on board because their favorite program will not work, or in other cases is not fully supported.

Hd-rec seems to be one of these. We can launch the program and play around with it, but alas we have no access to the MIDI side of things (unless their is something I am missing) again leaving us out in the cold. Though for what ever reason, OS 4 can take full advantage of it! And they can use the MIDI side of OctaMED S.S. as well.

Case in point (it pains me to watch this again so I won't be joining you this time):

[youtube]vPocY3UlK5A[/youtube]

Now, I would think, that perhaps the MorphOS team would want their users (even if they are the minority) to get the support they want, that is support that is within reason. I would think that they would perhaps look into this, maybe compare notes with Hyperion (assuming Hyperion plays friendly), and try to see what they can do to get their user's favorite software working. I mean, after all, we are paying customers, it's not like we are asking for a complete rewrite of the OS or anything to that effect. And assuming they took the time to work these things out, well they'd certainly have a few more users jump on board because after all, we never know when our precious real Amigas are going to bite the dust. In fact I am currently having a couple of mine re-capped.


Another point that I have brought up and will bring up again is there is software such as Digibooster 2 and the upcoming Digibooster 3 which from what I understand, has sampling capabilities. Now I understand that if I bought a huge ass eMac again that I could take advantage of that, or if I purchased a tower I could install a Sound Card and my problem would again be solved, but what of those people who do not have the physical space for such large computers, what of those who can not afford an additional computer to dedicate to each and every purpose. I mean after all I thought that the general road map was to attempt to create an Amiga compatible system that would suit one's every need, or at least most of them, the most basic ones.

The last I looked, USB, MIDI, Sound Sampling and so on are pretty basic needs. You don't have to have Windows or OS X to take advantage of those features, you can use an old Amiga, and Atari ST, a C64, Atari 8-bit, even DOS for most if not all of these needs, so this is not just something that has recently been added to OS' and hardware, and it certainly would not hurt for MorphOS to FULLY support they hardware that they began support for back in MorphOS version 2.7. I mean we are on 3.1 now after all. I took a few months off (because my eMac died) and recently came back only to find that some things had been improved, but those aspects that I looked forward to the most had not been touched at all, not a bit, despite all my posts in the forums.

We already have a good web browser and Fab is doing a terrific job to make it better. Our network stack seems perfectly fine to me, though I must say that wireless is LONG over due as I still can't even take this Mini on-line without plugging a cable into it.

As for flashed Radeon support...

OK, I guess I can see a need for that if you already owned a flashed card, otherwise, just buy one meant for your Mac. 3D is great and certainly improved, but...

I hardly think that gaming and entertainment should take priority over creativity and productivity.

Distracted, pretty girl started talking to me, will continue later. ;)
Earth has a lot of things other folks might want... like the whole planet. And maybe these folks would like a few changes made, like more carbon dioxide in the atmosphere and room for their way of life. - William S. Burroughs
 

Offline XDelusionTopic starter

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Re: Alas, I come to complain about MorphOS
« Reply #17 on: July 21, 2012, 06:32:32 PM »
Efika will work you say?

Hmmm.... Efika is small, it is low price and MorphOS just became much cheaper to license for that hardware....

That might be worth looking into, if I can find a CHEAP used Efika board.

You know, I don't mean to moan with all my complaints, though I know I'm not the first to be upset in relation to the state of USB or the matter of hardware support for said supported machines. Compatibility with software (either old or MorphOS native) that is said to be supported. After all this was to be a solution to the death of the Amiga, but it ain't much a solution if no one cares to try to make it as backwards compatible as possible, or conveniently expandable as possible at that. Especially when it is starting to look like MorphOS version 4 is going to kill backwards compatibility as we know it all together. Woohoo! Bright days ahead.
So ya, given that we just jumped from 2.7 to 3.1 and said supported hardware still isn't fully supported  (no wireless in MacMini, USB is still crippled compared to competing OS') and backwards, compatibility still hasn't been fully fleshed out, and the fact that the future may look like the death to all that... I do tend to moan a little.

All that senseless crap aside, they got my money now, and half of me does not feel raped. Half of me really likes what MorphOS is (for what it is), and I would find it hard to let go of. As I have said time and time again, unlike AROS (in its current state) it runs quite good under the hood. The OS specific features themselves have been fleshed out quite well and have created the best OS experience I've had since classic Amiga OS with Magellan II, and BeOS/Haiku!

Though, OS strengths aside, MorphOS' road map is starting to sound like AROS. To dedicate all efforts in getting games to run or run better, and having something to browse the web with. For us creative guys this isn't enough.

Anyhow the last I checked the Browser is pretty much a one man job. Seems to me (wireless aside) that the network stack is pretty damn good on MorphOS, so how could that require so much of the teams time and energy?

3D seems alright to me on MorphOS. Sure we don't have support for super high end cards and the ability to play DOOM 3 and what have you, but again, I don't care atm. I'm not pressed to play any more games, and besides, AROS already provides in that area.

What we need an a next Gen Amiga OS that is willing to continue to work out backwards compatibility issues (as a main priority), has Wireless support (AROS actually does have that but they have no wireless manager, irony of ironies), and we need USB that ain't stuck in the far past. We need cheap means to expand our hardware of choice and should not be forced to buy a different machine or OS for each task.

I would look into OS 4 as a solution as it seems to have support for some of these things, but alas I hear it is not quite as good under the hood, nor is it cheap to run.


BTW, I can sample on my Atari 8-bit (maybe not my C64), I do have MIDI on my C64, and I can do both on a 500, if I had one, but since I have a 600's and 1200's, I use them instead. ;)

Quote from: itix;700837
I remember (this was about 10 years ago) when MorphOS didnt have 3D acceleration for Radeon cards there was somebody yelling how MorphOS could be taken seriously without 3D... to some user other things are more important that others.



Neither my Amiga 500 or Commodore 64 support sound sampling or MIDI... :P as far as USB isochronous transfer support is concerned it is not something that very often. Anyway, I have no idea if isochronous transfer will be supported. It would be nice to have so Poseidon support would be complete but it is not my job.

Anyway, at least you have raised the issue. If nobody ever ask then nobody care...

Edit

For Maestrix emulation have you tried this:

http://aminet.net/package/util/libs/TheMaestrix

I dont have OctaMED SS so I cant try it out (and you probably already tried it?). If it doesnt work I dont know if there is something else blocking OctaMED SS but again... I never had that program.

To use MIDI you would need a computer with old style serial port (Pegasos 1/2 or Efika ?), it certainly is supported in MorphOS but to my understanding MIDI via USB would require isochronous support... so it comes back to USB then.
« Last Edit: July 21, 2012, 08:07:54 PM by XDelusion »
Earth has a lot of things other folks might want... like the whole planet. And maybe these folks would like a few changes made, like more carbon dioxide in the atmosphere and room for their way of life. - William S. Burroughs
 

Offline XDelusionTopic starter

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Re: Alas, I come to complain about MorphOS
« Reply #18 on: July 21, 2012, 07:30:04 PM »
Quote from: drHirudo;700921
USB2MIDI cable costs $5. MIDI is very old standard and almost any computer I have seen supports in one way or another. Microsoft tried to ditch it in Windows 7 but it still works with simple configuration hack.

Here is my AmigaOne controling KORG PA50 via MIDI. Using CAMD library.
[youtube]YKzZ79TLzs8[/youtube]
If isochronous suppot means being able to play while it performs - then it works nice.

I can install Camd library and get Hd-Rec to load, but this far none of the USB midi devices I've tested were properly handled by MorphOS.

Which model did you use?
P.s. Have not been able to watch your video yet, bandwidth is too lOw here.
« Last Edit: July 21, 2012, 07:58:22 PM by XDelusion »
Earth has a lot of things other folks might want... like the whole planet. And maybe these folks would like a few changes made, like more carbon dioxide in the atmosphere and room for their way of life. - William S. Burroughs
 

Offline XDelusionTopic starter

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Re: Alas, I come to complain about MorphOS
« Reply #19 on: July 21, 2012, 08:01:37 PM »
Nice!!!

Problem though, all my USB midI adapters came from EBay. Can you post a pic of the exact one you used? If I can get MIDI to work on MorphOS, then I can find a work around for recording audio since USB sound cards are neglectfully out of the question...

I mean regretfully. ;)
Earth has a lot of things other folks might want... like the whole planet. And maybe these folks would like a few changes made, like more carbon dioxide in the atmosphere and room for their way of life. - William S. Burroughs
 

Offline XDelusionTopic starter

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Re: Alas, I come to complain about MorphOS
« Reply #20 on: July 21, 2012, 08:51:05 PM »
Thank you, though the video was REALLY dark. I could not see the device clearly, but from what I did see, it looks like what I have...

...the device that MorphOS (for what ever reason) did not play friendly with.

Hmmm... now that I have a new machine and MorphOS has been updated, perhaps I should give it one more go. If it don't work I'll be back to moan. ;)

BTW, here's a couple videos I did about a month ago on my 1200 (before I put the 060 back in it).

OctaMED Sound Studio MicroKorg and XR20 MIDI. Tutorial Pt1

[Youtube]15NRcZD_d-w[/youtube]

OctaMED Sound Studio MicroKorg and XR20 MIDI. Tutorial Pt2

[Youtube]hXPhY9K1d34[/youtube]

Quote from: drHirudo;700926
I just recorded another video - I am showing the USB2MIDI cable in it.
[youtube]ufc-iKS3GbM[/youtube]

P.S. Ya, don't drop that synth!!!! ;)

Almost dropped the synth on the floor, again, while trying to lift it to show in the video. I realized at the end, it's easier to move the camcorder and show the synth than moving the synth. Oh well, the sound turned to be loud again, but I was trying to mute the noisy fan of my AmigaONE PSU.
Earth has a lot of things other folks might want... like the whole planet. And maybe these folks would like a few changes made, like more carbon dioxide in the atmosphere and room for their way of life. - William S. Burroughs
 

Offline XDelusionTopic starter

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Re: Alas, I come to complain about MorphOS
« Reply #21 on: July 21, 2012, 08:56:09 PM »
Oh, look what OS 4 users get...

http://aminet.net/package/driver/other/usbmidi

I bet that has something to do with something. They even got a native port of the library. Sighh...

Someone please come to my rescue, I need your coding skillz!!! :) If I was not currently jobless and near broke, I'd start a bounty as you know I've contributed to bounties in the past. Honestly, I'm not just a moaning bastard! I have supported the community in my own little way, please help!!!! :)
Earth has a lot of things other folks might want... like the whole planet. And maybe these folks would like a few changes made, like more carbon dioxide in the atmosphere and room for their way of life. - William S. Burroughs
 

Offline XDelusionTopic starter

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Re: Alas, I come to complain about MorphOS
« Reply #22 on: July 22, 2012, 03:54:14 AM »
What model do you got?
Earth has a lot of things other folks might want... like the whole planet. And maybe these folks would like a few changes made, like more carbon dioxide in the atmosphere and room for their way of life. - William S. Burroughs
 

Offline XDelusionTopic starter

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Re: Alas, I come to complain about MorphOS
« Reply #23 on: July 23, 2012, 02:15:20 AM »
Quote from: Kesa;700971
@XDelusion. My monitor is an LG 24 inch. Model: FLATRON E2441


Mm, can't find a review.
Earth has a lot of things other folks might want... like the whole planet. And maybe these folks would like a few changes made, like more carbon dioxide in the atmosphere and room for their way of life. - William S. Burroughs
 

Offline XDelusionTopic starter

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Re: Alas, I come to complain about MorphOS
« Reply #24 on: July 23, 2012, 04:40:32 AM »
Thank you fir offering your knowledge. I wish I was a programmer, but alas, I am other things. :)

Quote from: Yomgui;700964
Here, on morphoszone and metamorphos forums I've seen some user asking some questions and requesting support about sound devices working on MorphOS.
As you know, my Helios stack can handle such devices, but as you expect just having possibility to communicate to a device is not enough to use it.
We need specialized driver like the sbp2.class I've done to control SBP2 (SCSI over FW).

By checking what linux guys have already done in term of market filtering on this subet (see http://www.ffado.org/), it seems that most of working sound related hardware use the AVC protocol.
I know how to handle this protocol (i've already created a simple code to control my AVC DC-cam), so it could be possible in a near futur to have an avc.class to drive these audio hardwares.

But (yes there is one) even if enough people are interested by that, I've not such hardware.. and I think never get (don't need that). And more other, I don't have enough skills in the audio domain to do everything myself.

So I'm searching for some people having:
- a machine with a registered MorphOS
- some FW sound hardware listed in the ffado supported list (see the upper link)...
because need to support AVC protocol (becareful, many devices uses proprietary protocol).
- can be available for realtime testing (I'm on IRC).

So, send me a PM if you are interested by.
Earth has a lot of things other folks might want... like the whole planet. And maybe these folks would like a few changes made, like more carbon dioxide in the atmosphere and room for their way of life. - William S. Burroughs
 

Offline XDelusionTopic starter

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Re: Alas, I come to complain about MorphOS
« Reply #25 on: July 23, 2012, 10:11:42 PM »
Quote from: Crumb;701033
You don't need that port as Poseidon supports MIDI devices through camdusbmidi.class (or simplemidi.class)



@Crumb, can you tell me know I can get this to work with HD-Rec.? I can not seem to get it to respond to it.

Also you can see a photo of how Trident is viewing my MIDI device here:

http://www.mediafire.com/view/?wn87tsr2bwnn260#

@Krashan: Sweet, thank you so much for your response, this is wonderful to hear!!! A Digibooster Team member who is also a MorphOS team member! Now I have hope! :)

@Everyone

Discussion is also going on here:

http://www.morphzone.org/modules/newbb_plus/viewtopic.php?topic_id=8623&post_id=93756&order=0&viewmode=flat&pid=93751&forum=9#93756
Earth has a lot of things other folks might want... like the whole planet. And maybe these folks would like a few changes made, like more carbon dioxide in the atmosphere and room for their way of life. - William S. Burroughs